SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I tried to post in my old in thread to keep it linear but basically back with my fiancée who cheated on me and back to my life a year ago. Things are good for the most part, we have our ups and downs but been consistent so far. We do not live together, for cultural reasons, no living together until marriage. Which brings me to my next point. I’m in my final stint of medical school and applying for a residency for next year but I am not a US citizen, she is, and applying to these programs as a foreign grad is very hard if you need a visa. I spoke to a lawyer who advised me to get married first and then apply and that the chances are higher to be accepted. I brought this up with her but she just said “I’m not ready for marriage right now” even though we have been talking about marriage and have had many arguments about this topic leading up to this point. She always says she sees my side but at the end she’s like I need to listen to myself here and while I don’t want to end things with you, I just am not ready for marriage. This sounds like a repeat of the last time I caught her cheating happened. She refused engagement that time and a few months later I find out she’s cheating.

She’s not mean or rude or anything. She’s been doing a lot for me and has been actively working to improve our relationship in other ways. So I am so perplexed. This seems like a logical conclusion to why this would help both our futures if the point is to be together for the rest of our lives like we both claim for each other.

Am I missing something? Do I have blinders on again?

I feel so stupid. She’s saying the same things again to me. “I need some time for myself” “I need to work on my self” but at the same time when I question her if she’s having an affair again, she’s says no, she would never want to do that again because the guilt nearly killed her. She says I’ve made sacrifices for everyone, and getting married right now is not what I want so I don’t want to just get married just because of a visa issue. Without this marriage, I’m really not sure where our relationship is heading. I’m so lost and confused here. I have worked my ass off for all of this to happen and to build this life. 7 years I invested in this and forgave her and when time comes just for her to do this for our future, she’s becoming hesitant and distant from me.

Is she cheating again? She says she doesn’t want to end things and that I’m the only man she wants in her life, she just wants more time to figure herself out; meaning she’s been out of school for 1.5 years now but she hadn’t got a job which is affecting her a lot, she feels like a failure and doesn’t feel like she can contribute anything else to the relationship. She fears if she comes into this relationship like this, she’s doomed to be a house wife. I can sympathize with all these and dispel those fears. I just can’t get the thought out of my mind that I’m being played again. Please help me

It sounds to me like she’s being honest with you: she doesn’t want to marry you, or she does eventually, but not right now. I agree with her that it would be foolish to let herself be pushed into a marriage she’s not ready for because of a visa. There are SO many stories about that ending in divorce.

Yes, it's important to you. It will allow things to go smoothly and you are doing so much to create a nice future. I understand also that you feel like you have heard this before and she was not being honest about what she was doing. So that feels stressful. I would also use caution here. You want her to feel 100% positive about this. Keep working on the relationship and don't push. When shes enthusiastic you will know.

I know it's frustrating and you should let her know it's disappointing for you. Honor her feelings and tell her how much you want to be a couple visa or not. Be patient if you honestly believe she is changed and working hard on herself. I hope she gets a job she likes. That should take her stress and worries down.

I think my problem is that we been together so long, and I honestly have been dreaming of this day and her too since we were young and just graduated university, that when you become a resident, we will finally get married and suppprt each other.

Maybe you guys are right and she is being honest. I just feel hurt still because I feel like I’m doing all the heavy lifting of building a future for US mean while she’s just focusing on HER and her alone. Idk if that makes sense. I always figured in a relationship you do things for each other and try to always support each other and reduce each other’s burdens.

I spoke with her and told her that I am okay with her not wanting to be married and that I shouldn’t have sprung it on her like this and that it’s unfair to both of us for me to have to convince her to marry me for the visa especially. She responded that when we were young we used to look forward to our wedding with excitement and magic in our eyes but that has gone missing since everything happened. She says we should both work on ourselves to get to a point where that is back and we can then get married.

I just fear that without any real commitment here, if I move somewhere in the US, and she’s back at home the long distance is going to kill this relationship or give her another chance to cheat or something

LL90,

Going to be blunt here, so please don't read if you are going to be offended.

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You are still trying to do the Pick-me Dance, and you seem to want to do it. There seems to be a need in you to achieve your dream of marrying your WGF no matter what.

Why is this? Why do you seem to NEED your WGF to be part of your future? Why are you not comfortable with going on with YOUR life on your OWN? Why pin so much of your future dreams on your WGF?

I had a quick read through some of your previous posts, and it looks like your WGF is just placating you. She feels guilty of what she did, and because of cultural pressures/norms (you had mentioned that your families were still 'engaged' even if you two had taken a 'break') so she is staying with you. She will white knuckle the reset of her life if you two stay together.

I have worked my ass off for all of this to happen and to build this life.

Maybe she does not want this life anymore? How involved was she in this building/planning of the 'life'?

