SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

You know, after the SA came to light, I searched for any kind of abuse in his life. None. The only thing I see is that his family does not deal with pain. They are not able to outwardly express it. His sister did not cry at her husband’s funeral. His dad did not cry at his mom’s. I guess I keep wondering then why we are here. Why is he numbing with people and in need of that external validation?

He’s moved out now and we are waiting to sign the final papers. I had my first weekend without the kids. It’s been tough and I just keep trying.

My XWH was sexually abused by a man at church when he was young.

I have a lot of empathy for that little boy. I have very little to no empathy for the man who put me through this prostitutes and drugs bullshit.

I kind of have a theory that it's not 100% the sexual abuse, but a kid who is in a situation where either the adults in his life don't care enough to protect him or if the adults are sexually abusive they are also abusive and neglectful in other ways then that creates a multitude of problems. There's a bigger picture to look at. My sawh had emotional, verbal, physical, and sexual abuse as a child. Numerous things happened to him such as: being forced to eat food out of the kitchen trash, was prevented from using a toilet until he shit his pants, had his wrists and ankles duct taped and was put on the top of the family car in the winter wearing only underwear, was forced to sexual things with his sisters, etc. Who could come out of that NOT fucked up? If you took the sexual abuse out, I think he still would have been fucked up.

I can't see replies from the last page back, I'm going to have to go back and take notes ...

demolishedinside - Congratulations on your sawh moving out!!

nomorerugsweepin - I hope your sawh is able to eventually find happiness and sanity. I am in a similar situation; update below.

I also have to remind myself of what he has done recently "Remember Life, this is the man he is. He proved it to you with these actions. Do not pay attention to his words."

Allusions: WTF!? I just have no words for the cloth in his underwear thing. Ugh.

Dashboard: I can relate with the disposable feeling. They just need their supply of attention and validation. It's so sad. I am learning how to get a lot of that from myself. It's very empowering. SAWH does the fake crying thing too. Since all of these most recent stuff came out and he is coping with realizing the marriage is now over, he has done a lot of holding his head in his hands, making his face go red, making his voice sound like he is sad ... but NO TEARS. Amazing. He cried when he had to bury his cat last year. But no tears over his marriage. OK.

Idabel - CONGRATULATIONS CONGRATULATIONS

Supresse - Very similar situation here. When I found out about the cheating and sexual abuse all in the same day (the original dday four years ago), I felt sorry for him. I thought he really wanted to change. After the latest dday he asked "If I work hard to change, do I have a chance?" No dude, you already had 4 YEARS. I just have to accept that he isn't capable and if he is, I'm not waiting around for it.

My update: I updated about this in JFO but here's the quick story. I contacted the woman he recently messaged during the hunting trip. I came to find out that not only did he message her and give her his work number, but they had a phone conversation. He told her that I no longer have any interest in him. She said she tried to give him some advice on how to make it better. At the end of the call he asked if he could text or call her again and she said no, she doesn't date married men.

I did confront him about all of this and of course he had a million different excuses and lies for me. I told him I am sure I want a divorce now, so that's the plan.

I am only making about 12K with my business right now and we both want to try to get into a better financial situation. He has an opportunity to get another license at work which should get him a raise.

We both want to wait until the summer to tell the kids so that they can have an extended amount of time to absorb the information and get used to the idea.

We may not divorce until summer of 2021 because that's when our youngest goes to school but we'll see what happens between then and now.

This morning I told him that I want him to get his semen tested to be sure that his vasectomy worked and that he won't get some random woman pregnant. He said he doesn't have any interest in that, and that his primary focus is the kids. I guess he forgot that I have his facebook password and I know he got two new lady facebook friends yesterday and sent a friend request this morning.

I am having a hard time coming to terms with the fact that this is it. We've been married for 19 years and it may be 20 by the time a divorce is finalized. That's a lot of time wasted on this loser.

Luckily, I have an IRL friend who is going through a similar thing. She kicked her cheating husband out 16 months ago and they are going through a divorce. She has been a big support to me in the last few days and she has promised to be there for me going forward.

That's a lot of time wasted on this loser.

