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It’s suggested to BS’s that they demand a hall pass or a threesome and it’s posed to WS’s as well that they should offer it. I just never thought it was suggested as a serious idea and so I thought, Nah! They can’t really mean that. Wait, they’re serious? KWIM?

Were these suggestions from other waywards? If so, I doubt it is uncommon to think the problem is the sex, not the deception and betrayal, and think this will somehow even things up. It is no doubt something to make the WS feel better, like they have made good the damage they have done, or have allowed the BS to "get even".

The reality is there is nothing they could ever do to make good the damage, and nothing the BS could ever do would make them even.

NNM,

Injustice, experience, scales? Well that is Infidelity in a nut shell, isn’t it?

A gift? Since I have wronged you, and now have more experience, here’s a man or woman, have sex with IT, so that you can heal.

You dont even begin to understand how horrible your advice is to all the people involved in your magical threesome.

In light of the seriousness of this conversation, I'd like to offer each contributor one of Wools frozen puppies.

I know how hard they are to get rid of... tried using em as a party favor at one of the kid's bday parties but that didn't go over so well.

You offered kids pupsicles? What flavors did you advertise?

poker lingo here:

NTV and NNM...I "see" your frozen dead puppies and threesomes "bet" for healing through beastiality and raise it by 99!

Maybe having 99 Dead Baboons laying around to screw around with would help Mr. and Mrs. Walloped heal better....?

99 Red Balloons Parody - 99 Dead Baboons

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9Lt1rwj6R8

This thread reminds and some recent others remind me of a Dr. Seuess story about the Cat in the Hat Comes Back where he tries to get rid of a relatively manageable "small" red/pink stain by getting it on his hands and everything and everyone ELSE in that scenario and only spread the thing exponentially.

Read Across America - Cat in the Hat Comes Back by Dr. Seuss

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvad9jM7Ftc

Skip to 1:47 min to shorten it a bit and see some of my point sooner.

Hey look I said my peace, and I apologized for offending the OP. My intentions are good and I stand by that. Of course, I need to also recognize that for me the A was a deal breaker, and it has been mentioned that as a divorced spouse, it can’t necessarily be argued that what I suggested could help the M based on me as well he case study. I will say that it didn’t help me not feel so violated and injusticed. And if the person is single and happily willing, doesn’t hurt them either. Of course, not everyone has the same path, and I respect that.

You offered kids pupsicles? What flavors did you advertise?

Shitzu mostly, some chihuahua, and a few schnauzer. Had a couple pugs... but i didnt wanna scare the kids, ya know?

NNM, I personally think that your way of responding to the backlash you were seeing on here was great here in this thread just recently, but I guess with NTV trying to lighten the mood...

I succumbed to the temptation to help him accomplish that vision...

He knows my Achilles heel is humor I think. I'm not sure who told him though. SI certainly isn't the comics section of the internet world.

Maybe I just needed to do that for ME. Anyway, I liked your very diplomatic and sincere sounding replies, for what my own sense of fair play are worth to ya. Most everyone on this site has some bad dancing or bad dance partners in their repertoire. Maybe my jabs at you were just such an example. But I couldn't hardly resist, it seemed. The target was just....just daring me to shoot at it. (the concept, not YOU, exactly).

"When we use the words "should" or "shouldn't" we are not respecting others ability to make the best decisions for themselves. No, I don't feel a WS "should" offer everything up they did/gave to the AP. A WS certainly can't be forced to mean it, even if some BS's force the WS to accept that if they want a chance to reconcile.

ETA: I feel that forcing those conditions on a WS, to have a chance for reconciliation, is forcing the WS to give up their autonomy. It is degrading, demeaning and dehumanizing. "

How is it not demeaning for the BH to accept

that the WW will never give to him that she

gave to her OM?

Someone decided to bring scales into this conversation.

Are we weighing the bacon and frozen puppies So and 99 baboons?

Yes, frozen puppies, bacon and 99 baboons on one side of the scale and an agenda on the other.

Those damn pupbacaboons gonna be outweighed every time.

How is it not demeaning for the BH to accept

that the WW will never give to him that she

gave to her OM?

Demeaning other people will not make anyone feel better. Demeaning other people will not heal our wounds. In fact, you will harm yourself more when you demean others. There are healthy ways to cope and heal, demeaning, dehumanizing and degrading others is not a healthy way to cope and heal.

eta: I want to make this clear. What I am talking about is when people use the word "should". It needs to be between the couple and they do not need others telling them that the WW "should" do everything sexually she did with OM. They need to make those decisions that are right for them and their healing.

[This message edited by SisterMilkshake at 10:40 AM, February 12th (Monday)]

If we want Lady Justice to do the weighing, I think she's gonna have to put her sword down so she can hold her nose while she lets the scales try to balance or at least settle to a stop.

