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One week after D-day feel like R is too easy

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decaynus posted 4/15/2021 19:44 PM

One week ago today I discovered my wife was having an affair with a man in her hometown that lasted 4 weeks. (here is the thread I posted about it: https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=653250) I found their entire conversation history on her FB. It was a sexual affair and she was sneaking around behind my back to see him. She admitted everything, I broke down, she broke down, I told her our marriage was over. She stayed one night at home, and then went to her sister's (which I suggested as she needed her for her support.) She was in a complete fog.

I recruited her Dad by phoning him. My wife's mother cheated on her Dad and left him for this man, so he knows what I was dealing with. I also contacted the partner of the AP and together we blew the lid off everything and brought them both crashing back down to earth.

Those first few days were absolute hell, as you can imagine. I was completely broken. I had my 3 young children at home and had to take care of them, getting them to school etc. But I had amazing support from my parents and close friends.

In the 5 days she was away we talked a lot over text. She asked me if I still want to be married and I asked her "why would I want to stay married to someone who clearly doesn't love or respect me, and has zero loyalty?" This hit her hard and I think was the shock she needed because at this point she told me she would do absolutely anything to fix this and win back my love and trust. I told her I didn't think she had it in her but she was welcome to prove me wrong.

She returned home two days ago and we have talked and talked and talked. I've had her describe to me in explicit detail everything that happened in the times they spent together. This not only helped me to stop imagining what happened, but made her really face the idea that I now knew everything. I didn't allow her to skip past any detail and I trust that she's been 100% honest (because really, it couldn't possible GET any more honest.)

She's repeated over and over how remorseful she is, how stupid she was, and how much she loathes herself right now for the hurt she's not only caused me, but our children and families.

What helped me understand in having her describe everything (it certainly wasn't pleasant hearing any of this, but I'm glad I know) is that my wife's stupid choices were born out of this guy taking advantage of her low self esteem. We've been together for 15 years, and naturally, when only person is telling you how desirable you are, you do start to wonder if that's the general consensus out there. He was saying all the right things, and she fell for his charm, and then simply got caught up in the thrill and danger of the whole thing. Not once in the conversations I read did she say anything negative about me, or discuss leaving me. It was clear that she remained committed to me, despite the affair.

I've known my wife for 18 years so I can sense the slightest change in her character, and it was exactly this intuition that told me something was going on in those 4 weeks that made me start looking for evidence. She was being totally different towards me (which I now see as being driven by her guilt) and her outings were unusual and didn't make sense.

Since my wife returned home it's like I have my old wife back. We are sleeping separately but we are showing each other a lot of gentleness and affection. I want her in another bed as almost like a punishment. I've told her that this is going well but I don't want her to feel like she's had a soft landing. I truly feel that she has realized exactly what she stood to lose when I said I no longer wanted to be married to her.

Last night (second night home) we ended up having sex, and it felt so good to almost "reclaim" my wife. I did not want to sleep together so soon, but I felt like the longer it waited the more expectation there would be. I also needed to remind her of how good sex with me is (because this guy only really cared about his own pleasure - she told me he was rubbish, and they even discussed it in their messages.)

This morning she was a bit funny and when I asked her what's up she told me she feels like I'm rushing too quickly to forgive her and she doesn't think she deserves any of this.

All the advice in my "just found out" thread was to "DIVORCE HER NOW" (well not all, but mostly) because "she will do it again" and "she is with him now" and "it's not over."

I know when my wife is being sincere and when she's hiding something (fortunately in 15 years this is the first time I sensed she was hiding something) and I feel like I already trust her. She offered me to be able to track her location on her phone, and offered to turn over FB logins etc. and while I first felt like I needed those things, I decided it really served no purpose. A major reason people cheat in the first place is because they feel trapped in their lives, and I did not want to create a prison for her. It did not seem like a healthy way forward.

Everyone was telling me to demand that she end the affair, start no-contact, and block him. I then pestered her for the next 24 hours to ensure she did it. In hindsight I wish I had actually said "If you want to be with him, go now, I won't stop you. But if you do, know that our marriage is over." That would have given her a choice right then and there. Carry on her fantasy with Mr I've-known-you-for-4-weeks, or end it and move all your focus into saving the marriage that you didn't even realize was so important to you, and keeping your family together.

I keep asking myself if I'm being naive to think this will never happen again, and to ask if I'm letting her off too easy. What we are doing now, which is just talking honestly and openly about everything we feel now and anything we've ever felt before, feels like a brand new level of our relationship. Things I might have wanted to talk to her before about, but didn't for fear of hurting her feelings, are now completely on the table, and she is taking a really mature approach to everything because she realizes that this stuff happens.

