SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Bigger I will take you at your word if there were people assuming that his WW did indeed visit OM gravesite. I don't really have the time to go back through the thread. I can only speak for myself and I was only curious if his wife does (or did) visit and if so I thought it would be something that A1 would want to know (but that would obviously be up to A1).

Sudra, to answer your question, yes I am a BS and no I haven't shared my story on SI yet. As for your comment about me "having an agenda"? What are you implying Sudra (and what's your agenda by implying I have an agenda)?

Go through my posts in the time that I have been here, and I can pretty much assure you that I have shown NOTHING but compassion and encouragement to others on here as well as providing some insight. The only time I was out of line was in analyst's thread when I was a little hard on him for referring to an innocent BS and her children as "collateral damage". I apologized to him (which in my time here have I Rarely seen other posters do).

Bigger I hope you didn't take my comment wrong, and yes, TRUST ME, I know what your agenda is here on SI and you are one of the reasons why I finally decided to join SI after lurking here for years. Your insight and wisdom is second to none, and it's amazing to me how much of your time you're willing to give to the people who come here in dire straights and in a ton of pain. All I can say to you is THANK YOU.....THANK YOU my friend as it's helped SO many people (including myself). Thank to all of the others who continue to give their wisdom here on SI and ask nothing in return (and there are a TON of you). A1, like anyone else who comes here, is VERY blessed to have so many caring people willing to offer their wisdom.

One of these days I will share my story and if the mods want to ban me because I haven't done so yet then I will lurk in the shadows and not post anymore.

So back to your question Sudra. I guess my agenda is to try and help people who come here hurting and I feel in my own way that I have done this (at least I hope I have).

Sorry for the T/J A1.

I hope today was a good day for you, and I will continue to pray for you my friend.

You are doing well here Booyah. Keep up the good work

Thank you western and golden!!

Hello everyone. I was shocked to see how many responses popped up over the past 2 days. Lots of great questions and support, as usual. It's late (busy couple of days at work), so I am going to wait until tomorrow to make a decent post and try to answer some of the questions. Have a good evening all.

Good to see you back A1

Have you started to make Christmas plans with your daughters for their visit?

Ofc she has a good relationship with her Sister. She helped her during and after Affair.

Did her sister ever apologized to you ? I dont think you should ever communicate with her but it would be nice to hear those words.

If you have some free days go out with your close Friends. Go for a camping,trip to another city..

Good luck.

A1,

TRT has a point. A 9 year affair is tough to hide. She did it to you because you were busy busting your ass so she could stay at home and betray you day after day. Did her sister really know ?

Not implicating her but it is a good point

Hello All,

Sorry I haven't been around much this week. Work tends to get crazy around the end of the year, so I have been spending lots of time at the office. Like I have said before, I find work therapeutic, especially now.

I had my first IC session on Tuesday. Such a strange experience. We spent the first session going over my story. Outlined what I thought I needed the most help with right now and came up with a plan of attack. She helped me put together a list of questions (many of which have been asked by members in this thread) to ask WW. Mostly designed to help me determine how committed she is to me and our family now. She said that I need to get to a point where I feel like I am in control again. I am a bit of a control freak, and feeling like a leaf on the wind generates an enormous amount of stress in my life. She also suggested an exercise that Bigger mentioned...spending a week acting and thinking like I am divorced. That is my homework. I am seeing her again next week.

Several folks were debating about what WW's therapist told her years ago. I think I expressed myself poorly by saying:

"I guess that her counselor suggested that instead of telling me though, that she work on our marriage and become the wife and mother she should have been during the years she stole from us. “Bear the burden herself,” are the words she used."

I used "I guess..." as a colloquial statement of fact. Her IC did specifically suggest that she not tell me, to spare me the pain.

motod asked whether she was using the same therapist. No. Her previous therapist moved out of the state.

I doubt (but don't know for sure whether) she confessed to our minister.

The friends who were aware of the affair are no longer in our lives. Her sister was told after AP died when she was in therapy. So, sister knew before I did, but I don't think I hold her silence against her.

I have not asked whether she visited his grave. I guess that doesn't feel very important to me at this juncture. In some sense, I feel the same way about whether she would still be cavorting with him if he didn't die. There is nothing she could say that would carry any meaning for me.

Yes, DDs and I have already made some plans for the holidays! We always attend candlelight services at our church...longstanding family tradition. I am taking them to Busch Gardens in Williamsburg Va...they do a Christmas Town event with amazing lights. We also like to visit Colonial Williamsburg around the holidays, so I have booked us rooms at the Williamsburg Inn. They have lots of family oriented Christmas themed events. I may have gone a little overboard with their Christmas gifts, but I want them to build lots of good memories this year.

I am composing an email to WW with some questions, many generated in conjunction with my therapist. I will let you know the gist of her answers.

WW has been taking care of the animals while I am at work this week, a huge load off my mind. She also seems to be cleaning the house while I am away. I guess that is a good thing? One or two fewer tasks to worry about.

Thanks again to everyone who is responding to my posts. The support is much appreciated.

Your IC sounds like a winner, setting goals at the outset.

