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Just Found Out :
How the New Year started

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Mr. Kite ( member #28840) posted at 4:26 AM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

Excellent post HeHadADoubleLife. Thank you.

I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you what not to do.

posts: 1173   ·   registered: Jun. 18th, 2010   ·   location: Mid-Atlantic
id 8491623
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Marz ( member #60895) posted at 4:38 AM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

Bud, everyone is right there is no rush. Everything is on your timeline.

IMO I would not waste my time on a MC right now. I’d tell her you did this not me if you want IC knock yourself out but the worst thing you can do right now is get bushwhacked by an MC. Plus she’s still in the affair. Hard 180 or you’ll stay confused and tied up in this. You can’t think clearly in these situations.

Look man, shes got a fucking boyfriend on the side so don’t think you have to cater to her. You’d better take care of yourself first. No one else will.

See another attorney that one you consulted is higher than a kite.

STOP acting like this is your fault !!!!!!!! It isn’t

posts: 6791   ·   registered: Oct. 3rd, 2017
id 8491626
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anoldlion ( member #51571) posted at 5:26 AM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

Ever hear the phrase "Fight fire with fire"? First of all your self-confidence needs a boost. Never, and I mean never let the actions of someone else dictate how you feel about yourself. If one woman finds fault with you there are others that will be happy to take her place. There are numerous women out there that will not stab you in the heart. Your wife wants to grow old with you but also loves the other man. Something I read that fits your wife: "If you love two people at the same time, choose the second one, because if you really loved the first you wouldn't have fallen for the second." As the old adage says, "your wife is talking out of both sides of her mouth."

As someone earlier recommended, leave her to babysit the kids and you go out. Go get a good haircut (maybe even styled), buy some new "cool" clothes and some expensive cologne. Dress and leave. As you are departing tell her you will be back "sometime" and not to wait up. Then go out and have some fun for yourself. Remember, she has been screwing some other man for the past year and a half. Something BS forgets. The BS is in the same marriage as the WS. If she felt neglected it stands to reason the BS wasn't getting any attention from the WS either. You had a stressful year. How supportive was she? How many times did she tell you she needed your attention? You need to go out and do something for yourself. Don't go home early. Stay out all night. Come back home with a smile on your face (even if it has to be fake). I am retired military so I'm going to give you some advice on military strategy. "You can't win a battle fighting from a weak position." Every time you let her get to you, in some way, you grow weaker. I do wish you well.

posts: 713   ·   registered: Jan. 30th, 2016   ·   location: NC
id 8491640
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faithfulman ( member #66002) posted at 6:05 AM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

TheLostOne2020,

Therapy is not doing your wife any good because a) the therapist is giving shitty advice like "you both should go to marriage counseling", and b) no therapist or therapy is going to help if your wife is lying during her sessions, spinning tales about your marriage, her motivations, and actions.

Make no mistake, your wife is the therapist's client, not you or your marriage. The therapist's goal is to help your wife.

Not to mention there are a ton of crappy therapists out there.

The only way your wife improves from therapy or anything else, is if she is personally committed to truth and taking full responsibility her behavior.

It does not sound like your wife is "there".

I don't say this to bring you down but to temper your expectations. Too often I see therapy offered as this remedy for cheater mindset.

Read around and you'll see a lot of bad, wrong, and downright immoral advice that therapists give to cheaters.

***

Right now you can only depend on you. You must take control.

First order of business is to draw the line with your wife and if possible, destroy her relationship with the shithead.

[This message edited by faithfulman at 12:08 AM, January 5th (Sunday)]

posts: 960   ·   registered: Aug. 28th, 2018
id 8491647
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Buffer ( member #71664) posted at 6:44 AM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

Brother LostOne,

Take a breath in, now out. One day at a time.

You don’t have to make a call now, get everything in check.

Get legal advice from as many lawyers so you have a good handle on your responsibility’s as well as your rights. Then choose one that you are comfortable with, remember they will be working for your best interest, not the cheapest one, who will look at the easiest way. Then decide what other information do you think you need to know to make a call.

It doesn’t have to be made by Monday. Until then keep up or start the 180, now, look after your self as well as the children they are your priority not WW. Drink water, exercise even if it is just a walk in the park with the children daily. Talk to the trees they are good at listening.

At the end of the day WW has to be made accountable as well as responsible for her conscious decisions for taking a lover. Choosing him over her family.

She has to be NC, not a slow weening process.

