SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Barry how are you holding up? You have been through hell since Jan 17th and from what you have said the last 72 hours have been hell.

If you record your wife when you are not present and without her permission that is illegal. If you record her if a nanny came without her permission that is illegal too. You can record a nanny without permission but not your wife because she is also the property owner.

I did both and my attorney told me it was illegal and to destroy or make sure my wife doesnt get a copy. I recorded her on video having online sex or live masturbation. I needed it for closure myngut told me she was doing that when my son and I went to soccer practice and I just need confirmation.

I am doing Ok, thanks for wondering. I am still in the shock phase. I find myself obsessing about the OM, what my wife sees in him that she could not even control giving herself to him. I have looked over his social media accounts and I am obsessing. This is not healthy I know it. My wife will not get the copy of the recording I have, I was scared so I took it to my parents house.

Thanks for getting back and I'm relieved to hear you are holding up ok. I would hold off on mass exposure, talk to your folks and friends but I would recommend that's all for now. My mom cheated and my dad divorced her when I was in 5th grade and he didn't tell me about her infidelity until I was 20.

So how is your night going? Are you eating? How are you around the kids? What is your WW doing? How is she around the kids? Are you sleeping apart tonight?

Please realize that it is not you, she is the broken one. This new guy is fantasy, excitement, thrill, and you are reality, responsibility, kids, bills, life stress. You can't compete right now so don't even try. The best thing you can do is be strong and focus on yourself and your kids. Try to clear your mind, forget this POS guy. If she hooks up with him your kids will hate him for helping break up their parents. You need to be thinking about if you want to forgive her or if you will be able to forgive her. Y'all have been together for a long time and have kids together so it would be nice to hold together and make it through this for your kids. I hope the best for you and that tomorrow is a better day.

Barry, you're just a hardworking, faithful man who puts his family first. This other man with 4 kids from 2 different women obviously has a lot of experience with the ladies. That experience gives him a confidence that women eat up.

Women put a premium on a how a guy makes them feel. How smooth he is and how he makes her laugh. Being a failure as a husband and father doesn't phase these women. They'll over look these huge character flaws while blowing up at their BH for trivial things.

A husband in a long term marriage can't compete with the excitement of a new guy telling your wife she's so hot, whispering sweet lies into her ear. She's already heard your jokes and your compliments carry no weight.

Does that make him a better man than you? No, he has no honor. He's obviously below you economically if he's your wife's co-worker. He's also a failure to his 4 kids and their mothers. You on the other hand stayed true to your family.

So stop torturing yourself, lest you end up doing something to him that you might regret.

[This message edited by Jsmart at 9:44 PM, February 7th (Tuesday)]

Barry,

Glad to hear you're hanging in there.

I do want to pick up on something you wrote.

what my wife sees in him that she could not even control giving herself to him

I understand the thought process. Trust me I do. But it's incorrect. She was in full control. Her cheating was a choice. A conscious decision. And if you guys are going to get through this then figuring out her why, owning up to her choices, understanding herself and working on her own issues that led her to this set of horrible choices is an absolute must. In SI parlance, we call this owning your shit. Which is why folks recommend IC. Not MC. IC. For her to work on the above. For you, to help you deal with this and the trauma.

And the key point is, it's nothing about him. He's not superman. He doesn't have special powers. He's not uniquely good looking or successful or whatever. Because her cheating is not about you and not about him. It's about your wife and what drove her to choose to cheat. That's it. It takes a while for this to sink in. There are threads here about how they always affair down. The OM or OW are nothing special. I get the obsession, but please internalize this. For your own sake.

Barry, the most likely way it happened given how you described you and your wife and your marriage, is that your marriage was routine and boring, though contented and happy. Not the "in love" infatuation butterflies in the belly going on anymore, not constantly telling her how hot she is, and if you were, she was so used to it that it was practically invisible to you.

Let's face it, "boring" usually means "no fights, no arguments," no "rocky" relationship, happy together, happy with your great kids, really you were what I refer to as living the dream. She never thought of cheating until this guy came and initiated.

I personally never met someone married 10-plus years who were madly and passionately "in love."

This guy told her how hot she was and she liked hearing that, he told her how much he liked her and she liked that, he told her how great a personality she had and she liked that, he told her how much she wanted her and she liked that, and over and over and over she NEVER told the guy FUCK OFF, instead she said, "pshaw, you shouldn't say that" but never complained that she was being sexually harassed when he kept doing it, and over and over and over she started to like it so much, she started the feelings of "in love" butterflies in the belly, etc. The guy is divorced, probably dates, so he is maybe used to knowing the right words to say.

