SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

It's been about 3 months since I found out about the affair. I've been married for almost 2 years, been together for almost 6. We have a 2 yo daughter.

I never suspected a thing because he's always been the jealous type with me and I liked how much he wanted me all to himself. We have our own friends and both prioritize having some privacy. I found out when I had my daughter with me in the computer room and had to keep her playing on his. I went to go shut his down and he had messages open with one of his friends. They were explicit messages about what they would do to each other sexually and I saw call logs that I found out were them masturbating together. This had been going on for a little over 2 months.

When I confronted him, he said he never intended on telling me because he didn't think it would go on for so long. He said he had a hard time feeling like it was cheating because it was just online. For him it just felt like porn. But you'd think calling her would make it sink in that it was, but I guess not. He insisted that he only used her for attention and serotonin because he was stressed at work. Which he had been, he was miserable. I didn't know how to help him and it was taking a toll on me as well.

It had been over a year since he gave me any sexual attention, and when I tried he just said he felt pressured. He had been having a lot of problems with self esteem and feeling sexy. It was different with her because they weren't together or in the same room. But he told me that he just liked that someone was interested in him like that but he very much prefers what we have and the intimacy we share.

We've talked very extensively about all this and saw a counselor together. Now I'm doing counseling on my own.

I still have a lot of anxiety and pain. I feel obsessed. I even dream about it sometimes. He said he would break contact with her if I wanted and I told him I wasn't going to make him do that partially because I was curious to see if it would happen again and also because I figured that after seeing my pain he wouldn't want to speak to her anymore. Well, that wasn't true and they continued talking. I told him I wouldn't read his messages. I don't like being that person who invades their partners privacy even after something like this. Part of me wanted him to feel comfortable so I could test him. Not the healthiest on my part. I've been checking his messages with her still and haven't told him. I've tried to stop, but I just have so much fear.

They haven't crossed the line, but I think there's been things that could be considered light flirting. I eventually opened up that I really didn't like them talking and I only said he didn't need to cut her off because I didn't want to force him and because I wanted him make that decision on his own. He said he hadn't because he doesn't like when people don't like him and he didn't want to draw attention in their group. But he promised that conversations would be less and less and she wouldn't pop up anymore. I've noticed that he closes out their messages, not deletes I can still see them, but just so I don't see her name when I glance over at his message history.

Their last messages were from 2 days ago, just telling each other that they're awesome. I broke down again and felt like I wanted to leave him. I already have enough trust issues and anxiety without knowing they talk to each other still. I just don't understand with how much I've told him about the pain and stress I feel why he would still want to talk to her. I guess because he thinks I don't know and it isn't hurting me. It would be better if I just didn't check but I can't help myself. Every time I hear him typing I think he's talking to her. When I go to bed and he's still in the computer room I can't sleep worrying they're talking.

But just reading some posts on this forum has helped me a lot knowing that my feelings and anxiety are justified still. I'm really glad I found this place and have people to talk to who understand.

Gonna say this now. All his reasoning is bullshit. As long as he has no consequences, he won’t feel the need to stop talking to her, as proven that he just hides the messages now.

And as long as he still talks to her, you can’t work on this marriage alone.

[This message edited by Forks027 at 5:04 PM, Monday, May 23rd]

This behavior is so out of control and so outrageous that I have no idea how you can stay married to him. The fact that this is painful for you and he doesn’t care tells you he really does. not. care. You need to leave yesterday. You cannot fix someone with this kind of brain. It’s out of whack.

You are jumping through hoops, making sacrifices for him, trying to make it "easy" for him. And it;s not working.
Because why would he stop doing what he is doing? He has you doing a beautiful rendition of the pick-me dance plus his side chick giving him attention. And he didn’t have to give up anything.

His reasons are immature and bullshit.
He is not remorseful. He is barely regretful.
Is he in counseling?

The huge number of people here will tell you that you need a few things to R:
Both 100% in on R
100% transparency on all devices.
100% honestly
100% NC with the AP.

This is the bare minimum.

I am sorry -this is so painful, and it’s still such early days for you. But please see that his words and his actions don’t match up.

Go see a lawyer to educate yourself on what D might look like. It really helps give you power when you can see all your options. (Don’t tell him -just do it).

Hang in there. And I am sorry he is being a jerk.

