SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

(Duplicate Post Removed)

[This message edited by Stevesn at 12:32 PM, Thursday, May 2nd]

Hi minicheddars,

I am sorry you had a reason to look for this forum.

To me, it seems like your wife is totally gaslighting you, as painful as it is to accept that.

While you doubt the veracity of her version of events, a more obvious question would be this: is it likely that a hotel receptionist that you have never met, with no 'dog in the race', would make up a story like that, recount details, and offer to show you CCTV footage if it was not true?

That's one for your wife to consider too, though in her current mode of gaslighting, she would probably say something along the lines of, "How should I know? Maybe he's nuts".

It seems likely that you are going to find the uncertainty intolerable, so as painful as it may be, I think you would be better to go and look at the CCTV footage as soon as possible, before it gets deleted.

Our thoughts are with you. People here have gone through their own versions of the same story, and we are here to listen if you just need to talk or vent.

OP, its devastating to know someone you love could have so little regard for you. The cheating is bad, but the unabashed lying to your face takes a different type of person altogether; almost sociopathic. I don't see how you can go on like this, so the sooner you bring this to a conclusion the better. View the videos, as its probably the only way you can get the proof you understandably are desperate to have. If the videos confirm what you, in your heart, know to be true, I just don't see how you could stay in a marriage with this level of deceit. In any event stay strong and make the effort to get the closure you seek.

That's the problem, I need her with me to see the CCTV.
I asked her to come with me, to be told something along the lines of 'that is disgusting that you'd even ask me to do something like that'.

I told her I would move mountains to prove my innocence if our roles were reversed.

The counselling I have reached out to, she needs to call them, a quick call to confirm her details etc. She's had 6 hours to do it since she got out of bed, she hasn't called them yet. She's in the living room watching TV and on her phone.

I know she has her own mental health issues, but she needs to understand how serious this situation is. I've told her how serious I feel that it is.

I'm going to make a very important recommendation.

When my wife stepped out behind my back, I considered asking the bar to see their CCTV footage, but I waited. I wanted to try to figure some things out first, and I resisted the urge. But finally I did want to see it, and I called to ask. It overwrites every 30 days, and I had missed the window. I'll never know what was on the camera.

Find out if there's a way the motel could preserve the footage. Maybe an attorney could subpoena it so it doesn't get overwritten?

Unfortunately I am in the UK, things here are not the same as the US.
My options are the police or solicitor, I doubt either would be remotely interested as no crime has been committed.

I am simply sat here going out of my mind, believing that my wife has cheated on me, but desperate to be proven wrong. She cannot prove anything and doesn't seem interested at all in going out of her way to do so.

I think that with her own issues, I think she is currently burying her head, hoping this will all go away, brush it under the carpet etc.

OP, maybe I'm missing something here but why must your wife accompany you to view the CCTV videos? I get that it would be better to put the evidence in front of her face with you standing next to her, but short of that wouldn't viewing them on your own provide the proof you seek? You could then make decisions for yourself based on reality rather than just suspecting. I don't understand the reluctance here.

The problem is you're negotiating. Why?

You saw where her car was, people seen her, you added 1+1 but are being told 5, why?

Stop the game playing and negotiating, you're both too old for the "yes you did, no I didn't" spiel.

You're either angry enough to enact real consequences for your wife sleeping with another man, or continue to do the doesy doe forever.

I am in the UK, I cannot simply ask to see their CCTV. We have something here called GDPR.
My wife can ask to see the CCTV of herself.

The hotel did tell me they would show the CCTV if my wife returned with me. My wife is key here.
However, her reluctance to go to the hotel with me logically tells me that she has something to hide.

The other 4 people that she was with. She's already told me there are no photos or videos from the evening.
OK, might be a bit embarrassing, if they don't know already, tell them what has happened and somehow prove they were there together.
To save your marriage, there must be text messages, evidence of buying a drink on a bank card or something.

Alternatively, she cheated and she cannot prove anything...

OK thanks for the clarification. However with that in mind, you'll likely need to draw a line in the sand and take unilateral action. Certainly if you let her control the narrative, you won't get the resolution you seek. Its clear reasoning and negotiating with her is fruitless. You can't control her but you can control you!

Minic

I’m a former cop and as such have some training in investigative methods. I tend to be the voice of doubt and calm on situations where posters come with unclear situations and ask if there is infidelity.

Like... If someone shares that their wife claimed to have worked extra hours last Friday evening and was looking a lot at her phone next Saturday morning... I’m not on the she-has-definitely-got-to-be-cheating wagon. I tend to suggest you research more, look for more and keep an open mind. I try to remind posters to search for the TRUTH rather than a foregone conclusion.
I would suggest you look for the truth, rather than look to prove she’s been cheating.

Only... I think we have the truth...
Remember: This isn’t a court-of-law. There is only ONE person you need to convince, and that’s you. You don’t have to prove to your wife she’s cheating, nor do you need to prove to an attorney, your family or anyone else. It’s ONLY you.
If you are wrong... well... it could be on her to prove that.