The rest of your time is yours, though. Not wasting more than you have to is all you can do now. Good for you!

And I am so sorry he hasn't grown up.

I opened the door for him, held his hand and tried to guide him inside. Sometimes he would peak his head in. Other times he would even put one foot inside the door. But he had been living like this for so long, that the outside felt familiar and comfortable. The inside - the normalcy, the calm - that shit was scary to him. So that's how our entire relationship was - he had one foot out the door at all times.

Your entire post just rang so many bells for me. Thank you for posting - so validating.

One thing that bothers me is this idea that we must have been in a horrible space to attract, or be attracted to, fucked up people. Like you, in many ways I was in the best place I had been in for a very long time. I was happy, content, needed nothing. My STBX came along and I thought it was because I was in such a good place - that I attracted someone who would add to it. I thought we were such kindred spirits and while I recognized that I was further down the road than he was in terms of emotional health, I was excited to support him in getting there.

One thing that bothers me is this idea that we must have been in a horrible space to attract, or be attracted to, fucked up people. Like you, in many ways I was in the best place I had been in for a very long time. I was happy, content, needed nothing. My STBX came along and I thought it was because I was in such a good place - that I attracted someone who would add to it. I thought we were such kindred spirits and while I recognized that I was further down the road than he was in terms of emotional health, I was excited to support him in getting there.

So much the same here. I thought "wow, neat, this is a really healthy relationship".

We were with VERY good liars, skeetermooch.

HeHadADoubleLife, somehow I didn't see your post on the previous page (went right for the page index and just scrolled up, I think is how I missed it.) Lots of food for thought there, about the workings of our inner attractions...

I wonder if what happens is, when we do the work on ourselves and are in a good place with our self-esteem, more of the wounded birds (as somebody once called them) are drawn to us since they feel we have our life together? I don't know. But that thought you had back then, about maybe he was the kind of man you were meant to be with? Sounded to me a like a reflection of someone who still didn't expect to have or to ever find "normalcy," whatever that is. Could he have represented your own past struggles? You knew that you had conquered them, so maybe he was like the archtypal "kid brother" in his path out of it? Were you being pulled back to some "factory setting" as the caring, older and wiser one? Very interesting stuff.

Caring about shared problems expands our capacity for empathy, which is a wonderful thing. This board, for example, proves every day that it is a noble instinct to want to offer help to others going through the same bad stuff we have. Yet after years of trying and failing to "help" my SAWH "heal his shit," with no deep-level changes in his thinking, I now believe wanting to "help" our PARTNER by "showing him the way" does NOT bode well for us to have a happy marriage. At least, it hasn't for me. Maybe he thinks it helps him!

True, in the hormone rush of bonding, it feels "right" that a man's thinking seems familiar. Hand in glove, right? I don't know, but I think the problem is when our initial feelings of similarity came from a FOO role as Mom's Little Helper. (I was the oldest of 4 kids in a family with an alcoholic father, stay-at-home Mother, and my siblings were stair-step babies who came along as soon as 14 months after I was born. I was also big for my age, so I got drafted straight into that role very early by my overwhelmed Mother.) In school 10 years ago, I found out child psychologists now consider what happened to me "parentification," which they call another form of emotional child abuse. Who knew, back then? I think they concluded this from case studies of people like me, married to losers like my XH or this one.

After all that, I know not to follow my instincts to play Life Coach, Special Ed. Teacher, or Mom for any grown-ass man who wants in my life! Yes, I want to help other people, but I don't want that role in a Partnership. I'd really love to have a mentally equal-balanced relationship, if that is possible.

Really appreciate your insights about how it got started with you and him. And thanks for sharing that you also maybe had ADHD/ADD, but it still didn't cause you to cheat. I have a "low frustration tolerance," but I believe it comes more from my upbringing and years of disappointment at always having to be the bigger person, always needing to rise above other people's treatment of me.

Yeah, a lot of deep stuff, here!

LifeExploded, you are right about there being multiple abuse types identified in cases of child abuse. It is rare to find only one kind of abuse. Our professor was big on stressing the damaging effects of neglect as well. Often they suffer a sad combination of abuse AND neglect. But even just the neglect does a lot to hurt emotional development!

