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Wayward Side :
12 Years after D day .....

Topic is Sleeping.
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Hippo16 ( member #52440) posted at 10:03 AM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Hello?

Have you thought about what love really is? Have you given any thoughts on whether or not you have or what degree of empathy you possess?

Many folks have already given you points to ponder. And you are not unique - the road you must travel is well known.

suggestion: Look up a member with the handle" MrsSouthAfrica.

Her story and the many posts to her thread may help you find your way -

There's no troubled marriage that can't be made worse with adultery.If you’re looking for an adrenaline rush, why not bungee jumping off a bridge span? For an extra thrill, don’t anchor the cord.

posts: 908   ·   registered: Mar. 26th, 2016   ·   location: OBX
id 8768190
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 Ragab (original poster member #82425) posted at 10:47 AM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

I do have a lot of points to ponder, which is actually an understatement.

I learned more about myself in this last few days than ever before. I started doubting and asking more questions than ever before.
What is love - I only now understand that I can only aspire to love as much and unconditionally as my H.
I also realized, that I never knew and still do not know how to empathize.
I read everywhere that I must own it - HOW do I do it !!!
I always had a pity party, I do not know how not to. I do not know how to put my H first, I am so selfish, I have always been, and only realized how often and how many times I, I, I, I or me, me, me, me my whole life were about.
If I can learn how to be there for him - when I ask him what can I do, he doesn't know, he doesn't know what he wants from me or what he expects of me - I should know (and I do not know)
I am reading books and the entries on SI as if my life depends on it (and it does) I know I have so much work, I know I own my BS my whole life and only now really understand what he is going through. *attempt to, as I am not sure I will ever understand

With this said, I do not know how to change, what to change, how to react, or how to be there for BH. But just talking to him about everything I am reading and all the advice I am getting, I can already see a difference.

Some days are diamonds, some days are stones.... lately more stones than diamonds.

posts: 60   ·   registered: Nov. 19th, 2022   ·   location: South Africa
id 8768194
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 Ragab (original poster member #82425) posted at 10:52 AM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

suggestion: Look up a member with the handle" MrsSouthAfrica.

How do I look up a member?

Some days are diamonds, some days are stones.... lately more stones than diamonds.

posts: 60   ·   registered: Nov. 19th, 2022   ·   location: South Africa
id 8768195
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Hippo16 ( member #52440) posted at 12:35 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Top of web page - look at header and you should see the word "members"

clik on that

in the search box that appears type in members handle

a list will appear if search matches string you entered

scroll through the "hits" to find the Mrs.

BTW, I think there story was a happy ending (no pun intended!)

forgot to add - the path is long and will take a lot of time - years even
keep working towards your goal - and know that you will at times stumble - don't give up

[This message edited by Hippo16 at 12:37 PM, Monday, December 5th]

There's no troubled marriage that can't be made worse with adultery.If you’re looking for an adrenaline rush, why not bungee jumping off a bridge span? For an extra thrill, don’t anchor the cord.

posts: 908   ·   registered: Mar. 26th, 2016   ·   location: OBX
id 8768202
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lrpprl ( member #80538) posted at 3:02 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Hippo 16... I don't have that Search option on my Members page. I am fairly new. Is that the reason, because I don't know how to get that option.

Ragab... You are now asking the right questions after 12 years. One Wayward member you might look up is, that is, if you have that Search option on your members page, is Mrs. Walloped. I hope this is okay by the rules here, so I will post a link to her thread. She posted this about 3 years after her husband found out about her months long affair.

https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/topics/617982/a-little-bit-of-my-story/

About 3/4 of the way down Page 15 on her thread you will read her physical reaction to where it finally dawned on her the destruction she had caused to her husband. She ended up in the hospital with a severe anxiety attack. Her husband had posted his thread as sort of a journal and he is a great writer. She got this reaction after reading her husband's thread:

https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/topics/566988/i-don-and--39-t-have-any-idea-what-to-do/

Until she read that thread she probably thought she was doing everything right for reconciliation and had no idea of what to do next... much like you posted. After reading his post is when she truly became Empathetic. She probably thought she was doing everything right except she had not truly understood how deeply she had hurt him. That is when she sort of "got it", so to speak.

