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InkHulk ( member #80400) posted at 2:00 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

he has expressed the desire to just move on.

This is the definition of rugsweeping. It is like getting a cancer diagnosis and saying you just want to live above it and ignore it. It just doesn’t work. There are countless stories of intense misery that you can read here from people who have tried it.

People are more important than the relationships they are in.

posts: 2190   ·   registered: Jun. 28th, 2022
id 8839094
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InkHulk ( member #80400) posted at 2:12 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Here’s the thing: you have no idea just how deeply you have wounded your husband. And that isn’t surprising, because unless you have been betrayed you can hardly imagine the depth of the pain. If you care to get a sense of it, read some stories here. Go over to JFO and read some of what is happening there. We can point you to threads where the author is particularly good at communicating their anguish. It’s incredibly bad, and you are going to need to gain an appreciation for it so you can give him the empathy and support he will need. Asking him to make marriage improvements for your benefit just does not have a place at this time

People are more important than the relationships they are in.

posts: 2190   ·   registered: Jun. 28th, 2022
id 8839095
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 2:13 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Okay, I guess that is up to him and his therapist the way he wants to move forward. I don't feel like I'm in any position to make him do anything he's not ready for or push him in any direction. His therapist gave him a list of marriage counselors so he's clearly getting the go-ahead from his therapist as well.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839096
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 3:09 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Do you think I need to be honest about how I saw a father figure in ap for my kids? He was a little league coach when his kids were little and he'd play with my kids and practice with them; something my husband really doesn't have the patience for I guess I would say. He was so patient and kind with them it really warmed my heart and that was how I ended up falling for him. It wasn't the way he looked, it wasn't anything sexual, it was essentially a father for my kids someone who wouldn't yell at them somebody who would be kind and play with them and rough house with them and be the kind of father that I wish my husband was.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839098
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InkHulk ( member #80400) posted at 4:09 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Do you think I need to be honest about how I saw a father figure in ap for my kids?

Yes, complete honesty. And this is another huge fear for a BH. I don’t tell you that to encourage you to hide it, but to be prepared for the degree of devastation that is coming. Do not underestimate the way this is going to destroy your BH. You must tell him, and you must do everything in your power to support him in any way he will allow you.

My wife said similar things about her AP. It turned out to be an act, he would literally growl at his own children when they asked for food. But it sure makes a guy look good in front of a woman.

[This message edited by InkHulk at 4:11 PM, Monday, June 10th]

People are more important than the relationships they are in.

posts: 2190   ·   registered: Jun. 28th, 2022
id 8839101
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 4:19 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Jesus, I just cant see how that is going to benefit him. I told him years ago I don't like the way he treats the kids and I still bring it up so he already knows how I feel. AP is actually a good father so that's not even something I can counteract.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839102
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InkHulk ( member #80400) posted at 4:42 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

You have been fantasizing about replacing him as a man, husband, and father, and you acted on it in meaningful ways. He deserves the right to know what has happened in his life so that he can make informed decisions on how to move forward.
Also, if you are going to have a future together, you need to learn the practice of not keeping secrets from each other. You can’t hold any secrets from the affair. It will remain as a wall between you and he will sense it.

People are more important than the relationships they are in.

posts: 2190   ·   registered: Jun. 28th, 2022
id 8839106
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icytoes ( member #79512) posted at 4:51 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Ellie,

Where was your husband when you and AP had time to play happy family with your kids?

posts: 63   ·   registered: Oct. 25th, 2021
id 8839109
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SadieMae ( member #42986) posted at 4:57 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Is AP currently married?

Me: BW D-day 3/9/2014
TT until 6/2016
TT again Fall 2020
Yay! A new D-Day on 11/8/2023 WTAF

posts: 1421   ·   registered: Apr. 3rd, 2014   ·   location: Sweet Tea in the Shade
id 8839112
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 5:03 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

I want to be honest and transparent, but What if he doesn't ask about it? If it never comes up that I saw AP like that I'm not understanding why I have to even mention it. I will if he asks. I'm creating a timeline rn to have for when he wants to talk or asks. It's hard to think back. I don't have dates or anything like that, I just remember the emotional part started last July and the physical part started early spring and we had sex a handful of times. We also texted a lot. I kept no texts or mementos or anything like that. I don't want it to sound like I'm hiding anything but I really don't remember specifics. All winter we really didn't see each other much bc of the poor weather. Ik an affair is an affair but I read some of the jfos here and my god some I can't even believe what I'm reading. Please help me understand what I need to say to help him.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839113
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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 5:04 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

I have a slightly different take.

Challenge your thoughts first. The reason I say this is as you come out of the fog, and you are deep in it, you will find there is a rebalancing of thoughts.

I think on this one, you only witnessed a very small percentage of the AP’s parenting. And on his best behavior in front of people.And you have also likely put a microscope on your husbands flaws in which some are exaggerated.

