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Just Found Out :
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 TreesAreGreen (original poster new member #79155) posted at 9:32 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

Hello all, I've been a Long time reader of this site and others like it since I recently found out about a betrayal by my wife. Guess I thought it was time to share a bit of my story and seek some advice - my only concern is some of the specifics would cause me/us to be identified fairly easily anyone got a view how to prevent that?

posts: 39   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021   ·   location: Iowa
id 8677325
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asc1226 ( member #75363) posted at 9:49 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

Write your post with discretion in mind, change relevant info, names, location, employment, all of the usual. Once you post, other members can suggest edits to maintain anonymity.

[This message edited by asc1226 at 3:53 PM, July 21st (Wednesday)]

[This message edited by asc1226 at 9:53 PM, Wednesday, July 21st]

I make edits, words is hard

posts: 376   ·   registered: Sep. 7th, 2020
id 8677328
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 TreesAreGreen (original poster new member #79155) posted at 10:02 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

Thanks for the reply I suppose its fairly obvious but it's some of the nuances of this that I'm really questioning in my head that I really need some advice on. Just trying to figure out the best way to describe this to you peeps to get the best advice - appreciate the reply.

posts: 39   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021   ·   location: Iowa
id 8677332
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Thumos ( member #69668) posted at 10:08 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

You can share a lot of details while still being generic. For example, leave out references to professions, gender of children (if any), state you live in (or even geographic region). Etc. Probably you can share more details than you think.

For instance, of the many things I've written I shared that my WW's AP gifted her a wine fridge, drives a truck, and lives off the largesse of his daddy's money.

This is probably not terribly common, yet infidelity itself is unfortunately rampant in America now. So probably fewer people are going to be able to filter that information than you'd think.

If my WW's AP ever stumbled on some of my posts, he would probably know pretty quickly I was talking about him. I don't care.

"True character is revealed in the choices a human being makes under pressure. The greater the pressure, the deeper the revelation, the truer the choice to the character's essential nature."

BH: 50, WW: 49 Wed: Feb.'96 DDAY1: 12.20.16 DDAY2: 12.23.19

posts: 4337   ·   registered: Feb. 5th, 2019   ·   location: UNITED STATES
id 8677333
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rugswept ( member #48084) posted at 10:20 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

Anything you feel is uniquely qualifying should just be left out of your discussion. (As in, "when I was young, my mother had an AP and I had an illegitimate sibling as a result ....").

The observations you'll get here are based on hundreds of cases where so many of these cheaters follow certain behavioral patterns. At a high level, cheaters are quite alike. With more specifics you'll get advice about how to deal with them and what you should avoid.

I can say I've never seen a case where someone has indicated their cover was blown from posting here.

In some cases the spouse (wayward) found out and mined the info for their benefit. If you think your WW is aware of you being here, you might want to avoid this place. You'd be tipping her off.

[This message edited by rugswept at 4:21 PM, July 21st (Wednesday)]

R'd (rug swept everything) decades ago.
I'm big on R. Very happy marriage but can never forget.

posts: 964   ·   registered: Jun. 2nd, 2015   ·   location: Northeast US
id 8677336
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This0is0Fine ( member #72277) posted at 10:21 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

There are some options. You can put your story in your profile, which makes it a little less obvious.

Most people try to anonymize names/locations etc. Fudge ages a bit if you feel like it will help.

As a long time reader, you probably have a good idea of the kind of advice some of the more active/prolific posters give in the first place. Most of us are amenable to taking PMs, myself included.

Love is not a measure of capacity for pain you are willing to endure for your partner.

posts: 1398   ·   registered: Dec. 11th, 2019
id 8677337
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 TreesAreGreen (original poster new member #79155) posted at 10:23 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

Fair enough thanks I'll share more tomorrow as I'm knackered and going to bed - probably to lie there awake for most of it thinking where did this all go wrong - like a nightmare I want to wake up from but it's my new reality....

