SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

"AMaeMOBluesawyer, when you feel you are in a relationship funk, it is time for IC! Do not let the blah progress. This is about you and your feelings, not the marriage itself. That is my greatest regret, that while I did IC, I did not see it as the emergency it was when my depression began. I fought a connection between my emotions and my M, so I never got to the heart of the matter and let my H know what I was feeling. I just escaped into an A. Get into IC and let them know what you are feeling." Owningitnow (I don't know how to do the boxed quote thing in my phone yet).

Thank you for saying this ^^^^ out loud, OIN. I needed to hear it. Although I'm not M to my current SO (who is not my xWS/BH - we are permanently separated), I do treasure our relationship and want to keep it healthy. I told him some of how I've been feeling lately last night, and that I think I need to get C. I'd been in and out of IC since '06 and on/off AD's since '05. Most recently I'd gotten off the meds as I felt really good for a year or more in my new relationship, work and kids going well, etc... I also had stopped seeing my IC for financial reasons. Now I know I should have just scaled back the frequency, but it just seemed we weren't moving forward bc I was doing so well, I thought.

Well, now I know I'm not. I guess, in the least, I see I can! start to recognize when things are going south for me. My mother had clinical depression most of her life and it eventually took her life at age 68 (when I was 40, right after my dDay #1) and that was super hard and probably contributed to the false R at that time. I was just trying to cope from loss of my mom and raise my two toddlers, I gave up on WS. He didn't or couldn't do his own heavy lifting at that time and slipped back into an EA (possible PA-I never could prove it). He felt "entitled" to his "happiness", and justified it bc he gave me such a "wonderful" life (the waterfront house, boats, new cars, trips, etc..). I could continue that rant but it's all water under the bridge now.

Anyway, I don't know your story, OIN, but I assume you're

a MH or you wouldn't be responding here at all. I'm willing to listen and help you in anyway I can.

Just keep swimming.

AMae

To Maddy Hatty,

I replied a couple of times on WS forum but wanted to add some things here after seeing your more recent posts.

I'm glad you feel things are improving. IC, MC and open communication all keys.

That resentment in the background is TOXIC, though. You can easily false R by rug sweeping but letting go is crucial, too. Which means you have to LOOK at it first before it can be let go. It can be a tricky thing. Don't ignore the resentment but be willing to acknowledge it, identify the feelings, but try to let go. For me it means forgiveness. Forgive yourself. Forgive him. Forgive the drinking. Firgive his cheating. Forgive your ex-H. Forgive your parents. What ever it takes to let go (after owning your story and his) and to forgive.

I think there are some great books out there on this subject. Can someone help here with a reference?

I read once about envisioning yourself as a little girl, crumpled up and crying bc no one is "seeing your pain" and go to her, hug her and sooth her, tell her it's okay and tell her you are sorry, and I love you. It hurts like hell but helps me. Another thing that has helped me was knowing we all make decisions (bad or good) based only on the information and understanding of a situation we have AT THE TIME. We can't judge ourselves (or others) later based on ongoing knowledge of a situation; meaning you can't hold someone (or yourself) (or the actions of them in the past!) to standards that you believe TODAY. What happened in the past, is in the past...learn, accept, grow, forgive, move on.

I don't know if you are spiritual at all but I also like to think of me as that hurt-broken little girl being enclosed in the healing robes of "Jesus" or "God" or whatever "Higher Being" and them saying they still love me. For me that's about as spiritual as I get besides trying to practice daily gratitude "to the gods" (or powers that be) for all the good things in my life.

Hope this helps, it is helping me to try to help you guys because I need to hear all this stuff myself. I'm searching for a new IC today.

Keep swimming.

AMae

"We have some major disagreements about moving forward (example- because ex-husband and I have a child together, I still have limited contact with him. Husband thinks that because of this, he should still be allowed contact with his AP)."

