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Wayward Side :
From the beginning....

Topic is Sleeping.
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 12:40 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

Sixteen years ago I met the amazing man I have the pleasure and pride of calling my husband. Unfortunately my love story takes a shitty turn. When I first met H , I was in a sexual only "relationship" with the OM I had feelings for OM but he didn't have the same feelings towards me. I did want OM to want me for more than sex but he didn't and never did.

For the six first months of my relationship with H I was also having sex with OM. H expressed he wanted us to be exclusive I agreed but didn't follow through. I continued my PA with OM and I lied and hid it from H.

After H and I became an official couple I had sex with OM one morebtime. Then I stopped seeing OM. But I never told H about my PA.

Fast Forward a few months H and I moved in together, we had been living with each other for a month when H found a read a journal/scrapbook I had. He found out about my PA, I didn't deny my PA but I did withhold details and I lied about my feelings towards OM. We pushed through without addressing my affair. My H did have insecurities caused by me but we pushed through. I didn't talk I wouldn't talk about what I did. H did go to sex shops to try to spice up the bedroom but I didn't understand why he was doing that. I didn't ask either. We pushed through. We were happy in love building a life together. I never thought of what I did I never thought of OM. I just didn't put any thought into it.

Fast Forward 7 years, it was my 10 year high school reunion. An ex from high school reached out to me. I didn't shut it down and I developed and EA with him. And I never saw this guy in person, I truly didn't know shit about him. But I did allow myself to have a have 4 week EA with him. It all ended when H found a post I put online, expressing feeling for him. I lied about my feelings for EA.

After that we got married and had two children planned.

I lied and betrayed my BS, I'm a piece of shit.

And now we are here, I gave my BS an incomplete timeline, then last week I came clean with it all. My original timeline omitted that I gave OM oral, one time without OM asking. And I did this fucking killed my marriage. I killed my marriage.

It wasn't until a few years ago that I started giving H oral. And I started to really enjoy giving that to him. But I started giving him oral because I started reading dead bedroom boards on another site. I didn't want to kill my marriage because of sex. Even though I was killing with my lies and betrayal.

My BS is done with our marriage and I can't blame him. I realize I'm fully responsible for the state of my marriage…. or lack of marriage.

But I do love my BS with all my heart, I'm giving him everything he wants in the divorce. He has said the only way he can see a future with me is to divorce and start again after I got to IC.

I do start IC next Friday. And I will give BS the divorce and giving him everything he wants, because I know this isn't about me.

I have written and rewritten this post a lot, I want to share everything in hope to get guidance.

I do not want to be "old me" I'm seeking help and guidance from IC and SI. I have tried to get help from other sites but I never felt I was able to share my story in full out of fear of being call horrible names. But I need to hear it all from SI.

I'm working on accepting my fate of divorce I still go into a panic thinking about the divorce. I will follow through with my word and give BS everything he wants.

***Edit to try to keep this focused on my relationship not my custody choices.

[This message edited by 15yrsinthemaking at 11:18 PM, April 23rd (Friday)]

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653523
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LifeDestroyer ( member #71163) posted at 12:49 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

Why would you give him full custody? Were you abusive towards them? Do you neglect them? Do you beat them? Are you a raging lunatic? If the answer is no, then you do NOT give your custody rights away. Did he tell you that was a condition to reconcile, to give your rights away as a parent? If so, then you need to think long and hard about that. I don't care how many affairs you had, those are your kids as well as his. Do NOT give up custody.

I truly hope that you have not officially signed anything yet regarding custody.

[This message edited by LifeDestroyer at 6:51 PM, April 23rd (Friday)]




Maybe today can be a good day, and if today can be a good day, then maybe tomorrow can be too.

We might be broken and imperfect, but we still have worth and value.

As hard as it is to feel pain, it's much harder to feel nothing.

posts: 769   ·   registered: Aug. 1st, 2019   ·   location: OK
id 8653526
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 12:55 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

No, I'm a great mother. But I told BS I would give him full custody. And because I said I would and if I don't I'm going back on my word again. I trust that BS will not keep our kids from me. He hasn't asked me to move out and doesn't have a deadline either.

Edit to add: I want to show my BS I do trust him with my heart and soul. He needs to see me be vulnerable and trusting to him

[This message edited by 15yrsinthemaking at 7:01 PM, April 23rd (Friday)]

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653531
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LifeDestroyer ( member #71163) posted at 1:02 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

Then you do not need to give your custody away. That should not be part of reconciliation. Your kids are your kids. You have every right to them just as he does.




