SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

So, we are going to seek MC.

PeriodicZen

Both of you need individual counseling (IC) before MC.

The goal of MC is what it says it is. The goal is to keep you married. The quickest way to do that is to minimize the affair and convince you to forgive her. Some MC have been known to tell the WW not to tell about all the sex because husbands don’t take that well.

She admitted to having sex, but has been reluctant to say what when etc., making it look like it was a single event, instead of the two week honeymoon

PeriodicZen

She’s already doing that on her own without the advice of a MC.

Placed the blame on me: she was alone, so "she acted to take care of herself", in her words.

PeriodicZen

Remember you had the same marriage that she did. It may have been bad but you didn’t cheat. So she saying that it would have been OK for you to “take care of yourself” when she was on the trip?

[This message edited by Michigan at 11:01 AM, January 14th (Sunday)]

She put a lot of time and effort into planning this affair. It just didn't happen.

Very devious.

As 'Marz' said, "Very devious". Additionally, she hasn't told you the whole truth yet; one time? Bull.

I'm not sure why you're jumping to R so quickly. I'd suggest moving to D and waiting to see if she actually tells the whole truth and shows some remorse. Divorce papers are a tool to get truth and true remorse. Also, have you told her employer what's going on? She desperately needs to face consequences. She's a detriment to the company. Have you informed the other betrayed spouse if there is one? If you let her off without life-changing consequences, she's going to continue riding the other man and other men. And she wants to take your son with her? Is the purpose to meet a potential new daddy? Do you really want to live with a serial cheater? Do you want this mess altering your son's life?

Sorry to hear about you situation. Take care of yourself.

What concrete consequences has she suffered? Exposure? Removal from the house? Poly? Hard 180? Post-nup? ANYTHING?

Or will she be allowed to soft-shoe the whole deal--a pat on the hand?

MidnightRun

The possibility of divorce at least needs to be discussed. She obviously felt entitled and that want she did was called for because you are bad.

By having no consequences your actions show that you agree with her. It’s like robbing a bank, getting caught and the police don’t even bring up the subject of time in jail. Robbing banks must not be that bad after all and my excuse of needing the money is valid.

Your wife had a division of labor going on with you providing security and the OM excitement. She wanted and wants both of you. You have to make it clear that she can lose the security. That's your value to her.

If her security was never at risk why shouldn't she do it again?

[This message edited by Michigan at 10:48 AM, January 15th (Monday)]

Placed the blame on me: she was alone, so "she acted to take care of herself", in her words.

PeriodicZen

Just to reiterate what has been posted before. You are going to have to be in her presence the rest of your lives? That's some mighty entitled, selfish ass, behavior. You are done. Stick a fork in it and move on. With that kind of "remorse"( it's not even close, just regret for being caught) you're in for a long road of repeated infidelities. To even think about Reconciliation you would need these just for starters:

Prenup

Complete transparency

NC with OM

Ditch any accomplices

Complete timeline: who, when, where

Polygraph to match above.

Quit her job

No more traveling

IC for her

MC down the road for you both.

With her attitude so far I don't see her abiding by much if any of that.

File hard and fast.

RubixCubed ^^^^^^ is correct if you're going to R.

If you're going to D then let her keep her job.

You want her making money. Also don't expose to anyone. You can use exposure for leverage and get better terms in the divorce. Remember you're also holding her reputation and the OM's job in your hands.

Don't overtly say I want this or I will expose, that's blackmail. Just create an environment where she will want to keep you happy. Your lawyer will know how to handle it.

I always like to agree with people and turn it on them. So I would say “Yes the marriage is bad and I want you to be happy. I will not stand in the way of the OM. I wish you all the best.” Then you will be the prize she has to work for. If she doesn’t want to do the work then you lost nothing.

[This message edited by Michigan at 3:21 PM, January 16th (Tuesday)]

Tell her you feel entitled to a fuckfest, and gauge her reaction.