Oh, I meant to respond to this and forgot where I pulled it from --maybe WS. Either way...this^^^...is a hard subject and takes careful consideration. You do need to stay in contact with exH/AP bc of your dear child together. Him pulling the tit-for-tat thing is NOT acceptable, tho. He is obviously hurting a lot. I'm sure he has worries you may want to (even if you truly don't) go back with the exH since you have a child with him, history, and if he is further along in his recovery. You may need to constantly reassure him that is not the case. You must be steadfast in your commitment to this M and your R. But he needs to (thru IC) find a way to accept this fact and stay NC with his AP(s) in order to pull his weight in the R. Y'all have a really hard road ahead and I wish you all the strength and stamina to reach the other side safely.

AMaeMOBluesawye

Thanks very much for your helpful comments, and for listening.

Sorry to hear that there is no chance at R for you both. You are certainly in a similar place to me really.

Today I was looking after the children whilst she took a driving lesson, and before she went out she had made it clear that I couldn't stay around at the house tonight, but she wouldn't say why. So of course this sent my brain into overdrive (only because it always seems to be Wed's that she's not comfortable to be at the house.)

Anyway, when she got back to the house and I were there (this time there were no issues being in the house on my own.), I pushed her buttons again a bit about coming around and wanting to know why I couldn't given I needed to set something up to be able to work from her / our house on Friday. I think it was more an issue from her perspective about me wanting to have control, rather than respecting her space, which ties in with your point about "giving her some space and time".

This unfortunately led on to talk about the separation (which wasn't easy when there was our two under 4's making a right noise with their toys! at the same time!), and she was fairly clear on not wanting to progress with any R and instead now wants to talk to a Family Mediator about the financials, childcare etc. I tried my level best to show remorse, how I was changing, but she just kept going back to the fact that I cheated on a number of occasions, and this time she wouldn't forgive.

She's convinced that I met someone in person, and accused my drive up to see a friend as being when I popped into a town on the way to meet this person I messaged (who I have had NC with since May.) even though I can show my exact route on my phone app. I even provided a screenshot of the route the same day.

The only counselling she is getting is CBT, and with never having CBT I'm unsure of the limitations of that for her. As you say, there's many struggles that she needs to deal with with aren't my fault. It feels like I'm hitting my head off a brick wall when trying to help with this. She even stopped taking medication months ago, which in my opinion was helping her to deal with everything.

I spoke to her dad just last night and he seemed to think that she did really want to figure things out between us, but then I'm starting to think that alot of what he says is just to keep me happy? What my BS was saying to me was very honest, BUT, it was at a time when she was particularly stressed out. That said though, we text a little bit when I got back to my parents and she was still going on about the same re: family mediation etc.

I did manage to get to the house in the end tonight (she had offered for me to go across - mainly because my working from the house that day I was supporting her with childcare), and it was like we had never had that difficult conversation.

Yes, given we are technically separated now, if she is wanting to date, its not cheating, however I found the mens clothing in our bedroom back in July at a time when we were still discussing an R, so really that is cheating in my opinion. I honestly think she has someone but trying to prove it is difficult, particularly at a time when I should be giving her privacy and space.

For now I'm giving up and working on me, but maybe because its still fairly raw for her that time will allow her to see it all from a different perspective. Deep down, I don't think that will happen, which is a shame because I've worked so hard on me these last four months, on many levels and she's admitted that she's seen those changes in me.

She said that the reason for stalling the D was because she's unhappy about being labelled a divorced single mum with two children, which I guess makes sense.

I will leave the door open for a R, and I told her that when I left the house but she didn't say much. I do hope that some of this wanting to get the D processed is because she feels guilt about what she's done, and that being separated would be the easiest option. I'm not sure I have that patience. I've tried to be patient since moving out 4 months ago and its sooo hard. I'd rather get off this roller coaster now. There needs to be more understanding on her side before anything could progress; there had been some understanding maybe six weeks ago however since she has started talking to more BS's, her opinion has changed, and now I'm seeing words such as Emotional Abuse being chucked at me.

In terms of IC, I haven't seen my IC since doubting the actions of my BS, but I'm hoping to get an appointment any day now.

I have come completely clean although have never offered a polygraph. As mentioned, I've gone 100% NC although being honest, that online relationship was simply a handful of messages and they didn't even see my picture as I took it off! I do get reminded of the use of online chat at a time when she was pregnant, which I know has hurt her hard, and then I did the same again.