Maybe today can be a good day, and if today can be a good day, then maybe tomorrow can be too.

We might be broken and imperfect, but we still have worth and value.

As hard as it is to feel pain, it's much harder to feel nothing.

posts: 769   ·   registered: Aug. 1st, 2019   ·   location: OK
id 8653533
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 1:09 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

Life, thank you for your words. But if I don't follow through with my word I'll just be the same person unable to keep my word.

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653535
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LifeDestroyer ( member #71163) posted at 1:16 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

I absolutely get not wanting to back on your word. I'm fairly certain I too told N that I would give him full custody, but I absolutely went back on my word. Giving up my custody rights wouldn't have shown him that I trusted him. It would have shown him that I didn't really care about our child. Please, really consider your decision before making it official.




Maybe today can be a good day, and if today can be a good day, then maybe tomorrow can be too.

We might be broken and imperfect, but we still have worth and value.

As hard as it is to feel pain, it's much harder to feel nothing.

posts: 769   ·   registered: Aug. 1st, 2019   ·   location: OK
id 8653540
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landclark ( member #70659) posted at 1:22 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

Did he ask you for full custody or did you offer it? I’m really confused on why that is even on the table. Will you at least have a visitation agreement?

I think that’s one thing that absolutely nobody in their right mind would have a problem with you going back on. Being vulnerable doesn’t mean giving up custody of your kids.

Me: BW Him: WH (GuiltAndShame) Dday 05/19/19 TT through August
One child together, 3 stepchildrenTogether 13.5 years, married 12.5

First EA 4 months into marriage. Last ended 05/19/19. *ETA, contd an ea after dday for 2 yrs.

posts: 2058   ·   registered: May. 29th, 2019
id 8653547
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 1:25 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

This is a direct quote from BS

Only way forward is a true, healthy, honest, new start, including divorce, and new beginning with zero obligation. Pure restart.

I want to give BS this.

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653548
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prissy4lyfe ( member #46938) posted at 1:28 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

15yrs....

Just to offer a BS perspective. Your kids need both of you. I think right now your being incredibly reactionary.

If I were your BH I would see this as running away....you want to give him everything so you don't have to deal with the fall out.

I would suggest going to him and apologizing for the reactionary giving away custody and ask that you guys take a certain period of time to put some distance between your emotions and your reactions.

Kids need you both. Don't give them up to assuage your own guilt.

posts: 2081   ·   registered: Feb. 24th, 2015   ·   location: Virginia
id 8653551
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landclark ( member #70659) posted at 1:32 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

new beginning with zero obligation. Pure restart.

There’s no pure restart here. You already have a history and kids. Giving up your child doesn’t show anything other than being willing to give up your kids.

I ask again, is this something he’s demanding?

Me: BW Him: WH (GuiltAndShame) Dday 05/19/19 TT through August
One child together, 3 stepchildrenTogether 13.5 years, married 12.5

First EA 4 months into marriage. Last ended 05/19/19. *ETA, contd an ea after dday for 2 yrs.

posts: 2058   ·   registered: May. 29th, 2019
id 8653554
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 1:40 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

prissy4lyfe,

I'm far from running away and leaving. As far as my BS sees it this is the only way he can see a future with me. Me keeping my word and giving him trust and vulnerability I've never given him

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653558
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 1:46 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

I ask again, is this something he’s demanding?

Not really, in a conversation we had awhile back I said I wouldn't take the kids from him and I'd give him custody. I never want him to stay with me because the of the kids.

I want to be with my family and this is the path to be together. I did my BS wrong and I don't believe he will keep our kids from me. He hasn't even asked me to leave not one night.

I made my BS a plan B 16yrs ago and he wants to know that I'll choose him again if I wasn't married to him. I'll choose him everyday of my life.

But I lied and now I need to show I will keep my word and show with my actions I've changed.

[This message edited by 15yrsinthemaking at 7:50 PM, April 23rd (Friday)]

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653561
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 2:20 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

I'm here to seek advice on rebuilding my relationship with my BS. I trust BS not to take my kids away. I don't think he will ever use them against me or take them from me. BS knows I'm a good mother that is not in question.

My status as a wife is what is being questioned not me being a mother. I cherish my children and I will never not be there for them. I'm not running from my family, I'm trying to keep us together.

I'm facing my lies and betrayal I'm not running. I'm accepting the consequences for my actions I'm not trying to escape from my family. I want to be with my H and kids.