[This message edited by TreesAreGreen at 4:25 PM, July 21st (Wednesday)]

posts: 39   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021   ·   location: Iowa
id 8677338
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nekonamida ( member #42956) posted at 10:38 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

TAG, I can tell you that we have heard it all. Unless you tell us that you are one in 3 top researchers in a field or are running for an easily searchable public office, it is nearly impossible for us to identify you. I know for a fact that there are half a dozen posters from my state and I don't have a clue who they really are. Unless your friend/coworker/someone you know IRL told you to post here and can recognize the similarities, you would have to do a lot to reveal your identity to any of us. And the chances any of us even knowing you personally are incredibly slim. The only person who could pretty easily find you here is your WW so don't tell her about this place unless you want her to read your posts.

Think about it - you are poster #79,155 and at best a couple hundred people from around the world will read your post IF THAT. How many people do you personally know and how many know about your specific situation? A few? Out of BILLIONS? Statistically speaking it's practically impossible for any of us to figure it out just from basic info. There's millions of people out there around your age, around your demographic, in your profession, even thousands local to you who share one or more of those factors in common, and so very many who also have been married to a cheater. It would be like playing Guess Who with a board covering several acres of land. Unless you tell us, we can't do it.

posts: 5023   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2014   ·   location: United States
id 8677347
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asc1226 ( member #75363) posted at 10:44 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

Trees, sent you a pm.

I make edits, words is hard

posts: 376   ·   registered: Sep. 7th, 2020
id 8677349
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survrus ( member #67698) posted at 11:28 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021

TAG,

The affairs are so similar that it's easy to get one thread confused with another, sometimes people post to the wrong thread even.

Note that almost all the details of your WW affair will be duplicated in other posts, so much so that as you read the details you will marvel at how unoriginal WWs behave.

Also surprising is that WWs fall for the same cliche OM lines.

posts: 1056   ·   registered: Nov. 1st, 2018   ·   location: USA
id 8677364
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tushnurse ( member #21101) posted at 12:30 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Just make sure you protect this site.

Do not leave yourself logged in on your phone or computer and clear your cache/history if you dont want your partner to see it.

Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 21 &23
Married for 28 years now, was 16 at the time.
D-Day Sept 26 2008
R'd in about 2 years. Old Vet now.

posts: 18979   ·   registered: Oct. 1st, 2008   ·   location: St. Louis
id 8677386
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Cooley2here ( member #62939) posted at 2:50 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

I watched a movie that had cooley dam in it. I don’t live anywhere close to it hence my SI name. I wad cheated on years ago but hope I have enough wisdom to help newbies.

If you have young children that’s all we need to know. No ages or sexes. Don’t describe work in great detail. Never tell your ws because if she gets angry at you the AP will be the first to know. We don’t need specifics other than the cheating and issues around that.

To thine own self be true. Shakespeare

posts: 2952   ·   registered: Mar. 5th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8677400
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 TreesAreGreen (original poster new member #79155) posted at 9:28 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Ok well not sleeping again so thought time to share a bit more; here goes.....not sure where to start but i'll try and give enough to help - sorry if its too long!

My wife and I are in our forties, we've been together now for about 25yrs and married for 19 of those years - we have two children both daughters.

We met through mutual friends and got on great together, just had a good time and it felt right. Before we actually started seeing each other 'officially' my wife was seeing a good friend of mine (I will call him John for the purposes of this story). Even though we were all young at the time John was known as a bit of a player and used to have a different girlfriend every week. He was my best friend and i've known him since we were about 8 yrs old - literally grew up together, later on enjoying going to sports events, beers etc etc. I was his best man at his wedding for example. When he moved onto someone else, sometime later I started a relationship with my now wife and we've been together ever since.

My wife and I have fairly high moral standards (both raised fairly strictly) and decided to wait until we were married before we had sex so we were each others firsts in that respect and a lot of other respects.

When we first got married we were both skint had fairly poorly paid jobs but we didn't care we just wanted to be together and decided to get hitched and things would work out.

Fast forward a few years I rose up the corporate ladder, she also decided to retrain and got a good job working for her self earning good money so we are comfortable in terms of money no worries there at all. We also had the children during this time and all was going really well. I was working long hours but the pay was good and I was providing for my little family so happy to do it. The only downside of that was how little I actually saw them! My wife started working fewer hours as she was raising our children but it didn't matter mostly and it seemed the best approach.