I've opened up my phone account to her, but not others. That said, I've been honest about everything so far.

AMaeMOBluesawye

Thanks very much for your helpful comments, and for listening.

Sorry to hear that there is no chance at R for you both. You are certainly in a similar place to me really.

Today I was looking after the children whilst she took a driving lesson, and before she went out she had made it clear that I couldn't stay around at the house tonight, but she wouldn't say why. So of course this sent my brain into overdrive (only because it always seems to be Wed's that she's not comfortable to be at the house.)

Anyway, when she got back to the house and I were there (this time there were no issues being in the house on my own.), I pushed her buttons again a bit about coming around and wanting to know why I couldn't given I needed to set something up to be able to work from her / our house on Friday. I think it was more an issue from her perspective about me wanting to have control, rather than respecting her space, which ties in with your point about "giving her some space and time".

This unfortunately led on to talk about the separation (which wasn't easy when there was our two under 4's making a right noise with their toys! at the same time!), and she was fairly clear on not wanting to progress with any R and instead now wants to talk to a Family Mediator about the financials, childcare etc. I tried my level best to show remorse, how I was changing, but she just kept going back to the fact that I cheated on a number of occasions, and this time she wouldn't forgive.

She's convinced that I met someone in person, and accused my drive up to see a friend as being when I popped into a town on the way to meet this person I messaged (who I have had NC with since May.) even though I can show my exact route on my phone app. I even provided a screenshot of the route the same day.

The only counselling she is getting is CBT, and with never having CBT I'm unsure of the limitations of that for her. As you say, there's many struggles that she needs to deal with with aren't my fault. It feels like I'm hitting my head off a brick wall when trying to help with this. She even stopped taking medication months ago, which in my opinion was helping her to deal with everything.

I spoke to her dad just last night and he seemed to think that she did really want to figure things out between us, but then I'm starting to think that alot of what he says is just to keep me happy? What my BS was saying to me was very honest, BUT, it was at a time when she was particularly stressed out. That said though, we text a little bit when I got back to my parents and she was still going on about the same re: family mediation etc.

I did manage to get to the house in the end tonight (she had offered for me to go across - mainly because my working from the house that day I was supporting her with childcare), and it was like we had never had that difficult conversation.

Yes, given we are technically separated now, if she is wanting to date, its not cheating, however I found the mens clothing in our bedroom back in July at a time when we were still discussing an R, so really that is cheating in my opinion. I honestly think she has someone but trying to prove it is difficult, particularly at a time when I should be giving her privacy and space.

For now I'm giving up and working on me, but maybe because its still fairly raw for her that time will allow her to see it all from a different perspective. Deep down, I don't think that will happen, which is a shame because I've worked so hard on me these last four months, on many levels and she's admitted that she's seen those changes in me.

She said that the reason for stalling the D was because she's unhappy about being labelled a divorced single mum with two children, which I guess makes sense.

I will leave the door open for a R, and I told her that when I left the house but she didn't say much. I do hope that some of this wanting to get the D processed is because she feels guilt about what she's done, and that being separated would be the easiest option. I'm not sure I have that patience. I've tried to be patient since moving out 4 months ago and its sooo hard. I'd rather get off this roller coaster now. There needs to be more understanding on her side before anything could progress; there had been some understanding maybe six weeks ago however since she has started talking to more BS's, her opinion has changed, and now I'm seeing words such as Emotional Abuse being chucked at me.

In terms of IC, I haven't seen my IC since doubting the actions of my BS, but I'm hoping to get an appointment any day now.

I have come completely clean although have never offered a polygraph. As mentioned, I've gone 100% NC although being honest, that online relationship was simply a handful of messages and they didn't even see my picture as I took it off! I do get reminded of the use of online chat at a time when she was pregnant, which I know has hurt her hard, and then I did the same again.

I've opened up my phone account to her, but not others. That said, I've been honest about everything so far.

Owningitnow:

Thanks for your comments too, which I appreciate.

You guys are technically separated, but you do deserve to know which path you are on.