And if she told him at all about your marriage, whatever negatives there might be, he played it up even more that he would NEVER do that - e.g., your wife said, "my husband fell asleep watching TV last night," and he replies, "with a hot woman like you, I'd never fall asleep with you around." You get the idea, I hope.

In my situation, I had all messages between my wife and other man, and he started with a few comments here and there, and when she ignored it, he upped it more and more, and then she started to respond, and this escalated in about two weeks before I could see my wife was "into it" and from there it went fast.

She was in full control. Her cheating was a choice. A conscious decision.

As Walloped posted, this is true. She knew what she was doing was wrong, but she did it anyway.

[This message edited by wk55hn at 10:20 PM, February 7th (Tuesday)]

as I told you yesterday Barry, you are obsessing because you are in a nasty cycle and need to break the cycle.

Again, 180 ? Yes but you really need to get away for a day and focus on what you want, how to get it and to converse with those closest to you so you have a support group and you don't do that by keeping her nasty affair secret. At the minimum, expose to your friends and seriously consider Jsmart's advice on exposing to her side as well.

You need to detach. Otherwise, you will make no progress. Detach DOES NOT MEAN LEAVE !!! It means to mentally detach and find yourself and start your own healing. You also need to seek legal counsel so you are prepared in case this affair doesn't end.

Take my advice and get away for a day and work through your thoughts. Then do it again on Saturday and or next Monday. She will see the 180 and you going off and doing things and that may ilicit a reaction. She is a cakeeater. She wants him and wants you. Stop the cakeeating by taking away bot options. If she feels she's going to lose you, she can react in a myriad of ways but you will know where she stands.

Based on her crimes against your marriage, she is fortunate that you haven't filed for divorce yet. However, you need to make a stand for yourself as the keyboard wizards on this board (self included) can't do it for you.

First is mental organization and healing and isolation while holding her accountable for her actions

Second is a strong exit strategy where you aren't left holding a bag in your hand one year from now bankrupt, a new guy living in your house with your wife and kids but yet you also aren't in infidelity and sharing your wife with another man. In other words, stop being afraid to divorce or consider it, even if you use the process to shake her off the fence only

Third, her offer to work on the marriage while still being infatuated with him is unacceptable.

I can't post a link without moderator approval but I will refer you to googling the term "state by state recording laws" Myers Detective services has a really good synopsis of it and Rosen Law Firm in NC has another great wiretapping writeup.

What Soulhurt said is truthful in some cases but there is a federal wiretapping law and every state has laws. In many states, it's one party consent and you can initiate a conversation or keep a recorder on yourself and don't need her permission to record. Some states consider 'expectation of privacy' too. You have to see what the laws are in your ow state. You an always hire a PI as well.

In the end, you know what she did. You will know if she is still doing it. You do have 'skin in the game' by demanding a polygraph, holding divorce over her head, depriving her of you and other things.

In the end, most people want to know the truth and are willing to risk the trouble. Some use ultra secretive programs, some actually steal the spouses cell phone and claims that their cheating spouse lost their own phone and then disables the GPS on the phone and checks it out. I am not suggesting these things but keep this in mind

Would you rather be living for the next 5 years and having doubts knowing that your wife may still be affairing but out of fear of not monitoring her , you don't and you end up wasting 5 years of her life enduring a long term affair ?

My answer is simpler than many of the people here. I am opposed to reconciliation because of issues like this. Yes, there are occasional cases when I see reconciliation as the strongest option but not after a physical affair or after a physical plus emotional affair.

Again, you are stuck in a cycle and until you do a pettern interrupt and figure things out, you are too flustered to know what you want to do.

That is why you have to remove yourself from the firefight and perform a tactical retreat to regroup while staying connected to the battle. That is why I suggest a couple of 'YOU' days and a 180 while also refusing to leave the house and while maintaining your rights

You should think about one of the key points posters have mentioned in your moving out of infidelity - and that is taking care of your own health. THAT is an oft-overlooked aspect of exposure.

Yes, exposure can help to kill an affair, especially when the WW is still in contact with the OM. However, exposure can do more than just have your wife see consequences to her actions - it can also help YOU. It is imperative for you to have support during this type of crisis. As you are unfortunately discovering, infidelity can be one of the most awful traumas one can experience. You NEED the support of family and friends to get you through. What's more - even though your wife doesn't see it this way - she will ALSO need their support.

That's the thing about reconciliation (if there is to be any). Both you and your wife are going to have to come to a realization that this awful event will need to be worked through and healing must occur. THAT is the most important part of reconciliation... and it cannot be done in a shell. Believe it or not, your wife will one day realize (I hope) that the honesty and transparency of telling close friends and family are part of what mature, responsible adults do - they fess up to their poor choices and make a "public" decision to make amends. Then they go out and show the world that they are no longer that person - that they have learned from their mistakes. THAT is what also helps YOU heal - it shows YOU that your wife will no longer act in a way that is detrimental to the marriage. THAT is called remorse and, ultimately, reconciliation.

