SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Your thread grows so fast it’s near impossible to keep up with it (and keep a job…) so I’m going to focus on some issues you yourself have been talking about. As before I will jump around a bit…

JFO is SI ER department. Actions need to be prioritized. This is where we staunch the flood of blood, close the gaping holes and get you stable enough for the next steps. In doing so we often cause other trauma or damage, just like ER staff might crack your ribs to get your heart started again. Right now the small cut under the eye, the broken wrist, the twisted ankle… these things don’t matter. What matters is dealing with the life-threatening issues and then we can get on to treatment.

Your sense of not being in control. Your sense of loss of power…

One major realization you need to make is that her affair had nothing to do with you. Yes it affects you, but she had the affair despite you, not because of you. She didn’t go and think “Hmm… Walloped is getting fat, best I find a lover” or anything like that. Heck… I believe she never intended this to happen… Yes I have read her description but IMHO there is really nothing special about your WW affair (other than it happened to you). I’ll get back to that later… There is no fault in you for trusting your wife. There is no weakness in not suspecting her of infidelity. I don’t assume a defensive position if my wife starts cutting meat because I have a right to the expectation that she won’t go at me with the knife – there is nothing wrong, immature, bad, thoughtless or dumb in expecting people we know to behave in a rational expected manner. Your WW decision to cheat is about as much your fault as the 911 terrorist attack was the fault of the WT building supervisor.

There is nothing rational in having an affair. It’s that plain and simple. The only “reason” for having an affair is if you are so discontent with your present life, partner or circumstances and even then it makes about as much “sense” as binge-drinking for the same reasons. The rational reaction to unhappiness – no matter the reason – is to change the circumstances causing the unhappiness. Because it’s so irrational then trying to apply reason to understand it simply won’t work. Inevitably there will be gaps and missing pieces.

Well… To go back to the work-situation and big projects then do you know of a single large project that’s been on-time, on-budget and done exactly like it was defined from the initial concept? What you are dealing with is like your most complex project to-date multiplied by the second most complex and the result in the power of pi.

Right now it’s crisis management and it’s act-react. It’s like officer training in the military. A potential officer is taught to evaluate what info he has, set a goal and to decide on a plan. Then commit to the plan and implement it. The plan might cause a reaction that in turn creates a new situation so the officer reevaluates based on the situation, plans and implements. Maybe the new plan is to stick to the old plan, maybe it’s totally new plan but he must reach his goal… What the instructors try to weed out is those that can’t analyze the info, can’t formulate a plan, can’t implement it and can’t react to changes. In your case the biggest mistake you can make IMHO are the ones that might keep you in infidelity longer than you need to be depending on your end-goal.

End-goal? Well… That should be to get out of infidelity, the twist is if it’s with or without your wife.

If you commit to divorce I can make you this promise: Commit to D and 12 months from now you will be fine. Not great, not good, but fine. You will have established a life that’s fast reaching the border of infidelity. 18 months from now you will be good. Content. 24 months from now you might even be ready for new relationships.

Commit to reconciliation and COMMIT to it and the next 12 months will be full of doubt, problems and issues. There will be good moments in-between but it’s a lot like having a sore that you occasionally feel pain in or the scab gets pulled off every now and then. Next 12 will be better, with more and more time between the scabs getting pulled at.

It’s tough. It’s tough mainly because you are working at healing with the person that symbolizes the CAUSE of your problem. IMHO it can help to try to see your wife as two different people: There is your W, the woman you married and are reconciling with. Then there is the WW, the woman that decided to cheat, might raise her head every now and then to justify her decision to cheat and so on. If R is successful the WW is totally removed. Sort of an exorcism.

What people tell you about you never forgetting is correct. Infidelity will ALWAYS be a factor in your marriage. But with time you both learn to live with it and not allow it to define your marriage.

I said there was nothing special about your WW affair. Well… that’s true. I have read hundreds if not thousands of comparable stories: Middle age seemingly happy-has-it-all woman, routine typical seemingly happy marriage, shown attention, given a nibble that feeds her ego, a bigger bite that makes her want more and then eventually the payment for more nibbles and bites by crossing that fence completely.

