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My son has mental health issues. They are escalating.

He is still drinking. He hates me. Tonight I’m actually afraid for my safety.

Tonight started out with me picking him up from work. Normally if he is late coming out to the car, I just wait. No big deal. But tonight I was supposed to meet some friends for dinner and ‘catching up’ and I was already going to be late. So I called and told him I had dinner plans and whenever he was finished with what he needed to do, would he please come on out so we could get going. Came out in 15 minutes. Explained he had to stay to finish something. I said it was fine. That I just called to let him know about my plans in case he was just talking with coworkers.

Drive home was pretty much uneventful. Same as always. He puts in ear pieces and turns on his music. My friend from across country calls as she does most days as we are driving home. Our 7:00 pm is her 5:00 pm. This pisses him off…even though he isn’t talking to me. She and I talk 15 minutes…half the trip home.

I drop him off at home and drive to the dinner.

When I get home, he is outside with his music jacked way up. But it’s only 9:30 so I say nothing. I take care of my husband’s medication. I go to our den where I sleep. Turn on the TV low to lull me to sleep. Have to be up in 4 hours to prepare for more of my H’s medication.

Then I hear a very loud rumbling sound. It’s about 11:00 now. I step outside to the front porch and ask what the noise is. He shows me his latest toy. A big boom box kind of thing, with a microphone. And he is talking into it really loud. I just shake my head and go inside.

In no time, he has the microphone and music jacked way up. I open the door and ask him to turn it down. He mouths something, and I say, more forcefully, "It’s late, You need to turn it down".

He stomps into where I am and screams at me. I can’t even remember exactly what. I tell him he needs to grow up. He tells me the same thing.

Now he’s super pissed. He jacks the music up even louder. It’s 11:45 PM. I wait about 10 minutes, then go outside and tell him he needs to turn it down. That it is almost midnight. He says the neighbors don’t care. That I’m the only one who cares. I tell him more strongly to turn it down. He gets up and comes toward me. I’m actually a bit fearful. But then I see he is coming towards me because he has set the boom box right outside my door. So he moves it, but keeps it loud. I come inside.

This is awful (my opinion) music. F-ing this and f-ing that. I’m humiliated in my neighborhood. I’m certain people can hear even the lyrics it’s so loud. But no one ever calls the police. I’m sure if they did, he would say that it was me who called.

After about 10 minutes, he turns it completely off.

Then he calls someone. Starts screaming (about me) into the phone. I’m the worst f—— mother in the world…not even a mother…certainly not HIS mother. (I don’t know if he was referring to the fact that he is adopted). Lots and lots of out of control yelling to his friend about me.

Then I hear…"I’m about to f—- her up." "It’s either her or me." I was actually afraid of my own son.

Now, 2 hours later, it is quieter. Still talking sh#t about me, but also about saving his money so he can get a vehicle and go to another state to live. One where he can transfer from where he works now to another one of their stores.

He has worked there for about 15 months. 3 days ago he was talking about joining in a lawsuit against the company because they don’t let them take breaks. (Warehouse work).

I try to make sense of all this.

Whenever he goes off to me or to a friend about me, he always includes something like "She has no idea who I am!"

Once, when we were headed to his work, just about a mile from the house, (I have taken him to and from work for about a year now) and he had his music on REALLY loud. I asked him to please put his earplugs in. He refused. Yelling. "You’re going to listen to this!" "You need to listen to this!"

I explained that I wasn’t going to be forced to listen to it for 30 minutes on the way to his work. He said that "Yes I was! Then he whipped out his phone and said he was going to record me. That he was going to show people how terrible I am. I told him I would like to give him a ride to work if he wanted me to, but that I wasn’t going to be forced to do something I didn’t choose to do. He just kept the phone on me, so I drove back home.

I recognized the song from something he plays a lot while he sits on the porch. I remember it because whenever I go in or out of the house, he turns it way up. It is sort of a "I’m so misunderstood" and "Nobody cares" kind of music. Except it’s full of foul (to me) language, and very "woe is me".

