SurvivingInfidelity.com® > General

maise posted 7/3/2019 20:42 PM

What’s the point?

The damage has been done. The lies can still continue. My WS is fucked up and has proven to be fucked up to me. So passing or not, what do I care?

She scheduled this shit but then lied about something not pertaining to cheating right before going in...like...it’s the lies that I can’t stand. Pass this test or not, i see you and you’re fucked up. Toxic. Is this supposed to have me ‘want to keep u around’?

This may be a vent. Just thoughts I’m having. Wayward contacted the AP weekend before last...it’s like, behavior is still the same as far as I’m concerned. With the secrets and the lies. This test doesn’t really prove anything to me.

Bleu posted 7/3/2019 21:12 PM

Maise,

Hugs. This ish is hard.

I just with the best for you. You sound like you are on your way to whatever that may be.

Think of me on the side of the road wearing a t-shirt that says, "i see you and you're fucked up".

I'll take one in every color.

maise posted 7/3/2019 21:26 PM

Thank you for the hugs, return hugs back!

Sitting in the waiting room as the polygraph is being administered. Thinking to myself, can liars ever really change? And, so what about the results...do I care? I kinda don’t for the fact that she’s still a liar and I don’t think she will ever stop.

It’s so crazy the one thing I could never stand bc my father did it so much, is the one thing I’ve married. A liar. Gah. I hate how the cycles happen sometimes.

Think of me on the side of the road wearing a t-shirt that says, "i see you and you're fucked up".

I'll take one in every color.

LOL. Yes!

As I was typing my response we got the results.
She passed the four questions asked. And as I predicted, I totally don’t care and still am not ok with her.

[This message edited by maise at 9:27 PM, July 3rd (Wednesday)]

The1stWife posted 7/4/2019 06:14 AM

You are so right. She passed the 4 questions. So what?

She’s still lying.

At least your eyes are wide open and you clearly see who/what she is.

Sorry it had to happen but glad you are dealing in reality.

Bigger posted 7/4/2019 06:46 AM

Nobody has ever claimed that a polygraph proved if a person is a liar or not.
It can only STRONGLY indicate if the person is telling the truth on the questions asked.
For example: If your wife Jane told the examiner her name was Daisy just before he adjusted the sensors and tweaked the knobs before asking the FIRST question she could still pass the test, because he wasn’t asking her about her name as part of the test.

Furthermore, if the questions are subjective then what she believes is the truth, irrespective of the truth. Like if she is certain she saw John steal the apple she would pass that question, despite it really having been James.

I have a strong belief in the polygraph as a tool in reconciliation, but it needs to serve a purpose. That purpose should be related to creating a baseline. A point where you know the WS has told you the major parts of the infidelity and trusts you with the truth. This also means that if the WS fails it strongly indicates he/she doesn’t really grasp the seriousness, isnt willing to do the work and/or doesn’t have enough trust in you to be truthful. All factors that would make me seriously reconsider reconciliation.
This should be outlined BEFORE the test: Pass and we can build on this, fail and we are back to square one with divorce probably being my preferred option.

WhoTheBleep posted 7/4/2019 06:49 AM

Mehhhh....polygraph schmolygraph. If you're done, you're done. Continued lies are often the death knell for marriages. Not surprising.

(((Maise)))

Hephaestus2 posted 7/4/2019 07:14 AM

>>>>Mehhhh....polygraph schmolygraph. If you're done, you're done. Continued lies are often the death knell for marriages. <<<<

Exactly. Even if a lie detector could detect lies (it can't) when you're done, you're done.

Most of us can tolerate a bucketful of lies. But there is a tipping point.

A betrayed spouse is an infinitely sensitive lie detector. A betrayed spouse knows whether an unfaithful spouse has turned the corner and returned to the land where most people, most of the time tell the truth about the big things. A betrayed spouse knows when she/he has had enough with the lying already.

Hephaestus2 posted 7/4/2019 07:33 AM

>>>>Nobody has ever claimed that a polygraph proved if a person is a liar or not. It can only STRONGLY indicate if the person is telling the truth on the questions asked. <<<<

Tergiversate much?

cancuncrushed posted 7/4/2019 08:18 AM

We process things as we need to....NEED TO....

Poly is good if your going to R....
or when you have the insane need to know for sure...
an attempt to get some lies in control...

