SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I have been reading the thread and want to chime in .. I want you to know that its incredible how far you have come in such a short time. I know it may not feel like it but you have.

I totally get what you are saying about needing space. Everyone is different and she is your greatest trigger right now. Detaching and finding yourself is so important right now, it is the next step to healing. I think your plan is a good one, and it is about you putting your emotional and mental needs on the forefront right now. Separation does not always lead to D... when the love is still there and two people come back together from a position of certainty and strength there is nothing wrong with that.

She also needs to feel the void left with you gone. Nothing will shatter her fantasy/home compartmentalization more than simply not having you there.

But to take time, to give yourself space and to go where you are supported and understood ... THAT IS SELF LOVE. You are doing what feels right for you right now. And i believe it will help you through this next phase.

I did get the impression that she got off on what she was doing and how she felt about doing it, not the act itself. More psychological than physical.

I agree. I think she was honest about the two separate lives. She was an actress playing a new role that was totally different for her and she loved being the bad girl. (Actors say this all the time when interviewed).

She was very careful to keep her two lives separate. I don’t think her two worlds totally collided until the OMW called her a “whore.” That's when what she had done finally hit home.

If I remember correctly you were her one and only. You were Ward Cleaver and she was June from “Leave it to Beaver.” What’s sad is that a rock solid spouse can give the other spouse the confidence to cheat. The solid spouse is looked upon as a parent in that the child thinks that they will always be there for them at the end of the day no matter what. (i.e. her family world was safe and secure)

I read a post where a BS asked their WS how they would feel if they (the BS) cheated on them. Their response was that they didn’t know because they couldn’t imagine the BS ever cheating.

In addition, I think she needs to refocus on what's truly important in life after her 5 month vacation.

She wants to keep the family home part of her two lives pure. So she doesn't want to bring any souvenirs home from her vacation. What happened in Vegas should stay in Vegas.

Each of her two worlds is a refuge in its own unique way. Both are diminished if one bleeds into the other.

One reason she doesn’t want you to have sex with anyone else is that she wants to keep her “Leave it to Beaver” life intact. If Ward had sex with someone else it would taint that separate world. That’s why she wants to win you back with sweet love instead of hot sex. Hot sex between the two of you would also taint her “Leave it to Beaver” home.

39) Did he ever buy you anything? Just lingerie. Slutty stuff. Nothing tasteful.

I think Mrs. W would be very torn if W gave her some slutty lingerie. On one hand she would be very happy that he was contemplating sex. On the other hand her affair would be invading her home.

What I’m afraid of is she merely wants to maintain the strict separation of her two worlds. Not destroy her fantasy world with the POS/OM. Fond memories of her vacation will be retained in a separate file in her brain.

You’re vital to her salvaging and much of her former life as possible in more ways than the obvious. You’re like Senator John McCain.

For those that don’t know he was a POW in North Vietnam for many years. He was tortured by any definition, not just water boarded. After the war Vietnam wanted to normalize relation with the U.S. and start trade which would be very beneficial to them.

Many Americans had the attitude: You won the war, fu@k you. When Senator McCain came out in favor of normal relations it pulled the rug out from under all those objecting. How could they not forgive if McCain did? You are the key to get as many of her “Leave it to Beaver” friends and family back as she can. If she has you they will follow.

[This message edited by Graywolf at 3:01 PM, August 25th (Tuesday)]

Walloped, please talk to an attorney before you leave your home for any length of time. The legalities surrounding divorce and separation vary greatly from state to state. Specific legal counsel is a must in this situation. You are in the midst of a major emotional crisis. That makes it very easy to rationalize decisions that may or may not be in your best interest going forward. It is prudent to keep your options open. Get a damn good lawyer and take their advice.

I agree with Reddawn..

She does need to feel the void emotionally, logistically, financially of you being gone if she is to learn and grow from this experience...

IMHO no progress will be made towards a good R if this separation doesn't involve her being responsible for herself..

After some initial adjustments and grieving, you may decide that you like living without her better..

If I were you, I would want to know my legal rights, and protect myself legally and financially.. Come up with a plan of what to do and who to see should you decide that a permanent separation and divorce is the route to take..

You should work out a routine for you to see the kids before you leave .Be easier on the kids if they know they will get to see you .

I'm a stay at home mom with two young kids, and I wish desperately I could have left for a couple of weeks to clear my head when I was in the thick of all the mess from my H's affair. It was just not an option for me. Just being at home and seeing their face can be a trigger. W, get away if you can...it does not have to be for a month. Be selfish for once...get away from all the triggers take some time for yourself let her handle things at home, and the mess she's made.