One suggestion. Don't ask her if she has ever visited his grave because, after 9 years, I would suppose she has made such a visit. Probably soon after he died. The question to ask that will give you more about where she is in relation to her life with you is ......"When was the last time you visited his grave." If you are truly a priority in her life then she would not have been to his grave in a very long time. I do wish you well.

hope you and your daughters make some good memories this year. Sorry about your pain. you are doing so much better than many in your journey.

good question by anoldlion.

Colonial Williamsburg is excellent at this time of year. I love that place year round.

My question to you is that your IC wants you to figure out how committed she is to you and your family right now.

I don't doubt that she is committed right now. My question and one of which will probably ignite things here again is about you, not that I care about what others think. Not trying to sway you one way or the other but if you determine she is committed to you right now, does that mean you are considering R as an option ?

If yes, good for you. If not, also good for you but then how does determining her level of commitment become relevant ? That assignment is one that confuses me and probably came up based on something you said. BTW, I am having difficulties believing that you aren't in control. Though I am also having a hard time understanding why her potential status with him, had he survived, is irrelevant. Although we all think differently and have different priorities. If it means little to you, in this case, I guess that's what matters

I think you have been in control. No ?

That would be my question to the IC. Why is commitment material? If commitment means what she did for nine years (and covered up for more) then I’d be more interested into getting to the bottom of if I can accept the freshly-defined commitment.

That word, as it applies to this person and this relationship, is forever changed. The ultimately question is are you worth this commitment or are you worth an elevated form of it?

Why is commitment material?

Because it is everything. It is the facts on the ground as they stand today. Today, here, right now. It speaks to who she is, not who she was.

It was also about commitment to A1 and the family. She cheated on the whole family.

Is she willing to stand in the storm and take what is coming without flinching? How can that not be critical in whatever path? R, cooperative D, fangs out lawyer battle?

To answer a few questions before I head into work for awhile.

I believe that asking her if she would still be with him had he not died is an exercise in futility. Any answer would be pure conjecture and have no real meaning.

In terms of ascertaining her current commitment to me and our family: almost by definition it is stronger than during her affair. Only because she couldn’t have been less committed to me at that point (unless she was plotting to kill me). The question is how strong is it now. Because I wouldn’t even consider R unless she repeatedly proves she is 100% all in. We have one full year of state mandated separation limbo. At this point I consider myself the prize. It is difficult to even imagine the amount of work she will have to do to convince me that she is someone with whom I want to spend time. If that doesn’t require commitment, I don’t know what does.

Heading to work now. As always, thanks for the fast responses.

I agree with Sharkman. That is a very good question. My thoughts exactly.

Thanks A1 for giving further thoughts on it.

Some of the answers I can tell comes from your analytical mind

At this point I consider myself the prize. It is difficult to even imagine the amount of work she will have to do to convince me that she is someone with whom I want to spend time. If that doesn’t require commitment, I don’t know what does.

1. Yes, you are the prize, the one with high value. I'm glad to see you know your worth because any decisions you make will not be made from neediness.

2. You have gifted her with a legal separation.

3. She will have to move mountains, and not just for a certain period of time. IMO a WS cannot "make up for" the adultery; that the betrayal just created an empty bucket that can be filled up and called "even".

4. What does commitment look like? I believe that will be the struggle. For both of you. On its face, she became a dutiful wife, present for you and the family. To me that is probably not the commitment you need to see. Because that is what she should have been all along.

5. Can commitment be shown in "normal" everyday times? Her commitment to the M was tested once and she failed. Is it only possible to show commitment when there are tough times and circumstances?

6. I've been thinking about the years post adultery. Yes, the easy assessment is that she had no consequences. A deeper view may be that she avoided all occasions to make herself vulnerable by telling you. Why not become venerable 3,4,5 years thereafter when she had worked with a therapist and became present in her M? That would have created the tough circumstances where she could have shown commitment and change. She didn't make herself vulnerable...you found out.

7. Many will say if a person legally separates they should just D. The separation is just kicking the can down the road. I think you are doing the right thing though. It gives you time to go through your processes to come to *some* understanding.

8. The period of adultery is extreme. A separate life, a separate lifestyle. Big time cruel betrayal. But I keep focusing on the post A years. Is it possible that is a bigger betrayal?

I agree with Timelessloss. Great post there.

Regarding the post affair years, perhaps that was a huge betrayal but if I was in her shoes, I wouldn't tell you either A1 because that would mean she would lose you too.

However, I never have cheated on anyone in 48 years of life and I never would have cheated, let alone for 9 years.

I know IMO you are eyeballing R because she is coming by the house again with your consent. Your line of questioning with the counselor breathes of it too.

So, if that's the case, again 'IF', what do you want to see to make you satisfied in your mind that it's a real possibility ?

What measurable signs.

She wants her life back and probably will move mountains to do it but what do you need down the road to satisfy you enough that you don't spend years and years triggering ?

You are an analytical guy, like me. I would have it drawn out by now. Do you ?

Wow, what a story! I wish that my wife had an envelope for me. I have so many questions, and so few answers.