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AO

would like to thank you for sharing your situation with a bunch of anonymous people here on the SI forum. The reason why your story hit so hard with me is that i divorced as soon as I found out. Whereas you had the misfortune or fortune of reading your WW emails & love notes to her AP I used my imagination to think of things she & her lover wrote each other and that in itself pissed me off ten fold. I couldn't begin to imagine the pain you felt reading the first few lines, looking at the first few pictures then looking at your wife and how she has been the model W for the past few years.

R may be choice now but would it have been if you would have discovered the A and all the correspondence before the AP was killed? Sure she has been by your accounts an exemplary wife for the past few years which must be taken into account but also scrutinized. Why oh why would she keep photos & correspondence from her dead AP? She has had a long long long time to destroy any evidence of her A and did not do so. This would concern me.

To actually of seen the written words would have been a terrible thing indeed. That is why your post hit me emotionally and deep. I feel for you as no man or woman should be subjected to that kind of pain from the one who has your back.

Again although.I myself am not pro R, your WW is not my WW, your situation Is not my situation, your life is not my life. You do what's best for you & for your WW. That is all I am going to say on this matter.

In god I trust all others have to earn it.

Sending strength my man

[This message edited by notanotherchance at 7:14 AM, November 21st (Tuesday)]

I agree with Notanotherchance.

Here's how I look at it.

A1, you built your company. Would you retain an employee who has stolen from you for 18 years or fire them ?

What your WW did was theft. Lived off of you and then used your hard work and money to facilitate an affair. Then the affair deprived you of emotional, sexual and relational efforts that you deserved as it went to the other man who did the same to OBS.

Now sure, I am positive that one or two people will come on here and say that infidelity shouldn't be compared to a crime. I agree, IT'S WORSE. I know that you may see your wife differently or maybe not ?? I don't understand why people would think that you would have a soft spot for her this early in the game but maybe you do ?

Some may want you to try and take that 18 year employee, put your arm around the shoulders and not fire that person. I am the opposite and would fire.

But as NAchance said, it's your situation.

Despite all the posts here, I do have a few questions.

1) What are your plans regarding communication with her ?

2) Do your daughters plan to see her ?

3) What is your gameplan if she becomes stoic and tries to come back home ?

4) Have you begun to think about expectations regarding your own life and where you see things lining up ?

[This message edited by Western at 7:32 AM, November 21st (Tuesday)]

One thing I will say, I think that there ARE unrecoverable situations that can be created.

Based on my experiences, I would never reconcile after infidelity of any kind, ever again. In AO's situation, I don't think I would reconcile. He's forever the silver medal to her true love, with whom the relationship ended without intent. Living the rest of my life in the literal and figurative shadow of that man, no thanks.

That said, I am in a place where I have been drained of any sort of romantic ideals regarding relationships. I'm not saying that I'm right, but I'm saying that's where I am.

I just read through 19 pages of posts. Wow!

Many have given you great advice and i agree with your separation and likely decision to divorce.

My ex-wife was also a long-term cheater who hid a n 8-10-year affair for many years successfully.

Until she couldn't.

I divorced her after attempting to reconcile for about 4 years.

It didn't work because she was still protective of her affair partner. I only found out his name when he had been dead for several months, then she coughed up his name.

OK, so this is my advice that others only touched on a little bit.

Get tested for STDs. I mean all of them. Do not take this advice lightly.

See, even though I divorced her and I've even remarried now, I have a type of throat cancer (stage 4) that I got because my ex-wife infected me with HPV from her cheating.

It can take years to appear. Google Michael Douglas and HPV to find out more information.

You cannot know with certainty that you do not have an HPV risk. However, be clear-eyed that it is a possibility.

See if your "wife" can get tested for HPV and share the results with you. A PAP test will tell you.

for a man, there is no easy test. A throat biopsy after it was clear I had cancer was what gave me the diagnosis.

Radiation and follow on chemo and very changed life.

All from her cheating.

Yup, impacts my current marriage.

Good luck.

BTW, I vote for not trying to reconcile based on my own experience.

thank you Michzz and XHZ for posting and giving your perspectves.

Michzz, I will pray for you everyday. Promise. Thanks for giving your advice. Beat this man. Beat it.

XHZ, I agree.

The second someone cheats, there is no obligation to get back to the marriage, the worse someone cheats, the harder it is.

In the end, some people don't deserve R and whatever anyone says, it continues to be the truth

Hey there,

Glad to hear you’re seeking an IC and speaking with an attorney to learn your options.