In describing it this way I am NOT minimizing her accountability. As she has stated she realized where he was heading and she allowed it to go on. IMHO the affair was totally 100% HER decision and HER blame. But to me this does not define her as a serial-cheater, irrecoverable or forever cursed.

Back in a former life I joined the police. Spent nearly 8 years on the force before switching careers (got my BS and Masters on the force and then went into IT). There were two things I learned there that I want to share:

Early on a veteran I worked with pointed one rule that applies for nearly 99% of all people: They will always excuse their behavior – not matter what.

So the rapist would tell me that the woman asked for it or wanted it, the burglar that since everyone was insured there really was no victim in his crime. The dealer that he had to sell dope because he had a family to feed. The most absurd case: A man that insisted that the drive-through fast-food joint MUST HAVE MOVED their location a few inches. Why? Well… he insisted that he had stopped there for lunch nearly every day for several years, he had always driven the same car the same way and he had NEVER before driven into the place. Go figure…

That’s what your wife is doing when she’s talking about the affair. Was the sex good? Well – by saying no or that it was just OK would be like saying I ate all the old stale donuts for some unexplainable reason and didn’t enjoy them but still did it. She would rather spin some babble about mold being healthy, stale being good for the digestion or whatever. It makes “sense” and justifies the stupidity.

It’s easier to find justifications for her actions. It’s easier to say she thought she loved him and that the sex was nice because AT LEAST that gives some reason for going back. She’s going to use these excuses a lot – Classic ones we hear are “you didn’t tell me you loved me like you mean it”, “I didn’t get any signs that I was special to you” and so on. Since the breach was done on you her excuses will lean towards things you did or did not do. You have to understand these excuses and – eventually – refuse them.

I did meet several people that would raise their hand, acknowledge their accountability and shoulder responsibility. Generally these were the ones that made it through rehab, got early parole etc. I think these guys tend to live better, more productive lives because one tends to learn the most from mistakes one is willing to look into with a clear, honest eye.

The other thing I learned as a cop is that by far the vast majority of people I arrested were people that did that one thing that got them arrested. This covers more or less the whole scope of crime... A lot of guys might go through periods – steal cars, drive drunk etc. – but eventually see the light after 1-2 years. The hard-core criminal… the sociopath that felt no regret or remorse… those were few and far between. When posters call your wife a lost case, serial cheater, non-recoverable… they are describing that sociopath.

Previous to the affair did she drown kittens? Beat the kids? Tear wings off flies? Puppies in the disposer? Poison the doves? Gamble away money? Trip elderly people as they passed? If no then I am about as certain as I can be that she’s in the former group: someone that does something dreadfully out of character and wrong but then turns on the right path.

About your separation…

I would have suggested you don’t do it.

But you have decided to go through with it and that’s your call…

Personally I think your family (as opposed to your marriage) needs support you can only offer on-site but that’s just my opinion.

What I will suggest is that a) you two have a separation agreement in place defining your interaction, accountability and interaction with others b) a goal for the separation and c) an outline for how to reach that goal.

To put it simply:

We will separate for 30 days. In that time we both commit to not dating, flirting or having inappropriate interaction with others. The goal is to establish a base of calm to decide if our marriage is reconcilable. To help with that we will use the period to see IC, recover physically and get some rest.

Finally (and I promise this is the last point): I have stated this numerous times but IMHO until you commit to R or D then you are in infidelity. I have this theory that we KNOW when a marriage is over. If you have doubts, plus your comments about wanting to R, then you want to reconcile. It’s an IMMENSE task and there is absolutely NO guarantee but if done correctly it can get you personally to a new level in your maturity and development. I sometimes use this comparison:

Imagine this lifestyle. You (you being your marriage…) drive to work last-minute grabbing a breakfast at some junk-food place, take the elevator to your office where you work a stressful day screaming and arguing. Skip lunch but go for a smoke and coffee. Drive home grabbing a pizza or Chinese on the way. Eat in front of TV, have some drinks, more smokes. Watch reruns of Cheaters after midnight and fall asleep on the couch… then one day you pass out and next thing you know you are in the ER at the local hospital…

That’s where you are now. You are hovering at the brink of death recovering from a massive coronary. Next week at the hospital you do a lot of thinking… When you get home you start exercising. Start sleeping 8 hours a day, start eating healthy, start walking the stairs, start cycling to work. You deal with stress at work.

