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DD July 2022 My DH of 8 years Past 2 yrs since DD with AP. We have six year old twin daughters together.

Well, we ended up becoming officially married last month. He wanted to do it. I of course want him and wish he never had the affair. He does IC once a week and so do I. We are scheduled for a new couples therapist.

He loves me. I love him. He says the affair wasn’t about me. He has feelings of anger and guilt when I act sad or angry or talk about the affair. If I feel insecure or depressed or unworthy, talking to him, he can’t understand why I don’t move on or let it go already. Why I can’t just let him love me and give him a second chance and just move on. I don’t know why either. I get upset thinking about how he messaged her and wanted her all the while I was at home in bed waiting on him to come home.

I feel just pathetic. She was not hot but overweight with two or three kids, redheaded, tattooed and pierced nipples (which I am not) and drank miller lite and managed a tire store. He used her as a sec slave basically just like the help to take care of his d$ck. And I’m jealous because I feel like she was desirable to him. Even though I know I’m more physically attractive, he wanted her and to control her. And I’m jealous that he didn’t want to control me and desire me and want me. And it eats me alive. I don’t understand why he is with me now. Why he stays with me or chooses me now when that’s what he needed to satisfy himself. And I feel like I’ll never give him that thrill and excitement that she did. And the whole thing I envy the passion or sex they had and how here I was at home cleaning or being a house wench and had no clue. I pity myself for being here and for not ever questioning where he was and for trusting him blindly.

I’ll be okay for a few days and then I start to like realize all this again and think about times he seemed so normal and how I had no clue. And he is getting where he just leaves the house now and I’m left here in bed being miserable and he’s angry and doesn’t want to tolerate me anymore. And it makes me angry that he is so inconsiderate to think I can tolerate what he did and let it go and then he doesn’t have to tolerate me going crazy and "punishing" him again and again.

I feel stuck.

I am early into this process, my DD was July 22 as well though I was getting the picture in Dec 2021.

He is not being a safe partner with his treatment of you when you show or express your emotions. This is not someone who is a candidate for reconciliation right now imo.

You sound normal, albeit hurting as one does, to me. And, honestly, this might be unpopular....but so does he. Is he taking space, a breather, a moment away from your intense feelings - because he doesn't know how he can help, but still being a safe partner....or is this bad behavior? The first 2 years I was on a roller coaster of anger and sadness and grief. How could he do this? And with her? I didn't intend on punishing him over it, but my reaction hit him hard.(Not apologizing for that) My reaction, and I'll quote, made him feel like "utter garbage". I couldn't change that for him. He had to work through his guilt. And he couldn't change how devastated I was. What he could do was to be trustworthy, even if I didn't trust him. I could tell him what I thought I might need in those moments without attacking him. "I really need you to hold me right now". "I need you to say something about how you're feeling now with me". "I need to hear something reassuring". Not the why of it....he knew that. When I pointed that out, it brought us both back to the past.

There comes a time when you have to decide whether or not to pull together to heal or if this is a deal breaker for you both. You don't have to do that right now. But, you will have to work hard leaning into each other for this to work.

I'm SO sorry you're here. It was/is the hardest part of my life thus far. It is also not linear. I'd feel great for a day and then wretched. How have things improved so far? If they have?

He has feelings of anger and guilt when I act sad or angry or talk about the affair. If I feel insecure or depressed or unworthy, talking to him, he can’t understand why I don’t move on or let it go already. Why I can’t just let him love me and give him a second chance and just move on. I don’t know why either.

Sounds like you already have your first topic for your new MC, and you'll know instantly whether or not you have a good MC with how they advise you on this. A lot of people who have experienced infidelity will tell you it's a pain bigger than losing a loved one, and that recovery takes several years.

I pity myself for being here and for not ever questioning where he was and for trusting him blindly.

I’ll be okay for a few days and then I start to like realize all this again and think about times he seemed so normal and how I had no clue.

We believed in our partner and we believed in the story that we were telling ourselves, and then we find out that nothing was as it seems. It's a huge blow. Huge. I trusted my H implicitly even as the red flags were flapping in my face, and I'm a pretty smart person. It just wasn't something that was on my radar as plausible. Please don't beat yourself up because you trusted someone who promised to be trustworthy.