I never would have imagined in a billion years that my wife was capable of doing this. And I don't believe she ever thought herself capable either. It would be so easy to let raw emotion dictate the future in a moment, but I am choosing to take a wiser approach, realizing that this is real life, and things do happen, and nobody is perfect, and nobody sets out to hurt someone they love. I chose to look at what was worth saving in our marriage instead of throwing it out in an instant based on anger and bitterness.

What I suspected would take months or years of pain and suffering and rebuilding of trust no longer seems like a requirement. My wife knows in no uncertain terms that should something like this ever happen again, it will be the final and complete end of our marriage. But I also genuinely believe that she has learned a very painful lesson herself.

What is important from here is to not let the memory of this pain fade. Because as time passes, we remember events, but we don't remember the exact emotions, so it can be easy to start to dismiss the events as bad, but not "emotional murder," as I saw one writer describe it. For now I am just taking one day at a time. I'm not attached to any outcome. This could work out and make us stronger than ever, but it could also just as easily not work out - and that will be fine - but I have strong hope for the former.

My wife is going to start therapy to work on her self esteem issues (and lack of self respect) and we are starting couple's counseling next week.

[This message edited by decaynus at 7:51 PM, April 15th (Thursday)]

CaptainRogers posted 4/15/2021 20:39 PM

Brother, I'm sorry that you are among thosenof us who never wanted to be in this club. Welcome.

You probably aren't going to like what I have to say here, but you do need to hear it. Welcome to the 2x4, if you will.

You need to slow this down. You are a week out from your D-Day. You are still 100% in shock. I will promise you that you don't know half of what went down. Your wife has given you enough information at this point to satisfy your questions. I can tell you with 100% accuracy that this is only the beginning. How do I know? Because I traveled this road as well.

As a guy who made the same mistake that you are about to make, I will tell you this: DO NOT DO ANY MC SESSIONS YET. Hopefully that came out forcefully enough.

Here's what I will tell you about MC. Unless your counselor specializes in or has DECADES (not a few clients, not a couple years, but DECADES) of experience with trauma, specifically, infidelity-based trauma, this isn't going to go well.

We started MC too early. My wife hadn't figured out anything (and didn't really care to, even though she went through the motions) with her IC. Without that individual work, the REAL work, on her part, all the MC sessions in the world will be a thorough waste of money.

Get yourself a good IC. Put the MC sessions on hold, and go work on being the best you that you can be.

You don't have the full story. She isn't remorseful. She regrets what she did and that she got caught. Remorse doesn't create a victim (the "oh woe is me" that she is professing). Remorse sees YOUR pain and is saddened for causing it. Remorse is filled with empathy, looking at the damage caused, rather than loathing herself.

Slow down. This is a long, long journey. You are nowhere near the R-train yet.

Continue to post and to process here. There are thousands who have shared this experience. It is quite cathartic.

decaynus posted 4/15/2021 20:49 PM

@CaptainRogers I know exactly the days that she saw him and I've had her describe hour-by-hour what they did. It was excruciating detail for her. How they had sex, where they had sex, etc.

I already see a therapist weekly. Have done for nearly 3 years. So that is why I feel wiser in the way I am processing and managing this.

The thing about this guy was that he was telling my wife that he was separated and his ex-partner (and mother of child) was awful to him, and all this stuff, but once I contacted the partner - nope - they were in reconciliation. He was spending the whole day with his wife and son and then when they left, my wife came over for sex. She was pretty stunned that it was all a life. She's even contact the partner with an apology because the partner is now in the "just found out" stage and is a wreck.

fareast posted 4/15/2021 21:09 PM

Glad to see your WW has started to take baby steps. Watch her actions, not her words. We are all different. You do you. Good that she can see the AP for the liar and player he is,
But donít underestimate the power of the emotional trauma you have suffered. The emotional rollercoaster is real and you will be on it, and the anger and sadness will still hit you. Your WW has to be with you and not defensive. Humility is imperative. Read the posts from Bigger in your JFO thread talking about what is required for true R. So, your WW no longer wants to live in the rural area near her hometown? She is satisfied living in the city with you? She needs IC and you need to heal as well. Good luck in your way forward.

decaynus posted 4/15/2021 21:17 PM

So, your WW no longer wants to live in the rural area near her hometown? She is satisfied living in the city with you?

No, she still wants to move there.

Wiseoldfool posted 4/15/2021 21:52 PM

Hey, I am reliably a ďorient toward happily ever after until it is impossibleĒ member here. I admit it.