Five years later you might reflect on your progress: You are healthier and happier that you have been for decades. That’s where your marriage CAN be. Just like you won’t be healthier just thinking about walking the steps or just buying that gym-card then your marriage won’t improve simply by deciding to reconcile. You are healthier because of the WORK you put into getting healthy – just like your marriage can be better because of the WORK you put into it…

One might be tempted to think the above person might think “Thank God for the coronary because otherwise I would never have realized my crap shape”. In fact the person is more likely to be thinking “why didn’t I do all this work earlier and therefore never allowing myself to slip so far and maybe never having to go through the trauma of a coronary”.

And finally finally (because I see you just added to your thread): Do you plan on subduing your wife into a new marriage? Do you plan on a master-slave relationship? I don’t get the post-nup and legally outlined conditions for marriage. IMHO you either love your wife and intend to live the rest of your life with her and AIM at regaining a healthy marriage based on mutual equality and respect or you divorce. Either is fine but some concept of a negotiated marriage with conditions outlined by an attorney… nah…

Walloped have a safe trip. I hope it helps you in whatever way you need it to.

I also hope and pray you come back to your wife. Whenever you can, but I hope you do. I think out of the many stories I read about here you two have the best chance of overcoming this as I have ever seen.

I wish you only the best.

Cissi

As I told you before, now she knows you don't really mean it when you draw lines in the sand.

Actually, I read his conversation as telling her he is two steps ahead of her in the whole process. He's the one in control now. He knows her actions before she does, because she's just following the script they all inevitably follow.

Actually, I read his conversation as telling her he is two steps ahead of her in the whole process. He's the one in control now. He knows her actions before she does, because she's just following the script they all inevitably follow.

On HER end of the conversation, anyway, she's telling him she expected consequences as he promised and there were none.

I hope it's all rainbows and unicorns as you seem to think, but I'm a little bit more cynical and see a pattern, in her behavior since the beginning of this ordeal, of challenging limits, very shyly and with good manners, but all the time, and that is IMO something to be aware of and worried about

Hey Walloped,

Wow, where do I start?

Your trip to Az will be the best thing you can do right now...just having time away from the everyday and all the reminders, does so much good. I did it, and it really helped me (and I was only gone for 2 days)

The 20th anniversary cards! I cried (sorry!) I got a very similar card from my XSWBF which I used by at the opening of last meeting (what I now know will be the last face to face conversation I will ever have with him)

The words: much the same as what you both expressed. He loved me so much words could not express it, that he was so happy to have me in his life and....that he would be all that he could be for me, looking forward to more perfect years together and loving me always! FUCK!

I don't know about you but reading those words and trying to reconcile them with present circumstances, totally eviscerating!!!

Arizona...Try and do the Grand Canyon hike or trek with the friend (and a few Donkey's....) the absolute breadth and beauty, the vast expanse it covers, breathtaking and awe inspiring! And we all need something to inspire us, particularly now! So take it in and revel in it. Even if you don't come a definitive decision while you are there, just the respite from work, and all that has gone on, will be restorative!

Don't worry about us here in SI, if you don't check in here while you are away, I have no doubt the thread will continue despite you being away!

I know you will get your head screwed on straight, eventually! Even if you doubt it, presently.

Wishing you all the best!

(((((Walloped)))))

Want this to stop!

Wow, I just caught up with this thread. W, your experience is so similar to mine. Our WW's affairs seem to begin and evolve in the same manner, for the same "reasons". We were 22 years into what seemed to be an idyllic and well tendered marriage with three beautiful children. There was no warning, no indication.