I wanted to make sure that you saw the Healing Library at the top left of this website. It contains a ton of information worth reading. There is also a link at the very top of the JFO forum, called “Newbies Important Information Please Read,” written by SI staff. It’s also worth reading, but here are a few things it says:

2. You may feel that you need to make a final decision immediately. Your feelings will likely fluctuate - many describe these changing and conflicting feelings as the "rollercoaster" Take time for yourself, your emotions may be too raw for the first 6 months to make an informed and healthy decision on which direction you want to truly go. A hasty decision either way may make you feel trapped if you haven't given yourself some time to heal and tend to what you need for your own emotional health.

3. Be certain you want people outside of your marriage/relationship to know of the Affair. You may regret telling people later down the road.

4. Seek out a Counselor that specializes in infidelity and family crisis. It helps to have a mediator that can guide you both in the direction of healing.

5. Don't take advice from people that have never experienced infidelity or ones that immediately say "cut and run...". They are not in your shoes and do not know your history and/or investment with your relationship.

Choosing an IC can be tough. I think that seeking someone with experience at infidelity is particularly important. My IC had me read Not Just Friends (by Shirley Glass) within my first week, and informed me I was experiencing PTSD-like symptoms; in retrospect, that was great advice. You may want to consider asking prospective ICs whether they’re familiar with her work.

There are other things to consider as well, which I’m blanking now because it’s been a long day and I’m a morning person. Im pretty sure there have been one or more posts on this topic on SI; if I can find one, I’ll bump it for you.

Good luck, and please take care of yourself.

Had my doctor's appointment. Filled him in on my situation. He said the odds of us finding anything treatable this far out from the affair are slim. He went ahead and ran a comprehensive panel of STD screening tests. Also did a full physical and said I was in good shape for a 50yo. The bad news is that I'm due for a colonoscopy (family history of colon cancer). Bummer.

Doctor also made a recommendation for a counselor and offered to make a referral. I gladly took the name and added it to my list. I actually got around to calling most of the therapists on my short list. Couldn't reach a few of them who had already closed for the Holiday weekend. Decided to make an appointment with the one my physician recommended.

Spent some time at work and then went home to tidy up before the girls arrive tomorrow. Looking forward to their visit. We are going to fry a turkey, so wish me luck.

WW sent me an email. Asked how I was doing and if there is anything (beyond continued NC) that she could do for me. Said she understands why I need to be alone and is willing to wait as long as needed. Interestingly, she is going to start therapy again in the meantime. She seems particularly concerned that I am not eating and offered to put some meals in the fridge while I am away from the house.

I haven't responded yet, but several members have pointed out that it will be awkward for the girls to visit me and not see her. Not sure if I should contact her to plan something or just let my DDs figure something out on their own. I thought the offer to bring food was a nice gesture, but the warning about greeks bearing gifts kept popping into my head.

I found the ICR thread "For Those Who Found Out Years Later." It's sad that so many people have gone through this same situation. My heart goes out to everyone on this site.

I am starting feel strangely numb. I think I am subconsciously avoiding thoughts of the affair and WW during the day. That is one of the reasons I am trying to write something in this thread everyday. Forces me to think about things and not just hide. Therapeutic for sure. Here's hoping I can keep it together while the girls are visiting.

[This message edited by AmbivalentOne at 8:19 PM, November 21st (Tuesday)]

I suggest telling her the food is not necessary (although she's right make sure you eat, drink, etc) and then going back to NC.

As for your daughters, since they're adults you should let them and their mother work out their relationship themselves. You don't need to discuss their visit with your wife and you don't need to coordinate their interactions with their mother with them. If they want to see her and talk to her, they are adults and are capable of doing both without your involvement.

I know it's hard, no one wants to see their children's relationship with a parent threatened, but having seen this more than enough times the best thing you can do is stay out of their relationship with their mother for now.

[This message edited by JS84 at 8:20 PM, November 21st (Tuesday)]

Aone,

I expect that your not eating isn't due to a lack of food.

I think your daughters can manage getting together with their mother. She is at her sister's house so they can easily reach her or go see here.

Watch for signs that your daughters might start acting as intermediaries for your W. This can be knowingly or unknowingly. You may want to discuss boundaries that you need them to respect in their support for you. And in their support for their Mom.

AmbivalentOne,

You are doing very well in dealing with this and again, I'm sorry that you are forced to - as we all were.

There is something I would like to address regarding something that a handful of other posters have been stating.

Some posters have claimed that your WW's adultery partner was/is "the love of her life".

I can assure you that he was not and is not "the love of her life".

Why?

Because your WW, like my XWW, does not know what love is.

Love is the combined values of honesty, trust, and commitment.

Your WW, like my XWW, does not hold or live by any of these values.

It is believing in and actually living by these values that give one the ability to actually feel real and true love for another.