I had to go pick up my SIL and when I got back I asked him…"Are you sure you don’t want me to take you to work?" He said he had already called his boss to explain that he couldn’t get to work because I wouldn’t take him. Said he had been fired. The next morning he asked if I would take him to work…as if none of it had happened.

This happens in waves. Every so often. Lately it happens more often, and is more intense. He doesn’t take his meds. He drinks most days.

I tell my H and he says to call the police. When I say no, he says he doesn’t know what else to do.

Now he is going in and out of the house, opening and closing doors. I don’t know if he is just being dramatic, or if he has a friend coming to get him. Or maybe he’s going to live in the truck?

I don’t want to open a blind or go near the front door, afraid of what it will start.

Sorry about the novel. I have no idea why I’m telling y’all all of this. Maybe burning off anxiety.

I just don’t know what to do.

You know…this is going to sound perverse, but I feel like a part of this reminds me of how I related to my H after he did that thing which we do not speak of here.

I have to admit that I wanted H to hear songs that mirrored our situation. To get a response from him. And how I berated him about being a terrible H, etc. I mention this NOT to deal with that topic here, but to wonder out loud if there could be any connection.

Maybe I’ve let my son down - whether in reality or in his mind. And he is shoving descriptive music at me, and telling me how horrible I am…to somehow get me to provide him with something he believes I have not given before. I know he is right when he says I don’t "know" him. It’s so hard to understand him when he is all over the place like this.

He is always saying I treat him differently than his brothers. Told his friend on the phone tonight that I give my youngest son (the one incarcerated) all the money. ??? I guess he is referring to the money I send him weekly that allows him to call, and to also talk with his son. And I contribute to his son’s daycare expense. I don’t apologize for this because he is my grandson, and my son has let him down, but I won’t let the child or his mother suffer because of that. But I can’t think of how this has taken any money away from my other sons.

Ok, so maybe I’m just entirely off my rocker now. It’s 3:30 AM and I’m just super tired and scared.

I worry this will end badly. He will leave home and be estranged from us. Or will hurt me. Or worse, himself.

70 is really great so far!

I am so sorry to read this. It is hard to deal with irrational thoughts and trying to be logical doesn’t help.

I don’t know what options you have if your son doesn’t take his medication and drinks. You know it’s a bad combination.

It’s unfortunate he terrorizes you.

He may be better off in a different home environment. Like a group home where he gets the best care and where they can address his issues and provide the help he needs.

Sorry I don’t have better advice.

From what I read, your son is crying out for help.

Are there days when you drive home with your son and don't take any phone calls? Does that have any effect on his behaviors later? It sounds like he wants your attention during this time, even though he is listening to his music.

"You need to listen to this!"

Can you get the name of the song? I'll look up the lyrics for you so you can read it. Then you don't have to hear the music you don't like, but you can read what the song is about. And get to know him a smidge more.

Wasn't he going to do treatment? I guess that didn't work out. Sounds like a heart to heart conversation is needed with him when you're both calm. Does he say why he won't take his medication? Do you know what his diagnosis is? Is a group home an option? My previous job involved going to group homes and there were a few that were strictly for people who have behaviors. I rarely saw a behavior while I was there due to the fabulous workers maintaining the peace.

Does your son have a social worker? That would be a great benefit in getting things started for him. Maybe not even for now, but what is he going to do later in life? Can he function living without your support?

(((WR)))

Hi WR,

Been following your story for a while now. I'm really feeling for you in this difficult spot you're in. Please know the following is blunt, but is said out of a place of care and concern.

Your son is unstable and showing that he WILL NOT care for himself to make himself safe for those around him. I think at this point, since he is a fully grown and large adult male, your H is dead on in advising calling the police.

He's right in one way- he needs something YOU can't provide- SELF CONTROL. You're not going to be able to teach him this at this point in his life. It's gut wrenching because your emotional attachment to him is so strong. HOWEVER, I'm afraid that allowing him to continue to stay in your home is enabling him to continue behaving like an out of control 12 year old (and it's a disservice to most 12yo's I know to say that). A 12 year old in a grown man's body. A body that will at some point be capable of devastating damage to your personal property or even violence to your body.

