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Sal1995...It all started over when she attempted to rekindle the relationship and then in MC finally admitted to that and that the affair was a full blown sexual and love affair 2 months ago. Up till then she had denied any sex play, and claimed it was just emotional. A lot has come out in therapy over the past 6 months that was rug swept and gas lighted for 26 plus years. Until the attempt to rekindle, I thought it was all behind us and ancient history and we were reconciled.

[This message edited by Niceguy25 at 1:11 PM, October 1st (Tuesday)]

Well, she married you Kite and has stayed married to you for a long time. So there's probably a lot of truth in what she is telling you.

We've stayed married for such a long time because it was more convenient than getting a D. I put up with the limbo dance all these years because of a lack of self-confidence.

There's always a bit of truth in every lie. That's what makes liars so dangerous.

A lot has come out in therapy over the past 6 months that was rug swept and gas lighted for 26 plus years. Until the attempt to rekindle, I thought it was all behind us and ancient history and we were reconciled.

Wow! We are on the exact same time line of 26 years of rug sweeping and gas lighting. "I promise, nothing else happened." "You're just being paranoid." Same thing I heard all those years ago was spoken to me again recently.

WW is in IC now and a polygraph looms in the near future. We will see who is lying, her or my gut.

In the mean time I've been online looking at vans to buy. A trip cross-country with my dog, which will end at the Pacific Ocean, sounds like a good plan.

A trip cross-country with my dog, which will end at the Pacific Ocean

Me. Kite...it’s all so pointless when they deny, deny, deny. I don’t usually ask if I don’t already have proof of the expected answer. Then to be rug swept and gas lighted 26 years later seems incredibly deceitful. How can one ever trust again. So, if you make it there Spokane on your trip, take a pic for me. I can tell you the address😊.

Then to be rug swept and gas lighted 26 years later seems incredibly deceitful

WW had a PA in 93 and then she also mentioned later that she was in love with someone else but they never got it on. Right.

When we first started dating one of the first things she said to me in a firm voice was "Nobody knows my business!" Being stupidly "in love" at that time I didn't take that seriously and foresee what would happen.

She's been pretty much doing the 180 on me for many years now.

How can one ever trust again.

One can't unless their spouse is open honest, and transparent.

The question that some here have asked me, then why stick around?, has been reverbating in my brain as of late. I can no longer think of a logical reason.

So, if you make it there Spokane on your trip, take a pic for me. I can tell you the address😊.

It's a deal.

I had a dark discussion with my friend Sunday that has been rolling around inside my head.

He said he wished women weren't so weak so he could have just popped his WW in the face after she cheated on him. He said, knowing he hurt her back would have made him feel so much better about the reconciliation.

I am not condoning wife beating or anything. I used to fight and this guy is my friend who got me into it.

It kind of makes sense though. I have seen the most racist guy, change his tune after a good organized fight with a person from a group he hated.

It is like how in Fight Club, all those guys felt closer after fighting. The primal part of your brain says you fought well and if the person still standing helps you up, you bond in a way.

I don't know if that is a guy thing only or if it would work between men and women.

This same friend of mine at the start. It was his friend who his wife cheated on him with. The friend(AP) is still our friend. We don't trust him, but after he was caught, my BS friend whooped the crap out of him. The AP didn't do anything besides try to stand up and guard himself a little. He knew he deserved it. 2 months afterwards, he apologized again and offered the BS round 2 if it would make him feel better. BS hit him once (So he knows to stay away from his wife.), then they did shots together.

Could a WW ever do that? It was a strange question. My BS friend is getting a divorce now. He just filed because he said he just never could forgive her with how little she put into fixing things.

He forgave our friend and not his wife. BTW - He has known this friend longer than his wife.

I don't know. What do the guys in here think?

Is it just because they were guys or because he loved her.

BTW - The 2 guys fought in Iraq together. It just is an angle I never thought of.

Looking for thoughts. Told my friend I would ask.