But seriously--and at a minimum--she needs to experience dire, life-altering consequences for her 'joy' ride. What's to prevent her from seeking out yet another loverboy?

She admitted to having sex, but has been reluctant to say what when etc., making it look like it was a single event, instead of the two week honeymoon, and placed the blame on me: she was alone, so "she acted to take care of herself", in her words.

This is all classic, ubiquitous, and trite wayward behavior and excuses.

Whether you ultimately decide to divorce or reconcile, always know the following truths:

Your wife’s adultery has nothing to do with you or your marriage - she simply thinks she can blame common and insignificant marital issues as an excuse for character issues she had long before you ever met.

There is no issue, problem, or “rough patch” in any marriage that renders an adult married mother incapable of knowing fundamental right and wrong.

Do not ever accept blame or responsibility for her personal behavior - she’s an adult and made great effort to keep it all a secret because she knew it was not about you.

Blaming you and the marriage is childish desperation to fend off the great shame and guilt of an adult being caught acting like a child.

Hopefully, she will rise above the childish excuses and blame throwing and truly see what she has done and take full responsibility - like an aware, compassionate, and responsible adult.

If so, you might have some chance at reconciliation.

If she clings to the excuses and blameshifting then then reconciliation is an impossibility - unless you accept blame, sweep it under the rug, and live in utter misery for the remainder of your marriage.

As others have advised, going directly into MC is a complete waste of time and money.

Don’t do it.

She now bears responsibility in becoming fully aware of and solving her character issues.

How she behaves regarding her problems and how she treats you will be the determining factor in your decision to R or D.

[This message edited by keptmyword at 1:08 PM, January 14th (Sunday)]

I don't understand.

Your wife is travelling with someone from out of town.

She hired him to be her chauffeur ???

She rents rooms at hotels so she can fvck him and take care of herself (because you haven't been treating her right).

And you are ..... preparing to start having discussions about boundaries, transparency etc etc ?!?!?!?!

Are you kidding me? You should be blowing up her world right now and protecting yourself. You should be kicking her out and inflicting heavy consequences. Not to mention filing for divorce!

What on earth are you talking about ? What country is this POS from and what country do you live in ?

Indeed, this is no sociology 101.

Your wife admitted to humping someone else. Take the blinders off.

Ugh.

You all are sure tough.

I am asking for her complete story, full of details, via email.

I am going to see a lawyer to get my options clearly explained.

I checked her phone and computer, and all was erased. She boked the hotels with two double beds, for plausible deniability.

Yes, this was thoroughly planned, and it is extremely devious.

So, I am asking her to go to counseling, while I get my lawyer and my papers. I haven't exposed her yet, or the OM, but the OM has apparently a history of infidelity, and his partner seems to accept this. Anyway, I am looking for her, and holding that card for after the lawyer and custody talk.

She is going to get an STD and pregnancy test tomorrow when the clinic opens.

She's still in the middle of the fog, and it is literally impossible to make sure that she has cut contact with OM, and of course she doesn't want to.

You are all correct, her attitudes and acknowledgements are far from a contrite stance, and althoiugh she jumped immediately into a "please let's R" mode, she has not agreed to any substanctive plan of action.

WTF do I do? There's nothing open, and we have to had a weekend of visiting friends and things that we had agreed before I knew there was this situation! I do feel hopeless, a thing that now I recognize she encourages, because it gives her power.

I have been finally been able to sleep yesterday, for the first time since D-day. I am eating well, and tomorrow will be gym day, and hopefully lawyer day.

I stopped the MC talk and asked her to go to IC. And I got home pregnancy tests that she will have to take tonight.

No, the kid won't go to Mexico. He will stay with me in the States.

Also, she is doing independent research, so her use of resources was tecnically correct. Yes, devious and malicious.

