SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Apologies for not replying for a while. Things are going ok still. As previously mentioned I am giving WW a 2nd chance and we are trying to move on with her lives. Grab a coffee because this is a long one..!

I really did grill her for every little detail and she didn't alter any of her story and tbh I believe her. I then made her promise that she'd told the whole truth and if I find out different in the future or if she repeats her actions I won't be giving her another chance. It's my first step in placing trust back in her.

Regarding making her realise the consequences of her actions, I think she is having a good dose of reality because she did not use protection (had coil removed last year). She says he pulled out, which I suppose may reduce the chances but doesn't totally eliminate the possibility of pregnancy. She's pretty scared and won't be comfortable for another couple of weeks until her cycle happens (or doesn't!).

I have confronted OM on Facebook messenger and he was at first denying everything and blatantly lying. Eventually he came out with a story "she came on to me and she booked a hotel and I said no". This bit is slightly concerning as my WW didn't mention a hotel, but I'm thinking this is the story he's already made up and given to his GF, who had found out he went to see my WW.

I pushed him more saying I know what you did in the car and eventually got an "ok whatever" and a "sorry" out of him. I haven't confronted his GF because she's 40 weeks pregnant and don't want to add to her stress! She's already forgiven him for going to meet my WW. Even though I could easily wreck their relationship with the truth, for some reason I want to give him the chance to make things right.

As for the work situation my wife has been on business calls to him a couple of times. She described the call in detail and she was pretty blunt with him. Calls are recorded and they don't have outside means of communication so I'm confident no flirting will occur. My WW is trying to get over him and says she'll be happier when he's on paternity leave as it'll give her a couple of weeks space without his calls. She has just passed her probation period at work and also passed a test which will mean she's getting a permanent contract and a pay rise. This job security is something we've wanted for a long time. She used to jump jobs a lot, so finding a workplace where she fits in and can hold down a career is a big deal.

We have been on a couple of nice outings together. This weekend was a fun shopping trip, the weekend beforehand we went for a really romantic walk around a lake where we had good productive talks about our relationship and also discussed relaxing a boundary regarding ogling strangers. After all it's biological to find others attractive, as long as we leave it at using our eyes. We discussed what we find physically attractive in people and this openness gave us an insight into each other's turn ons. The whole experience was very positive and quite a turn on tbh and we are definitely still having lots of great sex. I always give her multiple orgasms and this hasn't changed.

There is one major concern for me though and that is her mental health. She has suffered for years, having a past abusive relationship and some other bad stuff including bullying really hasn't helped. And last year she was victim of attempted sexual assault in the car park of her former workplace. Her head is pretty messed up and she has bad anxiety, PTSD and OCD. She often refers to a 2nd voice in her head. The first is her normal self - strong, confident and bubbly. The 2nd is trying to derail her constantly by knocking her confidence and self image. Sometimes she is able to surpress it pretty well but sometimes it overrules her.

At the very beginning of our relationship 7 years ago, I said something really dumb and naïve. She asked me what I thought of her body and I stupidly replied saying she could be more toned. What an idiot I was. I had never had a girlfriend before and had no idea what to say/not say to a woman and I learnt the hard say sadly. No amount of apologies, compliments or generally treating her well over the following 7 years has made any difference. That voice in her head speaks up at every turn and she doesn't feels good about herself with me. I love her curvy figure and wouldn't change her at all, but she doesn't believe me.

I think that is a big part of what drove her to go see OM. He didn't judge her appearance and got off over her and she feels flattered by this. The big question is how do I make her feel this way. Personally I think she needs a lot of counselling to deal with her past and possibly psychological help with coping with the voice in her head. But I can guarantee she'll refuse this route. I feel really helpless.

[This message edited by ArnTheMug at 4:56 AM, April 16th (Monday)]

You are a truly good person to have so much insight and desire to help her.

I agree about professional help being needed. It can help her tremendously. If she finds the right person to deal with all of the events of her past she can change in very positive ways.

I hope she will consider it.

Hi Arn,

Many thanks for the update. It is good to know how you are getting on.