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653570
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Lostgirl410 ( member #71112) posted at 6:04 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

I'm here to seek advice on rebuilding my relationship with my BS. I trust BS not to take my kids away. I don't think he will ever use them against me or take them from me. BS knows I'm a good mother that is not in question.

Before you twist yourself in to knots trying to believe all these rainbows and unicorns, please start a poll asking all the BSs of SI if they believe for even one second that their WS was a "good parent" during the A. Offering to give your own kids up reeks heavily of continued manipulation, and he may very well placate you long enough to get you to sign whatever documents necessary to remove his children from a mother he deems unsafe for them.

If you truly want to rebuild your relationship, then start by becoming a woman worthy of rebuilding a marriage with. How many truly good men do you know, who would view a woman willing to give up her kids for a relationship with a man, that would EVER ACTUALLY view said woman as "relationship worthy???"

Your children are not pawns. I know you are refusing to see what you're doing as using your kids, but you are. You need to do some deep reflection, and become the mother they deserve. The one who you absolutely can be.

What will you tell them 10 years from now when they ask why you gave them away? Sorry kid...I betrayed your father, so I figured I might as well give up on you too? This makes no sense. None.

posts: 121   ·   registered: Jul. 27th, 2019
id 8653602
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bookworm19 ( member #54871) posted at 9:31 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

As a BS I won't get into the other stuff, just the kids. JUut wanted to say, please don't give up your kids. You probably have good intentions, but they won't see it that way, listen to Lostgirl:

Your children are not pawns. I know you are refusing to see what you're doing as using your kids, but you are. ...

What will you tell them 10 years from now when they ask why you gave them away? Sorry kid...I betrayed your father, so I figured I might as well give up on you too? This makes no sense. None.

You are just going to use them to prove him you are trustworthy?! I get, what are you trying to do, but this is a very flawed logic. You don't sacrifice yor children and say, look, how much I love you ... Please, reconsider

English is not my language, sorry for mistakes and funny words...

posts: 447   ·   registered: Aug. 28th, 2016   ·   location: Europe
id 8653610
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ChamomileTea ( Moderator #53574) posted at 9:35 AM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

Someone who loves you would never ask you to give up your children or demote you from wife to possible girlfriend. So by my estimation, you are incomprehensibly trusting a man who is more interested in punishing you than loving you.

Believe me, I'm a BW and I get it. I understand the pain and the injustice of intimate betrayal. But if I'm reading your post correctly, you weren't even married at the time of the cheating which would have been sixteen years ago for the physical cheating, and your EA was what... nine years ago, and also prior to the marriage??? I don't understand why your BH would then marry you, have children with you, and continue to live with you for almost a decade, then suddenly decide he can't go on without a divorce. It sounds to me like you're being lead down the garden path. Maybe he's just keeping you sweet with the promise of reconciliation IF you give him everything he wants. But sweetie... that's not R. Reconciliation requires LOVE. And we don't punish the ones we love. To do so, doesn't just hurt them. It hurts us.

My WH said and did terrible things. And this wasn't BEFORE we were married. This was after more than thirty years of marriage. He had at least one EA ten years before the physical cheating, so yeah... I understand how devastating an EA can be. It took me four years to recover from it. So, I'm not minimizing the EA. But let me tell you, the PAs he got involved in ten years later were the most brutal thing I've ever experienced. He went on a Craigslist binge for nearly a year, multiple partners, various levels of emotional attachment, protestations of love, future-faking with the OW, etc. To say I was crushed doesn't cover the scope of it. But you know what?.. one of the first things I realized when we got to the point of discussing the possibility of R, is that there could be no punishment. To punish him would have been to punish the marriage and that would have punished ME. I didn't take him back because I had to. I took him back because I loved him. I cared about what happened to him.

Your BH has had what? nearly a decade to forgive you? And he hasn't. I honestly can't begin to comprehend holding a grudge for that long without DOING something about it. If I couldn't at least get to a point of "writing off" my fWH's debt to me, there's no way I'd continue to live with him. Something is wrong here. I don't understand that kind of passive rage... and I don't ever want to, if I'm honest.

Please don't trust this guy. Lawyer up. Protect yourself and your children. Something is just off about this situation, like REALLY off. Build yourself a support network of family and friends, people who know you and love you in real life... and then LISTEN to them. There's something weird about this situation. I don't like it.