I have something important I wanted to share with you that helped me put things in perspective.

I am 22 months ahead of you. You are still in the discovery-shock-investigatory phase and are in no position to be making definitive decisions yet. Your WW is in the just discovered-shock-damage control phase. You will tirelessly investigate and she will desperately try and control damage and outcome. It's natural. They all do it to some extent.

Your WW is going through something my WW did not. She is ending an emotional affair. My WW seemed to not be as emotionally invested with her AP. My WW's A was highly sexual. The degree of your WW's emotional investment in her A is still to be determined. NC will be more difficult for her. Was she "in-Love". I doubt it. There was definitely infatuation chemistry at work compounded by the elicit forbidden fruit nature of an affair and novelty sex which is quite potent. The affect on brain chemistry has been compared to methamphetamine. Imagine having sex for the first time with someone different after decades of sex with the same person.

Marital love and love making can not be compared to Affair infatuation and novelty sex. Do not ever compare the two. They do not exist in the same reality. Don't even go there. If you do, look at it with the clinical indifference and objectivity of a scientist. It's a matter of brain chemistry. Long term marital love runs much deeper than the emotions between relative strangers-paramours who meet in secret and who's surrealistic relationship consists of smoke and mirrors. When you shine light on these superficial relationships they usually vaporize like that fleeting dream you soon can't recall.

At this point in your post infidelity trauma, I thought this point of view might be most helpful for you to help overcome the mind movies and help put the degree of betrayal in the proper perspective and reduce those tormenting mental comparisons.

At some point soon you will start to consider whether to R or D.

Soon after D-Day my WW's reconciliatory attitude was at it's zenith. She seemed truly remorseful. She answered every question, complied with every demand-except, she was reluctant to give up toxic friends and leave her job. I never pushed it so I'll never know if she would have made those sacrifices for me. Over the last 22 months however, she has become progressively less empathetic, less patient, less understanding, more defiant, less cooperative, more intolerant of common and reasonable BS symptoms. If I had pushed her to make those sacrifices for me, her willingness to do so might have been a good prognosticator of her degree of remorse. The Ws's willingness to make sacrifices and be proactive are huge indicators of their resolve.

It will not be her Affair that killed our marriage, it will be her lack of resolve, remorse and consistent actions.

At present, your WW seems truly remorseful-more so than mine. Time and actions will tell if that is true remorse or just regret. Regret has definite shelf life. True remorse is durable. Durable, but not indestructible. Even true remorse can be worn down by abuse, prolonged deprivation of affection, or a hopeless prognosis. If you decide to R, keep that in mind. It will be a delicate balancing act of you nurturing her while, at the same time, caring for and protecting yourself.

Divorce is relatively easy. You will move on and leave all this in the past when you get into a new relationship. Authentic R is hard and painful. Only true love and remorse can endure it. If she successfully passes the test you may find yourself in a battle borne-hardened marriage with a mate who is much more enlightened, who has been tested, than a new mate who has never gone through this before, never been given this acid test. Love is very risky no matter how you slice it, no matter how careful you are.

[This message edited by RealityBlows at 12:39 PM, August 26th (Wednesday)]

I have been a member here for a long time, but I don't usually post.

However, I wanted to tell you, Walloped, that your thread has triggered some very strong emotions in me. Reading your discussion( s) with your wife have actually brought me back to D-day in 2005. I really feel for you and I would like to help if at all possible. I am a Psychiatrist and have worked in the field for some time. That does not make me an "expert” any more than anybody else here; I want to say that I was really impressed with some of the posters' psychological insight, including your own. This 'club that you never wanted to join' has some really intelligent and well – intended people who have helped many others.

That being said, I would like to put my 2 cents in. It is not the absolute truth, but it is rather a “possible truth” which may be distorted by my own judgment and projections.