I am lookingf forward ot her email explaining the details of the infidelity. I asked for emotional and sexual details, as well as a timeline, in writing, via email; I might use that to heal from this, one way or the other.

tldr: she is still in the middle of the fog, and doesn't seem to want out of there.

There is a common saying here which now, of course, slips my mind, but it basically says that you can't run reconciliation. If she isn't remorseful then there is quite literally nothing that you can do.

Right now: GO SEE A LAWYER. Benefits of seeing the lawyer are many -

1. You are now empowered. It feels nice not being helpless. You'll see, within 40 hours of seeing a lawyer lots will change.

2. While you can't do anything, sometimes getting served papers will "snap" her into the right way of thinking.

3. It freezes financials. She can no longer fund her affair with common funds.

4. It protects your child.

YOU MUST GET YOUR HANDS ON YOUR CHILD'S PASSPORT.

the OM has apparently a history of infidelity, and his partner seems to accept this.

Who told you this? Don't believe anything your WW says at this point.

Did you try running Dr. Phone or another recovery program on her phone/computer? This would really help you check the timeline she is working on.

She doesn't give two squats about you or your feelings, will cheat for the simple reason that "you weren't there", has no morals, boundaries or principles, knows now that there won't be any consequences for her future sexcapades (and there WILL be more), and really isn't concerned about taking steps to hide it all.

Why are you entertaining any other thoughts other than divorce is beyond me.

And I got home pregnancy tests that she will have to take tonight.

She pees on the stick in front of you. Not just bringing the stick out of the bathroom. She shows you the written reports on the results of her clinic visits.

Her: "Zen, I'm not peeing on the stick in front of you"

Zen: "You have lied to me. I do not trust you. A consequence of your actions is that I believe you would attempt to deceive me. Any reconciliation that I might offer in the future can only be based on your continual actions that show me you can be trustworthy. I will only accept the results of the test if I am present."

You can use exposure for leverage and get better terms in the divorce.

Do not threaten exposure in return for better terms in the divorce. This is likely to be criminal blackmail (it certainly would be here).

Mind you, a little bit of exposure sprinkled around in places that hurt her emotionally (parents, siblings, selected friends) rather than financially might well make her think twice about doing anything else to upset you.

Let me be honest.

Both your ww and om sound like dimwits.

Now is the time to go jugular.

WTF do I do? There's nothing open, and we have to had a weekend of visiting friends and things that we had agreed before I knew there was this situation! I do feel hopeless, a thing that now I recognize she encourages, because it gives her power.

Since you show some self-awareness here, are you going to do something about it? (*hint* regain control, which will then take away her power over you).

As to the plans to visit friends, you can easily cancel, without giving any details, say that you have suddenly fallen ill (cold, flu, fever, whatever takes your fancy).

Visiting friends should be last on your list of priorities (unless your plan is to expose to them, then that is a different story), the topmost on that list would be to look out for yourself. She isn't going to worry if you drop dead, as she will then happily traipse over to her new man.

Well, there's news.

She has some implantation bleeding, complete with all the syptoms accompanying it: heartache, nausea, backpain, early period that last only up to 3 days.

Now, she swore that they just had sex with condoms, and of course expects me to believe it, so I bought two pregnancy tests; the first one was inconclusive (she took it while I was out with the kid), so now she's going to pee on the other one in front of me.

Also, already made an appointment with a divorce lawyer, and exposed to my brothers.

She's already seeking a place to move to.

Bigger, yes infidelity affects divorce. I have proof now.

difm and Cephastion Yes, I confronted based on my thoughts and feelings, and she admitted. That is amazing, because it erases the doubts about other behaviors that she might have or the attacks she might mount in the future.

tldr: You were all right. She's used to lying, and continues to do so. I already contacted the divorce attorney.

Surely she wouldn't try to have sex on ovulation day with a stranger!

That's the one thing PZ, that I couldn't get past. Even if she's not pregnant. If she is, I would imagine there's no ambivalence about what to do.