Your elation today will not last.

You will become consumed with rage.

You will despise what she has done and that will become inseparable from how you feel about her.

And then you will love her again.

And then you will be despondent.

And then angry.

And then you will love her again.

And so on.

For a while.

When this happens, when your world turns upside down again in spite of how you feel today, do not despair as if it were permanent.

Despair as if that, too, will pass.

And orient toward happily ever after. Just donít resent the roller coaster for being a roller coaster.

[This message edited by Wiseoldfool at 9:53 PM, April 15th (Thursday)]

HellFire posted 4/15/2021 22:04 PM

The thing about this guy was that he was telling my wife that he was separated and his ex-partner (and mother of child) was awful to him, and all this stuff, but once I contacted the partner - nope - they were in reconciliation. He was spending the whole day with his wife and son and then when they left, my wife came over for sex. She was pretty stunned that it was all a life

This is nothing unique. Nearly every ws lies to their AP. Thru say they're still living with their spouse, but in separate room,and only for the kids. Or that their is no spouse. It's so extremely common.

You are a week out from finding out. I think you would do well to read these forums. Listen to the advice you get. And realize there is a lot of wisdom here.

It sounds like you are in a hurry to rugsweep. That never works.

If you are having sex,both of you need to be tested for stds.

I find it odd that your wife went to his house, but didn't know he was still married. No pics up? No womens clothing anywhere? When she went to the bathroom, no women's shampoo, or razor in the tub? Nothing? Sounds highly unlikely.

[This message edited by HellFire at 10:05 PM, April 15th (Thursday)]

decaynus posted 4/15/2021 22:26 PM

I got myself tested this week. All clear. My wife had organised to get tested last week but had to cancel because we had a funeral to go to.

So AP and his partner had recently separated, so he had his own place, but they WERE actively trying to reconcile their relationship (they're not married.)

I'm definitely not trying to rugsweep. I'm even telling my wife I feel like I am moving too quickly with accepting and moving on from this - and she agrees.

redbaron007 posted 4/16/2021 00:26 AM

She's repeated over and over how remorseful she is, how stupid she was, and how much she loathes herself right now for the hurt she's not only caused me, but our children and families.

What choice does she have? The AP has thrown her under the bus, which is the only reason why she is back with you. She was actively having sex with him up until the A was exposed to his partner. So Plan A did not work, fallback to Plan B, which is you.

It was clear that she remained committed to me, despite the affair.

Yes, just like the thief followed the law, except while committing the robbery. Please don't delude yourself - she was not committed to you when she had the affair, unless you guys have an open marriage.

This morning she was a bit funny and when I asked her what's up she told me she feels like I'm rushing too quickly to forgive her and she doesn't think she deserves any of this.

What I suspected would take months or years of pain and suffering and rebuilding of trust no longer seems like a requirement.

You are more eager to forgive her than she is to be forgiven, it is indeed funny in an ironic way - your WW cannot believe her good fortune. Moving from JFO to Reconciliation in one week, that's one for the record books - people here generally agree reconciliation takes somewhere between 2-5 years.

My wife knows in no uncertain terms that should something like this ever happen again, it will be the final and complete end of our marriage.

With you being so quick to reconcile, how does she know that? Did you file for divorce? Ask her to separate? All she knows is she can fool around, you will play the pick-me-dance, she can come back and you will declare victory and "reclaim her" with a few romps in the haystack.

But I also genuinely believe that she has learned a very painful lesson herself.

She learned all this in one week? All she has learnt is to do a better job in selecting an AP.


Dragonfly123 posted 4/16/2021 02:19 AM

Decaynus Iím so sorry youíre here.

Firstly, I completely believe in reconciliation and am happily reconciling despite being walked out on with small children, multiple Ddays and a separation.

BUT I do not believe in a remorseful spouse after one week. The level of selfishness and entitlement that comes from an affair is just too great.

In the aftermath of a dday they are doing damage control. She may well have told you everything, she may well be hurt her AP lied to her too, she may well want to be with you BUT the drivers that got her into this are still there and driving her.

Do not trust a word she says. But also donít trust your own reactions. Youíre on one hell of a roller coaster and your feelings today could be profoundly different to your feelings tomorrow. I had counselling prior to my WHs affair, but I was not prepared at all for what came.

The hardest advice I had was just watch and wait. I wanted my marriage back. I love my little family, I just wanted the contentment and happiness back and I was prepared to rush it all through to get that. It was a HUGE mistake.

Please remove yourself a little and watch and wait. She will need to work on herself. You will need to see that. You do you. Take care of you.