She, like my XWW, live simply by how other people make her feel. Period.

I found out about my XWW's affair when I found her Valentine's Day love letter that she wrote to her adultery partner.

In it was the most grandiose, over-the-top, drippy declaration of love that I have ever seen in any novel, movie, or other writing.

Romeo and Juliet didn't have shit on my XWW and her OM.

She began with "I can not even begin to find the words to describe the depth of my love for you..."

Immediately after the grand declaration of profound love for him she followed it with affirmation to him that the sex was the greatest, most incredible, most intense, and unlike anything she had ever experienced with any other man ever, ever, ever...

Yep, she was as deep as it gets into fantasy-land and the more she elevated her OM to god-like status, the more she needed to bash me down by criticizing and mocking me in extremely mean and cruel ways.

And I eventually got to read some of this shit first-hand.

She was in this love-of-legends state even after I found out about it.

But, once she got my divorce filing, I started getting the tearful calls asking if we could fix this and that she still loved me.

It was far, far too late for me.

I was one who knew as soon as I started reading that letter that I was divorcing her.

Eventually, after being exposed and the secret was no longer a secret, the grand, deep, deep love wasn't really grand or deep after all and it died a relatively quick and shameful death.

My point is that this "love of her life" thing that some others are saying is not really true.

It is possible she may have been harboring some fantasy-based notion that this OM was some lost "love" due to his death.

The thing is, her "affair" was never exposed to reality - until just NOW.

Now that YOU know, and her DAUGHTERS know, and her family will know, and her newer friends will know, etc - it is being exposed to reality and now she will be forced to attempt to reconcile the fantasy she may have been harboring about her secret and-now-dead, taboo love against REALITY - and it's just not going to work.

So, it is highly likely that whatever melancholy, sentimental, shmoopy bullshit she may have been feeling for her illicit, secret, and now dead affair guy, will turn to "the greatest shame of her life" now that it is being exposed.

And, I highly, highly suggest that you expose the living shit out of it all to anyone and everyone.

That's what I did and it ended up working quite well.

Again, your WW does not know what love is and never knew what it is, nor what it means or what it takes.

She has a fantasy-based notion of love and romance that is just that - fantasy, as in NOT REAL.

It's fiction, self-deluded bullshit to attempt to make shit look nice and pretty.

Like they say though, You can't polish a turd.

And, no matter how she has been fantasizing about it in her mind - the reality about it is pure shit no matter how long it lasted.

So, please don't take to heart the "love of her life" statements because what they had WAS NOT LOVE - at all.

She was addicted to the fantasy and he was the dealer.

He provided the drug in the form of flattery, attention (cause he was a fucking SAHD), and she payed in the form of sex to keep the drug coming.

In the end, just like my XWW and her OM, it's a disgusting and gross arrangement of sex-for-flattery.

I would suggest you respond to the email with:

"No thank you. Please adhere to NC. If or when I decide to talk to you I will let you know."

Short. Business like. To the point. This is what detachment looks like.

Your daughters are old enough to make up their own mind about seeing your WW. If they are too disgusted by her wretched behavior to see her, tough titties. She should have factored that into her cheating calculus. She had her fun. Now its time to pay the bill.

A1

I am starting feel strangely numb. I think I am subconsciously avoiding thoughts of the affair and WW during the day. That is one of the reasons I am trying to write something in this thread everyday. Forces me to think about things and not just hide. Therapeutic for sure.

Actually I think you are doing just great!!

I never had IC or MC, in fact I have not had the dubious pleasure of telling anybody my story other than here on SI.

The SI community has kept me sane and got me through the worst.

Keep posting.

I love the idea of a short and sweet business-like email and to have a talk with the daughters about being intermediaries.

In terms of eating it all starts with water. Every morning chug 32oz of water before your brain catches up. A hydrated body is a healthy body. Your hunger will follow. Buy some Muscle Milk or similar protein shake. It’s very easy to eat and digest.

The reason people are asking you to keep NC no-frills because you’d not be letting NC do it’s job of settling your emotions and for you to complete some big tasks. Namely:

1. Finalizing separation

2. Meeting with an IC

3. Exposing to friends and family

We are very proud of you you’ve been doing. Your posts here will be helpful reference to the 100s of betrayers who come here but are not in the position to post themselves.

Don't really see the point of exposure in this case since the affair has been over for almost a decade and it seems like the wife has been remorseful. Exposure is best for an active or recently ended affair with a WS who is in the fog or remorseless.