While I do not know personally either Walloped or his wife, I can speculate like the rest of us on the possible" why"s of the affair. I think some of the "why"s have already been told to him by his wife herself. She is an upper middle class SAHM with increasing time on her hands. She is overall a relatively good person (and I believe that Walloped, who knows her for a very long time, has repeatedly endorsed that.) However, nobody is entirely good or bad (with very few exceptions), and she was no exception. She was, I believe, kind hearted, as illustrated by her choice of volunteering. She was also, probably,ike many good people, having some "dark" fantasies that were never shared with anyone (because she is also very self-conscious and admitting to these fantasies would spoil the 'perfect' image that herself and anyone else has of her.) These fantasies may include something illicit and 'bad'. Or maybe just dirty sex. Or just flirtation. In comes POS. He sees her and he wants her. It is not his first affair so he knows how to play. I don't think he fell in love at first sight. He was most likely circling the watering hole (the volunteering organization) like a lion looking for gazelles. After all, he was supposedly "working" on his marriage, therefore he should have refrained from the get go from approaching other women,but he chose the predatorial approach because that is what he was there for. He started with the classical 'good guy' and non-threatening 'buddy' and "shoulder to cry on" or "sympathetic listener" stance. Gave hercego kibbles and validated her. She complained ofcher husband nothelping enough with daughter's wedding because for her THAT was at the time the BIG stressor and what made HER feel important ( never mind that Walloped was probably working his but off to pro ide for her and 5 kids and probably the money for the said wedding). Sometimes when people are in a relatively cushioned situation and too long removed from the high pressure environment of the regular workplaces they lose touch with THAT reality and what THEY are doing becomes more important and is perceived as being more stressful. Therefore the "he is not helping me" becomes a reason for complaining to other wives who are also SAHMs. He is around and is pouncing at the opportu ity for an opening. And she bites the bait. He is validating her and starts complimenting her. She likes. Feels important. More feels like more than a SAHM soon to be empty nester. And then he is (maybe) wealthy and has time to do charitable work. A "Mr. Grey" of sorts, and suddenly she is his Anastasia. He pursues her and she likes it. He may be like one of her hidden fantasies that she may like to live. But she is married and a good wife and mother. A "good girl" who cannot do what a slut does. The cognitive dissonance between who she sees herself as and what she would so much like to do like in the fantasy is causing discomfort. The only 'acceptable' escape that would allow her to be both good a d do bad things tben is to fall in love, because when you love someone you are allowed to do all kinds of things for them. After all, people who are in love are supposed to do things for the beloved, right? And then everything starts- sex (regular and more dirty), expensive gifts, holding hands. She knows at some level that this is so wrong on so many levels, but she continues the love fantasy because it is so heady and intoxicating. She has convinced herself that she is in love with him. It is the alternate reality from the romance novels where there are no needy kids, bills or dirty socks. And where one does not have to deal with the mundane realities of day to day family problems. Her husband is providing and is dependable and loves her so she does not lack for anything or worry about anything other than her 'feelings'. And she is convinced that she and her "true love" were so smart that she would not be caught. And then the bucket of ice comes down...Walloped confronted her. She felt the dichotomy between fantasy and reality collapse, and the whole construct with them. She started to realize that her fantasy was going away, and with it her good name, and possibly her marriage. She held on to some of the fantasy that at least she had not ruined her marriage for nothing, but rather that she was “in love”, and he was ‘in love’ with her, too. That fantasy dissipated after she talked to his wife. So now she is desperate. She has started to realize the extent of the damage. She is facing losing her marriage, and her actions belie her image of herself as being basically a good person. She would like to take it back, and turn time back. She has so far done all the “right things” and has humiliated herself in front of her husband, and even her children and family by admitting it. She is pleading guilty and throwing herself at the mercy of the court (Walloped).

I personally think she will most likely do everything she can to repair the damage. The question is whether Walloped will be able to get over it. Most people would not. That is why she openly admits herself that she would not, if she were in his shoes, but she is trying to get his mercy and tell him she hopes he is so much a better person than she is.

I think she does really feel for him, and for his pain, and she is scared that this pain will drive him away. I also think that this is why she is worried that he might have a RA, and then fall in love with the person, and leave her (although there is always some double standard- ironic, isn’t it?).