ETA: Remember this too.. a BS who really loves you won't try and make you wear the "hair shirt" for the rest of your life. Nearly every successful R will begin with the WS in the "one-down" position, but the intent should always be full equality in partnership again. Once the WS accomplishes their work, finds the faults in their character, values system and boundaries, which allowed for the cheating, then remediates these flaws, that WS has earned some new trust. In time, even more trust is restored. But the whole idea that the WS should remain in the one-down for years and years on end is just crazy. Who would want that for someone they purport to love??? So yeah, WS's should work VERY hard to correct their wayward thinking and earn back trust. But if you're dealing with someone who won't stop punishing you, who can't see your changes, who thinks it's okay for you to live your life in the one-down... that's not love.

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 3:53 AM, April 24th (Saturday)]

BW: 2004(online EAs), 2014 (multiple PAs); Married 40 years; in R with fWH for 10

posts: 7075   ·   registered: Jun. 8th, 2016   ·   location: U.S.
id 8653611
helpless

 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 4:43 PM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

Chamomile,

Your BH has had what? nearly a decade to forgive you?

In a way yes but he didn't know the full truth of the oral until 11 days ago. And I lied about my feelings for PA and well honestly I'm still trying to figure out the EA. I had feeling for EA but not the real him ... I had made up a fantasy about him.

I would never talk about what I have done. I don't know where to go from here. I want to R so bad it hurts I love my Family and our lives together. I want to do the right and honest thing.

Since I've been married I've been 100% faithful. But in my BW eyes I shouldn't have even been able to marry him or make babies with him, because I lied.

I do start IC next week and we have an appointment to speak to a lawyer next month.

I'm more confused now than ever.

[This message edited by 15yrsinthemaking at 10:50 AM, April 24th (Saturday)]

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653649
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 15yrsinthemaking (original poster member #75828) posted at 5:01 PM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

My heart hurts for the pain I've caused my BH. I want my family to be together more than anything in the world.

How do I show my BS, I'm a changed person? He sees me going back on my word about the kids as me being WW thinking still. I've given him a complete timeline including the oral but it was 16 yrs ago so a lot of the details are gone. I really didn't dwell on the OM, honesty I was 20/21yrs old when I had my PA in the beginning of dating my BH. I did lie about what I did and that is why I'm here.

I wasn't expecting my thread to go this way. I feel a very strong need to defend my BH and to continue to try to see things his way. He is a hurt soul right now and I want to help him heal. I truly love this man and the family we have built together. My children are my world, I've been a stay at home mom for 4+ years. Just recently I got a part time job (2wks ago) that's how I'll afford IC. BH hasn't talked of me moving out of our home. We still have family dinners but we spend weekends apart taking turns doing something with the kids. BH works graveyard so we don't see much of each other during the week. We will still spend hours on the phone while he is at work.

I'm not defending my actions I betrayed and lied to my BH. I just don't know where to go from here. Nothing been signed yet, I will get IC before we talk to the lawyer.

[This message edited by 15yrsinthemaking at 11:19 AM, April 24th (Saturday)]

One sunrise at a time

posts: 122   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2020
id 8653658
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sisoon ( Moderator #31240) posted at 6:01 PM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

I'm here to seek advice on rebuilding my relationship with my BS.

You can't do that until you start rebuilding your relationship with yourself. You have your heart set on R, but that may not happen. You can't control the outcome. You might as well give up trying to control the outcome. By building a strong, healthy relationship with yourself, you can become a good partner - for your H, for someone else, for yourself.

IMO, R has to be between equal partners. It is not between a superior being and an inferior being.

You did not offer full custody from a conscious/mindful position. Your promise is contrary to best child-rearing practices and to current legal principles.

You need to get good legal representation, and you need to follow most of your attorney's advice.

You and your H's desires are secondary in custody matters - the kids come first. They are not pawns in this; they're victims. They'll come through this best with 2 emotionally healthy parents. If they can't have 2, one may do. But if custody is a bargaining chip, are either of you fulfilling your parenting responsibilities?

I agree with Chamomile, BTW. I'm confused about what makes this an issue now. What's going on with your H.

In another thread, you say you rug-swept. Actually it takes 2 to rug-sweep; your H chose that way out, too.

[This message edited by sisoon at 12:14 PM, April 24th (Saturday)]

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 30527   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8653670
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ChamomileTea ( Moderator #53574) posted at 6:36 PM on Saturday, April 24th, 2021

So, the only thing he didn't know about was an incident of oral sex sixteen years ago before marriage, and he's saying that he wouldn't have married you or had children with you if he'd known about it. You didn't actually get married until something like seven years later, right? And this was the only thing he didn't know at the time he agreed to the marriage?