Our thoughts are not always truth. You just have to be cautious because I can’t tell you how many bs are haunted by the stupid shit ws say when they are in the fog. (I have my own list)

If you still feel it’s true I think you do need to be honest, but I would use caution and give it time.

Besides you didn’t cheat on your husband because of him. Comparing him to the AP is not what you should be doing. Evaluate him as his own person. What does he do right as a father, what does he do wrong.

It’s easy for an ap to look like they check off the boxes until you are home with them and see how they really are at different times - stressed, hungry, etc.

I am not saying lie. Honesty is best. But I think I would challenge myself to get to a balanced view of the situation.

What I found is the things I exaggerated about my husband was about me, not about him. If we are self critical, we are critical of others. If we feel excited by this ap then we immediately go into rewriting. I know you think you haven’t rewritten but you have already backed off many things you said about the situation already.

What I am basically underlining is you are very confused and talking out of both sides of your mouth. Make sure you feel solid on your truth before you share it. It shouldn’t Hugo out unexamined and I feel like you are still coming up with reasons to justify your affair and throwing him under the bus in the process.

And I would not have believed someone if they told me that. I felt like so many things were wrong with my husband. And you know what? Those things were his reactions to how I was living.

I don’t know if I would willy nilly share all the things right now. Because what happens is you change your mind but now have made a permanent imprint of things you thought fresh off the affair.

Again, be honest but challenge if this is real or not. I think a lot of what you say is to justify to yourself and to us. You would be far better off focusing on where you have gone wrong in the marriage and how you could have had a better impact.

[This message edited by hikingout at 5:14 PM, Monday, June 10th]

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

posts: 7319   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2017   ·   location: Arizona
id 8839114
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 5:09 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Ellie,

Where was your husband when you and AP had time to play happy family with your kids?

My husband goes away sometimes on the weekends or for one weekend day and we'd meet up or he'd come here.

If the kids were all outside playing we'd kiss and make out a bit. He would have dinner with us if it was an overnight trip with dh. I feel awful husband trusted me completely. Even if he did think it was odd, he never said anything. The kids were so happy and I just got sucked into it even though I KNEW it wasn't sustainable.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839115
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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 5:13 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Personally, my husband does know all the shit I thought but I didn’t dump it all on him in the beginning. After examining some of my thoughts I would tell him things like "I was finished with you because it seems like you had no idea how to emotionally connect with me. I am discovering that I contributed to that by not being authentic. It made it impossible for me to have that deep connection with anyone"

I think dumping a bunch of unexamined shit on him is going to traumatize him more. It’s a balance. Don’t stay with him if you are always going to think it’s for a paycheck and that he is a shitty husband and father.

Stay with him because you have learned to look at him more impartially, giving him credit with what he does right as well. I am going to guess there is a list of all sorts of things that are good traits that you have minimized.

You can’t have an affair and not rewrite marital history. I am convinced of that. Make sure to understand the truth and not the revised version. This is 100 percent documented common behavior by people who have affairs. So please sit with that because right now you do not know which end is up. You are saying too many contradictory things for me to think you have your head right or that you have gotten to the bottom of the truth about your marriage.

Relationships are two people interacting with each other and reacting to the other. You have a big role in what was wrong with your marriage you need to seek that out.

If you still mean all this shit later then you need to divorce him. Period.

[This message edited by hikingout at 5:15 PM, Monday, June 10th]

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

posts: 7319   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2017   ·   location: Arizona
id 8839117
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 5:30 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

I felt like so many things were wrong with my husband. And you know what? Those things were his reactions to how I was living.

Yes! This is why my therapist telling me he's abusive doesn't hit home. I feel like some of the way he is is bc of me. He's not happy with me or I add to his stress. Instead of supporting each other during those times, he yells and I retreat. She says I'm not responsible for his behavior but, come on...

I think I'm just getting impatient and what I need to do is take a step back and not just word vomit to him. He's not expecting a lot of what is being talked about here and I think I'm just going to take a breather. My mom is coming this wknd and we're going to go out to dinner.

The fog is mostly gone, I think, and it wasn't that thick to begin with. I never planned to leave husband for ap (leave maybe but not for someone else), ik ap has flaws, and ik living with someone is totally different than "playing house". I always felt awful for my husband, cried a lot, called it off a few times, was disgusted I was doing it, etc. Honestly, I felt compassion for ap bc he's had a hard life and fell in love with me as the mom his kids never had. Ik the emotions I felt were not real love. I do care about him as a person and a father (his kids are really amazing and he raised them himself) but I love my husband and that's who I'm loyal to and trying to focus on.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839118
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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 5:35 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Honey, you may be one of the foggiest Ws that have come in this site since it was me seven years ago.

I think that it’s important he know the truth about his life, but you have spent a lot of time exxagerating his flaws to keep the guilt powere while you have been having an affair.

If you still "love" the Ap, you are still in a fog, it lasts for months. I know this scrutiny is hard and you want to take the heat off yourself but you are still living a duel internal life. Until that clears the fog is thick.