From one enabler to another- I'm seeing your situation deteriorate, and truly you are not parenting in his best interest at this point. His being able to stay in your home enables him to rage, lash out, act recklessly. You are not providing him the CONSEQUENCES he NEEDS to learn and grow.

I'm very afraid for you and your family's future if he is enabled in his bad behavior further by having you drive him to work and allow him to live in your home while exhibiting these behaviors. He's not 14 years old any more. My kids (11 and 13) have to take medication daily. I don't have to remind them any more to take it. He is a grown man, and while his issues are more severe than theirs, it is HIS CHOICE to not take his meds.

He is CHOOSING to behave this way towards you and your family and neighbors. He is CHOOSING to not take care of himself (and drink and buy "toys" when he needs a car). He is CHOOSING to bring guns into your house. He is CHOOSING to ABUSE you in his language and intimidating behavior.

Now, you can't keep him from his choices. HOWEVER, you CAN CHOOSE not to accept him in your house any more. That's not to say you don't accept him in the family. He is a grown adult and capable of buying alcohol, toys and guns. He is therefore capable of finding his own way to housing and a ride to work. YOU are capable of choosing safety and peace for yourself, your husband, your granddaughter and your neighbors. He needs to go. He needs to be pushed. He needs YOU to PROVIDE that push into adulthood.

What do you think will happen when your H dies? It is likely to be in the next year or two from his deteriorating health. You've mentioned before that your H was one of the only people your wayward son listens to. What do you think will happen then? That your wayward son will magically "get it" in his grief? I see only him going further off the rails and escalating his behavior into physical violence. At that point, I truly fear for your life.

I hate to reply to this, but I think it's that important. I probably seem like the new kid on the block, but I've been reading this site for 10 years so although I only recently started posting, I know who's who at the zoo, so to speak.

I couldn't agree more with MIgander. You've made enough excuses for this man. There are people who were born way more disadvantaged then he was who make lives for themselves. He has no right to make you feel threatened in your own home. He makes me so angry for you! He would be out on his ear so fast if he was my child. No one deserves to put up with that. The apron strings need to be cut, and they need to be cut now. Let God and let go, and all of that. He needs to figure his life out on his own now.

WR, his behavior is not about something you did or did not do. He is sick. He has a mental illness. You cannot rationalize what he says and does. He may not know why he is angry.

The only way he is going to change and get better is to get professional help which may or may not help.

I grew up with a parent that was mentally ill. You can drive yourself crazy and make yourself sick by trying to understand them and trying to prevent them from having angry outbursts. I had a knife thrown at me just missing my face for no reason. I also came home from work in the dark to find I was locked out of the house for no reason. A girl my age in a neighboring town had just been abducted leaving work, raped and murdered. What parent would not leave lights on and make sure their teenaged daughter was home safely?

People with these illnesses make no sense. I'm not sure to what degree they choose their behaviors. I was a really good, easy, respectful kid yet I was put through hell and back.

None of this is your fault.

Please be careful. People like your son can be dangerous. I did nothing to provoke that sharp knife coming at me and I didn't see it coming.

(((WR)))

Agree wholeheartedly with MIgander. A little tough love.

Thank you for the responses.

To answer some questions:

Can you get the name of the song?

Yes. I have planned to wait till he calms down but that hasn’t happened yet. Well, my sister has been taking him to and from work. When I feel he is open to it, I will ask him for the lyrics. My guess is that he will say I won’t like it due to the bad language. It’s almost like he sabotages healing.

Wasn't he going to do treatment?

He has been to a psych hospital 3 different times over the years. Just when he feels suicidal. Stays 5-7 days and comes home his old, kind, smiling, loving self. Then stops taking meds, and it begins to "turn" and escalate again. Sometimes months/years between visits to the hospital. Then he gradually stops taking his meds, and it goes slowly south again.

Does he say why he won't take his medication?

He insists that he IS taking his meds. I know he is not because he has to see the dr each month to get them, and he never leaves the house.

Do you know what his diagnosis is?

He tells me he has been told he is psychotic. I have no way to know if that’s true. He says he hears voices.

