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My XWH threatened a whole lot of suicide when I left him, Somber. He's still alive and now threatening to take me to court to get my dog because I went no contact with him and I guess that's what he has left to try and get my attention with. Pretty sure your WH won't kill himself, but I'm 100% sure he likes taking himself hostage like that in order to keep you in line. That shuts you up, right? I mean, you don't actually want him to die, so of course it works. He's full of shit, Somber. He's playing mind games and manipulating with that threat.

[This message edited by DevastatedDee at 9:01 AM, March 10th (Tuesday)]

I was conditioned by his refusal to ever accept responsibility for his actions and threatened with his suicidal claims when things got too real.

Yep - I I used to accept zero bs from a partner. Now, I can't stand what follows if I dare stand up for myself or question his behavior. I have Stockholm syndrome.

My stbx used to threaten suicide often. I finally told him to get on with it. He sat there, stunned. I clarified - "Either go ahead and do it or shut up because the next time you say that I am going to call the police for help and have you taken to the hospital." His suicidal tendencies miraculously vaporated into thin air. Amazing.

Wow. Im stunned that my post from a week ago is still the last one. How are you guys? The world has changed so much in the last week. Im kind of in shock a little bit. My stbx is still living here with us obviously. I can tell through phone records that he is messaging and calling women regularly. He acts like everything is perfectly normal. We dont discuss divorce anymore. We didnt have a discussion about putting it on hold. I think it is just understood. We cant cause any more upheaval in our kids lives than they already have. We just act like everything is normal. I think I said that. It puts things in perspecrive somewhat.

How has the current situation affected you all? I hope you are healthy. Most of us have a cold. It developed into bronchitis in our 6 year old but he is ok with an inhaler. He has been sick for a month so I am worried about him getting covid-19.

My stbx works for a propane company. His job is secure for now. Our older kids work at a restaurant but i requested that they take time off and leave the few remaining hours for the people who have bills to pay.

I think we are starting to get a little sick of eachother. Its been cold wet weather for the last few days so the kids cant go play in the yard. The dogs are loving the extra walks though!

Post updates please.

This thread is like that, a flurry of posts, then a drought. We are still in Hawaii, leaving tonight, getting home around 5. We have to go through two airports, making me a little paranoid.

Be well and cautious my friends!

Hey,

I haven’t been on in a while...

Lifeexploded, I hope you and your family all feel better soon, especially your 6 year old. Follow all the precautions and he should recover soon. Poor thing. I know how worrisome it is but hand washing and social isolation are our best defences right now. Hang in there.

Lionne, Safe travels! Hand sanitizer like crazy through those airports and you should be okay.

The world has changed dramatically. It’s unprecedented times ahead. We are both frontline workers so are right in the thick of it. However, I am grateful to be part time during all of this.

The lack of daycare is the most challenging for us as we still are required to work. My mom is our only social contact for childcare reasons. It’s gonna get tougher as the days turn into weeks and the weeks into months of dealing with this virus.

Aside from that, we also aren’t talking much about separation or divorce. Your right, the kids are experiencing enough changes right now. And truthfully, no big changes can really take affect when all services are closed, isolation in affect.

It’s like we are all forced to be in limbo right now.

Although it crept up on us the other night...

He carries on like everything is normal with us. Sometimes, I am triggered I suppose and act distant. He doesn’t get it. I explain that our marriage isn’t fixed because we are forced to isolate ourselves. He still doesn’t get it. I suppose because we are carrying on and not fighting, he thinks all is good. I fail to enlighten him that our marriage is no longer fixable. He gets mad. Then we start arguing about it.

Here comes the:

‘what about the kids?’

‘How can you do this to us, is there really nothing I can do?’

‘I was sober for 100 days, doesn’t that count?’

‘I have been trying’

Of course my responses are you aren’t trying, you don’t go to counselling, your drinking again, I didn’t do this to the kids, this is a consequence of your repeated actions, you never take responsibility for anything, you never admit to more than what I have shared, there is no transparency, honesty, disclosure...

He responds with: I have tried, I went to rehab and you didn’t seem to care, that’s not how my brain works, I’m sorry...I said I’m sorry.

I bluntly say in a calm voice ‘I don’t love you or trust you and a marriage needs both of those things’. He reacts to this by accusing me of verbally abusing him and begs me to stop verbally abusing him, it’s hatred and he doesn’t want me around him.’ I’m confused and say I’m not verbally abusing you, I’m telling you the truth of how I feel. He disagrees.

I give up and leave the room. Moments later he comes in and says “I got it, you actually want me to kill myself.” I respond that “that’s not true and now who is being abusing; this is emotional abuse and it’s not fair.” He mumbles “I just don’t want you to be surprised when it happens.”