7 years I invested in this and forgave her and when time comes just for her to do this for our future, she’s becoming hesitant and distant from me.

It could be that she wants out, but does not know, or feels too guilty, to say it. She might feel that she will let both families down (am assuming this will be a cultural/societal repercussion).

All in all, If your WGF truly wants you, she will be walking over hot coals and broken glass to be with you. Currently, you should be focusing on yourself, and not worry about what your WGF might/could be doing.

There is only one person that will be guaranteed to stay with you for your entire life, and that person is YOU. Not you parents, siblings, friends, partners, et al.

Do what YOU need to do for YOURSELF first. Then your successes can flow on to others.

I considered everything you said @RocketRacoon

Things have changed drastically since those posts. For one, there is no more cultural pressure, her parents are fully aware of what she did and so is my family. They respect that we are trying to work through it and want to see us succeed but wouldn’t fault us if it didn’t.

I have asked her multiple times, even tonight, that hey, don’t be here if you aren’t a 100% in it. You don’t have to be and I would rather rip of the bandaid all at once than slowly feel the pain over time, she remains adamant that I am her choice for the future. This was proven to be only because in certain arguments about her behavior I threatened to end it and she does not want me to end things, she refuses to take that answer because she always says “I don’t know what I would do without you in my life”

Back when I made those posts of her cheating, she was practically telling me to just F off and leave her alone.

You are right though in one respect. I am too dependent on her being in my life. I’m deeply bothered that I feel, even though she won’t let me end things, if things did end. She would be okay, but I would be devastated and I hate that imbalance and I have no idea how to fix it.

Maybe she feels pressure to make a commitment she’s not ready to make.

Stop asking. Stop talking about it. Stop thinking about it.

The reality is her words do not equal her actions. She says “you are the only man I want”. Yet she’s not running towards you to get married. Or move your relationship forward.

She’s “working on herself”. That signals she’s not sure what she wants YET she expects you to wait for her while she figures things out.

I hope this helps you see the reality of your situation.

I think if you found a job and she didn't follow you you would have an idea where she is. You can't worry about people's choices. I feel the same about my WS. Yes, I want him to ask me to move back and we are happy again. I love him dearly. The truth is people have free will to choose and sometimes they don't make us the top priority.

Letting go of a dream is very hard. Especially when you love someone and don't want another future. But now you need to focus on your task and it's her choice to come with you or not. She's at the branch in the road now. You can't pick for her. It's much better if you don't because you want someone who is completely there. Marriage is hard enough without added uncertainty.

I'm sorry, it's hard. It is. Sometimes we have to stop waiting. I wish I knew what to tell you to inspire her. She's got to feel it within. I hope she's being honest.

Don't be afraid. Fear isnt the way to make choices. If you think something will happen if you work far away then she's not safe for you. That is for her to prove she's safe. Maybe that means she follows you. You will feel it when it's right.

I think you're right in expecting 100% commitment to R.

Personally, I would hate to be M to someone who wasn't sure she wanted to e M to me.

I think she's being honest, too.

Are you ready to say, 'M me, or we're done'? If you're not ready for that, one of you has to bend.

If you want to M her and think she'll want to M you in the future, I don't see staying with her as allowing yourself to be walked over.

If this is a deal killer, though, what's keeping you around? If you want to M, why not leave and find someone to M?

I think she would want to follow me to my future residency placement wherever it may be but because she still lives with her parents, and our cultures are very strict about living with anyone you aren’t married to, there’s no other option for us if we want to be together like that. It’s marriage or just visits.

I understand what everyone is saying, and I know there are other fish in the sea but we all decided to R here because we found reasons to want to stay.

Let me explain again, I actually have no issue with the fact that she isn’t ready to be married to me. What I do take issue with is that she’s saying why should she do this. When she broke up with me for the OM, she broke my heart, completely screwed me over, my family and put her own parents in a tough spot in our community and families, had 0 regard for anything else even her own self respect, all for WHATT, a fucking loser who still to this day hasn’t accomplished jack fucking shit with his life. Here I am literally, putting my life on the line especially during COVID times, and trying to get everything done ASAP even though all my schedules got delayed, all so I can have a promising career and I just want to use that to help people and make a good living so I can provide for her and my family. That’s not a sacrifice worth making to her?

It just doesn’t sit well with me that she can go above and beyond for OM, but here I am, saying hey, the man who you claim to love more than anything else in the world is struggling to secure a good placement because of visa issues, but you can’t actually make a decision just to help that situation. I also get how I can be sounding selfish right now, because I’m worried more about me and my career, but in reality l, I never see these things in a vacuum. I always tell her your success is my success and my success is your success. Together we can accomplish anything we like.

I also have just lost all my confidence, all my friends got married, and tbh some of them aren’t amazing to their wife. I hear all the time, hey we wish they were like you, so then wtf am I doing wrong? Why can’t I just get some respect, empathy and care here.