I think I'm clear after todays chat about where I'm at with this with my BS, which unfortunately looks like a D.

but never make someone else the most important thing in your life. YOU must be the most important thing to you

Definitely, and I'm working hard to do this now. I've spent 4 months showing my wife that she was the most important, whilst taking forward IC, but it does feel like that hasn't been effective - probably because I've not worked on me enough.

Its hard to tell if she is straying as I don't have all the facts, and wish I did because it makes it harder and takes up more energy thinking it through over and over, assuming, getting paranoid, and getting into the BS's space.

I really wish things were different. My friend tells me that this is all just part of the rollercoaster, but I just think my BS has now fully "checked-out", which breaks me.

[This message edited by Hopeful16 at 5:56 PM, September 7th (Wednesday)]

Yes, Hopeful16, it seems she has checked out. I was there as a BS. We were just in false R for the sake of the kids (both also under 4 or 5 at the time of my Dday2). Once I felt both of us were just trying to "keep the peace" after that I knew it was just a matter of how long could each of us go. However, we never engaged each other about the past A's. I still monitored him to be sure no ongoing contact, but eventually even doing that was too tiring. He was doing no work on stuff. I was only going to IC for my depression. We did the classic rug sweep routine and pretended all was well.

Until I cheated and forced the issue. That happened about 18 months after Dday2. Once that can of worms was open, then it was all down hill. I say I moved out, which I did, but in truth we both mutually decided the M was irretrievably broken; and for us both to be happy we had to be apart. Of course, this was only bc he knew about my A and thus I (like I said) forced the issue. He would have been happy to continue as we had been going in our "Zombie" M.

So, you have to decide! if it's worth it to keep trying or not? If so, then buckle down and keep doing the work. Dig deeper, as they say here. Leave her issues out of it all but by example and gentle reminders she should be doing some work on herself, too. If D is not on the table, then work out a legal separation, or find away to cohabitate (if she'll move back in) for help with finances and childcare so y'all can both go to IC and maybe maybe? eventually MC.

Again, you have a tough road to navigate. You can only make your decisions, not hers. Stay the course.

[This message edited by AMaeMOBluesawyer at 7:05 PM, September 7th (Wednesday)]

Its never good to be in a false R just for the sake of the children. By just keeping the peace, only delays the inevitable, and is hard on both sides.

Its hard that he didn't work on stuff. You've obviously both got to be on the same page in order to consider an R. At least you did the IC though, and worked on yourself. Thats what I'm trying to do as I'm getting really depressed about everything and need a way to deal with the negative thoughts.

Its similar for us in that since I found our about what I suspect is her cheating too, we stopped working on the idea that there could ever be a R (and thats only 2 months after my own dday.) Apart from the great fun days together with the family, it has been down hill. The difference being that I was the one who wanted to fix the M, and she keeps telling me its irretrievably broken.

Similar to your situation, its not impossible that she was trying to force the separation by her A ("if" she has done; I still have no real proof).

Its only a matter of time now before I give up, as we can't continue as zombies (thats a good word to use!) I do honestly think its worth trying for, but where do you go with it when all you get is friendly texts each day and nothing in the way of wanting to to fix things, or even say that we could be more in time.

As I keep saying to her, she should give herself more space and time. Thats the only way at the moment. Maybe more quality time together will also help.

I've also offered to be around for her next week to look after the boys so she has free time to do her own IC, and I know she appreciates this.

The positive of today is that the D and talks of a mediation appointment, haven't been brought up at all.

Its obviously not over until its over. I sometimes wonder if she brings the D up only to keep hurting me when she is hurting; like a bit of a weapon. She doesn't admit to that.

One of the dangers I guess is to keep going around in a circle (good days, bad days, good days, D suggestion, good days etc) without any talk of a R. Again, similar to you. I will see what time gives us before letting her go. She's obviously going through a lot and its important that I'm more consistent with my emotions for now, to enable her to heal; which might be enough for her to think again, or not.

[This message edited by Hopeful16 at 4:33 PM, September 8th (Thursday)]

Hi, everyone. I just wanted to check in and introduce myself. You can read my whole story from start to finish in the Wayward Side forum, which is where I started prior to my BH becoming a WH nine weeks after my dday.