We've always got on well with John and his wife and their two children in fact our kids used to play together and we'd go out as families for meals / holidays etc.

Ok, hopefully your still here and this is where it starts going wrong......

John and his wife were struggling in terms of their marriage and the wife decided she'd had enough and they divorced. This was in 2019 John seemed cut up but didn't actually ever try and persuade his wife to stop the divorce in fact his view was yep time to move on. Obviously I cared about my friends well being and he spent a fair bit of time at my house (I know, I know) we supported him through a very messy divorce.

During the same time my wife and I were still happy although we were spending less and less time together. At the end of 2019 and into 2020 we would literally eat together then watch TV in separate rooms then go to bed not ideal but I figured that's kind of normal for people married for nearly 20 years. Sex life was ok, nothing great but ok, again 19 years later we're not exactly going to be going at it like bunnies/newlyweds anymore right?

I also started noticing her on her phone all of the time and I mean all of the time but she's big into social media and its not like I was sitting next to her anyways so it didn't bother me too much - what did start to bother me was the way she was always using the phone at an angle, taking it everywhere with her (and I mean everywhere). One evening though she came home and for some reason left her phone on the dining room table unlocked.....so I took a peek.....

What I saw in her messages nearly floored me, and I mean that genuinely I started shaking and nearly keeled over but I grabbed my own phone and took some pictures so I could read the messages properly later.

There were messages from John (fairly innocent that I could see albeit they were clearly taking the piss out of me) but the ones that floored me were from some other guy (lets call him John2) She had been txt'g this guy and ending the txts with 'hun' and 'xxx' etc etc it also appeared to me he was supporting her emotionally in someway, calling her beautiful and trying to arrange to meet her. Her texts back to him were clearly friendly/over familiar but she was making excuses not to meet but promised to call him.......I think he had bought her a present and wanted to give it to her but she was making excuses not to meet him. However it was enough for me that night to basically accuse her of having an affair with John2.

The really odd thing (for me at the time) when I made the accusation to her she assumed I was talking about john1 not john2 she denied anything inappropriate and when I demanded she show me her phone the messages had been deleted. Of course when I showed her the pictures I had she then backtracked slightly but explained he had been bothering her and she was trying to 'nicely' get rid of him - that they had met during her weekly exercise and they had started talking and exercising together but nothing had happened and actually she was fed up with his attention now and was trying to make excuses not to talk to him anymore - changed the park she exercised in etc they had never met outside of that. I asked what he was trying to give her and she said some flowers to cheer her up but she said she didn't want them.

I should also say here I think my wife is VERY body conscious and never been happy in a bikini etc even though I've always thought she looks great she has always been fairly insecure. Therefore any thoughts she could have been intimate with anyone else was a million miles away in my thinking, I was more concerned with the emotional element and she had maybe been naïve with her interactions with another guy and sent out some wrong signals. I said to her I wasn't happy with the txts she should not be sending anything like that to another man even if you are trying to 'nicely get rid of someone' be careful of the signals you send out etc then went to sleep and didn't think too much more about it.

Think that will do for now. I will continue on later.

[This message edited by TreesAreGreen at 4:27 AM, July 22nd (Thursday)]

posts: 39   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021   ·   location: Iowa
id 8677422
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beb252 ( member #78948) posted at 10:26 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Based on your initial story, it seems like your WW is having an emotional affair with a friend, John, who just got divorced with his ex who's also your friend?

Have you discussed the evidences you gathered with your WW? Was it just an emotional affair? Was it ever physical? When did the affair start? Did your WW admitted to having an affair?

All the best!

posts: 388   ·   registered: Jun. 14th, 2021
id 8677424
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 TreesAreGreen (original poster new member #79155) posted at 12:07 PM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

beb252 thanks for the reply I will get there I promise but its such a f'kd up situation you could not make it up....

Ok, following the initial shock I started thinking about things more and started to question in my head what my wife was telling me, things between us were also getting worse, no arguing or anything like that but I sensed a coldness/indifference from her that was not a great place to be, I ended up drinking more and I guess trying to drown out how I was feeling.