Regaining trust is a slow process, and a lot will be dependent on how much effort your wife makes to 'prove' herself to you. If you go into Google and do a search for these three words together - "affair trust again" - there are lots of links to all of the issues you are facing are discussed. There are even a few books out there on the subject. If you do a Google search for "affair trust again book", you will find links to a bunch of books and articles on the subject. These may be of help to you.

I have confronted OM on Facebook messenger and he was at first denying everything and blatantly lying. Eventually he came out with a story "she came on to me and she booked a hotel and I said no". This bit is slightly concerning as my WW didn't mention a hotel, but I'm thinking this is the story he's already made up and given to his GF, who had found out he went to see my WW.

I pushed him more saying I know what you did in the car and eventually got an "ok whatever" and a "sorry" out of him. I haven't confronted his GF because she's 40 weeks pregnant and don't want to add to her stress! She's already forgiven him for going to meet my WW. Even though I could easily wreck their relationship with the truth, for some reason I want to give him the chance to make things right.

I agree that the mention of a hotel is jarring. Have you discussed what he said with your wife? The problem is, the guy may live his life telling lies left, right, and center. I think it was good that you contacted him, because he now knows he is on your radar. You have a certain amount of leverage over him if you ever needed to warn him off, in as much as his girlfriend does not know that the full details of his meeting with your wife. I am not suggesting that you threaten him; hopefully he will keep his distance, because he stands to lose a lot if his relationship collapses at the same time as his child is born.

As for the work situation my wife has been on business calls to him a couple of times. She described the call in detail and she was pretty blunt with him.

That is good, and you need to stay on top of this, and make sure she tells you about any contact that she has with him.

Calls are recorded and they don't have outside means of communication so I'm confident no flirting will occur.

Sadly, these days, there are a huge amount of ways that people can be in contact if they want to be. The key to it is whether or not your wife wants to be. That is really the issue to focus on.

My WW is trying to get over him and says she'll be happier when he's on paternity leave as it'll give her a couple of weeks space without his calls.

I hope she will be honest with you on the subject of her feelings about him. It can be an incredibly hard subject for a betrayed spouse to discuss, but what you don't want is for her to not talk about it and effectively hide it. Figuring out why he had such an impact will show both of you areas where she is 'vulnerable', what her needs are, and where she may need to be more aware and build herself some boundaries to prevent a similar incident happening again.

She has just passed her probation period at work and also passed a test which will mean she's getting a permanent contract and a pay rise. This job security is something we've wanted for a long time. She used to jump jobs a lot, so finding a workplace where she fits in and can hold down a career is a big deal.

I hope you went out to celebrate this, and made a bit of a fuss of her. I know that she cheated, but as you want to stay and make things work, and she may have issues about her self-worth, praising her and making a fuss of her when she does good things can help her feel good, and draw you closer together. Whenever you think of something good or nice about her, tell her.

There is one major concern for me though and that is her mental health. She has suffered for years, having a past abusive relationship and some other bad stuff including bullying really hasn't helped. And last year she was victim of attempted sexual assault in the car park of her former workplace. Her head is pretty messed up and she has bad anxiety, PTSD and OCD. She often refers to a 2nd voice in her head. The first is her normal self - strong, confident and bubbly. The 2nd is trying to derail her constantly by knocking her confidence and self image. Sometimes she is able to surpress it pretty well but sometimes it overrules her.

If you look online, there are a ton of resources that can help you get a better understanding of your wife's conditions, the kind of support that she may need, and also the kind of support that you need. It can sometimes be hard supporting someone with issues, and you should not neglect yourself.

Personally I think she needs a lot of counselling to deal with her past and possibly psychological help with coping with the voice in her head. But I can guarantee she'll refuse this route. I feel really helpless.

As you are in the UK (me too!), these are some relevant links to get you started. I hope I won't get in trouble for posting direct links; these are all health organisations, nothing commercial.

https://www.mentalhealth.org.uk/

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/stress-anxiety-depression/mental-health-helplines/

https://www.mind.org.uk/

The way I think you could approach this is to contact some of these organisations yourself, describe your wife, her past, her issues with the 'second voice', and the fact that she is not keen to get any kind of help. I am sure that is a very common thing, and there will be people at these support organisations who can advise you about how to handle it, how to talk to her, and what support may be available locally to you.