Mrs. Walloped and her husband are sort of a legend here. She and her husband, Walloped, are examples of reconciliation.

However, she did post another thread on December 14, 2020, almost 6 years later into reconciliation.

https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/topics/649896/at-a-loss/

You can see that Mr. Walloped was not happy and had lost his zest for life. Of course, he had just survived a severe case of COVID and almost died. She mentions that even before his illness he had, more or less, accepted his fate and felt that this was going to probably be as good as it gets. She said he was acting almost formal towards her. She seemed to be at a loss on how to help him and this was years later.

I really hope that their marriage is doing better since she posted that thread.

However, you are not in the same position as Mrs. Walloped. I know you want to do the right thing, as she did, and develop empathy, however you do not have the advantage of reading what was going on in his mind when he found out how deeply he had been betrayed. I wish you could actually read what he was thinking, like Mrs. Walloped did.

One book that should be on your reading list is "How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair", by Linda MacDonald. Besides reading and counseling I have no other suggestions.

I wish you all the best because I know your head is in the right place and I wish your husband all the best. Since I have been where he is, I understand what he might be feeling. I was betrayed almost 66 years ago by my ex-fiancé. Nowadays when I think about it I have no feeling one way or another. It is just something that happened years ago. I really wish he could end up in that head space today for both your sake.

I apologize to the moderators here if it is against the rules for posting links to other posts on SI. If it is, then please feel free to delete this entire post.

[This message edited by lrpprl at 3:33 PM, Monday, December 5th]

posts: 284   ·   registered: Aug. 12th, 2022   ·   location: USA
id 8768215
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 Ragab (original poster member #82425) posted at 4:51 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Thank you for the links. I also do not have the search function @ members

Some days are diamonds, some days are stones.... lately more stones than diamonds.

posts: 60   ·   registered: Nov. 19th, 2022   ·   location: South Africa
id 8768237
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sisoon ( Moderator #31240) posted at 6:30 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

You should be able to search members. What you're seeing is a bug, and it seems to be limited in the mobile version. MH became aware of it over the weekend. At this point, I don't know when it will be fixed, but MH is usually pretty quick.

So all you phone users: put your phones down and use your computers, like people with lots of life experience do. smile

Sorry. I know phones today are more powerful than the multi-million $ mainframes I used to work on, and I miss them, and the text on phones is just too damned small for me to read comfortably.... blush

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:31 PM, Monday, December 5th]

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 29994   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8768252
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lrpprl ( member #80538) posted at 6:35 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Sisoon --- I have been using a desktop computer to post. I still don't have that option on my desktop. It is not a Mac or other type of Apple product. I use Chrome and Microsoft.

Could be some other problem.

Thanks.

posts: 284   ·   registered: Aug. 12th, 2022   ·   location: USA
id 8768254
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MangledHeart ( Webmaster) posted at 8:02 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Could be some other problem.

Yes it is. I apologize for the confusion. We require your profile to be at member status (51 posts) before you gain access to the search feature.

The lack of a search feature in the mobile version is a bug as sisoon stated. But not having access while under 51 posts is not.

Worry does not empty tomorrow of its sorrow; it empties today of its strength. ~Corrie Ten Boom

posts: 10000   ·   registered: May. 31st, 2002   ·   location: Texas
id 8768266
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lrpprl ( member #80538) posted at 8:27 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Mangled Heart...

Thank you for the information. I know Ragab thanks you also.

Also, a huge Thank You for this website. I know many, many people have been helped here.

posts: 284   ·   registered: Aug. 12th, 2022   ·   location: USA
id 8768270
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survrus ( member #67698) posted at 3:50 AM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

Ragab,

Did you.....

Write out a timeline for your affair, then offer to take a polygraph to verify the timeline.

Tell the complete truth or did you only answer his questions and omit or minimize the facts.

Get tested for STDs?

DNA test the children if you have them.


How long did you trickle truth your BH, by that I mean intentionally withhold details.