Still we had so many years behind us, nothing going on right?

I decided to check on her honesty and placed a tracker in her car just to verify what she said she was doing was in fact true so I sat back and watched.

So couple of weeks go by and I noticed a strange pattern in that her movements were really odd she would go where she said she was going but then go and sit in random locations before she came home.

Also I would txt her to ask her where she was and she would say one location but she was clearly somewhere else. Never for long but enough that I started thinking 'why are you lying to me?'

Then on one occasion she said she was going shopping but her car was sat in a side road. I asked her about her day when she got home with some clothes etc and all seemed normal.

The next day I then did something I completely now regret.....I said to her we need to talk, we went out and I said tell me about your day yesterday - she did, recalled everything she had been doing and I basically said 'I know your lying to me your car wasn't in the place you said it was' Q the 'how would u know that etc' eventually I lost it and told her I had placed a tracker on her car and I know you've been lying to me. I then got the 'your wrong, stop controlling me, I knew you would do something like that so I decided to test you, my friend picked me up and we went shopping together - I did do what I said, you clearly don't trust me and I think we should separate'

So wow - I was like where did that come from?

Slow down a bit and talk to me....

She then proceeded to give me the whole ILYBINILWY bit, she's been deeply unhappy for years and if it hadn't been for COVID she would have left.

Obviously I was totally floored and started to scramble to save my marriage. I should also say at this point the tracker battery died and she started to hide her car key from me as she was concerned I would get another one and she couldn't stand being 'watched'

Also at the same time I started to look for 'how to save your marriage' type sites and looked and started reading forums on TAM - I read various stories from others and started thinking hold on a minute this happened, that happened.....surely she's not having an affair not my wife must be wrong - but the more I looked the more I started thinking this must be happening and somehow I missed it, I also got annoyed at myself for admitting the tracker was on the car.

Some of the advice on there focussed around changing yourself so I started to get fit, more active, drink less etc etc etc

Also I asked for more time and we could put whatever the issues were right - not to leave without giving it a chance - she agreed but I found out she was miles ahead of me, had talked to her parents about how unhappy she was, had talked to a lawyer etc etc

I was feeling totally defeated and just could not believe what I was hearing, but thought I will continue with my self improvements anyway as I was feeling loads better in myself and I honestly thought at this point she was going so I needed to prepare, I also spoke to a Lawyer about my options.

So one of the things I assumed was if anyone it would be John2 so I spoke to my good mate John1 and asked his advice. What he said made me wince - he just said speaking from experience himself if its time to go. Just go. Start again - don't bother trying to fix something if she wants out let her - that's what I did and I'm loads happier......everyone else I shared issues with gave great advice on how to save the marriage - I just thought to myself - well he is the only person I talk to who is divorced himself so I suppose he has a different perspective.

A couple of months go by I'm working from home now due to the pandemic spending more time with family and trying to be a good dad etc We're doing loads of stuff together as a family and eventually my wife said, you know what the new you is great - I want to work on us. This was slightly out of the blue but also great news to me as I couldn't bear the thought of splitting my family up, I loved her and my kids. I did remember though that I had to watch actions and this is where I started thinking - what's going on here nothing is changing she's still cold/indifferent even though she says she wants to work on 'us'. It was like she was stalling and waiting for something else.

I then decided I was a poor PI so I hired one...he was great, good suggestions, said do I really want to know etc but I said the not knowing was worse. He started on a plan to follow my wife discreetly and report back. So a couple of operations in and nothing - I'm thinking ok, that's good....then eventually one weekend morning he was watching her and she met John1 at a fairly secluded location - he said he couldn't get close but all they did was talk and walk - now keep in mind we were in lockdown so this should not have happened.

Learning from before I decided not to confront too early and suggested to my PI to keep going I did wonder if the meeting had been accidental but he said no definite meet at a specific time/place etc

At this point my mind is all over the place I did check in with the wife to ask her randomly when she last saw John1 and she was like 'oh, weeks ago' so I knew she was not telling me the truth about him.