I want to underline honesty is so important. I just don’t think you know what the truth is until you have had time to examine it with a clear head. Be intentional about this is all I am saying.

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

posts: 7319   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2017   ·   location: Arizona
id 8839119
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 5:36 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Stay with him because you have learned to look at him more impartially, giving him credit with what he does right as well. I am going to guess there is a list of all sorts of things that are good traits that you have minimized.

I have a list of positive traits of his. And I'm trying to dig deep for more bc it's been so long since I've focused on them. You're right, I need to see him as the person Ik he can be and I can help with that. For you long we've lived as individuals and I take responsibility bc I'm kind of a loner and have issues with working with ppl and that has crossed over into my marriage.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839121
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 Elliebellie (original poster member #84918) posted at 5:49 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

I think that it’s important he know the truth about his life, but you have spent a lot of time exxagerating his flaws to keep the guilt powere while you have been having an affair.

Yes I have here bc this is what my therapist is harping on. I have my last appt with her today, I believe, unless she is able to switch gears and focus just on my issues.

If you still "love" the Ap, you are still in a fog, it lasts for months. I know this scrutiny is hard and you want to take the heat off yourself but you are still living a duel internal life. Until that clears the fog is thick.

I do not love him. I never really did. I loved the feeling. A light switched on for me 10 months ago and it switched off a few weeks after we were found out. NC has been established since then. I was sad. I grieved, and now I'm ready to move forward. I can only hope my husband is still willing to move forward with me

posts: 174   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2024   ·   location: New England
id 8839123
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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 6:13 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

I feel still in love with ap but i think with time it will pass.

You wrote this on Friday.

I think your reaction is to deny things that make you feel bad when you are confronted about them.

I thought that I was in love with the ap too. I talked out of both sides of my mouth too. I never thought he was a bad dad, nor did I need his paycheck, nor did I play house with the ap and my kids. But all the other stuff I am saying I see in you is because I truly have been where you are. Stop denying culpability. That will take you very far. Do not be afraid to face yourself.

We can only change what we acknowledge.

And right now you don’t even know what the truth is, how can you give that to your husband?

[This message edited by hikingout at 6:16 PM, Monday, June 10th]

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

posts: 7319   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2017   ·   location: Arizona
id 8839126
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InkHulk ( member #80400) posted at 6:20 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

I’m not sure I agree, but I respect hikingout too much to press very hard on her balanced approach that does combine truth with time and tact.

I’ll just say that even if you come out of the fog and reject the fantasy that AP was the kids’ upgraded father, I think your husband deserves to know that you started there, that AP had access to his kids, that you risked the kids walking in on you being physical with him. These are all relevant, even if they were founded on indefensible beliefs.

And I have a very hard time reconciling the idea that you waiting on him to ask is anywhere close being fully transparent. That puts the betrayed in the position of playing the worst game of Battleship ever. They don’t know where the horrible is hidden, but you do. You sitting there hoping he doesn’t ask the right question, that is not being forthcoming.

People are more important than the relationships they are in.

posts: 2190   ·   registered: Jun. 28th, 2022
id 8839128
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HellIsNotHalfFull ( member #83534) posted at 6:25 PM on Monday, June 10th, 2024

Slight back track. For me, WWs AP did the same. He swooped in to play uncle/dad when I was out of the country and doing a job that limited my ability to communicate.

WW told me some awful shit, things like kids missed AP more then me (all lies might I add, I am a very involved dad). She had tons of pictures on her phone of AP playing with my kids, all kinds of shit.

Looked great, like he was this really amazing compassionate guy. Turns out, he was an abuser and was physically and emotionally abusing my oldest son because my oldest son was calling out AP.

Not saying your AP was or anything like that, but you really don’t have the full picture. It’s really easy to look like the best dad in the word when the kids aren’t yours and you don’t have any actual responsibility to them. How is he when he’s being puked on at 2 in the morning after working a 14 hour day, and his wife is trying to calm the other kids down because they are crying from being puked on as well? Sure ain’t the same as coaching little league.

Tell your BH anything he asks.

Let go of the "who would it benefit" idea. You aren’t protecting him by withholding information. You are being selfish and only protecting yourself. He has the right to know everything you thought/felt/whatever.

Edited to add. I am glad that I know everything I do. All of it. Shitbag was in my kids lives and having sex with my wife in my house I deserved to know all of the gory details.

[This message edited by HellIsNotHalfFull at 6:35 PM, Monday, June 10th]

Me mid 40s BH
Her 40s STBX WW
3 year EA 1 year PA.
DDAY 1 Feb 2022. DDAY 2 Jun 2022. DDAY 3/4/5/6/7 July 2024
Nothing but abuse and lies and abuse false R for three years. Divorcing and never looking back.

posts: 503   ·   registered: Jun. 26th, 2023   ·   location: U.S.
id 8839129
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