My reaction, and I'll quote, made him feel like "utter garbage". I couldn't change that for him. He had to work through his guilt. And he couldn't change how devastated I was. What he could do was to be trustworthy, even if I didn't trust him.

100% this.

We tell ourselves (as the BS) so many things.

Why the cheater was attracted to the AP and what the affair meant to the cheater etc.

The BS tries to rationalize and "understand" the affair. Why they chose the AP they did (most often it wasn’t a choice but it was just the AP was the one that says yes to being the OM/OW).

Here’s the thing though. The cheater really doesn’t understand the hurt and trauma the BS feels.

I am almost 10 years past dday1 and the affair. My H was kicking me to the curb to be with the OW. It’s a miracle we are not D.

Last week we were talking finances and I made a comment about credit card debt (which he has but it’s minimal). My H said you always say "my CC debt and your CC debt but it’s our CC debt".

I looked at him and said no it’s not. We do not have joint CC accounts. And the thing that gets me through this is knowing that if I had to leave you or you left me, I’m not responsible for your bills. And I would financially be ok.

He really had no idea the trauma caused by an affair.

Here is my advice. Always always have $ in your own name. Just in case. Always always know your financial position and where your assets/accounts are.

Not b/c of a D. But because if anything in life. Illness. Disability. Death. It is important to know where the $ is and what you own and who you owe.

I learned this the lesson the hard way.

Love is an action. He is not acting as if he loves you.

What you are feeling is normal. It takes 3 to 5 years to heal,if you have a remorseful WS. You don't have that. It will be nearly impossible to heal with him as he is.

He expects you to rugsweep. Which an unremorseful WS always wants. They got to have their fun,and now no consequences. He's done no work to become a safe partner. He's still wayward.

If you express any feelings that aren't positive and glowing about him,he gets angry.

And now,he is abandoning you when you are in pain.

He's not reconciliation material. He's emotionally abusive.

[This message edited by HellFire at 2:03 PM, Sunday, March 12th]

I’m sorry he has done this to you, healing is two steps forward and one step back. It’s a roller coaster ride. Your H doesn’t understand the pain you are in, he should be doing everything possible to help you.

he can’t understand why I don’t move on or let it go already.

Exactly what I’m saying he is more focused on how he feels, it selfish and un-remorseful. He is not ready to R until he can put you ahead of him.

The AP, he targeted the weak and wounded. He wanted someone to feel superior over. Neither of them are in your league, you are much better.

So tonight we were doing okay. Then I asked him if she ever tried to contact him or if she did would he tell me. And then he was like don’t start. And I paused. And was like why? Why do you get defensive when I talk about it? It’s just causing me to build more resentment and not gain any reassurance and I asked him if he is trying to reconcile. And then he goes on to say reconcile is a big word I must have gotten off the internet today.
I don’t get it. I don’t get how he doesn’t just let this guard down or this macho man, know it all. Like he makes me feel like I’m in the wrong for talking about it. Like I shouldn’t at all. And if I tell him I need to talk about the affair, he says he is done talking about it. That he is done apologizing and he isn’t going to keep apologizing. Like I’m annoying or insecure (which I now am). But it just hurts still. I still feel heartbroken. And he acts like I’m holding us back from being happy because I won’t just let it go.
We haven’t had our new MC session yet. And my IC is in two days.
I’m just afraid that he may never get it. He may never or not be able to get me ever. And I feel like I’m the one messing our relationship up. Like I’m ruining it. Now he says he didn’t do anything to our relationship that the affair wasn’t about me.
We got officially married three weeks ago. He cried, he was sincere, he tells me he loves me and he’s never going to cheat again and he didn’t appreciate me before and didn’t know it would hurt me so bad him cheating and he could never do it again because now he knows from the look I had on my face when I found out. He said that b$tch ruined our relationship. (Not taking responsibility) said if she ever contacted him he would tell her to F off and tell me.
I don’t understand why people do cheat on a relationship. I really don’t get it. I would have never done that to him.
I’m just worried that I’m going to regret staying later down the road and wasting my time on us, we have kids too in kindergarten and I don’t want them to be affected by this.
I don’t trust him and I don’t know how to help him to show me that I can trust him I guess. I font know how I can ever trust him completely and I find myself resenting him a lot. And he says what else do I have to do to show you I want to be with you. He does IC, dishes once week, tried to get home right after work, it’s basically feels like back to normal before the cheating.
Kids came in for helping them before bed so we didn’t finish talking. He got his pillow and went downstairs to sleep like he isn’t going to tolerate listening to me talk about the affair.

