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General :
Am I being too mean to WW?

Topic is Sleeping.
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twicefooled ( Member #42976) posted at 5:48 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2021

please stop spreading this false trope that the 180 is used to end marriages.

I used the 180 to end my marriage. I don't understand why it's wrong to see that it can be used to both salvage OR end marriages. Just because it was designed with one purpose in mind doesn't mean it can't be used (successfully) for other reasons. Detaching from a marriage is the very first step towards divorce anyway. I would say that it's doing a disservice to people here to believe that it's not used for both purposes.

May 29 2021 ***reclaimed myself and decided to delete my story with my ex because I'm now 7 years free from him and mentally healthier than I've been in years.

*********When you know better, you can do better*************

posts: 408   ·   registered: Apr. 2nd, 2014
id 8676575
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The1stWife ( Member #58832) posted at 6:05 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2021

My understanding is that the 180 will not and does not end affairs.

I agree it will never be the reason an affair dies. An affair ends b/c one the cheaters ends it in some way - not b/c the BS told them to end it (I have some experience in that arena).

Think of some affairs like an addiction. In fact in some ways they are. The cheater has to decide to end it - nothing the betrayed can say or do to end the affair.

I was under the impression the 180 was used for a different reason.

Survived two affairs and brink of Divorce. Happily reconciled.

posts: 10519   ·   registered: May. 19th, 2017
id 8676580
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 ThankYah (original poster New Member #79037) posted at 6:37 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2021

I saw the benefits for me immediately after 180 and I really started healing. Though I can't deny the events that have taken place since then that show how strongly this can help wake up a WS. I can see how it can go either way depending ultimately on what the BS wants, and if wanting R depending on if WS is receptive to the 180 and makes changes. Now I'm in this lease and will be working and taking care of children, I'll just continue building my life and see what happens. Either way I'm good and will only accept WW if she pursues me and shows serious changes. I'm not pursuing and not contacting.

As for the communication, this discussion has helped me sort it. I'm fresh in my healing and I am not going to force myself to do anything for her. Pictures are definitely not necessary. And even asking how they are doing is not necessary and is not about logistics. They are always fine, I'm a good dad and take care of them. She'll be back soon and will be in the swing of work and seeing them almost everyday. My communication may change in the future but this is what feels good now. Thanks everyone.

WW started PA April 2021
Living in different apartments with hard 180 since June 2021
Healing and seeing how this plays out.

posts: 19   ·   registered: Jun. 29th, 2021
id 8676586
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guvensiz ( Member #75858) posted at 10:14 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2021

Even the divorce process is the most effective method for R, the 180 cannot be said to be just about ending the marriage.

Especially important for cake eaters to wake up.

In an exit As, there is nothing to be done anyway and it makes BSs detach themselves from WSs.

Or it allows BS to think clearly about whether to stay married or not, even a WS wants R.

All in all, it works in any situation.

A WS who ends her marriage just because BS is applying 180 is not R material anyway.

posts: 477   ·   registered: Nov. 14th, 2020
id 8676611
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Thumos ( Member #69668) posted at 11:06 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2021

I used the 180 to end my marriage. I don't understand why it's wrong to see that it can be used to both salvage OR end marriages. Just because it was designed with one purpose in mind doesn't mean it can't be used (successfully) for other reasons.

Correct and agree.. But sisoon was saying it should not be used if you're going to try for R -- and that is false and incorrect, because working toward R is exactly what the originator intended it for. Yes it can be used for both.

"True character is revealed in the choices a human being makes under pressure. The greater the pressure, the deeper the revelation, the truer the choice to the character's essential nature."

BH (me): 50, WW: 49
Married: Feb. 1996
DDAY: Dec. 20

posts: 4217   ·   registered: Feb. 5th, 2019   ·   location: UNITED STATES
id 8676616
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twicefooled ( Member #42976) posted at 11:10 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2021

Thank you for clarifying, Thumos! I was truly confused and I appreciate your comment.

Then I guess we agree

May 29 2021 ***reclaimed myself and decided to delete my story with my ex because I'm now 7 years free from him and mentally healthier than I've been in years.

*********When you know better, you can do better*************

posts: 408   ·   registered: Apr. 2nd, 2014
id 8676617
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rambler ( Member #43747) posted at 1:56 AM on Monday, July 19th, 2021

Thumos is correct in who developed it and why.

making it through

posts: 1254   ·   registered: Jun. 17th, 2014   ·   location: Chicago
id 8676632
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crazyblindsided ( Member #35215) posted at 9:40 PM on Monday, July 19th, 2021

A WS who ends her marriage just because BS is applying 180 is not R material anyway.