[Edit to add: BTW, what they also learn is that people who really love and support the marriage, ie. family, close friends... don't really give a shit about the infidelity. They just want you guys to be happy and will support you. As a result, while your wife might think exposure is terrible because it casts her in a negative light, that will eventually change as she realizes that people who really love her, love her ANYWAY.]

It is still VERY early - but one more bit of advice from a guy who's reconciled after a much longer infidelity than yours: It is very likely that, at this very moment, you wife could be lying in bed with some interesting thoughts running through her brain. She knows this guy's history and she knows what she could be losing (you and... kids? not sure if you have kids). So right now she's thinking to herself, "Am I really going to do this? Am I really going to leave Barry for this guy? Are things so bad with Barry that I'm going to walk away from this marriage to be with... well, I'm probably not going to be with HIM... but maybe there's someone ELSE. An unknown. Wait... am I going to leave this marriage for an unknown....??????" It is VERY possible that her predominant thought right now is, "What the fuck have I done??? What the hell is wrong with me???"

You get the picture. An earlier poster nailed it when he pointed out that, despite all the upheaval, she's HASN'T left. That is a very, very good sign. She certainly could have - she had the chance. And guess what? She stayed. So now my best recommendation is that you begin what may have been fundamentally lacking in your marriage (and most of our marriages): COMMUNICATION.

Sit her down and talk. Without yelling. Just ask where she sees the marriage going. I read somewhere to ask your wife to write down 5 things about what she wants in a "perfect" marriage - and you do the same. Share that information with each other and use it to start conversation. No marriage is perfect - but it's time to see if this one can be salvaged.

Remember, maintain your boundaries. NO CONTACT. Period.

Good luck.

[This message edited by LifeisCrazy at 7:25 AM, February 8th (Wednesday)]

Barry, you mentioned your own health in your last post and LIC (and many others) just re-stated the importance of it. I, too, want to comment on just how important your physical and mental health is.

Again, I'm a guy in a very similar situation to yours, just a couple months ahead of you in my process.

It took me a while to realize that if I'm not staying healthy on a basic level, it hurts my *cause* (get out of infidelity ASAP), and it hurts my kids. Right now, I'm guessing that these are two of your biggest priorities, so it really does matter. A lot.

For me, it means a few things in no particular order:

1) Not *ever* drinking to excess. *One* drink may be ok at times.

2) Consciously thinking about sleep. I take a sleep aid sometimes, prescribed by a doctor. You get 3-4 hours of sleep one night, you're fucked for the next day. You need 8 hours so you can be at your best. If you can get more, get it.

3) Talking to my doctor about what's going on. I like my Dr. a lot -- if I felt I couldn't talk to him, I'd find a different doctor.

4) Having anti-anxiety medication (prescribed and monitored by Dr.) on hand, and using it when I'm having bad symptoms.

5) Drinking water.

6) Going to individual counseling with a therapist I really like talking to.

7) Getting support from family and friends. Just moral support on the phone or by email sometimes.

8) Exercising whenever possible (that's a hard one for me, but it's probably the single best thing that gets rid of the horrible feeling in my gut when shit is bad)

9) Getting away. Sometimes, you just need to do that. It can be incredibly healing to just drive away. Go to the store or really do anything safe and legal. Even just a couple hours can help you.

I had over a month of dealing with the A before I found this place. I wish I could have gotten a lot of this advice much sooner, because by the time I got here, I had done everything wrong and hadn't been taking care of myself on top of it.

I know it's hard. Really listen to Bigger and the others who you can tell know what they're talking about.

Keep up the great work, you're really doing well. We're all still here for you.

Thanks everyone. Something I'm having a difficult time coping with is that she wanted me out of our home. If I actually did leave she maybe would of filed and turn her affair into a relationship. I'm hurt and crushed, my ego has perished and I can barely sleep. All her messages are deleted and from her words they're "pretty graphic and shameful". Very hard time sleeping, very difficult remembering to eat/drink. I went the whole day without eating and did not even realize. All I think about is what she did. My wife is putting on a normal act in front of everyone. We have our youngest birthday party in a week and I am dreading it.... what should be a happy day is eating away at me.

Her trying to act all normal is hauty attitude to have in such a situation.

You have to expose to family. Not only to burst her bubble but also so you can get support. Your kids will love on you. We are here for you but can't substitute for loving support in person.