Actually he will never be done apologizing if he is serious. He doesn't seem to be.

[This message edited by This0is0Fine at 3:06 PM, Tuesday, March 14th]

And he says what else do I have to do to show you I want to be with you. He does IC, dishes once week, tried to get home right after work, it’s basically feels like back to normal before the cheating.

You keep telling him what you need and he keeps denying you. You say, "I need to talk". He says, "stop talking about it". You say, "I need to know why you did this". He keeps telling you, "no reason". You say, "what has changed so I know you won't do this again". He says, "I didn't like causing you pain", and he says that... WHILE HE'S CAUSING YOU MORE PAIN.

The guy isn't listening. Nothing has changed since your last thread except that you went ahead and married him without making sure he actually did the work. Now that his lack of work ethic has been rewarded with your acceptance of it, he doesn't want to do the work.

It's not hard to find out what a BS goes through when they've been cheated on. This is the INFORMATION AGE. It's all right there at our fingertips. All we have to do is look. Did he read, How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair by Linda McDonald? Heck, sometimes you can find that one free for download and it's less than 100 pages. How about Not Just Friends by Shirley Glass? A little more lengthy but what an epic resource for building boundaries. Does he know anything about emotional trauma and how the brain processes intimate betrayal? Can he tell you which parts of the brain are affected or what kind of biochemicals are released into the body during triggers? Color me cynical, but I don't think you'd be posting what you have here if he did.

We don't get cookies for doing WHAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING. He needs to wash dishes when it's his turn because he likes to eat off dishes. He needs to come home from work straightaway because you BOTH have children to raise and they didn't just spring forth from your mind like Athena from Zeus's head. Why does he think routine responsible behavior should exonerate him from the process of reconciliation and relationship recovery? He must be some kind of special case, huh? Every other cheater has work to do, but hey.. he washed a load of dishes last week.

Believe me, I know how hard it is to set boundaries with people. It's been my WORST thing all my adult life. But we don't help the ones we love by expecting less of them. When we set the bar low, we get the bare minimum. Set it high though, and sometimes people will rise to the occasion.

This guy is NOT LISTENING. Consider pointing that out to him and see whether or not he's willing to make a change. Talking is healing. If he's not willing to talk about it, how can you heal as a couple? Where's the emotional intimacy in that? Right now, he's basically prioritizing his comfort over yours. He's denying you what you need because he doesn't want to sit in his uncomfortable feelings.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 5:40 AM, Tuesday, March 14th]

A lot of BS who have a WS like yours, end up showing their WS this site,hoping something will click.

Don't do that. It won't work. It's ALWAYS a complete disaster, showing an unremorseful WS this site. This is your safe place.

And,besides..we use big words like "reconcile." (Which was so incredibly condescending of him. He thinks you're too stupid to know that word without reading it somewhere)

He's not remorseful. He's not at all sorry. He's not suddenly going to get it. The best thing you can do for yourself is toss him out. He's doing dishes,and thinks that's doing the work to make himself safe??

Save yourself. He's not going to.

Oof.

I’m just afraid that he may never get it. He may never or not be able to get me ever. And I feel like I’m the one messing our relationship up. Like I’m ruining it. Now he says he didn’t do anything to our relationship that the affair wasn’t about me.

He didn't do anything to the relationship? Good lord, man! You 100% know that if the tables were turned and you'd been the one to have an A, his hair would be on fire. Can you imagine his reaction if you told him "It wasn't about you, therefore I didn't hurt my relationship with you. And I'm done talking about it."

Please know, dear lady, that you are not the one messing anything up. That's 100% on him. He would really like to sweep this under the rug, placate you by washing the dishes once a week, emotionally blackmail you to shut up about it, and move on like nothing happened. You're obviously not okay with that, and you shouldn't be.

