"You can survive this. Talk to others that have"

Brokenbutterfly8 posted 10/21/2020 17:07 PM

Ok so I have been lurking around this website ever since my life was turned upside down in April. As we have all been there, desperately googling ways on how to move forward and cope with infidelity.

First off, I will tell you that I’m not married to my partner yet. We were planning on that for next year or so. We have been together for years now (lived together for quite a while)- considering the reconciliation months as well. I’m only just 6 months from DDAY.

My story goes like this....

In April this year I found out that the love of my life has been having a sexual affair with one of his co workers. No emotions involved as I got all the things I need to see to clarify this. It was basically that the AP is pretty much a sex addict who started off by asking him for help with applying for external jobs, then started crying to him about her personal life, then slowly it escalated into something else. She is about 12 years older than my partner and is very skilled at what she was doing(manipulation).

Basically, it started off with a kiss- where she asked him for just one kiss saying that it’s only one kiss and no one will ever find out etc and then one thing led to another and next minute they were at her house (she lives close to his work place). She always knew that he had a partner and she kept assuring him saying “don’t worry no one will ever find out” and “you have to experience other women” (I’m the only woman that my partner has been with and obviously he has told her this.

I got all the details confirmed- including all visits (with proof) etc. In this whole story, there was no actual sex involved (it was mainly sexting, kissing and other physical stuff but no intercourse or oral sex etc). You will wonder how come right? It’s because she declared that she doesn’t use condoms and this scared him off to never physically sleep with her although a few other things did happen. Overall, she always dictated what she wants done to her etc etc... I saw these very evident in the text messages. Anyway, so basically all of this started at end of Feb and it pretty much all ended by the time I found out in mid April. So the whole thing didn’t last for longer than 2 months. But it was long enough to destroy my world and our relationship.

Now, after I found out... my partner basically was gaslighting me and told me I’m over reacting and pretty much did everything in his power to hide the truth from me. But he did forget that he is dealing with someone who is bloody good at researching and finding things out. For almost a good 2.5-3 months after DDAY- it was lots of lies, trickle truth, gaslighting, half truths, omitting the truth and basically creating a whole new past in his head! Everything that I found out, well 95% was through my own work and recovering texts/emails etc. And ofcourse, I did a few more things to ensure I had the whole story. Finally, once he realised that he has no way out from the truth, that’s when he finally confessed to all the details. All I can say is it took literally all my energy to find out most of the story and nothing at all came easy!

So today I can confidently say that I have at least 98% of the actual story. Since around July, I decided to try R. I was in limbo since April but slowly decided maybe I can give it a chance. He has good days (with being supportive), and then he has his days where he is full of his own shame and guilt. At first during R, he wasn’t very understanding as to WHY I need to talk to him about it. It was always “let’s move past this” “why do we have to talk about her” why this and why that... anything to really tell me that I should let it go and get over it. But over these months, I told him what I want from him if I was to consider being with him again permanently. When he realised that he could really lose me, then he started to put in a little more hard work. He still has days where he is just so stuck in his shame and really doesn’t want to face what he has done, but it’s better than it used to be.

The above pretty much sums up what happened... And now.. I’m stuck. I’m stuck because I don’t know if I can ever get past this pain? Some days I’m fine, then the other days I’m just lost... stuck in my head. I’m better than I was a few months ago, but yet I still don’t have an appetite for food. I’m usually soooo full of life, I’m known as a bubbly happy person and I really miss that person. I’m broken, broken from every side... I have done more than I could do for him, I have given my all and more and have always always been completely faithful and genuine.

I don’t understand why people do this? He has a history of lying, but he isn’t the smartest when it comes to hiding things as he isn’t tech savvy and he always forgets that I’m bloody good at it. A few times in the past there have been issues with online dating sites (but sexting and online only- no catching up etc), and excessive porn usage etc. So yes, there has been a history but nothing to the extent of what happened this year. I was willing to forgive the past mistakes and give him an opportunity to change. To be honest, he is a good guy. He is very loving, caring etc. But honesty is definitely not his strong point and it’s something that I just NEED. He has had a difficult childhood and me being an empath I always wanted to see him do well in life and so I did literally everything I can to see him succeed even in his career. I have stood by him, supported him every single day. I’m not saying I’m perfect, because I’m definitely not!! I get angry and he is more calm etc, but did I really deserve this pain? I really don’t think so.