Just because she can see herself growing old with you doesn’t mean you have to as well. It is your decision not hers. Will you feel safe with her.

Look at what life will be like in say 5 to 10 years from now.

The truth will set you free.

Buffer

[This message edited by Buffer at 12:47 AM, January 5th (Sunday)]

Buffer

posts: 1318   ·   registered: Sep. 24th, 2019   ·   location: Australia
id 8491653
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SnowToArmPits ( member #50943) posted at 9:43 AM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

I got her to talk to people (family) and she finally claimed to have seen the light. She'd cut contact & we'd work on us.

I believed her & for a bit it was good, but she was secretly sabotaging us by continuing to talk to him. That corroded our relationship. I was too blind to see it, but subconsciously I wasn't. It may not have been the only factor, but it contributed to my depression. Then she started having sex with him and became extremely distant.

She blamed me. When the reality was that she'd slit our relationship's wrists and let it bleed out. Making me believe I was in the wrong.

Hi OP, great start to the new year for you. Sorry man.

Your story is very typical of the cheating stories posted here. What's good about that is the posters here are experienced advising someone just like you how to navigate out of their infidelity. These people have been where you are and have helped many others. Listen to them.

Get busy mate, no one's going to you out of infidelity except you. For your own sanity and for your kids sake you need to be the adult here and address this.

[This message edited by SnowToArmPits at 3:44 AM, January 5th (Sunday)]

posts: 531   ·   registered: Dec. 25th, 2015   ·   location: Canada
id 8491665
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Buster123 ( member #65551) posted at 4:13 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

She’s getting counseling, says she won’t see him, and acknowledges that she has to break it off. That buys me some time I think. What do I want?

Why are you allowing this ? she does NOT need time to break it off, all it should take is a simple text to go NC FOREVER (done in front of you), it should only take 10 seconds, something like this:

"Don't ever contact me again I've made the decision to work on my M, if you try to contact me I will tell my H and pursue legal action and/or file a restraining order against you".

That should be it, it shouldn't take days or weeks, right now you're allowing her to take her sweet time to end it with her boyfriend, if she refuses to do it TODAY then you simply tell her your filing for D, again D takes a long time and can be stopped if she comes around and ends her A, shows true remorse and commits to NC FOREVER with OM and full transparency.

You seem afraid to EXPOSE her A with ALL family and close friends, right now she has not had any any consequences for her huge betrayal so she doesn't have any reason to change a thing, FULL EXPOSURE is the most effective thing to end an A, it must be done without warning, something like:

"Dear family member/friend I recently discovered that my WW has been having a A for a long time with POSOM (name him), the A is still ongoing, this is a difficult time for me and our family and I hope I can count on you for support during this horrible situation".

FULL EXPOSURE should only take a few phone calls and/or texts, start with immediate family on both sides, then with close friends, do it TODAY and of course without warning for maximum impact.

posts: 2738   ·   registered: Jul. 22nd, 2018
id 8491757
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HarryD ( member #72423) posted at 5:49 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

Your wife is playing spreadsheets in her mind.

With you she has a house,kids, vacation, food, She has relationship with your friends and family.

With AP better sex. Send Is always better in a affair. At the beginning. Buy AP knows she a cheater, she knows he a cheater. May not have money to live she living now

She rather be with you and have AP on the side ,

She has to break it off with AP before you can go forward. It you want to. Some people can not accept that there SO had a sexual relationship. That for you to decide

posts: 126   ·   registered: Dec. 30th, 2019   ·   location: NY
id 8491799
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sisoon ( Moderator #31240) posted at 6:59 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

MC helped us a lot, because our MC (who was my W's IC) confronted my W relentlessly, demanded honesty (from both of us), and and did everything else that I can think of to keep my W fully aware we were there because she cheated.

That seems to be rare.

Your W cheated because of her issues. She's the only one who can resolve her issues. If she needs help, she needs IC.

*****

A minimum of $10K for a D sounds about right for many urban areas.

If it frees you from an awful life, it's well worth it.

*****

Yup. You have a lot of power here. It may be scary at first, but it's actually the source of your recovery.

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex apDDay - 12/22/2010Recover'd and R'edYou don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 31129   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8491826
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Mizzbak ( member #64330) posted at 9:00 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

A big help for me was realizing that I didn't have to do anything that I didn't want to do. I didn't have to justify it or explain it to my WS. It's too easy to get sucked into reluctant participation in a frantic "R" effort, a carryover sense of commitment that is frankly no longer appropriate - once you have a WS. If you don't want to talk to your wife then say (politely) no thank you, not now. If you aren't interested in going to therapy, then "No thank you, not now". If you feel like you need space(mental, physical or emotional) to make decisions, then take it. If you need to see lawyers to explore your options, then do that.