Sometimes people can worry that any kind of analysis will lead to them being branded as 'different' in some way, or - to use a horrible term - 'nuts'. So they have an aversion to anything that could lead to that happening. Getting your wife to change her attitude, if that is possible, will be a journey, and you will need patience. It sounds like you have love and care for her, and you are committed to her, so you have the potential to move forwards with something that may take many months to have results. However, it will be worth it for both of you.

As I say, try contacting the organisations above as a starting point, and tell them that you want your wife to get some help, but she is resistant. I am sure they will help you with this, and they can probably help you devise a plan to lead your wife towards counselling or other help. They can tell you what to say to reassure her that you want to help her, and that it is not that you think she is 'loopy'.

At the very beginning of our relationship 7 years ago, I said something really dumb and naïve. She asked me what I thought of her body and I stupidly replied saying she could be more toned. What an idiot I was. I had never had a girlfriend before and had no idea what to say/not say to a woman and I learnt the hard say sadly. No amount of apologies, compliments or generally treating her well over the following 7 years has made any difference. That voice in her head speaks up at every turn and she doesn't feels good about herself with me. I love her curvy figure and wouldn't change her at all, but she doesn't believe me.

Summer is coming (very slowly!), so how about getting yourself a halfways decent digital camera, and organising a few trips where taking photos of your wife is a part of it. She may be a little resistant at first, if she thinks you have negative feelings about her looks, but if you are gentle, and persistent, she may loosen up and indulge you. You can then review the photos with her, and tell her what you appreciate. In time, this may convince her that you do find her attractive.

On a similar theme, how about going shopping with her when she is looking for new clothes? Yes, I know that is like kryptonite to most men, but my thinking here is that she can try on various outfits in shops, and you can comment about what really suits her, what makes her look good, etc. This could be a nice way to get the message across to her, and could become a 'fun' thing for you to do together. It will, hopefully, boost her ego, and she will have confidence that her wardrobe is pleasing to you, and that she looks good to you.

I hope something here is useful for you, and I wish you and your wife well as you work on your reconciliation.

[This message edited by M1965 at 9:58 AM, April 16th (Monday)]

My WW is trying to get over him

Please explain this.

Wow she confessed!! Even before being caught out. I’m afraid everyone on here will be a little bit pessimistic, with Good cause I might add.

First of all don’t blame yourself. I have stayed at home helping to look after the kids while working our farm. I have worked a heavy manual job working 12 hour days supporting my family and have worked at sea supporting my family. And have had treatment for cancer.

But that didn’t stop my W from cheating, any of it. So it’s not you it’s her.

Don’t be to quick to accept her story. I’ve done that. They are not the same person you thought. If she confessed there is a good chance she did it so she could make sure that her version was believed. Why would you investigate if you think you know the facts?

But if you feel there is a good chance for R then that’s great. Just take it slow. Ask for access to all devises all codes. All accounts.

But also try to do things together as you normally do. It is a fine balance I think to get the hard line and kid gloves right. She has to prove to you that she is sorry for betraying you and can be trusted.

I certainly have got there by along shot. Not even a confession, it’s all my fault even the things that didn’t happen or I think happened.

Enjoy being with your children, I missed to much of mine growing up from working away.

If something seems to good to be true good chance it’s not true.

Arn,

There's a couple things that stick out here as big red flags for danger ahead but I won't touch on those right now. BTW That doesn't mean you can't make it but it does mean you should take every opportunity to learn what you can from other people here that are doing the same.

I and most of us are always pulling for you even if it might not always seem that way. Understand though that we are pulling for YOU first as the BS and if things work out in a way that you can be happy in your M that's great. I'm all for it.

[This message edited by MrMagnolia at 7:28 AM, April 16th (Monday)]

I just read this thread for the first time so I'm late to the plate.