I love him, I really do... but I’m so broken... I don’t know how to come out of this... I’m a very ambitious person and now I just feel lost... like someone broke my soul and I can’t find it anymore... I’m in Med School (mature aged student chasing her dreams) and I had to take this year off due to all of this... I don’t know what I want to do anymore...

I’m new here, so please be kind and respectful. Life is already hard, so I would really appreciate some kind advice.

[This message edited by Brokenbutterfly8 at 2:22 AM, November 21st (Saturday)]

Evertrying posted 10/21/2020 17:40 PM

Welcome Broken, though sorry you are here.

Very gently, how do you know for sure there wasn't any sex? You will find here on SI that many BS's have been told this same thing only to find out later it was a lie.

When a wayward is caught, they go in self preservation mode (which you have already experienced with the gaslighting and trickle truth) and are mainly concerned with covering their own butts. They figure that you will never really know the honest truth so why spill the beans?

The condom story is a good one, but if I were you I wouldn't put a 100% of my belief in it. He has already proved to you that he's a liar, and why would he waste his time going to her house for just a kiss????? Especially if she's a sex addict and master at manipulation?

You indicate in your post that he has a history of lying about other things, so if I were you, I would process carefully and really take a look at your situation. Maybe he isn't the one for you.

Again, very sorry you are here.

Brokenbutterfly8 posted 10/21/2020 17:47 PM

Thank you for replying Evertrying.

Regarding the no sex- this was confirmed as I made him call her in front of me the same day he got caught and she had no clue whatsoever that I was next to him- because his phone was with me. That’s how I firstly got some of the physical information as I got him to call her to say he is ending things etc and he has told me everything. Then in that conversation she mentioned a few things that did happen (which before the convo he denied!) and also mentioned “Well, we didn’t even have sex, so what?”... basically, he was stupid to talk to her in front of me when he didn’t even give me the story! And in the end of that Convo, when he was acting awkward she was like “is your girlfriend next to you?” ... so yeah... he made some really stupid moves in trying to actually hide info from me .

So I’m dead sure that there was no actual sex involved but there was other physical things more than just a kiss.

Brokenbutterfly8 posted 10/21/2020 17:59 PM

Also Evertrying..

She (the B****) mentioned these words after saying “we didn’t even have sex” except “you made me _ _ _ with your hands”...

Sorry about the TMI. But just wanted to make the picture clear. So yeah...

Sofarsogood posted 10/21/2020 18:26 PM

Above all, if you want to reconcile with him, you have to be sure he is a safe partner for you. You might want to consider individual counseling for you both. The dating sites and porn are a concern as well, because additional wayward behavior can stem from use of both. Now is the time to think about what you need to have for a happy relationship. He might not be able to fulfill that need.

sisoon posted 10/22/2020 15:41 PM

I tend to think of specific feelings instead of generalized pain - grief, anger, fear, shame. Doing that may help you, because different feelings respond to different treatment.

Yes, you can process your feelings out of your body. Starting somewhere in the 18-24 month range, triggers and memories of my W's A started to diminish in frequency and intensity. By 4-5 years out, the memories were annoyances. Your recovery timeline may very well be different, but you can heal.

Your post looks like your recovery is pretty normal. Not many BSes are happy or eating well or sleeping well after 6 months. Not many BSes know where they'll end up after 6 months. Recovery is slow, and 6 months seems like a long time, but it isn't. The SI rule of thumb is 2-5 years to recover - some of us take longer, very few, if any heal faster.

You may be stuck because you know your WSO lies habitually. You may be stuck because your WSO's TT'ing, gaslighting, an minimizing stopped only 3 months ago, so in some ways you're just 3 months out.

I'm concerned about your H's short history with telling the truth, and I wouldn't be sure he's telling the truth, given his history. IMO, R simply can't work without total honesty from the WS.

What has your WSO done to address his cheating? What is he doing to change from cheater to good partner? Unless he makes that change, he's vulnerable to replays.

What are your requirements for R?