But friend – lets go over what you know and some of the questions that raises with me...

She’s been going out and spending the night on several occasions in the last months. You consider them "different" but that’s maybe because you haven’t had cause to consider them anything else.
A night at a cheap motel a "winning" at a lottery? Woohoo! What a prize...
Two night with same "friend" – what is it with this friend and winning freebee nights at a cheap motel?
These night out... they aren’t further away from your home that you drive there in the morning and/or to work (as she intended). What’s the buzz about spending night-out with her "friends"?
Look – My wife has gone on spa-weekends with her friends. But it’s the spa-experience they are after, not the mini-bar, expensive sandwiches in the lobby or the lumpy beds. Plus it tends to be some time away... Might have some drinks and all that, but it’s not a "let’s get a room and get hammered" type of thing.

I’m not putting too much value on the not-texting aspect. I do think couples can spend time apart without constant hourly updates and coos and ahhs. It’s a different pattern than before, but even if she was having an affair the second or third night away she could text while courting. Not putting any value on either having texted or not texting.
You visibly confirmed that 3 of 4 rooms were vacant.
You technically confirmed that her phone was in the one occupied room.
I have had strange knocks at my hotel-door(s) over the years. I don’t ignore them – I look through the peep-hole and/or ask through the door what they want. In your case it’s silence, and then the occupant (a single male according to what you are expected to believe) tells the manager that THEY are ready to leave. Now – why is this single male talking plural, and why isn’t he even willing to open the door with the manager at the door with you?
The manager offered that there was a man in there and that your wife had been seen going to that room.

Your wife states she was having breakfast in an area visible from the lobby. The same lobby you and the manager and staff who recognized your wife had been in and yet none had seen her, nor she noticed you.
The staff clearly recognized her – knew it was the same woman that entered the room she denies she was in directly from her car, was at the bar with the resident of the room...
They also say she didn’t have breakfast (most hotels have you sign off on your room, even if the brekkie is included), and she was watching a tv channel the hotel doesn’t have...

She staid in a different room. Yet there is no way she can confirm that. Her friend who won the raffle "prize"... can she confirm it?
The hotel manager (who btw was risking his job for you...) confirmed that the room she says she was in was not booked that night.
He also confirmed she WAS in the room with the strange man.

Her phone was in the room the schizophrenic and scared man was in... (schizophrenia maybe the only logical reason for him speaking of himself in the plural...)

there is no way she'd show me her phone or bank statement.
So she can support her story, but she won’t offer the evidence needed...

2020 she was caught with another man. Best indicator for future behavior being past behavior...
You don’t need the CCTV and you are correct that you won’t get it. But do you really need it? Even if it confirms everything the manager who has NO HORSE in this race is true, would that convince you? Or would you be getting some "I went into the wrong room, and you cant see me leave until next morning because I climbed over the balconies to get to my room" and believing that too?

Friend – I started this thread reminding you this is not a court of law and stating that I tend to be the voice of doubt. But friend.... WHAT DO YOU NEED? Short of catching her in action with the OM I don’t really see what more you need and want.
I honestly see NO DOUBT in what you share. I suggested you look for the truth, rather than look to prove she’s been cheating. I think you have maybe gone the other way, and are looking for anything – ANYTHING – to even remotely support your hope that she hasn’t been cheating.

It is natural to want to believe your wife. To want her not to have cheated. But all the facts line up. She cheated, it's clear. In fact, imo you have much more hard proof than many people get here.

So act like she cheated because you know she did. All the tools are here at SI for how to proceed. The other key is she is lying to you. Maybe you go straight to D, maybe not. Quite a few people can R from infidelity but can you R with continued lying about what happened? The experience here says no, not successfully at least. She needs to understand that the marriage is 100% at stake. Continued gaslighting means D. Sharing the truth means there might be a chance for R, but there are no guarantees.

You have to be willing to lose the marriage to save it. You have to be firm with your needs. Practice the 180, be clear to her what is at stake and when you say it, mean it.

As Bigger mentioned (lovely and well-reasoned recap btw) she has also been staying out with "friends" recently more than just this one night.
I feel the first time she was texting you all night to keep suspicions at bay.
This last time she was more relaxed and less worried about you becoming suspicious.
She's cheated on you in the past (with her friend's partner no less!) and is cheating on you now.
I know you want to believe her but she's lying to you. She won't go to the hotel because she's waiting for them to overwrite the tape. She will never go there because she knows she will be busted.
Stay with her if you must, but just know that a snake's nature will not change.

CCTV is usually set to self delete, sometimes as soon as 24hours later if not saved. Ask the motel to save the CCTV so that you can come in later to view it, so it doesn’t become lost. You can tell them it is to preserve evidence for a future matrimonial proceeding.