Then I totally disengage, wtf right! Always ends up in him being suicidal or me being the abuser or me being selfish for wanting to hurt the kids and bring some other man into their lives...

So the past 2 days, almost without effort on his part, we are back to pretending all is fine. Almost as if this argument never happened. It won’t be spoke of again; he will once again think everything is fine, until the next time I feel the need to speak my truth.

[This message edited by Somber at 10:10 AM, March 25th (Wednesday)]

Hi folks,

I'm doing a drive-by here. I left Genius, my "sex addict" ex in 2011. He fought me for four years in court. Finally divorced in 2015.

I wanted to pipe in about suicide. My ex wrote that he was suicidal after I discovered his double life and had to ask him to leave our house after 15 years of marriage. To be clear, this all included dangerous, violent, anonymous sex with men and women and groups. Scary, scary stuff. I did not make the decision lightly to make him leave, but it was NOT my first D-Day. I had two perfect little kiddies, and I'm an Irish-Catholic New Yorker, and it all broke my heart. But I should have done it years earlier.

So. Suicide. My ex told me he was suicidal after I made him leave. I was terrified he would act on it. But about a year later, I asked the courts for a child custody evaluator. (The process took six months and I had to pay for it. I also had to get evaluated as well!) It was all worth it in the long run for many reasons, but one was that my ex told the child custody evaluator that he was never suicidal and that he only said it because he "wanted to manipulate me and get back into the house." Kid you not.

He also told the judge the same thing during out divorce trial.

I am very skeptical about suicide claims by SAs who have been caught and want our sympathy. Suicide is such a powerful thing - we are not supposed to question it. But I hope everyone here can read my story as just one story of someone who did not mean it and was trying to manipulate his wife into letting him stay in their home - and of course keep leading his double life while I raised the kids and wondered what was wrong with me that he kept cheating on me.

Take care, everyone. Be good to yourselves. xx, Hope

But I hope everyone here can read my story as just one story of someone who did not mean it and was trying to manipulate his wife into letting him stay in their home

Choosing hope, thank you for sharing your story. It is insightful. Overtime, I have learned that his suicidal claims are strategic emotional manipulation to stop me pursuing a separation or talking about the pain he caused me. To see him trying to be nice and normal the next day now looks like he is smiling because he shut me up again. It’s almost cyclical. He’ll be fine until I push this again...I’m sick of living like this. He says he’s not walking on egg shells but I sure the hell am. I’m not comfortable, in love and am no longer hopeful for things to work out. I’m wiser to know that too much damage has been done to work it out. Also he doesn’t have it in him to do all the extensive work I would require to even start to feel safe again.

Yes we can play nice and get through these isolating days. I don’t hate him entirely. He can be charming and helpful to be around. I can see the good in him and be mature enough to tolerate him regardless of my inner feelings. However, that pain is not going anywhere. It’s still there and some days makes it harder to pretend...

There have been two suicides among the SAs that populate the 12 step meetings in my area. Both were triggered by slips they had after long term sobriety. Both these men had lost their families long long ago.

I have no doubt that too often threats like this are manipulative. That is the overwhelming talent of an SA.

Hope you are all staying healthy and well.

Hi All,

Weirdly this pandemic has brought my ex and I together. I've been feeling incredibly alone in the world and frightened and of course he's always there begging to be let back in so, I did. He's not living with me and he won't be but he's sleeping here at night. I was sick for a bit with symptoms very much like this virus (no testing option where I am). I'd been traveling and a few of my friends I'd traveled to see also got sick - one very sick - all with the same symptoms.

I guess I'm making excuses for the closeness with my STBX because I do feel embarrassed. It's a lot of rug sweeping but with everything going on in the world the cheating isn't a primary concern. My kids and I staying healthy, keeping the lights on and beating back anxiety about the future are the main concerns.

My work has all but stopped - the future of current projects is iffy. Mu oldest is 7000 miles away. My youngest is special needs and has a history of getting quite sick with ordinary viruses although he last several years have been much, much better so, hopefully he's outgrown that. My world feels upended and the one thing that's been brought into sharp relief is how lacking my support system is. My husband, such as he is, is the only person there for us. While he's got massive issues, I've never doubted he loves us and that's a comfort right now.

I hope you all stay safe and healthy.

Well, that's a wrap on the corona virus-induced reconciliation.

My STBX was a total dick to me and my son tonight. His ugly temper is back probably because he's got some hooker issues - or he's broke from webcamming too much.

I can't pretend he's going to be normal or reasonable for any length of time - he's disordered. His thinking is paranoid and distorted and immature. When everything's going well it's not so apparent or problematic but when he's under pressure he's an entirely different person.

When everything's going well it's not so apparent or problematic but when he's under pressure he's an entirely different person.