Couple of weeks go by and they met a few more times - one incident involved her getting into John1s car and them driving to a secluded car park - my PI followed and said they were talking / arguing and nothing physical happened as they don't have enough time - his view was it looked like she was trying to get away from him. He certainly couldn't say for certain they were having an affair but of course he did say the obvious 'why doesn't she pick up the phone if she wants to talk' maybe they have had something at some point and she's trying to break it off.

So I am now convinced if anyone its got to be him, I decide I've seen enough and I will confront. To be honest my health was good but my sleeping at this point is shocking I've moved from desperate to save marriage to 'who is this person' I am living with...maybe it is time to move on - can't trust her anymore etc.

So DDAY1 approaches and I start with the whole 'when did you last see john1' - get the response weeks ago etc then I say 'ok I know your lying only the truth from now on or I divorce you myself' she's slightly nervous now, starting to moan about a few things and asking why I want to know, not your concern who I speak to - I am allowed friends etc

Still denying everything I present some evidence that I know they have met - er....ok yes I met him once....then I said you've met him more than once and I know what you have been up to.

Silence....then....he's helping me. He's been setting me up so I could divorce you, I didn't know who else to ask for help. I've met him a couple of times to sort out how I could manage on my own. No I don't want to be with him, he is helping me as a friend that's all. She also shared some things with me that I can't write here that made me believe her - she then said something about that was then its different now I want to be here with you - I know he wanted to be with me but I never wanted to be with him, I just used the fact he wanted to be with me so he would help me out with practical arrangements if I left you......led him to believe they had a future together if he helped her out.

I must admit at this point I was like 'sorry but men don't do anything like this for free' what has been going on really, you must have done something? She's then like 'You know how I am about my body, you are the only one who has seen me I promise you'.

She was adamant nothing physical other than 'holding hands' had happened......mmmm

She then said I totally changed my mind, recently its been great and I want to stay, work on us and really make a go of it. I totally regret lying to you about meeting him - the next couple of weeks were amazing - actions by the plenty if you know what I mean - she couldn't do enough for me, felt like we were newly wed etc

There is more to come.......

posts: 39   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021   ·   location: Iowa
id 8677434
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Sceadugenga ( member #74429) posted at 12:29 PM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Sounds like your wife's AP doesn't want her full time and she doesn't want to be alone, so you're her plan B and she's sticking around. For now.

posts: 274   ·   registered: May. 13th, 2020
id 8677435
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guvensiz ( member #75858) posted at 12:40 PM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Sorry for you are here.

There are things to comment on so far, but I'm just waiting for the story to end.

posts: 518   ·   registered: Nov. 14th, 2020
id 8677436
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annb ( member #22386) posted at 12:49 PM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Hi, welcome to SI, the best club no one wants to join.

I'm surprised you didn't realize early on that John1 was not your friend and you asked him for advice.

Gently, your wife is a liar and a manipulator. You've had to go to great lengths (like most of us here) to get to the truth.

I'm curious for the rest of your story because so many, many of us on this site were told they were only friends, they only held hands, they only kissed once to find out it was a full blown sexual and emotional affair.

Unless you have the truth, you have no foundation to build on.

posts: 11266   ·   registered: Jan. 10th, 2009   ·   location: Northeast
id 8677437
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 TreesAreGreen (original poster new member #79155) posted at 1:31 PM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Sceadugenga - I have to say that is one POV I hadn't considered. The alone bit you are spot on but it may help if I continue the story and this is where you will all probably say WTAF move on already and I kinda get that.....here goes:

So great couple of weeks, we're back to better than normal, all good - or so I think.

Completely out of the blue I am contacted by John1s now x wife she sends an extremely blunt to the point txt to me saying.

John1 and your wife have been having an affair since 2017 you should get tested for STDs etc as he was not the first affair your wife has had.....

