SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Lostgirl, thank you for that, I appreciate it!

Yet, all I see is what his wife is doing to win him back and keep the marriage. No posting about what he is doing and changing.

I've seen quite a change in the tone of Buzzy's posts. Obviously he has a long road ahead, but he doesn't come across with the same self-righteous arrogance he initially presented to all of us.

I see a man who is starting to realize the world doesn't revolve around him, and learning his vengeance only served to further complicate his pain. Yes, he first tried to glorify it. I really don't think it feels so glorious to him now as he is sobbing into his wife's lap.

Buzzy's motivations to better himself have a lot to do with seeing his wife's pain right now, and that's a start. In the end, he will only be able to fix himself for himself, but I think it's okay if he sees her as a good reason to get that process rolling.

I guess I am seeing something totally different. I will go back and reread. I really just see a bunch of posts about what his wife is doing to knock his socks off and make a better marriage. I see her being vulnerable. Not him. I just see him telling the story of his wife playing the pick me dance.

I guess I am seeing something totally different. I will go back and reread. I really just see a bunch of posts about what his wife is doing to knock his socks off and make a better marriage. I see her being vulnerable. Not him. I just see him telling the story of his wife playing the pick me dance.

I see the same thing, Zugzwang.

Buzzy, can I recommend you and your wife buy two copies of How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair: A Compact Manual for the Unfaithful by Linda J. MacDonald and read it, and then talk it over as you go through it? I think it would help both of you immensely, especially if you're both reading it at the same time.

Thank you all for your input and advice.

Every nights after the kids are in bed we seem to be having an "exploration hour" to discuss the way forward in our M.

I am beyond certain that Julie will not stray again, maybe as Zugs said she has "learnt her lesson"I don't see it in those terms all I see is a loving wife trying her best. I do however sense that she has worries (the crying in bed over the photo), I hope what I am doing is removing those doubts but who knows because she tells me all is well. So I am going to do the following:

Our home belongs to my parents, my Dad has offered to transfer it into my name on many occasions, as I am 40 in January I am going to accept his offer as a birthday present BUTit will be to both of us in joint names, the only caveat will be that neither of us can be forced to sell until the children have finished their education.

I have a legacy from my late Uncle of just over £200K this is for my kids University fees, this I will transfer to my wife, also I will suggest out separate savings and investments are combined and put in joint names.

The above will give my wife financial security.

I don't know how she will take this and I don't want her to think I am trying to buy her love and loyalty.

Your opinions please.

I also have a longer post to do but I have a client meeting later today and I need to prepare for the meeting.

I guess I am seeing something totally different.

I really don’t know what I’m seeing. This thread is so bizarre to me. We’ve gone from a RA where he has sex with his wife’s friend and tells her it’s payback time to saying what he did to her is worse than what she did to him. Now she’s doing everything to win him back (sex, tattoos, piercing) and he’s doing I don’t know what. And all in one month. It’s like one big massive rug sweep. There’s no introspection or any sense of self-realization from either of them. I haven’t see one thing of substance from Buzzy or Julie. It’s weird. It’s so superficial. Everything is reactive too. “Buzzy you have to be vulnerable.” Then he says, okay I’ll bare my soul to her. And when he posts about her checking her phone and we say she’s scared and doesn’t trust him he says he’ll leave his phone and all other electronic devices for her to see. Now we point out that it’s all about Julie doing for Buzzy and Buzzy what have you done for her, and the response is he’s giving her a huge inheritance and is joining their accounts and investments.

I don’t know what to make of all this but this thread is driving me nuts.

Now we point out that it’s all about Julie doing for Buzzy and Buzzy what have you done for her, and the response is he’s giving her a huge inheritance and is joining their accounts and investments.

I don’t know what to make of all this but this thread is driving me nuts.

It's nerve wracking for sure. Saying I've seen a change in tone was in no way saying: "Oh wow! Look at all this deep work being done!"

Buzzy seems to place an overwhelming importance on the physical. Problem is that will never get him to the introspection work he needs to do. This is where they both need to get to an IC, and actually dive deep to really get it.

Right now he's trying to fix it with "things." Just like he tried to fix his feelings about her affair with a thing. (RA)

It wasn't just a revenge affair. It was a large, extravagant affair trip. Complete with pictures. The value of things over people maybe?