Oh Skeeter, I can totally relate!! They can be handsome, charming, loving, family focused and then bam those true colours that led us to where we are now come out. That is the other side of them, it’s real; it’s true and it’s likely to never change.

We get hooked on hoping when everything seems to be going well and then we crash back to reality and pain when that switch flips. It’s an exhausting way to live, I’ve done it for so long. In the ‘good times’ I even start to feel bad for ever doubting him and then I feel stupid in the ‘bad moments’ that I could ever let myself slip back into believing in him. It’s a cycle. Perhaps both sides are real but the side that is cruel, manipulative and emotionally abusive seems to always dominate.

I’m sorry, I get it; your not alone.

This isolation has also had me wondering what would happen if I took this massive wall down but then I remember all the reasons it’s there and tell myself it’s not worth the risk anymore. It sure is difficult being forced to spend more time together when All I want it’s less time with him.

Hang in there.

Thanks Somber.

I read your story - we have a lot in common - or they do I should say - both charming, manipulative liars who desperately want to have their cake and eat it too.

In the ‘good times’ I even start to feel bad for ever doubting him and then I feel stupid in the ‘bad moments’ that I could ever let myself slip back into believing in him. It’s a cycle. Perhaps both sides are real but the side that is cruel, manipulative and emotionally abusive seems to always dominate.

Even if the bad side didn't dominate - it's too bad - it's too traumatic and destructive. The energy it takes to rug sweep, to talk myself out of my intuition, to suppress my feelings and swallow shit yet again - it's too much. It exhausts me. It ruins my self-esteem. It takes away from my ability to enjoy my kids, friends, work, home.

It sucks giving up that wonderful version of them though - when he's in that space, he's my dream partner and best friend.

The energy it takes to rug sweep, to talk myself out of my intuition, to suppress my feelings and swallow shit yet again - it's too much. It exhausts me. It ruins my self-esteem. It takes away from my ability to enjoy my kids, friends, work, home.

I feel the same way. It is exhausting and takes precious time away from our children, work, friends, etc. I’ve joked with a few friends lately that this isolation isn’t too bad, I’ve been practicing for a while now! Meaning I have been choosing not to socialize as I hate putting on a happy face for everyone when I am so heartbroken and sad. I do it for my kids, for my work and that’s it. I have nothing left afterwards.

My story, I just re read it. I have more infidelities to add but what’s the point. It’s the same cycle.

It does suck giving up on that wonderful version of them, it’s not real though. Even if it is real and the better side of them, the worse side is too damaging. It’s abusive. It’s not a way to live. I don’t know about you Skeeter, but I’ve lost a tremendous amount of myself, my self respect and self esteem

directly from the way he has treated me. There is no happy marriage when another can treat us so poorly then expect us to be happy when they decide to play nice for a while. Especially with no true remorse, empathy or acceptance of responsibility. It’s narcissistic and cruel. It’s not love. I don’t think my husband is truly capable of such an emotional bond. It hurts to accept this reality of him and our marriage but it also hurts to be robbed of respect, safety, security and happiness staying. It’s an individual choice and from my story you can see I’ve been on the fence our entire marriage.

I wish you strength no matter what you chose. I wish you loving moments with your child, health and sanity during this pandemic forced isolation.

Thank you, Somber, I wish you all the same.

It hurts to accept this reality of him and our marriage but it also hurts to be robbed of respect, safety, security and happiness staying. It’s an individual choice and from my story you can see I’ve been on the fence our entire marriage.

I've been on the fence for sometime as well. Even before dday he was very confusing - running hot and cold - withdrawing, then love bombing, blaming me - it was a mess.

I was thinking today that he never got me a wedding ring, only an inexpensive silver band. Then he proceeded to spend tens of thousands on hookers and webcam girls - but a $200 ring (I don't even dream I'd get a real ring) is too extravagant.

He's not capable of a real bond either - he never missed a beat in his social or work life after dday, nor after I kicked him out. It's funny because he's been more hurt by some work conflict - and actually taken personal days to deal with it emotionally. He never missed one day of work because of the tsunami he unleashed on our lives. I guess what he was up to was no shock to him, but I believed getting caught and facing the end of our marriage would devastate him - it didn't.

So much dissonance between what he says and what he does - why is it so hard to just accept he's fake, he's a liar, he's bad for me??

So much dissonance between what he says and what he does - why is it so hard to just accept he's fake, he's a liar, he's bad for me??