I appreciate you guys. He hasn't been in counseling by himself. I've told him he should, but he never took any action. Well, thanks to the articles and posts I've read here, I got the courage to send him a long letter putting my foot down that I was gonna start standing up for myself and not settling for less than I deserved. I said there's no way this can work if he doesn't go to counseling and start working on himself too. We'll see how it goes.

I am so sorry for you.

I’m going to respond based on my experience.

My H had a 4 year Emotional affair. He would not admit this "friendship " was an affair. In His mind no sex = no affair.

We all know how wrong that thinking is.

No remorse. No apology. No thought he was disrespectful to me. Just I’m the crazy jealous wife.

So it was easy to start the second affair b/c there were no consequences (for him) for the first affair.

I suggest you get your own counseling. Talk to your counselor in very clear terms that your H doesn’t think this is an affair 😡AND has not stopped being in contact with the OW. Also discuss the lack of sexual activity in your early stages of married life.

Google the term Affair fog. It will explain so much and help you understand the cheater’s mindset.

He’s openly cheating on you and is forcing you to accept it. I suggest you have an exit plan or plan B ready to go just in case. Because if he continues to interact with the OW and refuses to end the contact, then you may not have any other choice but to separate.

And if he refuses to stop cheating then he’s put your marriage and you and your family second to his needs and WANTS. That makes him even more selfish.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 11:43 PM, Monday, May 23rd]

PS. He knows this is wrong. Otherwise he would not have hidden it from you.

I’m very sorry you are going through this. But I think you are starting to take positive steps. The important thing to keep in mind is that you are the prize. You deserve a partner who cherishes you and is committed to your M. He is spending time and energy he could be with you, communicating with the OW. Inexcusable. And his excuses for not initiating sex with you are bullshit.

Always value yourself. Take actions that send the message you will not be disrespected and demeaned in your M. You don’t have to be mean or nasty. Firm and decisive. Good luck.

I didn't want to force my wife to do anything either. As a result I didn't get true No Contact (NC) until a year later when I asked for a divorce in writing.

It had been over a year since he gave me any sexual attention, and when I tried he just said he felt pressured. He had been having a lot of problems with self esteem and feeling sexy. It was different with her because they weren't together or in the same room.

I'm sorry you had to join us, but glad you've found us. I hope you'll spend some time reading in The Healing Library to get started. One thing which popped to mind when you made this comment above was porn. How much porn is your WH watching? You know, there have been studies which say that too much porn and masturbation can lead to a loss of interest in in-person sex. The user becomes dependent on the pornographic stimulation and becomes so accustomed to his own touch and having it exactly the way he wants it, that he becomes less responsive to being with a partner. Add to that any feelings of anxiety, like fear of losing his erection, and interest can dramatically wane. I think you would be wise to insist that he see a therapist, preferably a CSAT (certified sexual addiction therapist).

In terms of his reticence to call this an affair.. I don't think you should tolerate that. If this was you, going behind his back and masturbating with a friend, I doubt he's be quite so sanguine. More like, he'd be wondering how long until you actually hooked up in person and whether the other guy is better at sex than he is. The problem here is that it's a secret. It's NOT privacy. Privacy is for the potty. This is saying and doing things BEHIND YOUR BACK that he would not do if you were standing next to him. That's cheating.

You've only got six years invested with this guy and I know that seems like a lot. But a cheater can keep you bamboozled your whole life, and you don't want to look back thirty years from now wondering why you didn't leave when he first started up his bullshit. So... make no apologies about insisting on the treatment you deserve and the kind of honesty you expect from a man who claims he wants to be your husband. He needs to fix this. He needs to find out what there is inside of him which is capable of saying and unqualified "YES!" to sneaking around behind your back like a thief. And if he can't (or won't) do that, you'd be wise to reconsider your future. I know that sounds really harsh, but time has a way of getting away from us, and you don't want to look back on a wasted life.

You've received some great advice.

Don't play the pick me game.

He's in the affair fog.

If he can cheat and you know and accept then win win for him.

You cannot ever let him stay in contact with her. That's like asking the fox to babysit your hens.

He is high on the affair drug and it is an addiction.

If he hasn't had six with you in over a year there may be some other stuff going on that you don't know about yet.

Rarely do they come clean right away, the usually lie or accept a loss of some truth to hide worse deeds.

You cannot trust someone in affair fog at all in any way.