You can heal by processing your feelings and by 'getting out of infidelity' - either by leaving or by your WSO's commitment to doing the work of R. Is he committed?

Do you really want him now? Do you see him changing? Do you want to spend the rest of your life together?

Will he help you through med school, or will he drag you down?

These are just some of the questions you need to answer (for yourself).

[This message edited by sisoon at 3:42 PM, October 22nd (Thursday)]

number4 posted 10/22/2020 16:59 PM

In this whole story, there was no actual sex involved (it was mainly sexting, kissing and other physical stuff but no intercourse or oral sex etc).

As others have said, sorry you're here, but hopefully you will learn from others' experiences.

My H initially denied that anything happened between he and his AP; he told me she wasn't willing to have sex with him as long as he was still married. I took that as it was purely an emotional affair. A month or so later, I found out there was some kissing. A week later I found out not only was it a full-blown physical affair, but he'd had two more affairs in the two years preceding it. As evetrying said, it's very possible you don't know the whole story behind his cheating. I hope in your case you do, but be prepared with some boundary setting if you find out there have been others, or this one was physical.

Cheaters are liars, as you've illustrated in other areas of his life. If it were me, there is no way in hell I'd commit to a marriage with someone unless he agreed to psychotherapy. He has some major issues going on with lying, and you will always wonder if he is being truthful or not; that will never go away. He needs to understand there are consequences to his lying, no matter how loving and caring he is. Why are you tolerating being with someone who lies to you? Perhaps you need some therapy, too, to figure out why you are attracted to someone who has a history of being dishonest.

My husband had a difficult childhood, but I did, too. I didn't go out and cheat. I began therapy to discover why I was the way I was, and made major changes in my life. H never did (even though he knew I wanted him to), until after DDays. Now he is in therapy and it's a requirement for me to stay in the marriage and reconcile. BTW... my H had eight years between his first and second, third and fourth affairs. You'll always wonder.

Thumos posted 10/22/2020 17:48 PM

I found out that the love of my life

Gently, you may want to remove this phrase from your vocabulary. You've just had romantic notions demolished in an instant and now you see with clear eyes even through a haze of pain.

This man in front of you who did these things? This is really who he is, not the idealized notion of him you carried in your head for so long.

When people show you who they are, believe them. "The love of your life" is a notion developed in the Age of Romanticism in the 19th century.

There are many fine, quality, attractive men out in the world who would not do this to you. You would be perfectly happy, sexually and otherwise compatible with dozens of them in your geographic proximity.

This man is not the love of your life and he just proved it.

You can reconcile with him, but probably in a healthier way if you shed this idea and move forward keeping your eyes wide open.

"To see what is in front of one's nose needs a constant struggle." ~George Orwell

[This message edited by Thumos at 5:49 PM, October 22nd (Thursday)]

The1stWife posted 10/23/2020 04:23 AM

He had a difficult childhood. Yeah so?

You had to uncover everything on your own? Not a good sign.

Sex or no sex — he cheated and lied and betrayed you. Infidelity can be emotional as in an emotional affair, financial as in hiding $ or spending $ and lying about it, etc.

Betrayal is betrayal.

I hope you have a counselor just for you. You need the support. It can also help you make some decisions about your future.

I don’t know if this guy is worth reconciling with. Only you know that. But a huge 🚩🚩 is the fact he was never honest with you of his own accord. Whether guilt or shame or fear or whatever —- that’s not a good sign.

He needs professional help as well. He appears to have issues that need to be resolved.

Hippo16 posted 10/27/2020 05:42 AM

Brokenbutterfly8

Please read what The1stWife posted.

especially the first and last sentences

I would offer to reword the last sentence from

He appears to have issues that need to be resolved.

to

He HAS issues to resolve.

I would throw this fish back into the sea.

btw - Have you seen your physician for complete testing of STDs?

HouseOfPlane posted 10/27/2020 06:51 AM

BB8, sorry that you find yourself here. You’ve been heard.

You sound like an enormously intelligent, loving, motivated person who knows how to go after and get what she wants. If it’s in your control and you want it, you get it.

Guess what is not in your control? Him. His actions, his feelings. What is at his core. Yet the actions you’ve taken scream you trying to control all of those things.