I will be checking in here from time to time to see how everyone who is dealing with a similar situation is doing. My husband and I are heading toward separation and divorce, there was no change of R there.

So hello and I'm sorry we're all in this mess together...

Keep swimming Hopeful16. Bring up R when it seem right. Otherwise it will just circle continuously until one of you breaks.

Hi, isthereanyhope. Yeah it sucks here. A lot of no or false R and so aims at D or S (me). I'll go check out your story. Mine 's on my profile. I haven't started a thread yet, as I'm not sure how to pinpoint my specific current issue other than I'm back here on SI reading.

[This message edited by AMaeMOBluesawyer at 9:18 PM, September 8th (Thursday)]

I really wish I could continue swimming but she told me tonight that she was now dating, and I still suspect they are the same one as who was at the house as she was refusing to answer many questions of my suspisions.

There was a brief pause where she said she just wasn't sure what she wanted, but said she was steering more to dating that an R.

So after an angry hour saying many things I shouldn't, I'm checking out and getting on with my life without her.

Feel rubbish but only me to blame!

[This message edited by Hopeful16 at 5:47 PM, September 9th (Friday)]

I'm sorry, Hopeful. Focus on healing yourself and finding out the why's to your own choices. It's our experiences that build us, and so you must use this to be a better version of you. Don't totally give up on R, unless you don't really want it either. There's a saying here that if you truly want R, keep trying even past D, even until the other spouse has remarried.

I'm going to thanks AMae. I've got another IC tomorrow which is the first in a few weeks, which I'm focusing on. There's many issues in myself which I need to deal with, particularly after the news.

Its interesting what you say about not totally giving up on an R. There's obviously a long long way to go, and not even 4 months in on the DDay.

I did try to break contact for a bit after seeing her yesterday, but that didn't last long, only to end up in a bit of a loop of paranoia wondering what she was up to. I'll find strength to reduce the contact as it only makes me look too needy. If anything would work, I think it would be the reduced contact (if may not of course) and may well take a lot more time.

I do feel a better me. As my ex BS often tells me, you can take that into a new relationship. She can see the changes, although possibly not enough over the recent week where all of my emotions have just ended up creating a huge mess, as I 'panicked' so to call it. She said that before my emotions came across, the R had been a thought, but I don't believe her. I guess I don't know enough, and assumptions are so dangerous to make.

Again, thanks for your support, which I've really appreciated. I'll keep thinking about me first and hopefully before long, this need to know what she is doing etc will fade. I'll certainly not give up on the R before I strongly believe she and our boys are worth the fight.

Hi, ITAH;

I've posted on your thread in WS. How are things going? Still going toward D? Or are y'all gonna try in house separation for awhile?

Hopeful16,

Yes, continue working on you (with IC, reading, digging) at this point. It's all you really can do. It is still early on, so things (on her end) can still change again. Be the man she (or someone else down the road, not fOP) would want; but yes, don't get needy. Contact only when necessary (kids, mtgs, finances).

You're dead-right about assumptions- they'll kill you. Although actions are louder than words (works both ways). Focus on you and hope/work towards the best outcome, but also (as the saying here goes) "let go of the outcome".

You sound better. Keep posting.

A

Hi. I did you your post on my thread and I do appreciate your insight. I do think my husbands A was a revenge affair and an exit affair all rolled into one. He'll never admit to that and it very well be a subconscious thing for him.

We are currently doing in-house separation only because he needs to get financing in place to move. But we are still in regular "friendship" contact and still hang out together all the time. We both know the marriage is over and we have to move on. But we really are good friends so there's that. And between you and me (and everyone else on this site) I still love him despite everything. Can't admit it to him but the love is still there. We both need to move on though. It is just a sad situation all around and there are no winners.

Being the kind of guy he is I am bracing myself for him to move on quickly. He kind of needs someone to take care of him (one of the underlying issues with the marriage). I just want some time to focus on myself, on recovering from what I did and what he did and rekindling old hobbies and interests I have neglected for many years.