Exposure at this point wouldn't serve much purpose and could cause more harm than good. Besides it sounds like everyone in the immediate family is aware which should be enough in this case.

duplicate post

[This message edited by antlered at 8:05 AM, November 22nd (Wednesday)]

A1,

IMO you should keep the NC during Thanksgiving for 2 main reasons:

1.- She may understand that you have decide to R; and

2.- Do not invite your WW before asking your Daughters what do they think. Remember that your WW betrayed them as well, and that they are adults and can make their own decisions. Of course as adults, they must also respect if you choose to not have WW at your home.

Other thing:

Before telling your wife that she will be out the marital home for more than few days, I believe you should set some grown rules:

NC (you already settled this one):

Explain about Thanksgiving;

Explain the logistics for Christmas (previous consensus with your Ds)

No dating other persons;

What to tell friends and family;

Where she is going to live (assuming she is OK with that, remember that she is entitled to live in your home until separation/divorce say other thing); etc

At this point I believe you still don’t know what you want. This is normal and totally OK. And for this reason I suggest to not make any promises, don’t engage in activities you don’t want to with your WW (phone calls, dates, family events, etc.).

Other thing, before start wondering what you want, would be a good idea to ask you WW what does she wants. You may assume that she wants to R, but have you asked her?. If she wants to R, what would she be willing to do to achieve it? It is pointless to fight for a marriage, if you decide to, when one of the Spouses doesn’t want to remain married or willing to do what it takes. Maybe she just wants out and couldn’t find the way before.

Last thing, notice that even if you want to R and your WW is doing all the right things, you may end up not being able to achieve it. R has not guaranties, it is not a must. It is a gift the BS gives the WS every day. It is OK if you tried for a year, five years, or even a day and then decide to walk away.

One more vote for a polite businesslike refusal of any assistance or contact of any sort from WW.

As for exposure, you've done the necessary informing to the daughters. To my thinking at this point exposing to others is a matter of how it fits into strategy regarding divorce. Something to run by your attorney perhaps.

In my case I was divorcing in a no-fault state. It made better economic sense to keep her cooperative, although emotionally I wanted to burn her reputation to the ground.

Edited to add: keptmyword There were some awesome nuggets of truth in you post that totally speak to my wife and situation. My XWW also bends her perception of reality around how she feels about something. And yes it was all about her haha.

JS84: I beg to differ. Exposure is a must regardless of whether the affair is ongoing or not. While exposure serves as deterrent to a current WS to continue his/her affair, for a former WS the exposure will make him/her question about themselves in new light.

The excitement of an affair is mainly because of it's clandestine nature while the adulterer does not have to worry about their good boy/girl image being tarnished. To end an affair and not getting exposed will only mean they really got away without one of the greatest of the consequences. And they will never reflect deeply upon questions of honor/shame until they know they cannot maintain appearances anymore. There may be remorse about loss of self-worth and such, but that is not the same as the remorse that accompanies the loss of image. Lack of exposure is simply getting a free pass.

@AO: I see that you are worried about losing your business. But since your WW is contrite don't you think she might in fact be ready for concessions in case of a divorce? Her readiness to do so, or maybe even sign a post-nuptial, will in fact let you know how repentant she is for her actions.

We are going to fry a turkey, so wish me luck.

One question: Do you own a fire extinguisher?

She seems particularly concerned that I am not eating and offered to put some meals in the fridge while I am away from the house.

"The way to a man's heart is through his stomach." It's very common for WW to start powerhouse cooking to win their husband's back over. Pie is especially popular.

I haven't responded yet, but several members have pointed out that it will be awkward for the girls to visit me and not see her.

You didn't make it awkward and you can't prevent it or fix it. They have to work these issues out amongst themselves. Personally, I think it would be worse if you were all in the same house together.

Letting your WW know you aren't ready to talk and still need space is perfectly fine. Let the kids know directly if they're crossing into "mom and dad's business." And as good as things are going right now, stay prepared. Your wife has had a long time to anticipate this happening, but in her mind, there is an expectation of how it's going to go. Once your reactions start conflicting with that expectation, she might wind up getting nasty. "Hope for the best, prepare for the worst."

Hope you can focus on your kids for a few days while they're home. Good luck.

Don't really see the point of exposure in this case since the affair has been over for almost a decade and it seems like the wife has been remorseful. Exposure is best for an active or recently ended affair with a WS who is in the fog or remorseless.

Exposure at this point wouldn't serve much purpose

While I agree exposure is an incredible tool to disinfect an active affair the benefits post-affair are:

1. To destroy any fantasy that remains

2. Most importantly, to form a real-life support network

A1 has spent his life picking who to share his life with. These people deserve to know what’s going on in his life so that they can offer support.

I know if a close buddy of mine was having problems I’d hope that he or she could trust me to lean on in times of diress