I told my husband (we are now well into R) "The general advice is not to make a critical, long term decision after D-Day until things have settled a bit. I don't know if I want to stay married. I'm taking the next x months to decide what I want. I'll let you know how I feel then. You need to do what you need to do." It freaked him out more than any guilt trip or hysterical accusation session could have. Losing "control of the situation" is good for a WS. Realizing that you have some is very good for a BS. (Postscript/ edit - this last paragraph was not a single, coherent, calm conversation. I wish! But it is pretty much the gist of what was most effective.)

I think that's what the 180 is really about - realizing that the relationship is no longer in effect. All bets are off. Sure, if you want to talk (or got to therapy, or read a self-help book etc.), then do so. But don't get conned into picking up the end of a rope out of some sense of obligation, when your WS let go of their end a long time ago.

“I have learned now that while those who speak about one's miseries usually hurt, those who keep silence hurt more.” ― C.S. Lewis

posts: 137   ·   registered: Jul. 2nd, 2018   ·   location: Canada
id 8491859
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 TheLostOne2020 (original poster member #72463) posted at 10:20 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

New info:

I’ve talked with her less. No real texts about this stuff. I’m also going to just stop talking to her about non essential items.

I went to a lawyer and IF we separate amicably (which is a possibility) then it’s not going to be terrible, financially speaking.

I told my ‘wife’ this and she seemed generally agreeable. She wanted to talk more, I didn’t. I went to a room and shot off a text to her aunt - one of her closest family members.

She came up wanting to talk a bit - about telling the kids, I said that we can wait until Friday as long as they know we’re fighting. I’m not sure I can handle doing that right now. After I said we could wait until Friday she wanted to talk and I said that I was done talking, I can’t handle it because it’s false hope. She was trying to explain her reasoning for delaying.

I just don’t care. I don’t want to talk about it with her anymore.

posts: 904   ·   registered: Jan. 3rd, 2020
id 8491876
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faithfulman ( member #66002) posted at 10:32 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

New info:

I’ve talked with her less. No real texts about this stuff. I’m also going to just stop talking to her about non essential items.

I went to a lawyer and IF we separate amicably (which is a possibility) then it’s not going to be terrible, financially speaking.

I told my ‘wife’ this and she seemed generally agreeable. She wanted to talk more, I didn’t. I went to a room and shot off a text to her aunt - one of her closest family members.

She came up wanting to talk a bit - about telling the kids, I said that we can wait until Friday as long as they know we’re fighting. I’m not sure I can handle doing that right now. After I said we could wait until Friday she wanted to talk and I said that I was done talking, I can’t handle it because it’s false hope. She was trying to explain her reasoning for delaying.

I just don’t care. I don’t want to talk about it with her anymore.

You have switched up the power dynamic. She was under the impression she could fuck her boyfriend over in his place by the casino and keep you around for her "future".

You just pulled the rug from under that, and now she is in "oh shit!" mode.

She doesn't want to be made out to be a villain or a loose immoral woman even though she has become both of these things.

She also realizes this douche doesn't want anything from her except her orifices.

You are way ahead of just about everyone with regard to how you are handling this.

The real question you have to ask yourself now is after she has lied to you, betrayed you and your vows, fucked this guy and done god knows what sexual acts with him - do you even truly want her back?

I always say it's easy to break up with other people's spouses on the internet, but in real life, it's much harder to sever yourself from the person you pledged your heart to.

So take your time. But in the meantime, I would limit the discussion if you can. If she wants to communicate all of a sudden, she can write out a timeline where she confesses in detail how she came to allow herself to betray you, how many times she met with this man, what she did with him in whatever level of detail you desire to know, what she said to you about him and she can also turn over all of her communications she had with him to you.

But I don't see the purpose of a "discussion" as in "how did we get here" because it ain't about "we", it's about "she".

[This message edited by faithfulman at 4:34 PM, January 5th (Sunday)]

posts: 960   ·   registered: Aug. 28th, 2018
id 8491879
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Buster123 ( member #65551) posted at 10:54 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

I went to a room and shot off a text to her aunt - one of her closest family members.