God, I hope your MC is a good one.

A lot of BS who have a WS like yours, end up showing their WS this site,hoping something will click.

Don't do that. It won't work. It's ALWAYS a complete disaster, showing an unremorseful WS this site. This is your safe place.

This site was started by a Betrayed Husband and his formerly Wayward Wife, so no... it's not true that sharing this resource is "ALWAYS a complete disaster". That's not even the only success story here. One of our own administrators has also shared this experience. My understanding of the early days is that it wasn't at all uncommon to have both parties posting and that with a few ground rules, it was a helpful experience for those couples.

It's not easy to R. That's just the bottom line. Even with WS's who really, really get it, it's a rough row to hoe. But it's really up to you whether or not you share this site. It's hard for foggy WS's who don't want to sit in their own discomfort to hear the criticism, but for those who are ready to work and work hard, that very same criticism can change their viewpoint.

This site was started by a Betrayed Husband and his formerly Wayward Wife

Key word here.."Formerly." As a long time member,I'm sure you know there's a lot more that goes into a person being wayward,other than simply not cheating anymore.

Her husband is not even close to being remorseful. He's manipulating her. He leaves when she is in pain. He refuses to allow her to talk about it. Yet..somehow..you think he would be receptive of the advice here? He very much fits the profile of a WS who would tell her to stay off this site because we are all bitter, and speak in "big words" like "reconcile."

but for those who are ready to work and work hard, that very same criticism can change their viewpoint.

Where in any of her posts do you get the impression her WS is ready to face his shit?

I stand by what I said. Bring your UNREMORSEFUL WS to this site is a bad move. A BS needs a safe place. If he were ready to do the work,showing remorse and empathy,not leaving the house when she is sad,not telling her to stop talking about it,etc,etc,then maybe this site would help. He's not even trying g to become a safe partner. He's too busy doing dishes,and telling her he will not even discuss it anymore.

Waywards often begin here quite foggy, so no.. I don't agree that the WS needs to meet your particular standards of defined remorse. It is the BS's option whether they want to share this website, and to say that it "always" results in failure is not at all factual.

I have tried to show him this site before. He told me it’s a bunch of hooky dook basically and those people don’t even know us and I rather go on there and listen to them than listen to our old MC that was trying to compare me talking about the affair to a mom trying to talk to her son about smoking weed and how I’m going to push him away.
Yea he is very judgmental of anything I read online and thinks it’s not me thinking that.. that it’s like been just put in my head from what I’ve read and causing me to be wrong. That’s what he will tell me that I’m wrong. And he truly believes it.
It would only take a good MC I think to help him see where I’m coming from on anything. Anytime I discuss the affair he thinks I’m just starting it all back up again and acts like he is done trying. Done with the relationship and starts with victimizing himself and going into self pity mode about how he is a piece of $hit and how I’m continuing trying to hurt him and punish him. And I just won’t let it rest and the b$tech is no longer in our life and I keep bringing her back into it. And if she really mattered it wouldn’t have been so easy for him to end it. That his life is here with me and kids and this is what matters.

Yea he is very judgmental of anything I read online and thinks it’s not me thinking that.. that it’s like been just put in my head from what I’ve read and causing me to be wrong.

Veiled insults are still insults. When he says you can't think for yourself, he's basically saying he thinks you are too stupid and/or incompetent to do so. That could be interpreted as a sign of how desperate he is to NOT sit with the discomfort of introspection.

How long has he been doing IC? Not long, I'm guessing. Or else he's got a personality disorder. He wants it to be all about him. What he wants, what he needs, and screw what you need to heal. Big baby.

He doesn't respect you. At all. Which, of course, has nothing to do with YOU and everything to do with him. He's got some work to do. The question is: Will he do it? And will you demand it of him in order to stay in the relationship?