Dee: I did the same sympathy bit. Sounds like a normal, healthy reaction, the first time....

[This message edited by Superesse at 2:42 PM, February 18th (Tuesday)]

Crazyblindsided-

Thank you, I relate to your posts, as well. Honest to God truth, I just obsess with crap. I spend hours reading and watching things in regards to human behavior. As we both know, abuse victims are hyper vigilant. We people watch, like a deer from the woods. We pick up on the slightest gestures, without even realizing it.

I relate to what you said, only it's not sex related, in terms of my ex. Following the trickle-truth and him living at varying places (for a few months at a time), he would bail into his man mancave everytime I would cry etc... I'm just over it. Theres no remorse and it's really hard for me to wrap my head around the fact that he chose the path to perpetuate the abuse, while I somehow became prey, per parental programming. I never had an example of what a healthy relationship looks like.

I try to contribute to your posts in "general" and I saw that you posted a similar post in "General", but I saw it a couple of pages after. You're one of the only people I'll reply to there. I find that whenever I reply there, I end up shooting myself in the foot. Theres a lot of egos over there and I honestly believe a portion of them are narcs. I find their replies/posts toxic...they are very stagnant in their mindset and they seem adamant at bringing everyone down with them. Trying to speak with a lot of "typical" betrayed is a lot like trying to relate to those that never been through it. I feel they see victims of SAs much like any other person outside would. I dont sense a lot of empathy over there..its more about winning, in terms of whom is more butt-hurt over the other...total victim mentality...meanwhile, we (over here) sit and watch. People fall right in...

The energy behind the amount time spent bantering back-and-forth, they could actually use towards moving foward.

[This message edited by DashboardMadonna at 3:36 PM, February 18th (Tuesday)]

Demolished-

I'm betting on the fact that there is more to the story. These "men" have a great deal shame and most never admit to the entirty of their pasts. To admit it, would be giving you the upper-hand in his eyes. They project their own insecurities and short-comings. They exploit other people, so therefore, they feel others (even those supposedly close) are capable of the same.

Personality disordered people only cry, when they are trying to manipulate, in terms of personal gain. They lack empathy and will stare a whole through you, when you cry.

Abuse is a dirty secret and parents have a way of brainwashing their children (well into adulthood) into not realizing their reality. A lot of gaslighting.

I’ve been reading and you all have such good info and insight.

I feel much too broken to have anything to add...instead I need to vent!

I came home tonight and my WH is drunk. Second time in a week he has been drunk when I came home from work. Valentines was the other day, his bday was the next day in which he moped around all day depressed. Likely because I called him on his drinking while with our children the night before...I managed to get him a gift, order dinner and bake a cake. He chose to lay around all day, I certainly wasn’t throwing a damn party for him. Tonight he insults me saying it was the worst birthday ever! What a jerk! WTF does he think he deserves. I just recently found out more about his affair with my cousin, told him I want a separation...he is lucky I did anything at all.

Yes, arguing with someone who has been drinking is stupid on my part. But I can’t be speechless when he is drunk with the kids so I addressed it again. I informed him that it is not acceptable and he can drink his face off any other day or time but not when he is in care of our children! Why do I even have to explain this is beyond me!!! As our argument continued, I got:

1. How can you do this to our kids?

2. Don’t you know what I’ve been through? (History of abuse which is suppose to allow him to treat me this way I guess)

3. Denial statements about infidelities.

4. I went to rehab and 100 days not drinking and nothing changed. Can’t you see that nothing changed even when I didn’t drink.

5. What’s changed now? (Which I replied I have pulled my head out of my ass and am refusing to live in denial, we have never processed or talked about any of the affairs)

6. Your therapist must be real good (sarcastically said). I reply, yes she is, I have been compartmentalizing all this pain and once it’s at the surface it’s just too unbearable to carry on in the marriage.