Did you EXPOSE her with this aunt ? if so now finish the job and EXPOSE her huge betrayal with everyone else on both sides of the family, as well as close friends. Did you ask her to text POSOM an NC FOREVER text in front of you ? if not why not ? this is a crucial step if you're still considering R or want to keep it as a viable option.

I went to a lawyer and IF we separate amicably (which is a possibility) then it’s not going to be terrible, financially speaking.

I told my ‘wife’ this and she seemed generally agreeable. She wanted to talk more, I didn’t.

It sounds like your WW has been contemplating D for a while, ask her point blank, do you want to D ? if her answer is anything but a resounding NO, then proceed to file and consider the M done, if she answers no, tell her she's got 10 seconds to end it with POSOM right there in front of you, if she refuses to do it, tell her you won't allow her to see/talk or have any contact with POSOM as your wife and that you will file for D immediately. Take action and take firm steps to get out of infidelity one way or another.

posts: 2738   ·   registered: Jul. 22nd, 2018
id 8491886
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 TheLostOne2020 (original poster member #72463) posted at 11:14 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

Did you EXPOSE her with this aunt ? if so now finish the job and EXPOSE her huge betrayal with everyone else on both sides of the family, as well as close friends. Did you ask her to text POSOM an NC FOREVER text in front of you ? if not why not ? this is a crucial step if you're still considering R or want to keep it as a viable option.

I don’t know, I feel like I said too much, this is what I texted (a few details changed):

Hi Aunt Type person,

I have been resisting doing this. I’m sorry - everything I’m reading, every professional I’ve seen, and the lawyer I’ve talked to has said that I should make at least one person that Da Wife knows and loves aware of this. I resist because I had hope, I don’t want to embarrass her or myself, but it’s false hope & the sooner I rip the bandage off the better. They tell me she is gone and that there is no hope in reconciliation with her. Her words are just words and her attempts to get me to wait for her on her time are simple manipulations (not deliberate!) that cheating spouses do. By taking this step I’m admitting it.

I know we haven’t talked much. I’m sure you have had your issues and I know I have mine. I’ve been depressed this last year & my relationship with Da Wife has been bad. For the past few months I’ve been trying to reconnect with her, but she’s been distant.

I found out on January 1st that she never quit talking to Affair Partner. She’s been betraying me for something like 4 years now. In the last year & a half she’s been cheating on me, unprotected, and potentially compromising my health & potentially getting pregnant. I know that’s TMI, but I’m struggling. I found out that she’s been turning me down because she wants to be faithful for him.

So I caught her on January first and she came clean. She says she loves him and she says she knows she has to stop (she’s talked to a therapist) but she continues to reach out to him (always her to him). She will not cut contact or attempt to reconcile. She wants to see if her & I can work on our relationship while she continues with him I think. She doesn’t really understand why she needs to break up with him and cut contact. In fact she says she doesn’t believe she can - he’s like a drug (to quote) and she doesn’t believe that it’s the excitement of the affair, the secrecy the ‘wrongness’ and the fact that it’s not real - it’s an escape.

So it’s clear to me that this is the end. I need to prepare myself for the inevitable. She wants me to wait until she sees another therapist on Tuesday - in which she’s going to try to see if there’s a possibility for her to be happy with me if she leaves the affair or something. She doesn’t realize the fog she’s in. But she truly doesn’t value our marriage and won’t.

I told her that her and I were not in a relationship (because I’ve been essentially fired as her husband) and that means I have to look out for myself and do what’s best for me.

Also, and I know this sounds petty, but if I recall correctly his birthday is in May, mine is in July. She got him a present and she was still telling me that she’d take the family out to Baltimore Aquarium for my birthday into December. That never happened. I don’t really give a shit about presents, it’s just the principle of the thing - where her priorities are.

This sucks and I’m sorry to lay this all out on you. You’ve always been a good person. I didn’t want to send this but I have to. It’s one Of the hardest things I’ve ever done.

I’m not sure if that’s too much or too little.

posts: 904   ·   registered: Jan. 3rd, 2020
id 8491890
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 TheLostOne2020 (original poster member #72463) posted at 11:18 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

Sorry, your other questions: I asked her to FaceTime him and break it off. She wasn’t ready yet.

