SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

On another note, our last exchange. I didn’t abandon it because "you got" me

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It's assertions like this that convince me you are completely misreading the exchange. There is no "got you." We had a discussion that didn't reach a consensus—that is all. I didn't view it as unhealthy. Do you consider philosophical differences to be inherently unhealthy? If so, we simply disagree. I don't expect us to agree on everything, though we likely share more common ground than you think.

My hunch is you've made up your mind that I'm so sort of red pill adjacent 'burn the Witcher'. I haven't arrived at that conclusion from nowhere, it's based off a series of tonal queue and vague references. This is just untrue. No politics and all that... But couldn't be further from the truth. So perhaps it would be beneficial for you to practice as you preach and open your mind.

All I ever ask is for someone to evaluate what I'm saying based off the logic presented. If you think it's wrong, great. You are free to shout it down. You are free to ignore it if it doesn't resonate. The only things I don't appreciate are; arm chair psychoanalysis of why they think I think a certain way, projected motives for what I'm saying or calls for lack of experience. Yes, when people make these claims of me, I often start claiming them right back. It wouldn't be my preference for dialogue to ever go that way. Either I'm right or im not. I literally had a baseless accusation that I was some historic user in disguise because someone disagreed with me. Either you related to it or you didn't. No hidden motives. Scouts honour.

I had plenty to say, but ultimately decided it wasn’t worth my time. Part of that draft mentioned this very thing.

No explanation necessary—I do the exact same thing.

If your advice was so damn helpful, then where are all the BS who say they appreciate it? Are they in the room with us?

Again this reads as if because you don't agree with my perspective it's worthless.

Countless times, both here and on other platforms, users have found genuine value in my posts—whether by considering a perspective they hadn't previously weighed or using specific points to clarify their own thinking. I’ve received DMs validating my views and direct thanks for my insight on numerous occasions. In fact, I doubt I could find a single thread I’ve started where at least a few users didn't find value in what I was saying. I don't keep an itemized ledger for your benefit, but look at page one of this very thread: a user explicitly stated that while they don't always agree with my posts, they related deeply to this one. They thanked me for sharing. Is that "in the room" enough for you?

I've said it time and time again. I write the sort of things that would have been helpful to me when I was going through it because I felt that voice was lacking. I'm doing so now under the presumption I'm not a unicorn. I'd wager statistically I've got to be right in that presumption.

maybe that’s part of why Hiking suggested you stick to Reddit. I’m sure your advice would do well if ChmpLdy had a subreddit there. She probably does, you should check it out.

I’m sure some would find it convenient to sanitize a space of differing voices. We have a word for what happens when a forum operates like that: an echo chamber. I, on the other hand, believe a platform is only truly valuable when a full spectrum of perspectives is represented. Which is why I doubt very much I would enjoy the forum you mention. Though I'm not disregarding their perspective.

It's so ironic to me that this tumbled out of what I would have thought would be my least hot take. Basically drafting that a BS should see themselves as a prize and not be fearful of loosing a partner who betrayed them. I hand on heart thought, this would be a one page thread where most people just acknowledged none of this was groundbreaking stuff.

[This message edited by DRSOOLERS at 11:48 PM, Thursday, September 3rd]

I didn't recover my power by deciding I was the prize. I did it by realizing I was willing to lose my marriage if things didn't change. Once I genuinely became willing to lose my wife, I didn't have to convince her to choose me anymore.

She had to show me why I should choose her.

It wasn't an ego or self esteem thing.

I reall liked ForeverLabeled's distinction between self-esteem and safety. They're obviously connected, but they're not interchangeable.

You can have terrible self-esteem without feeling unsafe, and you can feel profoundly unsafe while intellectually knowing:

"I'm a good person. I'm worthy. I have options. I'm not inferior to AP."

You can know perfectly well that you're desirable, capable, intelligent, loyal, sexually competent, employable, etc., and still have your brain go:

"Wait. What else don't I know?"

That's not necessarily an ego problem.

That's an epistemic safety problem.

But I'm sure [Morbs] will appreciate your shiny white helmet and shield.

Think I have a KISA complex, do you? First I've heard of it.

You do have a valid point, in a way. I will defend and protect this community... SerUnhinged at your service... in every way that I can.

This topic, this thread, isn't particularly groundbreaking insight. Those of us who've been around for a while can spot the "pick-me dance" immediately, will help the member identify why they're feeling the it, and help them navigate through it. No 2x4s, no judgment, no berating required. Newbies don't just need a pep talk, they a friendly hand. They need to be heard and understood. They need a fucking blankie!

Calling your OP mental masturbation wasn't meant to be funny nor do I think it's particularly uncool, immature or cruel. It just is what it is, kid. Nothing particularly insightful.

And begging...? Never works out the way people think it might. Doesn't work for BSs anymore than it does for WSs.

Begging might get a WS's foot in the door, but it isn't nearly enough.

I used to follow a blog of a woman who had been cheated on and abandoned, and her description of the first three days is the nightmare life of a BS. She collapsed in her bathroom on the floor and laid there for three days. She wet herself, she soiled herself, and she threw up, but she could not make herself get off that floor. That is trauma. There is not one single organ in the body that is not paying the price for this awful trauma. And you cannot make this person respond like that person. We all handle things differently and it’s genetic. We are the freeze type.or the flee type, or the fight type, and we were born with it. That poor woman froze on her bathroom floor. Our expectations are filtered through our own lives and we should be very careful when we make suggestions that we make sure these are only suggestions and we don’t hold anyone’s feet to the fire if they don’t follow them. You cannot make someone be rational when the life they’ve been thrown into is irrational. I’ve been to some training for this and one of the best analogies I ever heard was… if you are driving down the highway, going 70 miles an hour and the car in front of you slams on brakes you have a very short period of time to make a decision and it’s not done rationally. You either slam on brakes, turn to the right or turn to the left… that’s it. And the person sitting next to you might have not noticed and said something and you not only didn’t hear it, if you did it never got computed. The body can only take care of what’s in front of it and what is done to it. Being expected to be rational in the middle of trauma is ridiculous. It can’t be done.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 12:33 AM, Friday, September 4th]

Love the analogy Cooley.

Well said.

DRS.

Because your self esteem takes a direct torpedo hit below the waterline, leaving you feeling entirely inadequate and replaceable, a completely counterintuitive knee jerk reaction can kick in: you start trying to win them back.

is it really completely counterintuitive? If so, then it’s probably time to wonder about your intuition.

I really think much can be explained by a six word phrase, "I want you to want me".

Think of the boost you get when you find somebody who wants you. The increase in self-esteem. That increase is matched by the huge decrement in self-esteem experienced when you find out they want somebody else, either non-exclusively along with you or just somebody else.

Since them wanting you in the first place was a boost, it shouldn’t be surprising that they seek to want them to want you again. Matchmaking is always been a competitive affair, and why not here? You can call it to pick me dance, but it’s more like a battle.

I absolutely 100% agree with the idea that when you reel them back in, you may then realize that following your delicious victory, that they aren’t in any way shape or form worth the fight that you put out.

That’s the point where you demand change.