DoinBettr -

Google "Bill Burr no reason to hit a woman full" and

"Bill Burr woman are assholes" (find the 6min version)

Enjoy!

[This message edited by WornDown at 2:56 PM, October 2nd (Wednesday)]

He said he wished women weren't so weak so he could have just popped his WW in the face after she cheated on him.

Not a good idea. There are laws against that and society tends to frown upon it as well. The first thing WW said to me after her initial "confession" was "Please don't hurt me." I didn't and went down in the basement and punched a hole in the wall instead.

The 2 guys fought in Iraq together.

Well there you go. They faced danger and death together and survived. It seems those bonds were stronger than the marriage.

DDay 1, the ex begged me to hit her. I refused. She begged me to at least slap her. I refused.

After DDay 2, the ex got in my face and threatened to hit me, said that her five classes of Muay Thai means she could snap me in half (Hah. Haha. She's 130lbs and 5'4", I am 260lbs an 6'. I have years of kendo, HEMA, and MMA experience).

I stepped right up to her, looked her square in her eyes, and stood firm. "Do it, whore. You get one hit. Just one."

She didn't throw hands. She said she wasn't afraid of me, but when you've fought as much as I have, you can recognize it. She was scared. I was okay with that in the moment. I am not a giant, but I have a 50" barrel chest, thick, muscular legs, a square jaw, and very broad shoulders. I know I am an imposing man when I loom, and hoooly shit was I looming.

After everything had calmed down and we sat outside talking for a while, she said that she thought we should to Muay Thai classes together. I said that if she really wanted to go fisticuffs for fun, then I'd get the MMA gear and we could go to town in the back yard. She would be more than welcome to 'snap me in half' if she could.

Unsurprisingly, she hasn't accepted my offer. I can benchpress half again her weight.

The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of women are unable to physically compete with men in hand to hand combat. Even women who are trained and have worked out and are in peak fighting shape cannot compare to men who have done the same thing. It boils down to biology, muscle structure, and growth hormones.

Now, her current male AP has said he wants to fly in to my state and beat me down. I passed on that his bitch-ass was welcome to try, and I'd give him the same deal as my ex; he would get one shot. After that, all bets were off and he'd be in for the fight of his life with someone who knows how to fight. He's maybe 5'6" and probably 180-190 lbs, desk job, no real muscle mass to speak of. I'd destroy that little fuckboy. I would fight him in a heartbeat. I would NOT, however, help him up when I was done.

Her first AP was my best friend and sparring partner. I know exactly how fighting him would go. I was better, period. I'd win. I would not help him up; I would leave him broken on the ground. Might even piss on him. But yes, I would fight him, bareknuckle, without hesitation.

Google "Bill Burr no reason to hit a woman full"

One of my favorites! Partly because it makes so many people uncomfortable.

“Tuna Casserole!”

A new curve ball has been thrown into the marriage. WW, who has been a physical therapy assistant for over 40 years and at the same company for over 20 years, was laid off yesterday.

For over the last 6 years she has been working and living in another town and only came home for the weekend, but will be arriving today and will be home every day, all day and all night, from now on.

I'm foreseeing a daily cage match which may accelerate the end of the marriage.

Incarnate:

I'm 5' 11" and 160 lbs soaking wet but in my youth I studied Tae Kwon Do for two years and Kenpo for 9 years. I went as far as 1st degree black belt in Kenpo and was an instructor for several years.

It turned out that POS #1 knew this. I had a phone conversation with him in which he threatened to kick my ass, ha ha. Of course the fact that we lived 3,000 miles apart at the time may have had something to do with his bravery.

Of course today if I tried to throw a kick my back would probably go out, ha ha.

I'm 5' 11" and 160 lbs soaking wet but in my youth I studied Tae Kwon Do for two years and Kenpo for 9 years. I went as far as 1st degree black belt in Kenpo and was an instructor for several years.

It turned out that POS #1 knew this. I had a phone conversation with him in which he threatened to kick my ass, ha ha. Of course the fact that we lived 3,000 miles apart at the time may have had something to do with his bravery.