7. “I never did that” I replied would you like proof? “No I don’t want any proof of things you think you saw when you hired a PI or whatever the F you did. I can only imagine how much of our money you spent. “

8. I did try but nothing is ever good enough for you. I tried therapy and it didn’t work for me.

9. It’s not fair that you bring this up after I’ve had a few drinks, instead of on the nights I am sober.

...I think you get the point. I’m trying damn hard not to overreact and respond. I think he actually thinks things will go back to normal without any real change on him.

Duplicate

[This message edited by Somber at 7:37 PM, February 18th (Tuesday)]

I know not to follow my instincts to play Life Coach, Special Ed. Teacher, or Mom for any grown-ass man who wants in my life! Yes, I want to help other people, but I don't want that role in a Partnership.

Amen to that. I too suffered from parentification as a kid - I love to help people - working active or reigning that crap in.

Somber, that sounds a lot like some recent conversations I have had with my sawh. I'm starting to think that I can predict what he will say when faced with confrontation.

We were talking about him and the issues that he has that prevent him from having healthy relationships with people. I was also trying to make an example to show him that when people hurt you repeatedly you don't continue going back to them. I said "After all of the abuse you endured as a child, would you leave our kids alone with your mother?" He said "No, but I wouldn't leave them alone with yours either." She has never touched a hair on my head. Literally never even spanked me. She's a bit of a hot mess right now because she just recently endured some trauma but that's neither here nor there. I had to point out to him that I made a FACTUAL statement about his mother, that he AGREED to, and he still felt the need to retaliate and attack my own mother who has done nothing wrong as a parent like literally ever. That's how strong his instinct to self protect is. I'm just tired of all of it.

Last night he met with his pastor to discuss our situation and today I read in his journal that he conveniently left out that he is praying for a miracle with his wife. Ok. Give me a freaking break. This week he opened an Instagram account and a snapchat account. Did he friend me on those? NO, of course not. He has been sending out friend requests to some random women on Facebook. I just can't even with this guy. I'm so glad I'm beginning to see him for who he really is.

Also, I didn't cry in the shower today! Yay!

Also, I didn't cry in the shower today! Yay!

Congratulations. I too count days I don't cry as progress. May you have many many more!

I made a FACTUAL statement about his mother, that he AGREED to, and he still felt the need to retaliate and attack my own mother who has done nothing wrong as a parent like literally ever. That's how strong his instinct to self protect is. I'm just tired of all of it.

It is sickening isn't it? I go through this with my STBX as well it's a narcissistic trait to self protect at all cost. I believe all or most narcissists have SA too it comes with the disorder. But the self protection by dragging down others for no reason makes me sick to my stomach. It's crazymaking behavior!

Thanks lifeexploded.

I'm starting to think that I can predict what he will say when faced with confrontation.

YA me too!!

I am realizing that he finds way to never discuss the actual pain he has caused as he is unable to accept what he has done as true. Perhaps it is self protection but also them denying their truths as they are too painful to accept. It is crazy making especially when we are trying so hard to live in reality and make informed decisions about our lives.

Thanks lifeexploded.

I'm starting to think that I can predict what he will say when faced with confrontation.

YA me too!!

I am realizing that he finds way to never discuss the actual pain he has caused as he is unable to accept what he has done as true. Perhaps it is self protection but also them denying their truths as they are too painful to accept. It is crazy making especially when we are trying so hard to live in reality and make informed decisions about our lives.

Omg - so I've been idiotically spending some time with my SASTBX and last night I noticed he'd shaved his entire pubic region - all of it. It's certainly not for me - never asked for it and we've only engaged physically a few times in 7 months. He made a bunch of ridiculous excuses of course.

But wtf?! How fucking outrageous could he be - climbing into bed naked with me like that and not think I would be triggered?? He responded with anger basically. He's never before shaved his entire area - for a brief time, when he was deep into hookers he waxed his balls a few times and I didn't like that either - and now in the midst of vying for reconciliation he does this?!!

I threw him out.I blocked everything I could block. I hope to goddess I am really done this time. It was just another blindside. He's out of his fucking mind.

skeeter, seems like you are havng a hard time detaching. My wish for you is that somehow you would have had a hidden camera that caught that moment so you could frame a photo of him like that, to remind you, whenever you needed reminding, of his little quirks.