She has said she doesn’t want a divorce, but she said she didn’t know if she could stay away from him. She says a lot of shit.

posts: 904   ·   registered: Jan. 3rd, 2020
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goalong ( member #57352) posted at 11:21 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

know that it is not easy for you to take any steps regarding the emotional connection. But I think you are taking steps in the right direction because of her taking you for granted even after you gave her more chances. Then after the second indiscretion she is acting like nothing serious happened and there is little or no remorse.

She wants keep the status as it is and use you as the utility.

The more concrete steps you take the more she will show/pretend that she is ending it with OM because she no longer can have both ways. I think OM is a player and she is worried about his longer commitment. Otherwise she will be with him right away. So far she has not shown to you any emotional connection just like she may done during the past months.

Although it is difficult now detaching from someone who does not care about you may be good for you in the long run

looks like she is feeling some guilt. Use it to do a uncontested D (since it looks like she is emotionally attached to the OM). So do not antagonize her by taking steps like informing everyone.

[This message edited by goalong at 5:42 PM, January 5th (Sunday)]

posts: 819   ·   registered: Feb. 9th, 2017   ·   location: USA
id 8491893
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 TheLostOne2020 (original poster member #72463) posted at 11:29 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

He is a player and a liar. He cheated on her in high school. I think it’s why they broke up. He’s cheated on multiple girlfriends, he told her he didn’t consider it cheating because they were already ‘emotionally broken up’. He admitted that her was all about the chase ‘when he was younger’, but now, with her, it’s about the emotional connection she has with him. He’s ready to settle down.

....

So... um.... yeah.

He also doesn’t have a job (but expects an offer letter supposedly) and was kicked out of the military because he didn’t pass one of the psych tests - his excuse was that he ‘put down what he thought they wanted to hear’.

Clearly the top 1 percent of great people and high achievers.

posts: 904   ·   registered: Jan. 3rd, 2020
id 8491897
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ramius ( member #44750) posted at 11:33 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

She sounds like a delight.

Do you really want to spend the rest of your life with a fence sitter like her?

Let’s say by some miracle she pulls her head out of her ass and “breaks up” with her lover. (Sounds like the plot to a shitty RomCom). How can you ever trust her again?

How many scars have you rationalized because you loved the person who was holding the knife?

Their actions reveal their intentions. Their words conceal them.

posts: 1656   ·   registered: Sep. 3rd, 2014
id 8491901
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 TheLostOne2020 (original poster member #72463) posted at 11:44 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

You have switched up the power dynamic. She was under the impression she could fuck her boyfriend over in his place by the casino and keep you around for her "future".

You just pulled the rug from under that, and now she is in "oh shit!" mode.

It doesn’t feel like this. It feels like I’ve accepted that it’s over. I’m sure that I’ll fluctuate and I still have a lot of pain.

She doesn't want to be made out to be a villain or a loose immoral woman even though she has become both of these things.

That’s true.

She also realizes this douche doesn't want anything from her except her orifices.

I don’t think she realizes this.

You are way ahead of just about everyone with regard to how you are handling this.

It doesn’t feel like it; I just feel tired.

The real question you have to ask yourself now is after she has lied to you, betrayed you and your vows, fucked this guy and done god knows what sexual acts with him - do you even truly want her back?

Right now? No. Where I’ll be in a few days? I don’t know.

I always say it's easy to break up with other people's spouses on the internet, but in real life, it's much harder to sever yourself from the person you pledged your heart to.

Yes true. This is one of the hardest things I’ve ever done. Oddly even though I’m exhausted, I feel ‘awake’ and alive with all the pain.

So take your time. But in the meantime, I would limit the discussion if you can. If she wants to communicate all of a sudden, she can write out a timeline where she confesses in detail how she came to allow herself to betray you, how many times she met with this man, what she did with him in whatever level of detail you desire to know, what she said to you about him and she can also turn over all of her communications she had with him to you.

She deleted the conversations. That said, right now I don’t want to talk or anything.

But I don't see the purpose of a "discussion" as in "how did we get here" because it ain't about "we", it's about "she".

I agree - she mostly talks about how she’s weak and needs help. I then spend an hour going over shit with her. I’m done. I’m too tired.

posts: 904   ·   registered: Jan. 3rd, 2020
id 8491906
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beenthereinco ( member #56409) posted at 11:58 PM on Sunday, January 5th, 2020

I'm sorry. Take it easy on yourself. I know its exhausting. The reality is that right now it is all on her and she needs to put forth the effort. She won't do it which is why it is making you so tired. You're working and it has no effect.

posts: 1429   ·   registered: Dec. 13th, 2016
id 8491908
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