And Iím going to say it, her excuse is BS. She had the affair because she wanted to not because she was vulnerable to his wiles or because her loving husband wasnít showing her enough attention. To apportion any blame to you is wrong. That alone tells me sheís NOT remorseful.

[This message edited by Dragonfly123 at 2:21 AM, April 16th (Friday)]

decaynus posted 4/16/2021 02:35 AM

thanks Dragonfly123

RocketRaccoon posted 4/16/2021 03:52 AM

No, she still wants to move there.

What is the driving force behind this almost irrational 'need' to move back there?

If she says it is family, then it might be worth asking what is it about 'family' that she 'needs' to move back?

If she says they will offer support, then you ask why your support is not enough.

This questioning keeps going on until you get to the base 'why', which may not be 'family' after all...


grubs posted 4/16/2021 06:09 AM

thanks Dragonfly123

He's 100% correct. The brokenness in your WS that allowed her to stray is still there regardless of her AP's failings. Just because her AP is awful in comparison to you doesn't mean the next one will be. You can't rely on her promises that she won't stray again. She made similar ones on your wedding day and violated those to have the A.

The1stWife posted 4/16/2021 06:32 AM

She still wants to move back to her hometown? Hmmm.....

I think a compromise is possible- like a weekend home there. But why would you want to move to a town where she had an affair? How difficult that would be for you.

In reading your posts you said your wife pursued you for 3 years. While you lived where you do now. So she was willing to accept you for who you were ó but now wants to rewrite the marriage terms.

It would be fine if you both agree to it. But......your lives are not in her hometown. Not your work. Not your kidsí lives.

You can compromise that after the kids finish HS itís an option. But itís not an option right now. And sheís either going to accept that or sheís going to leave you.

Now is NOT the time to be discussing or considering a relocation. Your marriage is on life support and now is not the time to move the patient.

I hope you see that.

asc1226 posted 4/16/2021 06:55 AM

I think a compromise is possible- like a weekend home there.
You can compromise that after the kids finish HS itís an option.

Definitely wait to make this an option. If you buy a weekend home in her town, I think youíd soon find her spending a lot more than just weekends there.

As Dragonfly said, wait and watch. Donít make any major changes to your life for a woman you canít be sure of, who probably isnít sure of herself.

I believe from your last thread you were consulting with a lawyer. You may want to ask about a post nuptial agreement.

ggcamp1975 posted 4/16/2021 07:50 AM

decaynus - I am posting this as a person who is just a little over 6 months out from DDay. I know exactly how you feel, I have been with my husband since I was 16, we are talking almost 30 yrs with this man. I know his every move, facial expression etc so like you I knew something was off and boom discovered his A. He was immediately "remorseful" and I was so happy thinking ok cool we can make it. The thing is for at least those first 90 days, neither one of us knew how we felt. I loved him, I hated him, I wanted to have sex with him (we did a lot), I wanted to throat punch him and I could have all those emotions in one day, or one hour. I can say honestly only now do I feel that he sort of gets it but we have a long way to go.

My point is, embrace and enjoy the good days but by no means get your hopes up that it's all going smooth and will continue to. I made that mistake only to have a trigger or just anything flip me back to the DDay feeling and let me tell you that rage yeah it comes back and it will blindside you. I am in no place to give long term advice on R, I just making it day by day right now. We have had a great few days, but last weekend not so much. Why you ask? Because I saw a phone case that looked like his old one he had during his A and yep that's all it took to take me down. Keep working on yourself and take it day to day or minute by minute if you have to

CaptainRogers posted 4/16/2021 08:46 AM

I know exactly the days that she saw him and I've had her describe hour-by-hour what they did. It was excruciating detail for her. How they had sex, where they had sex, etc.

No, you know exactly what she was willing to share. Believe me, you don't know everything.

As another has already said, talk is cheap. She can say anything and everything she wants. Until those actions align with the words, it is all simply lip service.

Whatever she says about the AP being manipulative, cunning, etc., you need to see that as her blameshifting. She is placing the blame at the APs feet, making herself out to be the victim. Same thing when she says something about the marital relationship forcing her to look outside for love/validation/ego stroking. Until she points the thumb at herself and takes ownership of it all, she is blameshifting, minimizing, deflecting, or defending. None of those is remorseful. Those are all regret-based.

And don't believe what your wife says that the AP told her. My wife would tell me what the AP said about the dates he had been out on, how he described in detail what he was doing with the women he was dating (including their bedroom activities). I asked "how could he have been doing all of that if the two of you were either together physically or were on the phone/texting all the time? When did he have time for that? No answer...because he couldn't have had time. Was he grooming her and trying to figure out how far she was willing to go? Possibly. But she was a willing participant in all of it.