Based on his past history of repeat offending, what are odds it will continue in the future? Set aside your wants and do the math. Will you need to be ever vigilant? Will there be a time when you can lower your guard and just trust? Not wonder?

Forgiveness is about the past, trust is about the future. It’s great you’ve been able to forgive...but will you be able to ever trust again? Truly? Those bad thoughts plaguing you are your mind telling you, “never forget”. He’s a living, breathing reminder of the worst betrayal you will ever experience in your life.

That all sounds horrible, because it is. It is not insurmountable, but you need your eyes wide open here, to see things as they are, and not how you wish them to be. There are things here out of your control. Him, mainly.

Sending strength!

Dragonfly123 posted 10/27/2020 07:57 AM

A few times in the past there have been issues with online dating sites (but sexting and online only- no catching up etc), and excessive porn usage etc. So yes, there has been a history but nothing to the extent of what happened this year. I was willing to forgive the past mistakes and give him an opportunity to change.

This is the clanger for me. He escalated his behaviour with this affair. Nothing changed after you first discovered his ability to lie and cheat. He then met her and upped his game. Very gently you seem determined to paint him as a little boy lost, hard childhood and her as a sex addict predator (believe you and me I get that) but at the end of the day he already was untrustworthy he was already fishing and looking for an affair. He does have some serious issues. What is he doing to address these?

I am not surprised under those circumstances that you’re so broken. We all, as betrayed have to rip off our rose tinted glasses when it comes to our SO. We can’t change them. We can’t make them who we want them to be, they have to want to be better and nothing you’ve posted gives me the feeling he wants to change. I’m sure he saw you broken over the dating sites and sexting but he chose to do this to you. I have to agree with others, I’m not sure he’s worth your effort. I certainly would be focused on healing you and shoring yourself up. Then sitting back and watching his effort.

I’m so sorry you’re in pain.

[This message edited by Dragonfly123 at 7:59 AM, October 27th (Tuesday)]

Anna123 posted 10/27/2020 07:58 AM

Sorry you are here. Reread the above posts and take the questions seriously. Give them some deep thought, it will help guide you.

I’m stuck because I don’t know if I can ever get past this pain? Some days I’m fine, then the other days I’m just lost... stuck in my head. I’m better than I was a few months ago, but yet I still don’t have an appetite for food. I’m usually soooo full of life, I’m known as a bubbly happy person and I really miss that person. I’m broken, broken from every side...

I believe this is your soul/body/maybe even God, warning you. Your mind wants to give him a chance but deep down you know better. As I read your story I was thinking there is a chance the guy really was manipulated etc., but his response shows otherwise. And then you say he has a history of lying. Personally I would end this before marriage and children are involved. You NEVER will forget it. Can you live with that? This isn't 20 years of marriage you are weighing things against. Six year is long enough for it to be life-shattering for now, but you will get past that. You have an OPPORTUNITY to move on with a clear knowledge of what he is capable of. Many don't find this stuff out until years later.

He is interrupting your life and dreams. A partner not cause this. A partner should inspire. This is another really bad sign for the relationship. You are not broken! I don't like that term for a human being. You are in a crisis and will find your way through it.

Good luck in what you decide and if you choose to continue R, please keep coming back and make sure his actions are lining up with what a successful R looks like.

Btw, find a couple things that you can stomach and make sure you keep the nutrition going. And water and rest. I am sure you know with your experience, but keep reminding yourself it is important for your health overall and your immune system.

Take care.

HouseOfPlane posted 10/27/2020 08:21 AM

BB8, you've been given a gift that all of the married people who caught their spouses cheating never got...he showed you who he is before you got married.

Use this knowledge wisely.

...and is very skilled at what she was doing (manipulation).

Maybe he is easily manipulated? Lacks his own central moral compass. When he's with you, you can guide and steer him (a nice way of saying manipulation). But when he is with someone else...

EmbraceTheChange posted 10/27/2020 08:28 AM

I also want to chime in, but on another subject.

I don’t understand why people do this?

I have stood by him, supported him every single day.