[This message edited by straightup at 9:02 PM, Thursday, May 2nd]

Yeah, you are getting lied to. Also, she is just going full DARVO (Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender). Your example on the CCTV exchange is textbook DARVO.

In short, right now your wife is your enemy. She isn't safe and you are in an informational war with her right now. She is denying you any real information.

She is treating you like a mushroom. Keeping you in the dark and feeding you bullshit.

For me it's simple. No kids? Cut your losses. Let some other guy deal with her stupid behavior. Reconciliation will depend on how much of a "caveman" you are about knowing some other guy was prancing around in *there*. My wife's affair was in 2006 and I still wake up at night thinking about it. I stayed because we have a disabled son. Not sure if it was the right choice in retrospect. Had there been no kids, I would have been like Fred Flintstone when he picks up his car and does a burnout with his feet as he takes off down the road.

Gently, you are in denial.

You already have all the proof you need.

You don't need marriage counseling. The marriage isn't broken, she is.

She's cheated before, she's cheating again, she has shown you who she is, please believe her.

You don’t need proof or any further proof. You have all the facts you need.

Her gaslighting and stonewalling you is evidence that she’s doing everything possible to make you believe YOU are the problem.

That Manipulative behavior is what liars and cheaters do to deflect your focus away from them and pull the conversation or situation in a different direction.

Typical cheater behavior:

Lie and lie and lie about cheating

Play the "proof" Game- meaning you need to prove they cheated when you know and the cheater knows the truth

Focus on your words to steer the conversation away from the real issue - the cheating. If you say "I don’t believe your story" they will go off on a tangent about why you don’t believe them and you have trust issues and blah blah blah suddenly they are talking about YOU and your faults, not the cheating

Continue to say "nothing happened" without doing anything to prove it.

I hope this helps you see what you are really dealing with.

I am sorry you are here - as far as where you are in this situation I think Bigger's recap needs no further additions. He is correct (as are you).

I am going to suggest something that I (and many others here) wish they had done sooner in their infidelity journey: Make plans to separate - NOT because you are going to and not because I am even suggesting you do that. Do it because in the event you decide that is the path you want to take you already have it laid out before you. I did not do this at d-day 1. Only a year later at d-day 2 (the discovery that the cheating had never stopped from when I first found out) did I decide that I was time for me to get out...but I was not in the position to do so and it took me a long time to do it, partially because of my financial and job situation and then because of COVID lockdown. In my case, had I started planning my future with a focus on me at d-day 1, when d-day 2 came along I would have been ready to leave on my terms. As it turned out it took me the better part of a year to get my house in order and right when I was about to leave COVID came along and I had to stay put for another year. Ugh.

This is my advice to anyone who gets married, infidelity or not. Life is uncertain. As my signature line indicates: the only person you are guaranteed to spend the rest of your life with is you. Start thinking about what you would need to do in order to be on your own and get those things organized, with the focus being on you. You can control how you proceed - you cannot control how your WS has or will behave. I know - I tried to control the outcome. I, despite being one of the rarer people on here whose WS, when caught, confessed easily and pretty much told the truth about his affair, still wanted to try to work things out. In hindsight I don't know what I was thinking or why I wasn't just filled with anger immediately - but like most people, my actions/reactions were not what I thought they would be when faced with infidelity. So don't worry about your conflicting feelings. Take some control over your life - it's there for the taking.

What I'm getting at is your WS has proven herself - 100% for sure in the past - that she is untrustworthy. And what she has proven now is that she will not help to make you feel better about something. Say she is telling the truth, but will not happily show you bank statements or whatever else you think might help clear this up. You cannot trust her to look out for your best interests. As such, you should act accordingly. If you told her you were leaving would she try drain bank accounts? IDK. My WS did not do that BUT we owned property together and he was a bit of a jerk (for a short period) about how we were going to address those things....and all that happened while he was claiming the A was over, that I was paranoid and could not "get over it", but when the A was actually still going strong. In other words - he looked me in the eye and lied to my face and tried to blame me for the state of our shitty marriage, over and over and over again.

You will feel better if you take some action to protect yourself. I promise.

She cheated on you man. Stevie Wonder can see that. You have so many things that line up to prove it that amounts to almost DNA like proof for you. And this is just one event.

She seems pretty good and comfortable lying to your face. An innocent person would have no problem going to look at the CCTV footage to prove their innocence. Especially if they love you and want to put your mind at ease.

Instead she is gaslighting you because she is cheating on you and she knows that the CCTV footage will prove it. She is a liar to you and a liar to the other guy. Even he said that she told him she was separated.

Sorry you are here and she is doing this to you. How many other times do you not know about? No one should have to live like this being a policeman checking up on their cheating wife.

I know you don't want to believe it. It takes time for your heart to catch up with what your mind already knows. Time to get tough. It sucks. But you know what sucks worse? Tolerating it. Do not tolerate any of it. All of her activity and behavior and excuses and lies and treatment of you has been entirely unacceptable.