Is a group home an option?

He doesn’t actually behave so badly that I would have reason to hospitalize him or put him in a facility myself, against his will. And he doesn’t think he needs that.

Does your son have a social worker?

I don’t even know how to go about that.

Can he function living without your support?

If he had his truck functioning, he would have no problem going to and from work, preparing his own meals, etc. He would LOVE to be on his own in theory. But once he got angry and left and moved into an apartment type housing. He lasted a couple of months, then called me and was suicidal. He called the police himself to come get him. Told me that afternoon that he doesn’t do well on his own.

your H is dead on in advising calling the police.

I get it, but tell them what? "He is playing his music too loud"? Or, "He is cursing at me"? And I can’t kick him out, even if I wanted to, without going through a legal process of eviction. And if I told the police that he said he was going to "F—- me up" there would be no way that I could say with certainty that that meant to hurt me. Physically.

I understand what you are saying, but I can’t kick him out. I know he is not ready to make the kind of decisions to enable him to live his life somewhat successfully.

I guess I will wait till I think he is calmed down enough to talk calmly. It’s just that any honesty on my part makes him feel that I am demeaning him. In some ways I believe he does care what I think, but if I disagree with the least thing, he takes it as rejection.

Money is extremely tight right now. With all of my husbands hospitalizations, bills, and life insurance policies that we obtained when our finances were better. But I plan on somehow finding someone to go and see myself. I don’t think he is ready. But maybe I could talk with someone and they could tell me the proper way to approach him about trying to figure out a better way to coexist.

Record the threats and actions and get a restraining order against him. He's drifting so far from reality that everyone's safety is at risk. What will happen to your WH if your son incapacitates you? To your other son and grandchild? To your mentally ill son himself, who will have to face the legal consequences of what he's done? Even if you take your own right to live peacefully out of the equation (which you shouldn't), your responsibility to every other person in this scenario is to take legal action to protect yourself.

If your son loves you deep down inside, he won't be able to live with having seriously hurt or killed you. And if he doesn't -- if he's listened to his demons to a level where he's convinced himself that you are evil -- then you cannot risk allowing this behavior to play out to its likely conclusion.

If your son loves you deep down inside, he won't be able to live with having seriously hurt or killed you.

Help me understand this.

How frequently is he using alcohol?

WR— i don’t have kids nor have I dealt with serious mental illness, so take anything I say in that context.

Your son has to learn how to manage his condition. He may not have caused it, but neither did you.
You need to set the expectation that to live under your roof and take advantage of your largess, he must be adequately managing his mental health. One day you will not be able to help him as much as you do now. He needs to be ready. And if he will not do this, then he is not okay to be part of society - he will hurt himself or others. His origin story is really sad but as we tell everyone on SI, our FOO is our own to deal with. No one can do that for us.

And you already have to take care of your H - you don’t have the bandwidth or energy to take on more. Your H actually can’t do things for himself. Your son can but chooses not to. (Again, not dismissing his condition, but he CAN do it.)

We’re all team WR here— and we see you under such insane amounts of stress. I fear what you are doing to your body with those stress hormones running 24x7 for so many years. You are strong, loving, compassionate woman. Please put you first. It’s what is best for you and your adult sons.

Sorry this became a novel, but I think you need this perspective.

This sounds like my next door neighbor’s son. Mid-30s, still lives with them, bi-polar with delusions (last diagnosis I know of), so bad that he’s actually on disability. I get the joy of listening to his obnoxious screaming (when his parents aren’t home, so clearly there’s some self-control there) where he stands outside on their side porch. He has his own dog, but greatly enjoys mentally abusing mine ("I’m just talking to her and making noises at her for fun!" Despite being told repeatedly over the last 8 years that it triggers her anxiety.)