Of course today if I tried to throw a kick my back would probably go out, ha ha.

That is why I go more for things like Jujitsu and Krav Maga. I can't do high kicks, lol. Not at all. TKD is outside of my range. However, I hit like a hammer and I have a low center of gravity. I have thick, stocky limbs and a powerful core, despite the goo that covers it, so I prefer rolling or, in some cases, boxing. I loved sparring TKD fighters because as soon as I got them on the mat, it was game over.

Just... getting a skilled TKD kicker onto the mat was a challenge.

[This message edited by Incarnate at 11:44 AM, October 3rd (Thursday)]

MrKite:

The 2 guys fought in Iraq together.

Only played a minor part. They never really even fired their weapons they said. They received some of the best details you can get. Running water from the ports to the transits to transport.

It was more about the fight and how the other guy handled it. He didn't make excuses or complain. He said he knew the ass whopping was coming and just took it.

BTW - No body gave the AP a hand up.

Incarnate - Your friend should have known how things could have gone. I wonder why he didn't just show up and let you lay him out. As a fighter (Sorry I boxed, so concussions are our bread and butter.) why didn't he just let you settle things?

At least slip the gear on and let you inflict some minor damage. What a coward.

Lastly, at 240 you only bench 200 or is my understanding of your math off? I assume you mean rep and that is 4 plates right?

That is why I go more for things like Jujitsu and Krav Maga. I can't do high kicks, lol. Not at all. TKD is outside of my range.

Even in my youth I had a lousy stretch. Tae Kwon Do emphasizes high kicks which is why I quit that style. All those years on those stretching machines was like being on a medieval rack. Yikes!

Kenpo was a mixture of boxing and martial arts more suited to my abilities. My instructor, Mark Milstead(who you can find on You Tube) had us wear headgear and use 16 ounce gloves. Fun times!

However, I hit like a hammer and I have a low center of gravity. I have thick, stocky limbs and a powerful core, despite the goo that covers it

Judging from the pic you posted, you look like one scary dude.

Incarnate - Your friend should have known how things could have gone. I wonder why he didn't just show up and let you lay him out. As a fighter (Sorry I boxed, so concussions are our bread and butter.) why didn't he just let you settle things?

At least slip the gear on and let you inflict some minor damage. What a coward.

I didn't find out until we had move 2500 miles away, from the midwest back to CA. I made it very clear to him that if I ever saw him again (he was considering moving to the west coast) we would have more than words, and I would claim my pound of flesh.

He stayed in MO.

Lastly, at 240 you only bench 200 or is my understanding of your math off? I assume you mean rep and that is 4 plates right?

My heaviest bench ever was ~350-ish, when I was lifting almost every day and working at a sawmill. Full set of 8 reps. But that was a LOOOONG time ago. I haven't lifted like that for quite a while, and I'm not as strong as I used to be. For giggles, though, about a year ago, I threw 4 plates (180lbs) onto a standard bar (45lbs) and did a set (225lbs). It was about my max; I don't think I could bench a whole lot more than that right now. Not without training for a while.

The ex is 130lbs. Half again that (130x1.5) is about 200lbs (195), so it worked for an estimation.

At my peak shape, I was able to put a fresh, green, 10' railroad tie on each shoulder and walk the length of the sawmill I worked at, running the headrig. Each tie weighed roughly 250-260lbs per, and I had my chain pullers stand them up, I balanced them, rocked them back onto my shoulders, and walked with 'em.

And now I have back problems. I WONDER WHY!!!

You would have hated me as a kid. I looked like a thin guy at 175 but was a beast. Yeah, 4 plates is my rep weight for most things. I think I am younger than you, but by less than you would think.

Work the back muscles out with some non-standard low weight exercises until you get those muscles to reinforce things.