[This message edited by Jsmart at 8:51 AM, February 8th (Wednesday)]

Sorry Barry, it will get better, you will make it through this. Remember you are reality and new guy is fantasy, that is a no win situation for you. I had to endure my son's bdp last February when I knew about her infidelity and she was still doing it. It was hard, also our son had the lead role in the school play which should have been a great day a great memory and that is tainted too because the day after the play she was sexting sending nudes ect ect. to other men she met online.

Do you think she could be going through a mid-life crisis?

The pain is not going to go away for a long time, and none of this is your fault. Try to remember you are good, and she is lost. This POS other dude is scum to be a participant in the destruction of a family.

Yeah her plan was probably to get you out, painted you as a bad husband, then roll out new guy in a few months. This happened to the couple across the street from me. She filed and had her husband removed from the home and within weeks I see a new guy coming over.

Marriage is risky, my 1st wife cheated and we divorced. I dated my 2nd wife for 5 years before we married to make sure she was safe, well that didn't work out either.

Did you WW show any remorse or compassion or empathy for the pain she is causing you?

Most waywards that want to stay in the marriage after they get caught cheating want to rug sweep move forward and just be happy. It takes awhile for them to see, feel and understand the damage they caused to their spouse and marriage.

I hope you have a better day. Please try to eat something and maybe go see a doctor for some meds to help you. I don't like meds so I didn't go that route, I started working out more frequently and that helped. What about going and spending some time with close friends and family? What about taking some time off work and spend it with people that are supportive?

So let me get this straight, she cheated and is telling YOU how to heal? That is screwed up on Many levels. She needs to be knocked off her high horse, expose to everyone, file for divorce TODAY. I always look at what the worst out come will be in any givin situation. What is the worst that can happen is your situation? You get divorced. I would much rather know now than 6 weeks from now.

I like what LIC posted.

Her trying to act all normal is hauty attitude to have in such a situation.

She needs to be knocked off her high horse,

I'm going to respectfully disagree. Look, what your wife is doing now is normal. Completely and totally normal. I'm not saying it's good or right. Just that it's normal. There is no handbook that she has and no one to tell her what she should do or how to act.

Right now she is bewildered, confused, scared, and uncertain. I am not throwing a pity party for her. She is an adult and made her own shitty choices. But her head must be spinning as well and she likely doesn't know which way is up. So she is doing what is typical - self preservation. And she is grasping at some sense of normalcy when the rest of her life has blown up. Hence her putting on a front.

However, if she truly wants to remain married to you, then the work she needs to do will require her to face some pretty terrible truths about herself. Over the past year and a half, I've said many times to folks here and IRL that I'd never want to change places with my WW in a million years. Not for any amount of money. Despite the pain and the sleepless nights, and the infidelity diet and anxiety attacks. I get to look in the mirror and see a man of integrity staring back at me. My wife cannot say the same. And she knows it.

Your wife will too, one day. And that's a greater punishment than you could ever inflict.

Now, while her reactions are understandable, you still need to hold the line and do your part. Follow the advice you've received here. If she wants a life with you and truly dumps OM, and you set boundaries, requirements for R, consequences for deviations and follow through on those, then the change in behavior will come.

Generally speaking eosure is used to break up an affair. IF she has stopped the affair, hold exposure for future use if she backslides.

At some point though your kids should be told in an age appropriate manner.

Reset the var. Maybe leave it where she can keep track of it and buy two new ones for the car and house.

There is a book about helping your spouse heal but I can't think of the name of it. Hopefully someone here can post it.

Be prepared for an uphill battle. Most people say this is the worse thing that ever happened to them.

If I remember correctly, she didn't cut you off of sex . That's a great thing and the more now the better. It is the the best bonding technique and may help keep her satisfied while she goes through withdrawal.

There is a book about helping your spouse heal but I can't think of the name of it. Hopefully someone here can post it.

How To Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair - by Linda J. MacDonald

You are in a life and death struggle and you are feeling sorry and pity for your attacker. Blow her up. You CAN do it. If she's cheating by contacting him, there is no marriage. Get into individual therapy so you can find your courage. No one is coming to save you. ONLY YOU can save you from this. Lay down the gauntlet. Move out if you have to. Go no contact with you WS if you have to. Get away from this toxic person.

Well I'm now at a crossroads. My wife quit her job yesterday but worked the last shift. She has admitted that OM was hurt and she feels like she broke the heart of two men. She also told me he attempted to kiss her and she stopped him even though it was " very difficult". Ugh should I be happy or upset that she confessed this? She seems genuinely hurt that she has to stop talking to her co worker but has said she's going to fight to save our marriage. How do I know she even stopped the kiss? How do I know that they weren't intimate? Great my head is spinning again. I want to throw up.

[This message edited by barry22 at 6:58 PM, February 8th (Wednesday)]

You can't be happy over it, but it was at least truthful I think. Which is good.