So I'm like WTF is going on now - ring her up and she's in bits - john1 has grown a conscience and admitted to her he had an affair with my wife while they were married prior to their divorce. He also stated some details of how it started.....he claims my wife was having an affair with john2 that she thought she had caught some STD and panicked - couldn't talk to me about it so decides to go to john1 for help - like a KISA he comes to her aid and sees her into the clinic and helps her out - they then unbelievably start their own affair!! This goes on for the best part of three years - yep 3 fckn years! - right under my nose - I had no clue this was even happening until I started looking after the messages I saw on her phone and got suspicious but even then 3 YEARS!

SO again my world ends....I have no reason not to believe what I am hearing - why would she lie?

Roll on DDay2

Kids are out so I confront my wife about this new information it takes about 5hrs in total but she eventually admits to sleeping with john1 and john2 - she says it started with john2 then she confided with john1 her concerns ref STD (although she claims always had protection....) - he took advantage and basically threatened to tell me if she didn't continue with him - she was I quote 'his slave'

Now I was in complete shock - the perfect moral wife with body issues was sitting their sobbing her heart out......I basically said to her we're done I cannot believe anything you say anymore. Get your lawyer ready - after much pleading from her (I sort of regret this bit) I said maybe we could see if we can move past it - way too early to make that decision I know now.....

Obviously she's over the moon and says she'll do anything I want to make it right, still in complete shock she then went to see her mum and dad and confessed all to them and I sat there saying I would try and work it out with their daughter. She also told a number of family and friends what a fool she had been. She seems to be showing full remorse and is trying to work hard on us (although I have some issues with the how she's doing that but that's for another time)

Part of the issue for me was the utter anger I had for john1 - I had known him as a friend for 30yrs......how could he do this to me....oddly I was looking past my wife at this time all I felt was total sadness and pity for her..not anger. I felt she was a victim.

Now as time has moved on I'm now in the - hold on she made the commitment to me not him - I married her not him so my anger towards her is building at a very quick rate....also the 'slave' image and what that would entail is just awful to contemplate.

I am also struggling with the plan B bit. She says after John2 she knew she had destroyed our marriage therefore she never saw me as an option she couldn't come clean and tried to make a go of it with John1.....then decided she wanted out of that and that's why he basically threw her under the bus as she wasn't cooperating anymore.

That's what the PI saw them doing, arguing together with him threatening to spill all if she left.

Part of me thinks he just grew bored of her moved on and thought may as well destroy their lives while I'm here! Great friend eh?

The weeks pass and we're struggling with some kind of half assed reconciliation I'm swinging daily between honouring her and booting her out.

She is trying and answering all questions I have even though she basically doesn't want to talk about it if she can avoid it.

A massive issue here are our children who don't really know the whole story and would be devastated by divorce and obviously the fear of having to start again etc etc

I've spent my whole adult life with this woman and feel I should try and give it a go before I pull the trigger and D.

Am I being a complete and utter fool here?

Its one thing to think what you will do in the situation but another to actually be here.

Its all just so messed up.

Oh and one other thing the POSOM John1 tried to contact my wife she shared with me his note basically asking if they could see each other and work it out! Like WTAF again........she showed me and it proved to me she hasn't been in contact with him before the note - that was something I insisted on and also complete openness of phone etc which she has given me.

Am I being a complete idiot to even consider this and somehow being able to move on? I obviously don't trust her in the someway I did before and I'm also wondering if I should ask my PI to get back on it just in case?

I've said I can't and won't do this again - its been unbelievably hard already.......

Sorry for the long posts!

posts: 39   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021   ·   location: Iowa
id 8677452
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 TreesAreGreen (original poster new member #79155) posted at 2:13 PM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021

Not 100% sure yet how to respond to specific posts but to annb to answer

I'm surprised you didn't realize early on that John1 was not your friend and you asked him for advice.

So it became clear to me later on what an absolute fraud this 'friend' of mine actually is.

When I talked to him I did so thinking 'I am fairly sure its you' but I wanted to hear what he had to say esp about the john2 txts - of course at that time I didn't have the full picture but had started to not trust him and then what he said confirmed for me it was very likely him - I actually thought it may be a surprise for him to know she had been txt'g someone else, but he obviously already knew that! - I just couldn't prove anything and didn't want to confront without evidence.

posts: 39   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021   ·   location: Iowa
id 8677466
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