He has been in therapy now since I want to say September 2022, DDay was July 22, 2022. He found the therapist. It was a guy that his goofy, good friend whom has sex addiction went to with his ex wife.
Today he made the appointment with a new MC recommended by his IC who was also out MC for a few sessions until it just was going no where other than telling me to own my 50 and to feel where I felt the hurt at in my body and to release it. Never really addressing the why he cheated just telling me if I continue to question the why it is just going to lead to him shutting down and possibly leaving me and told me I should be afraid of him leaving me if I keep on with questioning him.
He is an only child of his mother who raised him. His dad died in 2018. Affair began, I believe from phone records, Sept/Oct 2020. He is very dominant sexually. And he’s not the type to go research anything. I had him do a personality test and he is ETSP I am INFJ.
He cheated on his ex wife with a coworker also that had twins around same age our twins are now. He continued to date the coworker for six months after they split up. I met him when I was 26 and he was 35. I’ve only met her once in passing at one of the kids school games. He said they were different and he was miserable with her and she accidentally got pregnant and she was the type of person that will use any information against you because she is evil basically. And never had anything good to say about her. That she didn’t work and help with bills. That she would buy a bunch of a stuff for projects and fill the garage with junk. That she was a selfish person and a b&tch and evil. And I remember I would tell him that’s the mother of his kids and you should have respect for her and let go of the hate. And he still harbors this hate towards her. He know is able to communicate via text amicably for his older kids. It’s very formal and to the point.
When we met, I had been through a five year relationship with a guy with a porn addiction and I had reached my point a month before where I was completely finished. I had had my own apartment for a few years at that point and I was just ready to be single and I met him. He wanted to be with me all the time and for me to text him and call. He would go through my closet and tell me I can’t wear certain clothes anymore. I did have some pretty sl$tty clothes at the time and I thought it would be more appropriate being in a relationship with him to dress more modest at the time. We got our own house and we did fertility treatments for about a year and a half before I finally got pregnant with twins.
I just suppose I thought he was truly happy with me and adored me. I told myself he just wasn’t with the right person before and that we were meant to be. I never imagined he would cheat on me. The woman he cheated on me with isn’t hotter than me at all. I guess I feel kind of stupid for being so arrogant in myself for thinking he was adoring me and felt fulfilled with me. I also just am still in disbelief that he had me at home and could have had sex whenever but chose to with her and she’s overweight and tattooed and manages a tire shop. And he had her on his FB as a friend and she was liking our family posts. And he said when he ended it he said he called her and told her "She knows" like I’m this person left out of their secret romance. It hurts. It makes me not feel special like in the beginning when we met and he tried to control what I wore. And he was trying to control her and for her to be his like sex slave and to call him when she woke up. I just feel like I got replaced and we repeated the cycle like doing the same thing as his last marriage.
Why did I get married? Well my IC was telling me I should be asking him why he has proposed three times and not followed through with it. And every time I said yes. Well he had said before that the reason was because he didn’t want to drag me into the divorce and child custody drama with his ex wife because she was evil and to protect me from all that. And I never really needed to have a paper I thought. I thought we were already basically married just not officially. Then our health insurance would change and one of my daughters got cancer (now okay) at 1.5 yrs old. And so we just didn’t get married officially. I didn’t think about it really. And so I asked him why he hasn’t married me yet when I’ve said yes, and he said I’d marry you tomorrow if u let me. And I said well I did say yes three times and I was like okay well tomorrow it is at 10am. And he showed up to go to the court house. We decided to have a small wedding with just kids and our moms and photographer and did it like a week later. And he says he wants to spend the rest of his life with me and loves me and can’t live without me. I told him if he cheated again I would be done and we would have to put our kids through a divorce and he said he didn’t want it to happen and he knows and doesn’t want that to happen either.

So his current IC is the one who did MC with y'all and was telling you to "own your 50" and to stop questioning him or you were going to drive him away? GOOD GOD. That's a bad IC/MC right there. I wouldn't go see ANYONE who is referred by that dummy. YOU pick the new MC. Ask your IC for a referral, if you like your IC, but I wouldn't even entertain the idea of seeing the MC that he picks. No way, no how.

Also, it just occurred to me that no reputable counselor would offer MC to someone with whom they've already done a bunch of IC unless they were simultaneously doing IC with the patient's partner in the interest of saving the marriage.

he is ESTP I am INFJ

So polar opposites. Oof. And ESTPs aren't known for their emotional intelligence, to put it nicely. INFJs are my favorite, by the way. I'm an ENFP.