A couple of years ago, he was escalating. I’ve no idea if he stopped taking meds, but something clearly wasn’t working. His parents called the cops on him a couple of times, but were basically told they couldn’t do anything if he was just being "obnoxious" because he could hold it together long enough to make the police and doctors think he’s fine. Clearly some forethought and self-control to his threats/acting out, to be able to do that. His parents (his mom, really) refuse to throw him out because she’s afraid he’ll end up homeless/dead, and don’t have money for a halfway house of some kind. In his escalation, at some point we also became the bad guy – nonsense about we were helping his parents sell drugs or something, in his ranting. In reality, all we did was our best to avoid him – which meant looking out windows before taking the dog out, trying to hustle past without speaking if he was outside. It wasn’t even our kid nor are we particularly close to his parents, but we also have had to structure our lives around his issues. They’ve locked up all their kitchen knives and tools to keep him from turning them into weapons. He’d never done anything with them, but always insisted he "needed" to have various weapons. Found new ones as fast as they took them away.

Things came to a head when he was home alone one day, and my camera picked him up out in front of their house, swinging something around (found out later it was a "sharpened" butter knife, I believe). He was ranting (mostly incomprehensible and racist nonsense) and eventually made his way up onto my porch, yelling at my door, and spitting on it. I was WFH that day, in my basement, and didn’t see the video until a couple hours after it happened. I texted the clips to his mother and told them they need to get him sorted out, first time I’ve said something about him. Shortly after, I suddenly had several family members begging me to call the cops. I did, and there was a lot of back and forth with the cops, his family (two siblings arrived, and the parents) and eventually him when they found him later (he took off when he saw the cops turn up), and I filed for a restraining order and he got carted off to the bin for two weeks. The family’s options had been limited by not wanting to throw him out, but the minute he made threats against someone else, they had the ability to have him put involuntarily.

He's been somewhat better since, but still yells a lot, obnoxious to us and my dog. We’re hoping to move in a few years, because his parents are getting older, I’m reasonably sure there’s no real plan for what happens to him after they’re gone, and I expect over a few years, he’ll eventually become immune to these meds and the cycle starts again. Whether he’s the one that offs his parents, or it’s natural causes, I think is 50/50. And I don’t want to be here when it happens.

Point being, his parents had no idea (and probably still don’t realize the extent) of how much this was affecting us, also. We weren’t in a position to do anything because until the incident on camera, nothing was "bad" enough for us to step in and we didn’t feel like it was really our place to talk to the parents or the cops. Other neighbors have complained to us about his behaviors, but I don’t know how much any of them have told the parents. His parents are stuck because they refuse to take drastic measures. But enough calls to the cops eventually helped. He was known to them because his parents called enough times, that when someone else called, it had that much more oomph. You may not want to call in what you suspect are probably empty threats. Your neighbors may not want to call because they don’t want to become targets (or are targets of some sort and fear escalation). But someone is going to have to do something. Nothing changes, if nothing changes.

I wish you the best, because it’s not easy.

Take all threats as serious.

Thanks for your responses, and concern.

I am trying my best to figure out what is best.

I have been very respectful toward him, but very reserved with limited interaction. He is acting as if nothing happened. General conversation. As if he is trying to come up with something to talk about in order not to take responsibility or make amends. Also, he finds identity with exaggerations regarding his personal life. If he stumps his toe, he "dislocated or broke it". Once we were talking about what all his dad has been going through. (C5-6 quadriplegia, multiple antibiotic resistant infections, dangerously high / low BP.) My son said "That’s not as bad as what has been happening to me at work!" I said, "Your dad is PARALYED" and he said, "Yeah, but…"

This is a very full week as we are preparing for my H to be honored. Next week I will try to get an appointment with a mental health professional to ask for guidance in how to proceed.

Tonight he sort of hurt my feelings. He asked me out of the blue what it meant if an illness was in "stage four". I asked if he knew what illness. He said brain cancer. So I told him that usually stage four was quite serious and probably the end stage of life for some people. He told me that he had a close friend that was in her 70s and that she had stage four lung cancer. And what did I think that meant. I told him that I wasn’t a doctor, but that it was very serious.

Then he explained their friendship. How he had met her through someone he had lived with and that she was older and her daughters weren’t very kind to her and did not do things for her. So he would go over and do things for her.