Then all the guys on this page should take Glucosamine. They give it to dogs to fix their arthritis. Not medicine, vitamins. Yeah, it works. Kind of like WD40 on the joints. My wrists are messed up, they click if I forget to take it. Give it a try, after a month, you will feel it. Don't get the expensive stuff either. Just a big bottle from Sam's or Costco. Less than 10 bucks.

I am 190 now, dropped 20 since my WW started being an idiot. Still benching the 225, but 230, I put the 2.5s on to get round numbers on my sheets, and go 10 in a set, 3 sets, always super sets, I don't have time to stand around.

I used to do the paper factory route. I had to grab and squeeze around 80lbs of paper, 4-6' across, so out wide. Yeah, at my peak, I learned I could accidentally pop beer bottle like they were water balloons. It surprised the hell out of the me the first time. I was mad a sports event and the bottle shattered in my hand.

Impressive on the railroad ties. Those are some weight with a lever even.

Our friend(AP) actually was going out of town for a work meeting and made a 45 minute drive to get his ass whooping. Then went to meetings pretty thrashed. He said he knew he had it coming. Thanked our friend (BS) for not trying to break anything. Just some bruised ribs, 3 teeth, broken nose, and his jaw was pretty messed up. Said he pissed blood all week.

When I was sparring all the time (3-4 hours a day every day) we had a party out on my property in MO. The ex invited a friend of hers, a marine who was a few years younger than me. I had my suspicions that something was happening with them, and that night he was very friendly with her and curt to me. She was walking around, being the hostess, and had had a few drinks, and he reached up and grabbed the back of her thigh to trip her up.

Under her dress.

I was livid. When I get pissed, I get really loud, then it suddenly drops off to absolute silence. I skipped the loud part, and went into 'predator mode.' Everyone noticed, and the party sort of stopped at that point and everyone went to bed.

The next day, my birthday (January), we all went out to spar, and this dude, this little fucknut, he turned to my wife in the first round, and said "I'm going to show you how a real man fights."

I slipped right back into silent anger mode. When we started the bout, we both had a single shinai. By the time I was done, I'd separated one of his ribs, dislocated his shoulder, broken his ankle and his wrist, bloodied his nose (didn't break it), and disarmed him; I had both shinai.. That fuckshitter didn't know what happened. He was laying on his back, staring up at me with eyes like dinner plates. I looked down at him, and said "You're right. My wife DID see how a real man fights," and left him there.

He sat out the rest of the day. After we were getting ready to go back in, I stopped him at the door and said that he could drive home then and there of sleep in his car and drive home in the morning. He decided to leave then. He messaged me later and apologized. We haven't spoken since. I removed him from FB a few years ago.

I rose to challenges with overwhelming force when I was younger. Full of piss and vinegar and the mass to back it. There were few checks my mouth would write that my ass couldn't cash.

Double-tap post.

Been losing myself in finishing the revision on my book the last while here. Had some friends invite me out to go do Karaoke, and I decided to take them up on it, but I don't sleep much (1.5-3 hours a night) so I am always tired. I lay down to take a nap for an hour.

I don't know how I slept through my alarm to wake up at 4:20 and go get my girl from her friend's group thing she does every Thursday, but I did, and the ex had to go get her. I woke up shortly after they got home.

Now I feel like a failure as a father, that I couldn't even wake up to go get my own daughter, that I would rather sleep than fulfill my responsibilities.

I recognize that this sentiment is illogical, that it stands to reason that someone who gets as little sleep as I do would possibly sleep through such a thing... but the emotional side is still doing its thing.

Triple tap.

On edge and angry this morning. Had to take care of the phone bill last night, and I saw my ex's minutes for the last 20 days. She's spend 46.5 hours on the phone. I exclaimed in surprise, and she asked me what was up and I told her. She said she spent a lot of time working, but I checked the call logs. 98% of that time, by minutes, was spent on the phone with her new e-fuckboy and his cottage-cheese walrus-whore.