And that's how a normal healthy relationship is. However, (and it took me many years after dday to realy come to grip with it) ... some people are not interested in this. They are on a different "frequency". They don't want a smooth, happy life. They are after power, one-upping, they love the Karpman drama triangle (victim, rescuer, prosecutor).

My ex husband was pro at doing this, as was his family. Chatting with you and being all nice, and back stabbing, nitpicking to look for proof on how crap I truly was, in the other side. They involved the kids. If I was asking them to tidy up their bedrooms? He would do it for them (they were the victims), he was the rescuer. The prosecutor was me, because "I" was the one who wanted a clean house, so they had to "obey". Cue to the kids rebelling and making a mess on purpose because they had their dad and grandma's support. I didn't want to pay my daughter college fees (I was the prosecutor). Dad was the victim of me (I wouldn't bulge) and the grandma was the rescuer ( she was going to make it all ok by putting pressure on my then husband to force me to cough up the cash). Then my ex husband got himself a girlfriend at work who had the same attitude. Cue to emails (on the company server no less) where they were both bashing the manager (who used to be my husband's friend, we had him over for a bbq). The manager was the "prosecutor" making the OW's life hell because he expected her to work... at work. Ex husband was the rescuer, and of course OW was the victim.

It sounds really far fetched and from a comedy show. I put up with this shit because he put enough truth in some statements + loopholes ("there is a rumor at work that...) to make it believable.

At the end of the day he wanted power over me. He even started telling me what I should and should not say to people because of my "tone of voice". After a while you believe that they can see the forest from the trees (unlike yourself), that they have your best interest at heart. So you give them the benefit of the doubt. And away they go. They have you on the hook.

Logically I understand, emotionally I don't. I don't understand this need for power, and one-upping. I don't understand because I would feel bad about it. People are not puppets to play with. People like that thrive on it, though. And my deal is not to understand anymore (which I did try, like you) but to be out of this toxic relationship.

HouseOfPlane posted 10/28/2020 16:48 PM

BB8, how are you?

I know you may have gotten a bit more harsh response that you wanted, but we're not living with your cheating partner, we're just thinking of you.

Sending strength!

Brokenbutterfly8 posted 10/29/2020 07:55 AM

Hi everyone, I'm so sorry I took ages to reply. I have been trying to find myself again slowly.

I'm sooooo grateful, beyond grateful actually for all your replies. Every single one helps, yes some were a little harsher than expected but I guess I need to hear them all.

All of you with the beautiful kind words- many many thanks and blessings your way. It really means the world to me right now. You guys are so amazing- xx. Pain does make us all so much more compassionate!

HouseOfPlane- Thanks so much for checking up again. I'm doing ok at the moment and I'm trying my best to focus on myself as hard as it is. I just turned 32 last month and I guess I have a long way ahead of me...

I don't know where to begin to be honest... Last weekend, I told him that I want some space. So I asked him to move out for a while until I figure things out. I have felt stronger than I did the last few months and I'm starting to take care of myself better. He has been consistently begging me to give him a LAST chance (his words)- I think he is starting to see that he is probably going to lose me. Initially, I really wanted to try R, but he didn't really show much in actions after I decided to try again in July. He begged me to come back even in July, then I gave him a chance- then he said all these things he would do for me and maybe 60% he did and 40% not so much- If this makes sense? Meaning like showing remorse/understanding that I need to talk about it etc.

Anyway, 6 months of constant grief, pain and suffering... I feel emotionally exhausted and drained...

My question now is, so I gave R a genuine try since July, but I'm not sure if he was really doing the work to show complete remorse and to show that he is worthy of R etc. Am I judging him too soon based on the fact that I'm considering July to October (R)?

I mean, he tries to be all remorseful whatever, but then he starts going down the guilt road/shameful etc- getting defensive/being selfish and then just makes it worse for me when I want to talk about it. So now in October, I just felt like I'm expecting something from someone who will never be able to change? Is this wrong of me to think like that? Coz I always give people more chances than they even deserve but now I'm giving up...

Anyway, as it stands now- I'm considering leaving him... But it is not easy... nothing is easy right... He keeps begging me to consider him again- saying this time he will do everything and talk to my family blah blah blahhhh ... My question is- why did it take 6 years for someone to come to this realisation? I mean, I have always put him first, I honestly can say that there is nothing that I have not done for him... In fact- he agrees and says this to me as well.