Maybe we should have Atlas do the job instead. I think those pupsickles might just make the Lady cry a bit. Or was she just tearing up because of the smell of those baboons stinking up the place?

Maybe there's cold storage available over in the Betrayed Menz neighborhood.

For the dead baboons and pupsickles I mean. I think we even have a bottle of Febreeze over there. But we can just go ahead and cook up all of that bacon right here and NOW.

Or was that laughter she was tearing up over? That's a bad sign right there.

[This message edited by Cephastion at 9:59 PM, February 11th (Sunday)]

Eh, I’ll be alright, I can lick my wounds of defeat once in a while. Even without being right, I believe mr and mrs walloped understand the intentions of what I posted, if not the actual act. Maybe it’s true that there is no justice. But they are both crystal clear that walloped deaerves it, and from what I can tell mrs wallloped is doing everything she can to give him peace. I’m not knockin anyone

NNM,

Thank you.

The wayward spouse should offer everything they gave the AP and mean it, albeit reluctantly.

When we use the words "should" or "shouldn't" we are not respecting others ability to make the best decisions for themselves. No, I don't feel a WS "should" offer everything up they did/gave to the AP. A WS certainly can't be forced to mean it, even if some BS's force the WS to accept that if they want a chance to reconcile.

ETA: I feel that forcing those conditions on a WS, to have a chance for reconciliation, is forcing the WS to give up their autonomy. It is degrading, demeaning and dehumanizing.

We've had this discussion several times on here, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. I understand your point, and I agree with much/most of it. It doesn't, however, change the reality of the situation for me, and for many others in the situation where the WW (typically) does things sexually with the OM that have been refused to the H.

We "force" all kinds of conditions for R; no contact, a timeline, lie detectors, financial restructuring (post nup). Giving the BS "better than" the AP got should be table stakes, and, if it were anything but sex, it would be; we would all agree, of course you should. Draw any analogy you like (non-sexual) that isn't personally dangerous and you'll find that every single one of them comes down on the "of course you should do that and more with the BS". Gifts, expensive dinners, getaways to romantic resorts, romantic gestures (flowers, etc), writing poems.. Anything else that the WS did with the AP but not the BS, we'd all say "Dude, you wrote your AP poetry every day, you better darn well get out the pen for your wife". And I think we all accept that as the bare minimum for R. Only when we talk about sex does the story change; and for an understandable reason, but, an unacceptable change either way in my eyes.

Sex is ever worse, in many ways, because everything I said above, all the "other" things that a WS could do with the AP, you can do all those things without your BS in the confines of marriage. Go have an expensive dinner with your friends. Pay someone to write poetry for you. Send yourself flowers, or have a good friend send them to you. It's only sex that's exclusive to the relationship, and therefore, in a lot of ways, the most important place to "even the tables" between the WS and the BS.

All that said, this comes down sharply divided on gender, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree, and I do respect and appreciate your position, I just don't, and probably never will, agree with it.

The discussion about justice and fairness is an interesting one, unfortunately IMO, there is no justice in infidelity. It's not fair, and I don't think anyone can really settle the score. More importantly, why would you want to? Early on we all feel the need to punish our waywards for the pain we go through, I was particularly nasty to my WH, but the thought of abandoning my values never entered into it. As much as I wished he could know what my pain felt like, the reality is he never will.

I don't see threesomes (or anal sex, or any other sexual request of a BS) as a way to "punish" the WS. If that's the goal/intention, a D is probably the right answer. It's a way for the BS to experience the rush of the new like the WS did. Or get something the AP didn't (or did, in many cases, but the H didn't).

Maybe that's why these conversations get so off the rails sometimes, I can't imagine anyone doing any of this stuff, threesomes included, to "punish" the WS. That's crazy, and the pain will never compare, the best way to punish him/her is to walk out the door and live a good life, not keep re-engaging.

I have been around SI for many years (too many some think).

It’s been over 30 years since my d-day.

This will be my 7827th post.

Of those 7827 probably fewer than 150 are on the Wayward forum.

The reason being that IMHO it’s possibly the bravest, rawest and most delicate of all the forums here on SI and it requires quite a level of competence to contribute constructively there.

I think it’s a rare BS that has doesn't have the maturity, experience and detachment from his/her own pain that can do much good on the WS forum.

[This message edited by Bigger at 7:30 AM, February 12th (Monday)]

We "force" all kinds of conditions for R; no contact, a timeline, lie detectors, financial restructuring (post nup).

Forcing sex acts is totally different than this and I feel you know it is different. I mean, I really hope you know the difference. Really hope.