The goal from SI is to get out of adultery. We all have opinions about how that should be accomplished, Arn. The way I chose was long and painful. Perhaps it would have been long and painful whatever route I took.

You're looking at a marathon here. Not a sprint. Common thought is 2 to 5 years to heal. Lots of up and downs hence the referral to the roller coaster. The calendar gets reset at new truths (trickle truth) or new DDays or both.

Take your time in making decisions. Watch her actions. Actions speak louder than words. I, personally, don't believe she had a come to Jesus moment and confessed. I think she was getting out in front of a potential disclosure - risk of exposure. I think she did that to maintain control and for damage control.

Just as I think your WW needs to be tested for STDs (no protection and where has his pecker been before) the OBW needs to know so she can demand he gets tested or gets tested herself. I know she's pregnant (maybe a new mother by now) but for her own health and protection she should know before she has any more sex with WH.

As so many have said there is nothing you said or didn't say, did or didn't do that caused this. It is her. 100%. Do not accept any responsibility whatsoever.

Back on page 2 M1965 wrote a very thoughtful and descriptive post that is true for many of us. It's worth another read, Arn (you're not a mug). Your WW should read "How To Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair" by Linda J McDonald. Others have suggested it. I support that suggestion.

I'm so sad you're in this position, Arn. It's a long road. Take care of yourself and your children.

M1965 - thanks for all the advice and I will check those links out.

I have taken her shopping as a treat and got her some new clothes and earrings. I'm trying to pay her compliments but without overdoing it because I want to sound sincere. I'm not the best at taking photos but will certainly try and get some good snaps and get them up on social media to show her off and hopefully flatter her.

GoldenR - I'm not totally sure myself but she definitely doesn't want to go back to him. I know she still finds OM attractive and is trying to get him out of her head. Not going to be easy due to her job and people dropping his name during office conversation so I'm concerned as to how she's coping.

I would think she should be buying you and the kids new things as you guys are the ones who have been hurt. She shouldn’t be rewarded for infidelity. I’m just saying.

I think she should have said no let’s get you something, and you could say thank you very much. Have a nice meal together take fotos but not give gifts.

It sounds like you're trying to woo her back to you. Should be the other way around.

And back to my original point a couple pages back...

She's still pining for him, and in front of you no less! As long as she works with him,your marriage is in jeopardy. Him taking 2 weeks off won't make her forget him, it'll just make her be all excited to see him when he returns.

It sucks what I keep saying, but it really does come down to her job or your marriage

Sorry you are going thru this.

With that said, you are going about this all wrong imo.

She has to quit the job.

You have to inform OM's pregnant gf.

You are rug sweeping this big time.

Okay, I was going to keep my mouth shut but well fuck that....

Arnnie, please listen. If you were in any situation and I saw you behaving as you describe I would recommend you take a hard look at a few things. As you are dealing with your WW affair it is even more essential that you take a look at how you are handling this.

In SI terms you are doing the pick me dance and that has a long proven track record of failure.

In other terms, you are being the "Nice Guy" who takes care of everybody and treats his lady special, does everything he can to please her, and avoids conflict because he's different than all those other guys. This has a long track record for failure.

In other terms still you are showing some major signs of Codependcy. I see you are justifying your spouses ABUSE of you and her ABUSE of your marriage.

You are enjoying the moment at the cost of your future happiness and it kills me to hear it.

We can help you but you have to trust us. We've got a hand out waiting for you to take hold and pull yourself aboard so just tell us when you're ready to trust us. We'll be here for you.

[This message edited by MrMagnolia at 9:03 AM, April 16th (Monday)]

There is one major concern for me though and that is her mental health. She has suffered for years, having a past abusive relationship and some other bad stuff including bullying really hasn't helped. And last year she was victim of attempted sexual assault in the car park of her former workplace. Her head is pretty messed up and she has bad anxiety, PTSD and OCD. She often refers to a 2nd voice in her head. The first is her normal self - strong, confident and bubbly. The 2nd is trying to derail her constantly by knocking her confidence and self image. Sometimes she is able to surpress it pretty well but sometimes it overrules her.