The thing about trickle truth is that BHs get to a level of distrust they can't dig themselves out of.

The fact that you quit may feel to your BH that you were protecting the OM by sacrificing yourself.

It's difficult for most BH to believe that the OM was not better than them in some way particularly sexually, looks or other physical details.


I suggest you read some of what BHs wrote here to get a better perspective on how your BH feels.

Come up with some creative solutions about how to get back at the OM.

posts: 1487   ·   registered: Nov. 1st, 2018   ·   location: USA
id 8768320
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 Ragab (original poster member #82425) posted at 6:42 AM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

So I will just keep on posting to reach member status grin quickly.....

I had a discussion with Hubby last night, I asked him questions about what you all told me he is going through for instance, does he feel like he is on his own for the last 12 years (suffering in silence) - YES HE DOES

How does he feel when I said I am sorry - then I explained to him that I understand that he sees it as lie because how can he trust me? I also asked him how he felt when I said I stopped the A immediately (this was a HUGE SHOCK) He said that when I say it, it is as if it was this big effort and that he must be thankful that I stopped it. I can not believe that it is how he experiences it. I told him what is a real eye-opener for me is that the words he described in a different language in a different country are actually verbatim what is used on this forum - rollercoaster feels like his limbs been cut off, the puzzle pieces, etc. etc.

Above were all my intention to share this today and thank you all.
now to answer

survrus ( member #67698) posted at 3:50 AM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

Ragab,

Did you.....

Write out a timeline for your affair, then offer to take a polygraph to verify the timeline.
- I offered the polygraph many times, and he said that he want me to convince him with actions and proof (I only now understand that) - No I never did the timeline sad

Tell the complete truth or did you only answer his questions and omit or minimize th? facts.
- I only answered his questions and also minimized the facts (I also only spoke about the A when he asks, never out of my own)

Get tested for STDs?
- Again no

DNA test the children if you have them.
- Kids were already 8 and 10 at the time of the A
(we only ever had sex with each other up till the A) - He never had sex with anybody else, and he believe that the reason I wanted it was to know how it was to have sex with somebody else - but that was never the case but he doesn't believe me.


How long did you trickle truth your BH, by that I mean intentionally withhold details.
- up to now (years and only now understand that while I was trying to protect him (that was actually more hurtful for both of us)

The thing about trickle truth is that BHs get to a level of distrust they can't dig themselves out of.
- True

The fact that you quit may feel to your BH that you were protecting the OM by sacrificing yourself.
- My H insisted that I quit - His ultimatum. I think I tried to protect the OM by not giving all the information as I was scared my H will murder him (still scared but he immigrated to another country and now my H feels like I am only giving detail now, that his changes for "revenge" / Justice/retribution are almost impossible.

It's difficult for most BH to believe that the OM was not better than them in some way particularly sexually, looks or other physical details.
- He totally believes the OM was better, in all aspects. *that he was not good enough)


I suggest you read some of what BHs wrote here to get a better perspective on how your BH feels.
- Busy with this. My challenge now is not to self-pity myself because of all the additional "ad on,s) I told my H that if I ever tell him again that I had enough that he must pack my bags, he laughed and said he will not even pack my bags. I can not run away, I must face my shit.

Come up with some creative solutions about how to get back at the OM.
- Please share ideas as this is one of his biggest issues and I really do not know what without my husband going to jail for murder. He even said he will sit in jail with pleasure as long as he know justice was served crying

I am sorry for the long post but THANK YOU SI THANK YOU I believe there's hope.

Some days are diamonds, some days are stones.... lately more stones than diamonds.

posts: 60   ·   registered: Nov. 19th, 2022   ·   location: South Africa
id 8768329
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 Ragab (original poster member #82425) posted at 6:43 AM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

lrpprl ( new member #80538) posted at 8:27 PM on Monday, December 5th, 2022

Mangled Heart...

Thank you for the information. I know Ragab thanks you also.

Also, a huge Thank You for this website. I know many, many people have been helped here.