I tried to talk to him about it tonight and he just said that he wouldn't and he wanted to kill himself.. which is something I've been afraid of
I'm going to try again when he's in a better headspace

If he threatens to kill himself again, call 911. If he's serious, he'll get the help he needs, and if he's manipulating you, he'll learn not to do it again. You can't be held hostage to threats of self-harm every time you need to talk. That's no way to live your life.

Suicide is extremely serious and I don't think he understands how damaging his manipulative threat is. My MIL died of suicide. My fWW struggles with depression, and she only told me well after (not as a manipulation) that she struggled with some suicidal ideation after the A but worked through it with her therapist.

You husband is "catastrophizing". "Nothing I ever do will be good enough, I might as well kill myself." This is an excuse to not do the hard work in front of him and hope you help rugsweep instead of forcing him to face up to the concequences of his actions.

I agree 100% that if you seriously believe his suicidal ideation you should consider having him voluntarily admitted to a mental health facility. Usually takes an actual attempt to be involuntarily committed.

I am so sorry that your life has been turned upside down and then completely blown up. When my WH mentioned suicide, I took him absolutely seriously and when he first said it, I said, "if you are serious, then I am going to call emergency services as I have an obligation to inform "authorities". And I was going to contact our adult kids. He backed right down as he wasn't being serious, he was just being confronted of the enormity of what he had done and that the secrets were out. If we take it seriously, then we can act or put the ownership back on the WS as to whether it is serious or some form of manipulation. Either way, this is very hard for you. There is a lot of free advice here. I have had some amazing aha moments from what people have said, research they have done. I came onto the site later and had done alot of the things the advice here says to avoid, so you are incredibly smart being on this site so early. It is an opportunity for you to set your boundaries and expectations and plan what you will do next. We can not control what our WS's will do. Do take good care of yourself. This is big and very sureal and as I found, extremely isolating. I hope you have some good support people to draw on.

He’s very manipulative.

Tell him the next time he says he’s going to kill himself you will call the police and have him committed. It’s not a joke or a game. He cannot use this to avoid facing the consequences of his bad choices.

Please try not to buy into his manipulation.. And suicide is no joke.. If he threatens it again tell him to get himself checked into the nearest psych ward for proper treatment.

And if he truly wanted to fix things he would be doing EVERYTHING he could, going NC should be a no brainer, as should counselling, the fact he refuses to do either tells you alot.

My WW refused NC, Counselling, etc and her EA soon bloomed into a full on PA, one where even after DDay it took nearly three horrific years to get her to go NC, She also threatened suicide just after DDay in what I see now as just a diversion tactic to avoid me filing or digging for the whole truth.. We are now a long way away from where we should be and although divorce is not the route, it is a much much harder path we now face to reconciliation.

[This message edited by StrugglingCJ at 9:41 AM, Tuesday, May 24th]

Thank you so much for your advice and sharing your experiences. It really baffles me how cheaters can share so many traits across the board. My H said he didn't want to do counseling just to be called a POS, and I tried to assure him that's not what they do. But this is a deal breaker for me, so if he won't go then it's time to look into D. I don't want this toxicity for me, but I especially don't want it for my daughter.

It is so hard to look at the person you love, and married, only to see such outrageous behaviors and attitudes that you wonder who they really are. The first thing to do is look reality in the face. Your H sounds like he SHOULD NOT BE MARRIED TO ANYONE. People who can’t form deep attachments are leaves that go where the wind blows. They don’t put down emotional roots. It appears that is who you married.

Be honest with yourself. Is his behavior just part of his overall attitude about life. If he can’t, or won’t, see your pain he is very selfish. That does not bode well for relationships.

Sorry, (((alittlestitious))), you found yourself in this situation....

My H said he didn't want to do counseling just to be called a POS

1. This is another excuse of his

2. He is afraid to face himself, his own character, his own weaknesses, bad judgment, addiction(s). What you can do is to write down your WH's character traits and see for yourself if they're acceptable to you. You may share the list with him

3.

"and I tried to assure him that's not what they do"

Please don't mother your WH. He needs to accept his brokenness on his own and do the hard work to fix himself IF HE WANTS it. It's not enough that you may want to change him, this won't work.
4. Request a detailed time line of his A(s). Your relationship has only been 6 years, so this should not be a big deal for your WH to remember and put everything on a piece of paper (you may ask him to include porn usage).
5. Demand NC with AP (s). Written and sent in your presence.

See where it goes. Observe his actions.

[This message edited by TruthIsPower at 2:32 PM, Tuesday, May 24th]