What makes you think one voice dominates the other?

Lets take this from a different angle. For the sake of argument lets say that the OM is the main instigator in your WW bad behavior. Lets also say that OM is the cliched husband that can't/wont have sex with his own wife due to her being very pregnant. From a previous post you mentioned there is lots of joking and sexual banter at the workplace. We know OM is a scumbag. There are men in this world that have the gift of talking woman out of their pants. They seek out woman that have self-esteem issues. I've worked in places that had men like this (discusting I know) but absolutely true nonetheless. In their own words they would seek out fat chicks (self-esteem issues) in the hopes of getting a roof over their head. The point being is this world is filled to the brim with assholes like this. If a woman has self-esteem issues she had better have...

1)Very good boundaries.

2)Have a very good counselor to help her deal with her issues and lack of boundaries.

3)Quit the job that puts her in the position of talking men down... once again due to lack of boundaries.

Notice the phrase lack of boundaries keeps comming up?

Personally I think she needs a lot of counselling to deal with her past and possibly psychological help with coping with the voice in her head. But I can guarantee she'll refuse this route. I feel really helpless.

I agree. I would insist that for you to even attempt to R she would have to have IC...period. If you learn anything at all from history... it tends to be repetitive.

I worry about you.

Her issues will get worse as she gets older.

As her career grows so will her intellect and young attractive guys along with smart old men will catcher her eye.

See your wife is easy to spot and a predator will smell her right of way.

She needs t get help not for her but for her family. If she wants to protect her family she will fortify her emotional weakness's.

If she goes and gets help it will protect her marriage and that should be a priority...in 5 yrs or even 10 years from now her head is going to be in a worse place then it is now, which means predators will have an easier time spotting her.

If she doesn't fortify her emotional health she will repeat this unhealthy choice to stray....especially when she start to show age and the kids are more independent.

She needs to rethink her stance on therapy! That voice in her head is only going to get louder.

Haven't you read enough threads here at SI that start out with "married for 20 yrs and I should have divorces my spouse 13 years ago when they first cheated"

And then these posts usually end with "my spouse is emotionally unhealthy due to their past relationships/childhood abuse".

And some were in between the beginning of the post and the end of their post they talk about what a good spouse they try to be, and they still get phucked over by a cheating spouse.

My point is...boundaries are great, GPS is great, software is great, great spouses are great but a wayward is broken and they cheat. The trick is repairing the broken person and having a healthy relationship with someone else.

I want to be the voice in your head......YOUR OLD LADY NEEDS THERAPY!!!!

Sorry, but it is a matter of time, when years from now you are going through your old ladies phone and you find a pick of some guy rubbing one out with the caption "I miss you"...

Please convince her to get help now that she has permanent employment and insurance will cover a bill from a shrink.

manfromlamancha:

—You have a pm—

Its a standard mantra of this site that cheaters cheat because of them, their faults, their lack of boundaries, their whatever - not because of anything the betrayed spouse did or didn't do. That includes being a sahd. Nothing you did or didn't do or could have done differently made her cheat.

Romantic walks and shopping trips are nice. By right after cheating its sorta rewarding bad behavior. Be careful you don't fall into a pick me dance or a nice her back scenario. Neither works. Ever.

Please tell the other guys wife. She deserves to know. You'd want her to tell you. More it puts baby and her life at risk because youbdon know if your ww was his first time cheating.

Its great she told you. That's rare. Even rarer is she told you ALL the truth. Confessions are often minimized.

You should monitor and recover data on her phone, social media, and emails.

"We discussed what we find physically attractive in people and this openness gave us an insight into each others turnons. The whole experience was very positive and QUITE A TURN tbh and we are definitely still having lots of great sex"?????

"She says he pulled out"?

"Even though I could easily wreck their relationship with the truth"?

2X4 coming......you need to wake the F up.

Your wife had another man's unit inside of her and you're rewarding her with "nice outings together" and a "fun shopping trip"???

I'm still having a hard time understanding how you are going to be okay with her having daily contact with the guy she cheated with. Just don't see how that will work for you.