Let me share something with you... the prefrontal cortex of the brain doesn't fully mature until we're about 25 years old. That's the judgment center. So, you're being held to account for something which happened before your brain was fully matured. His argument... well, you hid it. Yes you did. When you made the initial decision to hide it, your brain wasn't fully matured. But later, and before the marriage, you might have reviewed that earlier piece of information and you didn't. THAT is the ONLY thing you're guilty of. And as mitigating facts, you've been a good and faithful wife and mother for NINE years.

You know what? I had sex before marriage. Lots of sex before marriage. I had boyfriends and hook-ups, and yes... there was some oral in there too. And you know what my WH knows about all that?... fuck all. It's not his business. We weren't married yet. I took a vow of fidelity when I married him and I have held to it. And even though I am the promiscuous one, it was him who cheated. But... I can hear the argument... you were exclusive sixteen years ago and he didn't know about the blow job. He wouldn't have married you if he'd known. And my answer is... that he doesn't love you and he never did. Further, you might not have married a man so prudish and judgmental if you had known. So, you BOTH didn't know something. He's not the only one who got sold a bill of goods. A man who loves you might be upset, let down, etc. He might feel a bit cheated that he wasn't getting blow jobs earlier in the marriage or whatever. But your fifteen years together would mitigate his irrational urge to punish you for something you did when you were essentially a child and BEFORE marriage.

I don't believe he's being honest with you. I think he's keeping you sweet while he divorces you and that his promise to reconcile is worthless. Even if he did allow R, he's demoting you from wife to girlfriend with no promise of remarriage. That's putting you in the "one-down" in perpetuity. A lifetime punishment, as it were. Frankly, you still sound like you're young enough to be a wife and maybe even have a few more children. Why would you sacrifice your status as a wife and mother on the off-chance of forgiveness by a guy who's FIRST inclination is not to consider how much you've been through together or whether you've remediated the internal flaws which allowed you to lie all those many years ago, but instead, wants to put you in a permanent one-down? You ask "How can I show him I've changed?"

But he should be able to SEE that in the nine years you've spent together as man and wife. Those years should have meant something to him.

I wasn't expecting my thread to go this way. I feel a very strong need to defend my BH and to continue to try to see things his way. He is a hurt soul right now and I want to help him heal. I truly love this man and the family we have built together.

For typical BS healing, the schedule is something like two to five years. That's even when very bad things have happened, not just before the marriage but during, and not just one incident, but many. Healing also requires the BS to be a bit proactive in seeking out therapy and healing solutions. So how about this?.... before you agree to throwing out the baby along with the bathwater, why not try some traditional therapies? IC for both of you and MC together. You would do well to work with a therapist who is well-qualified in infidelity so that s/he can empathize with your WH's feelings. It's only been eleven days since he found out this missing piece of information, right? Doesn't it make more sense that before he throws away his entire family dynamic that he give traditional therapy a real shot. Then, if he can't find healing in five years... go ahead and give him a divorce on good terms, but NOT custody of the children. Kids NEED both parents. They're innocent. They should have their truest needs met regardless of what's going on between you and their father. If that won't satisfy him, than I think it's a fair conclusion that NOTHING was going to and that he's tricking you into an unfair financial settlement by plying your guilt.

At that point, you should lawyer up and fight back for what's fair.

Don't trust someone who is telling you with their actions that they don't love you. Sweetie, you couldn't GET more hurt than I was after my own DDay, and hell yeah, I was bent on divorce that first week. But, I calmed down and I realized that my fWH was willing to do whatever it took to prove himself, and because I loved him, I gave him that chance.

I always say that no cheater is OWED a second chance, and I mean that. If your WH feels like nothing but divorce will make it right, fine. But that doesn't mean he should be allowed to cheat you out of what you're owed. The majority of courts won't agree to it anyway. So if he doesn't back down on this, you should fight back for your children and a fair settlement. Remember that love isn't enough to keep a marriage going. There has to be respect as well. You don't get respect by laying your neck on the execution block. You get it by being a fully matured woman who can (and will) manage her business. So, if your WH is looking for "sorry"?.. yeah, you're sorry. You were young and stupid and your brain wasn't fully matured. If he's looking for "change"?.. you've proved your change in nine faithful years of marriage. If he's looking to fuck you out of custody of your children and your half of the marital assets?... NO. Get an attorney and fight for what's yours. Don't think that you're losing anything either, because if it comes to that, you can rest assured that he didn't really care for you.

BW: 2004(online EAs), 2014 (multiple PAs); Married 40 years; in R with fWH for 10

posts: 7075   ·   registered: Jun. 8th, 2016   ·   location: U.S.
id 8653675
Topic is Sleeping.
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