DEFINITELY

Some days are diamonds, some days are stones.... lately more stones than diamonds.

posts: 60   ·   registered: Nov. 19th, 2022   ·   location: South Africa
id 8768330
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Hippo16 ( member #52440) posted at 1:34 PM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

Ragab:

apologies for the "member search" - wasn't' aware of the 51 posts condition

I do "search" for stuff using Google (google-dot-com) lower right corner is a "settings" link.

Clik on that and "Advanced Search" pops up on a list. Clik on the advanced search link and

you get a window in which you can enter what you wish to find.

After some digging (even Google doesn't know everything!)

I found these posts that, I hope, help you navigate over your path.

CantSleepCantEat

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=608961&AP=1

I suggest you read Walloped first thread - if you skip over the members posts to Walloped - you will quickly get a feel for where his mind was.

MsWalloped

http://www.f.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=617982&AP=1&HL=

Note the comments in an earlier post about the Mrs. regarding specific entries to check.

Walloped

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=566988&HL=38603

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=569234&HL=38603

MrsSouthAfrica

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=617861&HL=62465

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=621793&HL=62465

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=622219&HL=62465

Cerda:

https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/topics/623749/i-have-destroyed-my-husband-live-/?ap=1

Will you stay married? Only time will tell - best to work on yourself and be honest with your husband

no matter what happens going forward.

[This message edited by Hippo16 at 1:35 PM, Tuesday, December 6th]

There's no troubled marriage that can't be made worse with adultery.If you’re looking for an adrenaline rush, why not bungee jumping off a bridge span? For an extra thrill, don’t anchor the cord.

posts: 908   ·   registered: Mar. 26th, 2016   ·   location: OBX
id 8768345
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Stillconfused2022 ( member #82457) posted at 9:50 PM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

I’m kind of new, but we are 7 years in and 4months out from a horrible new D-day. So anyway….my husband has said that about me cheating to balance the score. I’m sure you’ve already thought of this but that is a really mean thing to say to someone who feels betrayed. The BS is struggling to feel they are important to you, and that you would hate to lose your BS and then you go and make it sound like you wouldn’t be jealous at all if they strayed. That is like one of the most insulting things you could say to someone. "I’m fine if you go cheat, wont hurt me at all…". Anyway just dont say that

posts: 379   ·   registered: Nov. 27th, 2022   ·   location: Northeast
id 8768406
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lrpprl ( member #80538) posted at 10:05 PM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

StillConfused2022... I agree.

I have seen this in other posts... where the Wayward, when discovered, will tell the Betrayed to go have their own affair. I guess this is done to help alleviate whatever guilt the Wayward might be experiencing. If this happened to me then two things would immediately come to my mind.

#1 -- I sure as heck do not want to sink down to the Wayward's level.

#2 -- The Wayward sure has a real low opinion of me... so much so that I am not important enough for them to be jealous if I cheated.

Just my opinion.

posts: 284   ·   registered: Aug. 12th, 2022   ·   location: USA
id 8768412
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LegsWideShut ( member #80302) posted at 11:33 PM on Tuesday, December 6th, 2022

#1 -- I sure as heck do not want to sink down to the Wayward's level.

#2 -- The Wayward sure has a real low opinion of me... so much so that I am not important enough for them to be jealous if I cheated.

This^

It also says the WS does....not....get...it.

[This message edited by LegsWideShut at 2:36 AM, Wednesday, December 7th]

posts: 134   ·   registered: May. 9th, 2022   ·   location: New England
id 8768437
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survrus ( member #67698) posted at 1:30 AM on Wednesday, December 7th, 2022

Ragab,

I had a discussion with Hubby last night, I asked him questions about what you all told me he is going through for instance, does he feel like he is on his own for the last 12 years (suffering in silence) - YES HE DOES

Has your BH told anyone else about this who understands, it sounds like he has no pressure relief valve. Preachers and marriage counselors can often make the BH feel like they are on the WWs side, or that the WW has hand picked them for her own purposes.

Write out a timeline for your affair, then offer to take a polygraph to verify the timeline.
- I offered the polygraph many times, and he said that he want me to convince him with actions and proof (I only now understand that) - No I never did the timeline sad

The thing is that a timeline allows someone to apply structure to conversations that are often emotional and repetitive. Your BH can read it and ask additional questions.