So I don't know- I feel like I have been taken for granted every single time- with every single chance that was given to him ... I'm a hopeless romantic.. stuck in a hopeless situation...

Thank you to every single one for your contribution to my post. I'm superrrr grateful xx. I hope you all never have to go through this kind of pain ever again.

twicefooled posted 10/29/2020 10:57 AM

My heart hurts for you.

I was you once upon a time ago. The difference is that I married him and had kids with him. In hindsight, I ignored the gigantic red flags slapping me in the face because I felt bad for him (terrible childhood, like your guy) and saw a ton of potential in him.

But you know what potential is? It's a maybe. Maybe he stays faithful and maybe he doesn't. But he's already proven that he hasn't been faithful and hasn't done what you needed after you gave him a second chance (or third or fourth).

I'm a romantic at heart myself. I stayed single for most of the past 6 yrs. I am currently dating the kind of man I only dreamed of - kind hearted, good boundaries, excellent father, no tolerance for unfaithfulness and stays faithful no matter what.

I PROMISE you there are tons of much better man than the one you settled for. You owe it to yourself to love yourself more than you love him. In my opinion, he is not worthy of you. He has proven that he is not capable of being what you need.

tushnurse posted 10/29/2020 14:16 PM

Old timer here, and an old nurse so I'm gonna give it to you straight. It may sting a bit, but you need to hear it.

but then he starts going down the guilt road/shameful etc- getting defensive/being selfish and then just makes it worse for me when I want to talk about it.

^^^This is NOT remorse^^^ this is fear of losing you, or his own shame and guilt getting in the way.

Remorse is genuine, and doesn't wax and wane. It also is followed by actions not meaningless words. Stop communicating with him. Tell him you need 30-60 days of no contact. If he truly wants to make this work, he will respect that, and get his ass into therapy and start working out his issues.

I also see a lot of self blame going on, like the whole I never did anything and devoted myself to him for a whole 6 years... why wasn't it enough...
It wasn't enough because he is a broken person who has not and will not do the work to heal his shit. He didn't do this because you failed him in some way. He didn't do this because you are too fat/thin, too smart/dumb, too caring/neglectful. The thing his choices to cheat, are exactly that HIS CHOICES. It has ZERO to do with you.

I know you mention you are in medical school, I urge you to reach out to resources available through school and get into some therapy. You have some healing and exploring to do with yourself, even though you aren't a kid, there is something in you that makes you willing to tolerate less than you deserve. That's not ok, and honestly if you don't get a better handle on it, Residency is going to chew you up and spit you out. (Yes I'm an old crusty nurse but I'm pretty smart too, and have been on here for over 12 years because this placed kept me sane when my H cheated).

Now... Back to you.
Therapy.
Goals.
STD testing... yes I know they didn't have sex. Cheaters lie, yes they confirmed it on a call. Cheaters and their AP's lie together. Just go get it done. Pelvic and blood work. You don't need HPV.

There will be someone else that will come along and give you the respect you deserve, and the real love you need, and when it happens the difference will be palpable, and you will know what we are all talking about. But first time to heal yourself.

Infidelity is a major trauma. Don't minimize it. Allow yourself to heal. Then you can reconsider if you want to go back with him, or not.

HouseOfPlane posted 10/29/2020 15:56 PM

I'm considering leaving him... But it is not easy...

Yes and no. In some ways it is really easy. You write it down on paper, good and bad for staying or leaving. Make a decision. Execute. Turn away and head the new adventure.

He will be fine, no need to worry about him. There will be someone else to suck into his drama vortex before you know it. In fact, there already has been. Many.

this time he will do everything and talk to my family blah blah blahhhh ...

I'm a hopeless romantic.. stuck in a hopeless situation...

Meh

A hopeless romantic believes there’s a prince out there, and you don’t have to shack up with a frog first.

Some frogs are just frogs.

Somewhere out there is a guy who would be thrilled to death to hang out with a caring, loving, med student. In fact, there’s a bunch of them. Be a hopeless romantic, believe in it, and go find him. Or more likely, let them find you.

Sending strength!