I don't see the need for one if D is on the way...or if they lie with every sentence...sometimes....they are not worth the effort...

It is always helpful, as mentioned....to finally see who they are...their choices...their prioritities….

When I finally D....it was more about who he was...who he would always be...not the details of the A.. I never would have thought, the details would mean nothing...

[This message edited by cancuncrushed at 8:19 AM, July 4th (Thursday)]

kickedintheknads posted 7/4/2019 09:19 AM

If your PG examiner is worth his salt, they will get the truth before the machine is even turned on. And usually, the "Parking Lot Confession" will reveal the info you want before you walk into the building. The PG is just an intimidation tool. If you are going for the D, there is no point in spending the money. Just file and move on with your life. You already know your WS is a cheater. What else do you need to know?

maise posted 7/4/2019 10:38 AM

Bigger, cancuncrushed, kickedintheknad,

I 100% agree that this is more about who my WS is rather than details of the A or a passing of a polygraph test. Which is why I don't care, and predicted this would make no difference to me. WS set this up I guess to prove something? I'm not sure what exactly this proves when the behaviors are the same and she's still a liar. I don't care about the passing of a polygraph. I didn't care when she set it up. The damage has been done and she continues to do more. That's nothing a polygraph test will pacify.

The1stWife, WhoTheBleep,Hephaestus2,

Yes, yes and yes! You all are spot on. It's pointless really, the concern is the lies, manipulations, and overall psychologically/emotionally abusive behavior. If that cycle doesn't stop, then seriously, there's nothing left to discuss.

It's literally always the same:

-WS vaguely states an issue she's having

-I offer my thoughts, a compromise, or suggestion for her to resolve or heal issue. OR IC, SLAA, sponsor, etc. offer suggestions to aid in issue.

-WS doesn't like the thoughts, or doesn't want to compromise/seek help/communicate, etc.

-WS then thinks; "I'll do what I want - what makes me feel good, as long as my BS doesn't know about it." (at my expense and WS's expense too if we're honest bc issue is still there and pacified now with unhealthy nothing)

-I find out and feel hurt and repercussions of WS's decisions.

-WS begs, pleads, says sorry, promises to change, 'this is the last time', I love you, tries to do externally kind things.

-If I attempt to protect myself here - then WS threatens suicide, destroys my property, contacts AP, sleeps it off, avoids and pretends like nothing happened, etc, etc, etc.

Rinse, Repeat.

The polygraph test won't make her any different in my eyes, when the cycle above which allowed for me to end up on this site and in this current state to begin with are still there. A person like this robs me of my choices, my voice, my reactions, and my ability to be in 'the know' of situations that directly impact me. Still capable, still destructive, still the same.

[This message edited by maise at 12:35 PM, July 4th (Thursday)]

sisoon posted 7/4/2019 10:44 AM

Most of us can tolerate a bucketful of lies. But there is a tipping point.

Thislife posted 7/5/2019 07:19 AM

I gave my WS a poly about 7 months after DDAY - at that point, he was in a 12 step program, IC, had hypnotherapy to retrieve the “I can’t remember” details, stopped drinking, stopped using adderall, had already left his job and began a new one and had began MC again. The polygraph was to help me clear up the details that just didn’t make sense - biggies to me.... he passed.
However, within weeks, I felt he convinced himself of those answers which is how he passed and now, that the polygraph was over, he would begin to see her again because the heat was off, he passed and the price of another poly was so high he was safe to resume his A because he was safe.
None of that was true or at least, the seeing OW again part didn’t happen but the poly made me crazy for a minute or two.
I had to look at his actions because the truth was the Affair happened - this wasn’t a nightmare! I had to decide if I wanted to actively love him still anyway and that is still the work in progress today.
Love yourself, watch WS’s actions - decide your future based on your gut instincts and feelings and don’t put all your eggs in the “if WS passes” basket ... it may or may not be enough for you! Mine would not have been without the action and almost wasn’t with the action.
Infidelity and it’s lies are a bitch!
(((Hugs)))

cocoplus5nuts posted 7/5/2019 07:53 AM

The damage has been done and she continues to do more.

maisel, gently, why are you still with her? She is manipulating you with her suicide threats and rages and all that other behavior. She won't change because she doesn't have to. She hasn't suffered any real consequences. Why are you allowing this?

maise posted 7/5/2019 08:30 AM

Cocoplus5nuts,

Well...sigh. I kicked her out at first. Then true to form - after a few months I felt bad about her living situation (I should have cared more about my feelings than hers) but of course, I didn’t. Because I’ve cared about others feelings over my own since I was 3 years old, beginning with my mother. Codependency of course, I’ve been trying like hell to break all of my codependency patterns. It’s been so hard to do while she’s been here trying to keep me in the same cycle she and I had while we were together.