The way my friend put it, and it’s true and that’s what bothers me. He said, she could walk away from you right now and be okay. You can’t do the same. So what does that tell you. I don’t know wtf that tells me, I never wanted to limit how much I invest or care about a person I just wanted to love them with all of me and I always do.

I really do feel hopeless these days. Just going from anger to sad, with really no emotions in between.

I know one of her concerns is that, she thinks I’m also not in the right head space to get M to her. In the last year I’ve been very suspicious of her, I can’t help but check her location all the time. The moment anything seems out of the ordinary my mind jumps to, she must be cheating on me. She thinks that she’s being treated unfairly in this way when she isn’t doing anything of the sort but I can’t help it. I read on these websites to always trust your gut and I honestly can’t tell anymore. She always texts me where she’s going, sends me pictures when she’s there without me asking, all the things to comfort my head that goes crazy when I start to think about what she could be up to. It’s been over a year since the affair and I don’t think I’ve made too much progress in this part.

I think her mom may also have advised her not to get married right now because of this behavior in me.

The way I see it, I’ve had to have so many fights and arguments with her for her to see things from my perspective, nothing that was given to me came easy, I had to spend hours and hours explaining every little feeling in detail for her to get it, so I just don’t have trust in her own instincts if I have to explain literally everything.

I tried to tell her mom, how can I feel like she’s committed when anytime any real talk of commitment comes up (marriage) she wants to run for the hills. Her moms rebuttal was, no you should not be bringing it up at all anymore since you said you forgave her, and she really isn’t doing anything at all to even make you doubt it.

Dude. Why?

Why are you with her again when she hurt you so much before? No kids, no house, etc.

Why are you still with her when she doesn't want to meet your needs?

Why do you keep trying to get her to make a commitment she clearly doesn't want to make and likely can't keep?

I mean, love? Really? Please tell me there is more than that.

To paraphrase the children's movie Cars, she isn't a trophy, she's just an empty cup.

[This message edited by This0is0Fine at 7:16 PM, October 7th (Wednesday)]

I have asked her multiple times, even tonight, that hey, don’t be here if you aren’t a 100% in it.

You are not wrong here, especially if you have been betrayed.

she remains adamant that I am her choice for the future. This was proven to be only because in certain arguments about her behavior I threatened to end it and she does not want me to end things,

What do you mean that it was 'proven'? How did she 'prove' that you are her choice for the future?

she refuses to take that answer because she always says “I don’t know what I would do without you in my life”

Errrm, I think we all have an inkling of where she would be if you were not in her life...

You are right though in one respect. I am too dependent on her being in my life. I’m deeply bothered that I feel, even though she won’t let me end things, if things did end.

Why is this? Have you raised this issue with your IC? Might be something to sort out for the long run.

She would be okay, but I would be devastated and I hate that imbalance and I have no idea how to fix it.

If you are truly looking for R, then this 'imbalance' will NEVER be 'balanced' no matter what you do. What the betrayed will need to do, is to learn to accept that the scales will never be balanced. The betrayer can help reduce the lopsidedness, but it will never be equal again.

In my case, I knew this would be a fallout with my ex, and it would have eaten me alive, so I made the only decision I could, and left. Started anew. Took quite a while, but am now in a 20+ yr marriage that is 'balanced'.

we all decided to R here because we found reasons to want to stay.

What are your reasons? Are you able to give an example? Are they actual reasons, or excuse not to split up?

It just doesn’t sit well with me that she can go above and beyond for OM

Like the 'imbalance', this will never get out of your head. Again, you will have to learn to live with this if you decide to get back together.

I know one of her concerns is that, she thinks I’m also not in the right head space to get M to her.

She is correct in that aspect... You are still in turmoil, and will not be able to make such a comittment in the state of mind you are in.

In the last year I’ve been very suspicious of her, I can’t help but check her location all the time. The moment anything seems out of the ordinary my mind jumps to, she must be cheating on me. She thinks that she’s being treated unfairly in this way when she isn’t doing anything of the sort but I can’t help it.

Of course you can't help it! What you are experiencing is quite normal.

She always texts me where she’s going, sends me pictures when she’s there without me asking, all the things to comfort my head that goes crazy when I start to think about what she could be up to.

What else has she done to try and help you? Has she given you full access to all her modes of communication? Since you do not live together, it would prey heavily on your mind who she could be chatting up when she is at home, using the home computer, but is she as transparent as she can be considering your living arrangements?

It’s been over a year since the affair and I don’t think I’ve made too much progress in this part.

Don't force it. What stage do you think you should be at now? What do you think you should be feeling now?