[This message edited by Lostgirl410 at 9:43 AM, December 4th (Wednesday)]

T/j too... Hellfire is one smart cookie and pulls my head out of my ass in a way that knocks my socks off. Thanks girl. The best part about her is how malleable she can be. It’s not about being right or wrong with her. It’s about DOING /CHOOSING right. she sees that and holds waywards accountable. She also listens. Basically she’s a bad ass bitch with a heart of gold and velvety side that she breaks out every once in a while. And her name. I just wanna say it over and over. ‘Ahhhh hell fire!!!” Ha!

Also... buzz ya made progress. Yes there are superficial tendencies that are quite visible but if that’s how you’re raised, that’s how you are. His wife is equally superficial (or so it sounds) so the issue to me is moot.

What I mean about what is he doing for her is self introspection and change. Not about the "white-knuckle" stuff on giving up part of his inheritance and signing a house in her name too, stuff that at already good person/husband should have always been doing. About owning his faults and choosing to change.

Agree,

Right now he's trying to fix it with "things."

Something that has probably been going on as a coping mech for a long time. Probably a learned thing since childhood. That will fall short for Julie because she has already pointed out that she didn't want that anymore and sought the opposite of that out with her AP. Her AP wasn't a looker and he didn't do the "things" for her. What was she finding in him to try to make herself feel whole?

I don't think the "superficial issue" is moot because that might be most likely what is causing problems with themselves. The real self fulfillment. The real growth in being happy with themselves and loving themselves without needing it to come from others. According to him, his wife is done with the "superficial" and wants something deeper. IMO, I think the "superficial" is the driving force here. Even if it is learned. We still choose to what incorporate into our character. One can still choose to change it. To speak love languages in a different way and to show it.

Ok, I have discussed this with Julie and we are both going to separate IC but not until the end of January.

A nice touch.

Last night Julie asked me to look at a painting (watercolour) she had done, the painting was a seascape looking from a beach to the rising sun on the horizon, small birds in the sky. Across the top in script were the words:

Not me, Not you, Just us. At the bottom of the painting was the title "A bright new day"

I cried the other day and I started again, It's getting to be a habit.

The picture will hang in our bedroom to remind us of what we nearly destroyed.

I seem to be using SI as a blog almost, it helps me to think and all your input is very much appreciated, thank you.

[This message edited by Buzzy at 7:53 AM, December 6th (Friday)]

A slight thread jack here, and this is from much earlier in the thread, but it is relevant to the subject of RA’s and the alleged “motivations” for doing so.

Twicewounded wrote:

Men, in particular, get emasculated by affairs. I'm not saying it isn't crushing to BWs as well. But we even have a word for men who are BS--cuckolds. I don't think a term exists with the same power for women. It's deeply shameful and strikes at the very core of what it is to be a man. To be strong, to be tough. BHs immediately feel like we have "lost" to the AP. To all other men. We've failed. We wonder if we're really even a man, still.

No to every word of this.

None of this is true - unless you willingly want to see yourself this way for whatever inexplicable reason.

Emasculated - really?

My XWW did not define or validate my sense of masculinity and neither does your WW.

Does your wife bear and maintain the standard of what is masculine and somehow bestow that unto you when you date or marry her?

Does she null and void your sense of masculinity if she has sex with another man?

When she has slept with another man does that mean she has removed masculinity from you and bestowed this state to the other man?

Or, is she really just a weak, selfish, and esteem-bereft woman who will trade sex for cheap compliments and a false sense of value?

A cuckhold? Sure, if you are aware and feel you have no choice but to accept your wife is going to have sex with other men or you get some bizarre thrill from it.

If you do not accept your wife sleeping with other men and remove yourself from the situation the you are not by any means, a cuckhold.

As a betrayed spouse, one who has been faithful and true to their vows, there is absolutely ZERO shame. Period.

The only deep shame exists in the perverse rationalizations, the disgusting behavior, and the profound hurtful damage to children caused by the Wayward.

I did not lose anyone or anything to the AP or anyone else.

My XWW lost me, lost her marriage, lost her family, lost her integrity, and lost her children’s ability to look at her with any sense of innocence.

A betrayed spouse did not fail at all - the adulterous spouse failed horribly.

I don’t know why you would have such a lowly view of yourself as a result of your wife’s behavior.

One of the great and fundamental truths about infidelity is that your wife’s/husbands infidelity has NOTHING to do with you or your marriage.

Remember that.