I didn’t want her to move back in, and felt like I was letting myself down in that moment (I was), but I thought I could do an in house separation type deal. Since November I’ve asked her to move off and on. Then somehow I fall back into the same cycles and allow for her to stay. It’s been a mess. This time is the first time I actually wrote down this insanity circle for myself and saw it clearly for what it was and how it goes time after time. It’s toxic and abusive to me.

There was a lady that posted on here recently, she mentioned that part of her issue was realizing she had placed a large part of her ‘identity’ into rescuing/fixing/helping people. That’s me.

So lately I’ve been trying to continue keeping the distance physically, and I don’t do the “I love you’s” “I miss you’s” pet names type stuff. I managed to not treat it like it was before in many other ways since she’s been here. I’ve been journaling to find my toxic patterns/behaviors and working to break them. I go to IC of course, and purchased a book that was recommended to me to help me care for myself and my emotional state more instead. Recently I began shifting my focus to making sure I show up for me in every way. Meaning doing the things I love and not half-ass, making sure I do them with effort because they DO matter.

She always begs to stay when I ask her to leave. Says she’ll change. For a while there I was confused. She’d be doing all of these things, but i was still upset and not ok with her and couldn’t figure out why. I didn’t feel like it was effort but didn’t have the words for it.

She had:

Started IC since she’s been here, gone to SLAA since she’s been here, replaced all furniture where she had sex with AP, changed her number, restricted her phone, allowed me complete access to email/passwords, her phone, etc. Changed jobs, threw out anything reminiscent of AP, cut off people that knew of affair and sent NC’s to all AP’s (but keeps relapsing and calling the main one, went to her house in one instance but she wasn’t there). The poly I guess did prove what she's said was true regarding AP contact...not that I was putting anything into this polygraph test. It wasn't my doing to begin with. She checks in when she’s at work, she sends pictures and videos for proof, she has a tracker for her location, a sponsor for the program, posts/reads on here sometimes, has read many many recovery books, journals about her feelings, and ‘attempts’ to be there for me emotionally.

I say all of that because these were the reasons I was confused. She was doing these things and I was still not ok with her. I felt like she wasn’t there for me. It took a lot of digging to finally see the cycle I mentioned above. I wondered why I felt like a trapped animal, and why I was so resistant to her in so many ways, and so...just...angry. I felt like I was living in chaos - despite everything she was “trying” to do. Well, of course I am! Because it’s still so toxic. It’s only by my slow detachment that I’ve felt relief throughout this time.

I have no idea what I’m doing honesty.

[This message edited by maise at 10:58 AM, July 5th (Friday)]

cocoplus5nuts posted 7/5/2019 11:11 AM

It’s toxic and abusive to me.

Yes, it is. I'm glad you are starting to see that. Keep working on yourself. Have you read about the 180? Try to implement that. I think it would help you immensely.

maise posted 7/5/2019 15:46 PM

Yes, it is. I'm glad you are starting to see that. Keep working on yourself. Have you read about the 180? Try to implement that. I think it would help you immensely.

It's sad, and so heartbreaking...I remember I used to say: "This is my healthiest relationship yet!" when we were together. Eesh...just shows my patterns. Everyone else thought so too...even when I would raise concerns - they always seemed to think it was nothing and back her. Sigh.

Definitely continuing to work on me. I have seen the 180 and read it a few times. I've been trying hard to implement it - will continue to push on that. It's been rough.

[This message edited by maise at 3:48 PM, July 5th (Friday)]

cocoplus5nuts posted 7/5/2019 18:35 PM

I know it's sad and heartbreaking. You have invested a lot of time and energy into her. And, she just keeps on taking from you. Time for you to invest that time and energy into yourself.

maise posted 7/5/2019 20:01 PM

Absolutely, you’re right.

(((Cocoplus5nuts))))

Thank you