And by the way...he was cheating on his longtime GF with my wife. And he had cheated on his ex-wife 2x before she divorced him. Yeah, he must have been smooth. But my wife was willing and made herself available. So did yours.

See, I've been down your path, brother. I SO wanted what my wife told me to be true. What I found out was that she started with lies, continued with lies, and to this day, I believe she still has lies left unexplored.

It has taken my wife over 4 years (and us changing to a new, amazing MC) for her to even begin to understand. In the last 6 weeks, she seems to be a new, truly remorseful person. Our MC has held her feet to the fire. My wife was with two ICs (one before/during her A, one right after), both of whom encouraged her to "do what made her happy", which included having the A and leaving me. Until you see real change through actions, don't pin any hope on your wife simply seeing an IC.

As a guy who has dealt with the spouse who could go a couple weeks of "pretending" that she cared and was remorseful, only to watch her fall back into either rugsweep or blame everyone else mode, you need to listen to what everyone here is saying.

You are still emotionally in shock, even with a good IC whom you have seen for years. This is going to take time because those emotions will hit you like a ton of bricks.

Be good to yourself. Listen to the advice of the "experts" at SI. If something doesn't fit your situation, feel free to discard it. But I believe you will find more in common than not.

Unhinged posted 4/16/2021 09:48 AM

Hey there, decaynus. So, I have to say from the outset that this is the first time I have ever read from a BS who "feel[s] like R is too easy." My very first thought upon reading just the title of your thread was that this is a man who is in shock.

Those first few days were absolute hell, as you can imagine.
I don't have to use my imagination. The first few months were absolute hell for me. The next couple of years were pretty fucking awful as well.

Perhaps you have the tools and coping mechanisms that most of us lack when our lives are suddenly blow apart. I might hope that such is the case (and admit tremendous envy). However, I have my doubts. If you're anything at all like the rest of us, you're in shock, which is typical, normal, expected and perfectly natural.

For me, I think the shock finally wore-off about 10 months after d-day.

What I suspected would take months or years of pain and suffering and rebuilding of trust no longer seems like a requirement.
Give it time, brother, and hold on to your hat. It's only been a week. The shit storm is just beginning for you and it's one hell of a storm.

Keep on reading and posting here.

ETA: Read what CaptainRogers wrote to you again. Despite being a Cubs fan, he's a wise man.

[This message edited by Unhinged at 9:50 AM, April 16th (Friday)]

GTeamReboot posted 4/16/2021 10:42 AM

Hey, I am reliably a ďorient toward happily ever after until it is impossibleĒ member here. I admit it
Same, and I like how you worded it wiseoldfool

Shock. It sucks. I was also one who posted straight to the reconciliation forum because by the time I found SI, I had not ďjust found outĒ and we were in R but I needed support. But I may have benefited from the advice and 2x4ís in there. I also had an instantly remorseful/regretful FWH who had already long given up his brief A phase. From the start he told me everything, got tested, lovebombed, hysterical bonding, apologized a lot, fielded all my questions... Shoulda been easy peasy right?

Ok so 18 months out we are doing well. Thatís to say... well for a couple working through significant trauma during a historically stressful time in the world. But even the ďeasiestĒ most well-handled and perfectly executed R (spoiler alert- no such thing) is SO HARD. And the extra cruel thing is how it hits you just as you start to enjoy the feeling that maybe this isnít so bad and youíll be fine. Bam. Triggers and ruminations and new questions. That reality can be unsettling for a WS who thinks they are almost in the clear then finds you crumbling again. They need to be very patient with that. And you be patient with yourself.

For me the shock wore off and the anger hit hardest around 6 months. The ups and downs were steep after that. The next 6 months or so were awful. Gradual improvement over the next 6 months after that. The ups and downs are more rolling now. I think Iíve gotten off the Extreme coaster and onto the Kiddie coaster. But it still makes my stomach drop when I least expect it. And I come running here for advice and reassurance.

For sure you have some of the key pieces needed for R. Your hopefulness isnít baseless and if it feels that way, embrace it. But take none of these factors for granted, and realize that one of the most important yet unavoidable ones is Time. And it canít be rushed by either one of you.

Best of luck!

HardKnocks posted 4/16/2021 11:26 AM

If you feel like "R is too easy" then you are definitely rug-sweeping. It doesn't usually turn out for the best.

Keep reading here. Keep going to IC.

Good luck!

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