I don’t guess he realized the irony. Because now he does nothing for me, and I am about the same age as the woman he is referring to. So he goes over to her house and helps her when her children won’t help her. But when he is at our house HE is the child that won’t help his mother.

Some days it’s hard to maintain self-respect around here!

Have you tried contacting NAMI for resources?

Cat

Nearest meetings are an hour away. Not able to leave H for that amount of time right now.

I have been totally ignoring him since the latest incident I shared. I don’t mean, ignoring as in refusing to interact. I just mean that I do not start conversations with him. And the result has been that he has approached me to talk with me, or to ask me a question that was not entirely"necessary". I answer politely and as briefly as possible.

I plan to get some professional advice about how to coexist with him seeing how he feels about me, and the fact that I am not willing at this point to put him out of the house to live on the streets. Even if I have to have a very muted relationship with him, if it will help him, I can do that. I’ll see what the professionals say.

I really appreciate all of your advice.

That sounds like a good plan. You are an incredibly strong women.

So, yesterday my H’s home town inducted him into their Sports Hall of Fame. It was really very nice. Meant a great deal to my H. He has been pushing his wheelchair up and down the road and working with an OT to get stronger. He is finished with the 6 week antibiotic infusions.

The day before the event my son who is the subject of this thread, was acting like he was drinking a little. I texted him and said that it was going to make his dad so happy that he was joining us (he got off work). I said that I hoped he would not drink before the event because it could embarrass his dad, and that I knew that was not what he would want to do. No response…positive or negative.

Our 2 sons who presently live with us went with us. Along with other family members. I can’t begin to express how WONDERFUL it was to have an evening of NO DRAMA.

We joked and laughed on the 1 1/2 hr drive there and back.

Today he is drunk again. I went outside and saw him sitting on the front porch drinking. I asked him if he was sitting there drinking. He said, "Yeah, it’s legal". I replied, "Not on my front porch".

That was that.

I ran an errand. My grandbaby’s mama had borrowed my car and she brought it back, but needed me to run her to her sisters where her car was.

I’m guessing this somehow pissed my son off. When I got home, I could hear him from inside my car in the driveway…when he’s drunk, he yells on the phone. Lots of f—-ing this and that. One "MF". But the jest of it was that I’m a horrible person, that I care more about my grandbaby’s mama than him, and that she was out buying and using meth in front of her daughter. I was just with her. We were discussing the baby’s first day of school and the new job she was trying to get at a different daycare. A job that I feel SURE she would be drug tested for.

Anyway, I opened my car door and just listened for a while. It’s sad when listening to that vile stuff about me spewing out of his mouth. And the girl he was telling all of that to replying that I might think I’m "all that", but I’m not. Of course, she has never met me. Then she proceeded to tell my son about how today she was babysitting with some kids. She let them watch a movie on her phone and she went to sleep, leaving them with no supervision. "I mean, it wasn’t good, but, ya know, I was tired." SMH

I just came on inside. He saw me as I was entering the side door. Can’t say if he realized I had heard all that. Shortly thereafter, he hung up and cranked up his music.

Then I lifted the window close to him up just a tad to hear if he was making any threatening comments re me. What I heard, was…"I’m sorry, I can only take so much." Then…"No, I don’t THINK I’m the shit…I AM the shit. I’ll come over there and f—k you, and then I’ll f—k your mama."

How is it possible that my precious baby boy has become this vile person??? I don’t know that I will ever know how to help him, or that he will decide / be able to help himself. 😢😢😢

I can’t decide if it is better to have one pleasant, enjoyable family day together with no drama, and then return to it…with a vengeance. Or just to never have a break at all.

THE PEACE OF WILD THINGS

by Wendell Berry

When despair grows in me

and I wake in the night at the least sound

in fear of what my life and my children’s lives

may be,

I go and lie down where the wood drake

rests in his beauty on the water, and the great

heron feeds.

I come into the peace of wild things

who do not tax their lives with forethought

of grief. I come into the presence of still water.

And I feel above me the day-blind stars

waiting for their light. For a time

I rest in the grace of the world and I am free.

[This message edited by WhatsRight at 7:19 AM, Monday, August 7th]