I’ve had to have so many fights and arguments with her for her to see things from my perspective,

This is a bit worrying. Your WGF seems to lack empathy skills. In your arguments, does she ask for clarification, or does she push back on what you are saying?

The SI rule of thumb is 2-5 years to recover.

At a little over a year out, why are you pushing for M? So you can live together? Because your friends are M?

It's too early to know if R will be successful. Now is not the time to tie yourself to the woman legally.

M now makes you very vulnerable to coming back in 2020 and saying, 'Well, she cheated before M, and she cheated again....'

[This message edited by sisoon at 10:39 AM, October 9th (Friday)]

You appear to be fighting hard to control and maintain this relationship.

She’s not working as hard. It is obvious.

Her mother gave you advice that favors her daughter. She’s biased that way. You don’t tell someone to “get over it” and think that is good advice. It’s a slap in the face.

No one understands the pain you are in except people who have been cheated on.

Put yourself first. If she follows you then you know she is committed to you. If not then you dodged a bullet so to speak.

Go back to your lawyer and make it clear you aren't in a position to get married and look at other options for your visa. Also speak to your college and see what they can do to help, you won't be the first foreign student with the same issue, so they'll know the drill.

You are in a place where you are reconciling but to be honest she doesn't sound like she is putting in much effort (who thinks you should trust them after they commit a major breach of trust less than a year ago???). She is right, neither of you are ready for marriage. Stop listening to what she is saying and look at what she is doing, are her actions those of a person who wants to be with you?

There is this thing I read about (and suppose I am sort of doing myself) called moving on without moving on (MOWMO). What that means is working to make yourself and your life as good and as happy as it can be without her influence. So you get your residency, move somewhere new and interesting, you make new friends, get out do hobbies, develop new ones etc. Basically live a great life that's independent from your partner. That doesn't mean leaving your partner or forgetting her, you can do what you feel is right in that respect, keep in touch, go on dates, be a couple - its simply enriching the rest of your life outside of her.

Once you are out of the current life bubble that you are in, you can see better what life is like elsewhere. You might find you don't need her as much as you think, that life where she isn't right there isn't as bad as you thought it might be. I think her interest in you will show from how much she actually comes to see you, speaks to you etc.

Then if things go well with her, its the icing on the cake. Should it be that, as I suspect, she isn't as committed to the relationship as you are, you have a strong life to fall back on and move forward with to recover.

I'm going to come from a different tack:

If you want to be a doctor in the United States, then get your citizenship. Quit making excuses and just start the process. Stop putting the pressure on her to be your anchor. That's not what she is there for.

As for her? There is a reason she was your ex-fiancée, and you need to think back hard on why she was your ex. What makes her a safer bet for a future wife than she was back when you broke up with her the first time? From reading between the lines of what you wrote, it doesn't seem like she has worked on herself very much. She's still stuck and spinning her wheels. So why would you want to take the same risk twice?

This may not be popular, but I think it's reasonable to be reluctant to get married at this stage. Infidelity shows both partners that the WS isn't the person the BS thought they were. She's trying to figure out her whys and what they mean for the person she wants to be in the future. She doesn't know who you'll be when your healing is complete or what level of trust you'll have in her. You don't know that, either. These are major challenges that make it difficult for many members to save existing marriages. Both of you need to be sure you're ready before binding yourselves together even more tightly. This is doubly true if your religion and culture forbid any possibility of divorce.

It sounds like the best she can give you is a sincere desire and intent to work towards marrying you. If your feeling is that you aren't willing to stay with her unless she's absolutely, 100% all in, then that's your boundary, and it's a legitimate one. But in that case, I think it's time to walk away.

There’s a saying here in the United States. She’s just not that into you........

Meaning you value the relationship more than she does.

You need to value yourself more. First.

I put this on many posts just to show you the reality of infidelity. In real life I have 15 friends and family members who were cheated on prior to the marriage (some were just boyfriend/girlfriend and some couples engaged to be married).

Every one —- and I mean every one of those 15 married the cheater and were cheated on during the marriage. Some were occasional cheaters but others were serial cheaters.

This does not include the people on this forum who had the same experience. I don’t know the number here but it is many.

Take the information for what it is worth.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 5:54 AM, October 10th (Saturday)]

You only need to read this first page and all the advice you'll ever need is there.

Anything else, you continuing to try to force things, you despite studying to save lives which I assume is also about being of sound judgement to make potentially live altering decisions for patients, continuing to act in a way that contrary to what you know to be true.

I hate that imbalance and I have no idea how to fix it.

There is no imbalance. You are just there. The visa issue is just a crutch you use to continue to hang on to her.

I just fear that without any real commitment here, if I move somewhere in the US, and she’s back at home the long distance is going to kill this relationship or give her another chance to cheat or something

Yeah but she did it anyway with you right there. If this is the basis for a relationship then there is none.