My IC tonight helped as I've been in a bit of a mess for most of the day with emotions. I have good days and bad.

Its been made more difficult today by the less contact with my BS. I was going to try no contact following our chat yesterday (my decision as I said I'd find it hard her dating and being in touch), but that didn't last for very long after a bit of a tiff over something minor, and all of her text message replies have been cold since. I find it frustrating because only this time yesterday she was being playful throwing sweets at me when we were sat in the living room after putting our boys to bed, and today she seems so distant.

As mentioned, I'll try hard to contact only when its necessary, not the 42 that I sent today which really is over stepping the boundaries but when I notice that she has drastically changed in her responses, I panic.

You are very right, it is still early on at her end and things can still change. It is only just 4 months tomorrow that she made the discovery.

I'm going to try to be the man she would want. By doing some new hobbies should help take my mind of the need to always want to send her a message, or drop by.

I like the phrase "let go of the outcome" - thats very true.

I do wish that my BS made more of an effort though. I know she hurts, and is still angry about what happened, but it just feels like no matter what I do its not right at the moment. But then feelings change in time!

[This message edited by Hopeful16 at 2:55 PM, September 12th (Monday)]

ITAH,

In all reality, it's sounds like you two can handle D if that's what it comes to. Be friends. Be great co-parents. But be happy ... somewhere else. That's basically where I am now. I had enough love for my x to want him to find happiness elsewhere since I wasn't able to give it to him, so I had to leave; and he feels the same for me. It was, in all honesty, a mutually decided upon outcome for us permanently split in order to both be happy. My mantra was I could not be the best mother I could be (and I pretty much suck at it as it is anyway) by trying to save the M. I had to get out for my sanity and my family. But subsequently, x and I are actually okay friends now. I hold no outward resentment toward him and feel none from him in return. He actually accidentally said "love you" to me the other day after dropping the boys off while he was leaving. I kinda said "what?" And he said, "oh....well...you know, like as friends". Caught me off guard.

Anyway, it gets better. If you do love him then maybe this is the best, if you truly believe it's over for him. My x was also like yours and needed someone in his life to "take care of him"; and he found someone relatively quickly. He was with her about 2 years, then moved on to a new girl, and they've been together 3+ years now. It's all worked out and the boys seem well adjusted. I know they would prefer us to be a "normal" family, but this way they have 4 parents looking after them, which is nice, since only one grandfather left in their lives and cousins are all far away.

Sorry to ramble on. Just letting you know you can be okay on the other side if R isn't in the cards. You decide. If you need to ...fight for it!; but if it's over, then let go and move on.

Yep, Hopeful16,

Feelings do change. Everything is in flux all the time. Every moment, every choice we have to make is a new chance to be our best selves. Forgive yourself when you stumble, pick yourself up and continue as planned. Learn from mistakes and try to be "present" with your kids and with yourself. You can't make her choices or change her thinking so just let that go.

You just need time. Keep going to IC. It will help. Reading, projects, reflection/introspection, envision what the best you would be like then make small changes to stay on track to become that. "Rome wasn't built in a day" and all that crap is true.

Best of luck and keep posting.

I was proud that I managed to reduce contact with my BS over the last few days by text, with the exception of going there for tea last night to help look after our children for a few hours. It was positive, she put in lots of effort to make what was a complicated tea, not a microwave attempt, which I appreciated.

The BS's texts were a bit colder today and she once again reminded me that our marriage wasn't fixable, so I slipped in the R word to make sure she was aware that I didn't want anyone but her, for reassurance. I've really found it hard dropping contact - going from 30+ messages per day, to 2-5, but it still contact, rather than no contact. I also said today that I didn't want to bring up any more questions about the RA (if that is the case), as I'm often concerned that when I'm around her she's nervous of me asking loads of questions about it.

Anyway, I don't plan to have deep discussion for now. I just felt it was important for her to know just how I felt rather than keep focusing down the path of not ever being able to reconcile. I think she thinks that I'm always happy (I look happy when I'm around her, because I am happy when I'm with her and the children) but when I'm not, I'm fairly miserable, and work has noticed this too.