So, working, nah. I didn't realize it at the time, because it was subtle, but it put me into a mild panic attack. It shouldn't have, but it did. I'm still riding the waves of that, and missing my midnight meds did NOT help. Still waiting for my 6:00 meds to bring me to a level an hour later. I feel like my arms and shoulders are filled with electricity, like I need to fight, I need to hit something. I am keeping my communication with the ex to a minimum so that I don't go on the offensive. Right now, I want nothing more than to scorch the earth and sow the ground with salt, and this level of vengeful anger bothers me.

It is so difficult not to act when you have the ability and inclination to burn a motherfucker to the ground and piss on their ashes.

I've got things in motion to gain some financial independence. Hopefully, this cohabitation ends sooner rather than later. I would prefer for her to move tf out. I can handle the kids.

Edited to add: Apparently Fuckboy unblocked me on FB; I got a suggestion to add him as a friend. Hardcore trigger. Threw me back into rage. Today is not going to be my day.

[This message edited by Incarnate at 11:29 AM, October 7th (Monday)]

Hey Incarnate - sorry for my absence. Life has been keeping me super busy these last several days.

I understand your anger. That's a tough beast to reckon with. When it came to dealing with the AP, I viewed the inside of my head as the most valuable real estate I could think of. I mean, if the inside of my head is like Bora Bora, do I really want the POSOM as part of my scenery? Hell nah. Get the fuck out of my head, you sack of greasy swine excrement. That mind exercise ended up helping me a lot. Almost nine years later, and the anger hasn't gone completely away, but I don't think about him nearly as often as I used to. Not worth it.

Also, why not block those fuckers from your facebook, so you don't see any of their shit, and they don't come through your "suggested friends" ticker feed, or whatever they call that thing. I ended up blocking POSOM, his family, and his friends. I really only like to go out there to interact with people that I care about, and share pics of my kid, look at people's food, etc. Blocking them is like cleaning house, and you have control over it. As you start going through your separation process, it's an excellent time to start purging people/things/reminders from your environment that aren't healthy for you.

Were you able to physically channel your rage today in a constructive manner today? When you are feeling like you've got electricity going through your veins, that's the best time to get in some good workout therapy.

Have you thought of integrating any of this stuff into your writing? That might be another interesting way to let off some of the mental steam you're dealing with.

Hope your day has gotten better, man.

Let me ask you guys something. If your wife went "full porn star" in the A, as mine did, and you were to D and get into another relationship, how would that experience color the new relationship(s)? I have trouble thinking about it at all, but, when I apply it to "what does this tell me about women", sad to say, I think that if I were dating a woman who wasn't "full porn star", I'd probably move on for someone who was, simply because it's become obvious to me, for at least some women, that tells you a lot about how they feel about you. I used to think this (as a young man) and was then convinced otherwise (by my W), and now, sadly, I think I'm back to believing it. And I think that I'd pull that into my next relationship, no matter how wrong it might be, the baggage of what she did, I think it would follow me around. I can't see myself accepting less than "everything" in the bedroom again, not necessarily because I'm so "dying" to do a certain act, but because it's now become totally crystalized in my head that those acts are a direct link to "how much she cares".

I guess as an aside, and probably obvious from this conversation point, I really don't know if I'd be a safe partner for anyone. This experience, in a lot of ways, I feel it ruined all the "indoc" that I got as a young man about the nature of male/female relationships and brought out all the "learning" I did as a slightly older man to figure out "what women want". It would be very hard to set that aside again, I did it for my W, and then she went right out and found "the asshole" that I used to be.

Anyway, curious what others think, and, in particular, if you used to think this way and "got over it" (and how). I'm not thrilled that I think this way now, however, it's also the best approximation I can make in my head about 'what's real'. Just because I don't like it, or like what it says about me, doesn't make it untrue. And perhaps the problem, I spent over a decade trying to convince myself that something I knew to be true (women who really like you go all out in bed) was, in fact, not true. Except, of course, then my wife went "all out" on the 1st date with the OM.. So, was I trying to convince myself of a lie the entire time? Did I have it right (and that would be a first, I'm not sure I had much of anything right at 18) as a young man?