Exactly!

fBS/fWS (me):48 Mad-hattered after DD1
XWS:50 Serial Cheater, NPD tendencies
Together 24 years, Married 19
DD(18) DS(15)
DD1 (2008) COW, DD2 (2012) MOW, False R (2014) Same MOW. DD3 (2019) Webcam girl

posts: 8031   ·   registered: Apr. 2nd, 2012   ·   location: California
id 8676806
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 ThankYah (original poster New Member #79037) posted at 10:12 PM on Monday, July 19th, 2021

^ Heavily agree.

Some thoughts.. My WW has me feel so unsafe and put me through so much trauma. This is why I am so averse to send any message to her. I have about 0 trust in her. I just don't know what she might be trying to do to manipulate me in some way. I don't trust that she wouldn't use our children as a tool for manipulation. Really F'ed to feel like this but that's what her actions have done. In time things will get easier but it is very important that I strongly protect myself.

WW started PA April 2021
Living in different apartments with hard 180 since June 2021
Healing and seeing how this plays out.

posts: 19   ·   registered: Jun. 29th, 2021
id 8676828
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BluerThanBlue ( Member #74855) posted at 10:30 PM on Monday, July 19th, 2021

Let her know that the kids are fine and that if she wants to see or speak to them, she can make arrangements in advance for a phone call or video chat. Then leave it that. You don't have to send her any pictures.

BW, age 40
Divorced WH in 2015; now happily remarried to a great guy

I edit my comments a lot for spelling, grammar, tone, and rewording. I'm not being sneaky; I'm just critical of my own writing.

posts: 471   ·   registered: Jul. 13th, 2020
id 8676839
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sisoon ( Guide #31240) posted at 11:02 PM on Monday, July 19th, 2021

IIRC, Weiner-Davis presented the 180 as something that she heard from a patient of hers. The patient said she had given up on her M, forced herself to detach, and was shocked to find that her H came crawling back after she started doing the things on her list. Further, IIRC, Weiner-Davis warned that using it was a last resort and not to expect that it would bring the WS back into the M. I no longer have the book at hand, so I can't verify this.

Where the 180 helps the BS find their strengths and detach, it's helpful. Where it manipulates and lies, it's not helpful, at least IMO.

Relationships are built by Communication and truth and broken by non-communication and untruth.

*****

How has the 180 helped your R?

[This message edited by sisoon at 5:03 PM, July 19th (Monday)]

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 25999   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8676846
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Buffer ( Member #71664) posted at 11:59 PM on Monday, July 19th, 2021

One word responses is ‘fine’ or ‘satisfactory’. No photos or funny stories. Just satisfactory due to the circumstances.

One day at a time.

Buffer

posts: 1191   ·   registered: Sep. 24th, 2019   ·   location: Australia
id 8676872
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DevastatedDee ( Member #59873) posted at 12:22 AM on Tuesday, July 20th, 2021

Where the 180 helps the BS find their strengths and detach, it's helpful. Where it manipulates and lies, it's not helpful, at least IMO.

Agreed. I always took it as the 180 is for and about the BS only. Whatever happens with the WS is incidental, but the point is for the BS to detach and gain some clarity about the situation. It can lead in either direction, but it stops the pick me dancing.

DDay: 06/07/2017
MH - RA on DDay.
Divorced a serial cheater (prostitutes and lord only knows who and what else).

posts: 4437   ·   registered: Jul. 27th, 2017
id 8676885
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jb3199 ( Member #27673) posted at 2:27 AM on Tuesday, July 20th, 2021

I always took it as the 180 is for and about the BS only. Whatever happens with the WS is incidental, but the point is for the BS to detach and gain some clarity about the situation. It can lead in either direction, but it stops the pick me dancing.

Ditto. I learned of it here, and this is how it was described to be used. I don't know its true origins, but using it as described above is as good a tool as we have for dealing with infidelity, IMHO.

BH-50s
WW-50s
2 boys
Married 28yrs.(together over 30yrs.)

All work and no play has just cost me my wife--Gary Puckett
D-Day(s): Enough
Accepting that I can/may end this marriage 7/2/14

posts: 3818   ·   registered: Feb. 21st, 2010   ·   location: northeast
id 8676906
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cancuncrushed ( Member #28156) posted at 6:24 PM on Tuesday, July 20th, 2021

Is she testing you? How far will you go to meet her needs?

I would do it how I wanted to do it. Maybe decide a schedule. Maybe pictures on Thursday evenings. Once a month. If you even want that.

She gave up telling you how to do things when she cheated. She certainly shouldnt be telling you what she prefers from another country.

These are not mean and cruel things your doing. These are petty things she’s demanding.

Do what you prefer. It’s ok. As long as kids are fine.

She’s criticizing your photos . Really?

Never put in print things that she can use against you. In court or otherwise. Do not engage

This was very hard for me. I had anger. I was hurt. He was cruel and continued to do cruel things. I never responded It made our day in court fast and easy.

[This message edited by cancuncrushed at 12:33 PM, July 20th (Tuesday)]

a trigger yesterday

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id 8677050
Topic is Sleeping.
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