She was pleased though that I had given her space this week and said that she appreciated it, so that action has been noticed :)

I like your point AMae about the fact that feelings do change, and how everything is in flux all the time. It certainly is in flux! Something my BS quoted just yesterday was "I understand things change on a daily if not hourly basis"!

I'm stumbling all the time, but I'm able to pick myself up quicker. I managed two full days in work too without just wanting to run out the door.

I agree, I can't make her choices or change her thinking, but its hard letting that go because I always feel like I need to try, or it will be too late i.e. I don't hear from her by text for half a day, I have to send one to say "hello, I'm still here", to avoid getting into a new normal of not texting for days and days.

These changes I'm making to myself are going to take time. I've been proud to have given her proper privacy as of late. No questioning, no turning up unannounced and no pushing her buttons. I'm fairly sure that she has seen that change in me.

The hardest part at the moment is just how long this is all taking. It was 4 months yesterday since DDay and I'm still at my parents house, with no sign (other than being in touch with the BS) that there will ever be an R, but its baby steps. On the positives, we never talk about the D, there's still chemistry (in my opinion) between us, even though my BS will never admit that and I'm invited over for tea again on Monday night so knows where another 4 months will take us.

I'm not giving up, but I'm "absolutely" drained from the effort it takes. Whilst I've let her go, and the outcome, I feel she's worth it. It does leave me scared at times about my BS dating and how it will feel when there is someone more visibly around, rather than my own assumptions. I have no idea how I will cope trying to stay in contact with my BS and still putting on a fight to R when this happens. Maybe I'll be stronger by then in my own self.

Hows things with you AMae?

Hopeful16,

4 months into this part of it is still a short amount of time even though it feels like it's been forever, and you're getting tired. Use the time apart to work on yourself. IC, reading, journaling, hobbies, exercise, etc... Keep focusing on "letting go of the outcome" and just being the best you can be for yourself and for your kids.

You're doing fine with limited contact; it shows her you can give her space, that you have your own life, and keeps the chance of engaging with her (negatively) about things to a minimum. Keep a log or list of important topics you want to talk with her about and then be quiet (meaning keep it to yourself until she is ready to discuss it). In the meantime, think/visualize about how that conversation could go in your head, how you will keep calm, will not get angry or defensive, will not be accusatory or condescending, but also how to open a healthy dialogue about what you'd like for you're mutual future. It might help to not force a conversation on her either, but when things are going okay mention that "soon, you'd like to have a open and safe talk" with her about your future whether it be together or apart.

I know the limbo and zombie state feels like nothing is happening, but time is great to let the dust settle and to get distance and perspective about what's happened. Be mindful to the fact that you are still the wayward (regardless if she's started dating or not) and you need to aim to fix that. If she really has started dating then you being calm, open, approachable, safe, transparent, dependable (but not a push over or needy) all will make her less inclined to want to pursue any outside new relationship (that always seems better than it turns out to be--starting over is also tiring). Obviously you had feeling for each other previously, and so she won't forget that. Also that you're the kids dad and that means a lot, too. Be the best father you can be under the circumstances. And for goodness sake, do not ever point out to her all the great things you're doing to be better (person or dad), bc that only makes you look pathetic; let you're actions speak for themselves.

I know it's hard now, bc you don't see what is in store between you two, yet; but keep going. Have patience. Nothing is set in stone, yet. Have faith that she will come back, but don't hook all your hopes on it and definitely don't push her. If you push too hard she will more than likely run the other way. You can't "nice" her back either by being whiny, needy, begging or pleading. Just be happy for the times she gives you, tell her (without hoping for any response) that you miss her, you are working hard to improve yourself, and that you hope that you can R.

And keep on swimming.

And for me? ..thanks for asking. I've got my first IC appointment set up for tomorrow. I'm depressed, I know, and that's what's brought on all my current insecurities about my relationship. I don't think I've properly dealt with all my issues about myself and my past. I know I need to change a lot of things, and it's a daunting task; but I know it is the right thing for everyone that I get healthy (for me, my kids, and my SO). I'll get there. Recognizing you need help is the first step. Getting help is the second ...then you're walking the walk, right?