It’s so hard because of exactly that, the dissonance between what he does and says. Then your own cognitive dissonance between believing someone who says they love you is also the person causing you pain. I often felt like my head was spinning after arguments where I was trying to remember what exactly just happened, what was real, what was imagined, does he love me, am I crazy, is he crazy, I love him no wait I hate him, how can I stay with someone who has done this, how can I leave the victim....the conflicting views in my head have seriously impaired my ability to trust myself. I’m trying so hard to jot down things to remind myself that this happened, that happened, I’m not crazy. I am validating myself by doing this and it helps break that personal dissonance a bit.

He never missed one day of work because of the tsunami he unleashed on our lives. I guess what he was up to was no shock to him, but I believed getting caught and facing the end of our marriage would devastate him - it didn't.

I can relate 100%!!!

Checking in and hoping everyone is safe and healthy. I have a different kind of update about living with my husband during physical distancing.

I am immune compromised and would not fare well if I got covid-19. In my state, cases are surging right now and we haven't reached peak. We are told to assume everyone is infected and all surfaces are infected. It's truly terrifying.

I've been practicing physical distancing for about 25 days now. At the start of this, I had a conversation with my husband in which I said I had to be really aggressive about physical distancing in order to stay alive. I need to wait for a vaccine. I said he would have to be as rigorous about physical distancing and cleanliness as I was going to be. I invited him to leave if he wasn't up to the challenge. I did this calmly and with great resolve. He has chosen to stay and after quite a bit of discussion, I believe that he will try to do the right thing. After six years of work, I trust that he WANTS to keep me safe from the virus. It's also part of his way to make amends.

I am grateful for him during this time. He has been helpful. I don't trust him 100% and never will since he is still a space shot. He also still struggles with immediate gratification so getting him to think beyond the next hour is a challenge. That said, he is much less angry and much more able to deal with this pandemic with some maturity.

But while I am grateful, and while I think he is fairly sober, I haven't found the return of any love or affection in me for him. Nor desire. I continue to live with him the way I have been: he's a decent roommate. Even under the same roof I don't spend much time with him. Given his improvements in behavior and maturity, he still really isn't fully grown up. He's easier, that's for sure. But his addiction took so much of him that without it there isn't much there. He doesn't really have hobbies and since he doesn't work anymore, he really doesn't have much meaning in his life. I find him to be quite shallow and uninteresting. He's a sober 12 year old.

So I'm grateful he's not an active addict and that he is here during this pandemic. He's devoted to our dogs and he is helping me. But my marriage, for me, is over. Really over. And that feels just fine.

Wishing us all health and safety,

ashestophoenix

[This message edited by ashestophoenix at 6:19 AM, April 5th (Sunday)]

Last week I told my husband I don't really think I love him anymore.

I appreciate him quite a bit, actually. We've had some great times with the family since we've been on stay-at-home orders...I don't remember laughing as much in the past year as we have in the past three weeks.

I would have expected, by now, *some* sort of loving feeling would have returned. We play card games. I feel nothing. We watch tv. I feel nothing. We put puzzles together...spend time as a family...nothing.

I'm fond of him and care about him as a friend. But, he's definitely in the friend zone.

It's a relief. I'm still pretty content, actually. I know he loves me. I won't give up my kids half the time *just* so I can go out and find someone to be FWB with. And I was upfront about that, too.

Ashes,

I’m glad you are being safe and your spouse is supportive and helpful. You deserve that. Stay home and stay healthy.

You shine light into a future for many of us. One that could potentially be stable, comfortable, friendly even, a decent roommate but without love. I’m glad you can find your peace with this and make the best of it and develop a different relationship with him aside from a loving one.

My spouse is too narcissistic and emotionally abusive for this to be a possibility for me. I feel my mental health is compromised by staying. I hope one day I finally get the strength to leave this emotionally psychologically abusive relationship. That being said, he isn’t entirely sober either so living with an active addict creates an instability that I can no longer live with. That’s my story though.

Second time, it sounds like you have found a similar comfortable situation such as Ashes. I’m glad you both can find a new kind of peace in your marriage. One without love but with other traits you can respect and treasure. He must be sober too.

Thx for the updates. Hope you all stay healthy and well.

I often felt like my head was spinning after arguments where I was trying to remember what exactly just happened, what was real, what was imagined, does he love me, am I crazy, is he crazy, I love him no wait I hate him, how can I stay with someone who has done this, how can I leave the victim...

Ditto. It's so much conflicting information and intensity - that alone I guess tells us that these are profoundly unhealthy relationships. There's no truth that needs to be gotten to in order to understand the bottom line: they're toxic.

Ashes and Secondtime - your situations are exactly what I was hoping for. At my age, 57, I'd just rather stay with he devil I know even if I don't feel romantic love or attraction for him. Unfortunately, like Somber, mine isn't sober and is too mentally ill. He's demanding, paranoid, critical and cranky - and he's still so triggering. I'd give anything for a platonic friendship based partnership devoid of drama and trauma.