That’s it for now.

I hope I was not too boring and verbose.

P.S. While I was typing away on my phone, I saw that the “mystery of the NC” was already revealed by Walloped. Also, the clarification about how much she may still be ‘in love’ now with POS after the content of her discussion was revealed.

Walloped, I think that, were you to be able to get over this (and it gave ME mind movies reading about the whole affair, and was deeply disturbed even though I hear all kinds of stories all day long) she will most likely do everything in her power to redeem herself, and will most likely not tempt fate again. But then, I am not a prophet…

When thinking about moving forward, don't let the last 26 years of marriage overly influence your choice to D or R. Look up the term "sunk cost fallacy" and see if that applies.

I keep seeing the term "irrational" popping up when

describing your wife. I believe this to be a mistake because it leads one to think that your wife has/had no agency in all this.

Her fear is that you will find out how deeply and freely she submitted herself to this other man. I know it's hard to hear but what truth she told you was still an edited version.

This is where I want to point out that there is a delineation between lies and deception. One can tell "the truth" and still deceive.

W

Use the next days to focus just and excusiveky on you. Put your self toguether fist then you can focus on what to do.

Walloped

Way back you mentioned that a divorce would cost you greatly…

To me when I hear that all I hear is excuses. Let’s go back to business: When you invest in something then price is a factor but ROI is the key factor. With divorce it’s not what it will cost you but what the ROI is for you.

First of all: One basic mistake most of us money-earners in a family make is seeing the money as OURS. The reason you are making money is (amongst others) because you could leave the house in the morning and come back late and your kids would still be fed, bathed and in bed. Your W ability to earn an income was diminished by your (both) decision to decommission her from work while having the kids, raising the family and all that. Therefore any cost you or she incur is family cost. Any income you or she make is family income.

So IF your divorce the laws and regulations tend to be FAIR.

Not the way we like them, not to our advantage but fair.

You could spend $$$ getting a post-nup but if it leans towards your advantage financially then a good attorney on her side will tear it apart – no matter how well it’s written.

If you do get a post-nup then make it realistic: For example that you keep your pension untouched but that means she gets a higher share of the house, or that she settles for a fixed period financial support period paid and present-value in a lump-sum. Get the picture? It’s more about arranging beforehand how you intend to pay and with what rather than trying to get a much better financial cut.

BTW – divorce is one of those financial enigmas: Somehow having half of what you owned always feels significantly less than owning half of all you own.

I hope it's all rainbows and unicorns as you seem to think, but I'm a little bit more cynical and see a pattern, in her behavior since the beginning of this ordeal, of challenging limits, very shyly and with good manners, but all the time, and that is IMO something to be aware of and worried about

IJ, I've got a 30 year head start on this, so believe me I dropped the Unicorns and Rainbows long, long time ago.

Asking a question when you already know the answer just to find out if they are going to lie when you already know they are going to lie...think about that one for a second. Consider if an alternate approach isn't better, otherwise you're just a player in the standard Kabuki Dance.

Walloped, a fascinating read is The Book of Not-Knowing by Peter Ralston. All about consciousness and The Self, but very readable and enlightening. A later one is Pursuing Consciousness: The Book of Enlightenment and Transformation. It is deep with kernels of truths.

Enjoy your break. You deserve it, my friend.

WHat gets me is when half of what you own gets spent on cuff links for a mothafu..

W -

Like you said, all the cards are on the table and you need to process them. We're here to help you and sometimes in the zeal to do so will push for action.

Go to Arizona, drink some beers and smoke a cigar. You're not going to solve this in a week so don't try to.

I think with her final admission of breaking No Contact you have all of the information that you need. Read up on the 180 Plan - you're not doing either of yourselves favors if you're keeping physical distance but keeping yourself emotionally engaged. Break away by using the 180. The 180 is for you, it's not to punish her. The quicker you completely disengage the quicker the healing process will start.

Emotional disengagement is like getting the shit burned out of you in the sun, it'll keep on getting worse while you're in the sun, but once you get in the shade the sunburn starts hurting like hell, but the healing has started.