DNA test the children if you have them.
- Kids were already 8 and 10 at the time of the A
(we only ever had sex with each other up till the A) - He never had sex with anybody else, and he believe that the reason I wanted it was to know how it was to have sex with somebody else - but that was never the case but he doesn't believe me.

You know the kids are his but does he? You're judging what BH knows and feels by what you know, this is a special fear BHs often have. Have you ever asked him?

The fact that you quit may feel to your BH that you were protecting the OM by sacrificing yourself.
- My H insisted that I quit - His ultimatum. I think I tried to protect the OM by not giving all the information as I was scared my H will murder him (still scared but he immigrated to another country and now my H feels like I am only giving detail now, that his changes for "revenge" / Justice/retribution are almost impossible.

It's difficult for most BH to believe that the OM was not better than them in some way particularly sexually, looks or other physical details.
- He totally believes the OM was better, in all aspects. *that he was not good enough)

It's sometimes not just the affair but the years before the affair which make the BH bitter. Often a WW loses sexual attraction and/of passion for the BH before the affair which the BH tries to fix, but gets told that the WW is less or not sexual. The affair just proves that the BH is the reason the WW lost interest in him. I understand that with children a Ws love for the BH is diminished.

posts: 1487   ·   registered: Nov. 1st, 2018   ·   location: USA
id 8768456
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survrus ( member #67698) posted at 1:50 AM on Wednesday, December 7th, 2022

Ragab,

Come up with some creative solutions about how to get back at the OM.
- Please share ideas as this is one of his biggest issues and I really do not know what without my husband going to jail for murder. He even said he will sit in jail with pleasure as long as he know justice was served crying

The simplest is exposure, workplace, linked, facebook, OM parents, grandparents, siblings, everyone in his life that matters. Do it all at once without warning or threats. This may be especially effective if OM still has people where you live.

bold]Keep track of obituaries/weddings for OM family your BH will have a chance to confront OM when he comes back.

Look for OM current wife on social media, inform her of what happened and advise her on ways to snoop on OM, suggest ideas or methods you've seen here, PIs, polygraphs, divorce attorneys, etc. Do you know the name of other women OM was with give OMW the names tell her to look for them on OM social media

Seduce the OM on social media yourself and record the evidence then hand it over to OMW, same thing with OW then hand it over to OM

Look for OM current wife and OM on dating site, this is easy to use and may result in OM divorce or Money for your BH

Hire a prostitute to have a ONS with OM, hire a PI in OM country to investigate him

Demand that the OM make payment for damages, even if he doesn't it may help to inject fear into his life since his family may still be close at hand.

I have darker things I came up with for my own situation, but I'll not mention them

posts: 1487   ·   registered: Nov. 1st, 2018   ·   location: USA
id 8768458
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 Ragab (original poster member #82425) posted at 9:37 AM on Wednesday, December 7th, 2022

This^

It also says the WS does....not....get...it.

👆 I can only agree. The more I read the more I realized that all my "good intentions" are not at all seen as good. I only now after 28 years with H realised how selfish I always been. He just gives and gives and gives 😢😭

I know I will never be able to make up for what I did. The insight of the BS on this site is so much value for me to try and understand. To each of you Thank you.

Hubby have absolutely no one to talk about this accept me. He admit he is like a ticking time bomb and any general situation can set it off.

I honestly just do not know how to be there for him (taking into account that I aways been selfish - me me me) It is not that I do not want to, I honesly just do not think of it. I am reading and to most people things would be obvious, to me it is not. Basic stuff 😭

Again even if you think you are being harsh or judgemental. It is not viewed in that light but REALLY appreciated. Please keep on giving suggestions even the BS as you see (experience) it differently.

I need to become a whole new person I JUST DO NOT KNOW HOW

Some days are diamonds, some days are stones.... lately more stones than diamonds.

posts: 60   ·   registered: Nov. 19th, 2022   ·   location: South Africa
id 8768478
Topic is Sleeping.
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