Since we're focusing on the situation a lot I figure I'd give you my best, and weirdest, stress coping mechanism. All you need is a lacrosse ball.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzozw2Aso3M

Get that lacrosse ball basically wedged underneath your shoulder blade. Your head will still be messed up, but your back and the physical signs of your stress will be completely destroyed. Last week I had a client yell at me like I was an asshole for two hours... I needed a lot of lacrosse ball time that night.

Walloped, You are blessed to have responses from Bigger & Longtime Sucker...God is good.

IJ, I've got a 30 year head start on this, so believe me I dropped the Unicorns and Rainbows long, long time ago.

In the specific case, I was just underlining that everybody's singing Hallelujah about W's lady behavior, but while overall it does seem encouraging, there are still dark areas and points of attention, and that to overlook them may cost dearly, emotionally, to W

Asking a question when you already know the answer just to find out if they are going to lie when you already know they are going to lie...think about that one for a second. Consider if an alternate approach isn't better, otherwise you're just a player in the standard Kabuki Dance.

The problem is that when W told his wife that breaking NC would have had hard consequences, he didn't know she was going to break it.

I can see why he changed his mind, but he needs to give her a good reason for not enforcing his boundary, IMO, or the message will go through as "I talk tough but I don't really mean it", and the biggest problem W's wife has presented this far is a tendency to do as she feels no matter what tomorrow brings, from what I can see, even if she does so in a delicate manner.

That is something our friend need to watch out for, IMO.

W

Let me clear up two fallacies being promoted in your thread and also let me say that you sir are a unicorn of BHs. I can count on one hand the number that have taken the decisive acts you have and I hope one day, the moderators tack your thread as an example for what BHs should do to get through infidelity

Fallacy #1 - Post-nups are torn apart by shark lawyers. Not always true. Settled post nups with legal representation on both sides are often the basis for the final divorce settlement. Unless she can show duress (thus she needs representation), or there are extraordinary terms (you get sole custody), post-nups are NOT easily tossed.

Fallacy #2 - A post-nup is subjugation of your wife. To have a successful "R," you have to just let your financial security go and trust her again because her judgement is so clearly awesome. False False False False. Your post-nup will not override state mandated CS. Your post-nup won't put her in a cardboard box when she cheats again. Your post-nup will not be an ax to swing against her in the future. Again, it is a negotiated settlement - the basis for asset allocation following a divorce.

What is does is provide some certainty as to your future for the case of her future infidelity.

Now, I do not want to project onto your situation. But I can draw an analogy from my extensive professional medical experience. Have you ever dealt with a person that has an addiction? They will go through hell with horrific physical trauma, inflict massive mental trauma on loved ones and SWEAR TO GOD AND ALL THAT IS HOLY THEY WILL NEVER EVER ENGAGE IN THEIR ADDICTION AGAIN. Just too much pain. Guess what, the vast majority of them will be back in the exact same place with all the pain and destruction before the end of a calendar year. Counseling can really help, but it is not a miracle cure.

I am not saying your wife was addicted to the affair. But I am saying that something inside her allowed her to cast off a loving husband and family to engage in an activity she simply could not get enough of.

Once the shock of discovery is over for her and she gets back to her "normal," those risk factors will still be there. And you have witnessed, FIRST HAND, that her aptitude for handling the risk factors and make a good judgement is NIL.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with exploring options to protect you and your kids from her crappy judgement, especially when financial matters are so important to their future.

Superb things you did:

1. You exposed to the other BS, even though you were told many things you still did this, it put him on the defensive and doing damage control.

2. You insisted on a poly.

3. You decided you needed to get away.

All 3 things put you back in the drivers seat (somewhat, not that any of us wanted to be here but somewhat in a better position) which then had your WW give you more information as we all suspected, even you, when you took a firm stand.

None of these will determine what your marriage will be going forward, but you got more then most get because you implemented these things, very hard to do and I just wanted to give you a pat on the back. Not the trophy you wanted obviously, but just to say you did good.