In answer to your question, W, it could be as simple as this. She is desperately trying to be as honest as possible at this point. Hence the details, the things you wouldn't have known about necessarily. However, if she were the one who made the call during NC, she may be terrified that it is too much. Telling you things about pre dday is one thing. Admitting she broke a post dday rule of yours might be too scary for her. This is not an excuse, of course you deserve the truth. But I am just explaining how this might be happening.

I get the (albeit from the distance of the internet) impression she really is trying to be honest. But admitting she made the call (if she did) might be terrifying her in case that is the final bail in her coffin so to speak.

Trying to work out the whys behind lies is very difficult when you don't have that mindset.

Just a thought.

Walloped, I get that you are going to go the "don't trust, just verify" approach as much as is reasonably possible on her when you are out and gone. That seems like the right call!

I like that you have realized at a deeper level that there is no going back. Your boys are going to realize that fact and you need to manage that soon -- I think that your daughters can help and since they know the truth I think your wife needs to tell them that she made mistakes and that she and you are taking time to decide the best way to go forward, that you will always both be their parents and love them but that you are going to be doing a lot of work to figure things out and need to do that while being away for a while.

With that done, I'd suggest that you let her carry the load exclusively for two or three weeks. That is, it would be like you are on a trip somewhere with a big time difference and no good way to contact. No calls, no emails, no nothing unless there is a real emergency. Just completely cut her out of your life and let her deal with making sure your kids are good with it. That's her task, she has to own it.

Go out with friends -- that is, make a point of arranging outings, not just take the chance if someone suggests it. Do it places where there will be attractive and available women. You aren't going to go get laid and probably not even going to flirt. Still you need to awaken more of the parts of you that would be active if you were divorced and look at the world with that different perspective.

Part of what you need to do (in my opinion, which could be completely wrong!) is to understand the two halves of putting your wife on a pedestal. First, you cannot fathom how that person did what she did. Second, you cannot fathom that there are other women who could make you very happy in this world. There are, without a doubt (probablity 1!) and there always will be, even if you choose to forsake all of them and return to your wife. Understanding that does not lead to you leaving, it leads to you making the best choice about why to stay.

Best wishes, and as everyone here is telling you, you have done great things for your kids, your wife, and yourself over the past few weeks.

I agree with Doggiediva and Nekorb.

While I am not a proponent of separation, I also don't classify what you are doing as true separation. It's taking time to find your own route towards healing. Although yearsofpain does make an interesting point about the timeline and legal separation if you ultimately decide to divorce.

I agree that you can't control her while you are gone but I would again emphasize that if you are serious about the polygraph, I would make that a mainstay of any future reconciliation because while you can't control what she does when you are gone, what she does and how she acts after seeing you leave will show you truly how remorseful she ultimately is. In this way, you don't need to worry go nuts monitoring her now and focus on your own healing but ultimately will get the truth when you are ready for it and before you make any major decisions on where to proceed. but I'll stop beating that horse.

Whatever you do, just protect yourself legally, allow yourself to heal.

The reason why this thread is so long is because you respond to most of the posters and I think that's a good thing because whether you agree with some or not, they all have their own experiences and share because they are trying to help. I think that's a great thing.

I also want to applaud you because you have done an excellent job climbing out of the mind-fuck that you got a few weeks ago and your analytical mind is a strong asset in enabling you to start your recovery process, wherever it leads.

So keep up the good work

[This message edited by Western at 11:00 AM, August 25th (Tuesday)]

Hey Walloped,

My 2 cents on you moving out temporarily. On the legal side, perhaps W can send you an email saying she will not rely on this temporary situation as a means to pursue legal relief of any kind, this way you don't have to worry about any time period or W taking advantage (I don't believe she would, based on what you have said...but at least the email could give you some assurance that she will not?)

And I totally understand your need to get away so you can figure out what you need to do for you and get to where you need to be!

I also agree that if the status quo is W takes care of the kids, then keep that for now. Your kids should not have to have their lives change entirely...keeping routine, in as much as possible, for them is crucial.

All of it is temporary if you haven't already ( suspect you have) make sure you set up a schedule that gives you quality time with your kids regularly and often, when you have it and it works for your kids and you! make sure she is not present other than maybe at the beginning and end of that time for purposes of communication pertaining to the kids ONLY!

I also agree about policing! When did we put on that uniform and why should we have to wear it? People have to take responsibility for their actions, not have someone else enforce them or hold them to it! Egad!

On expectations. I agree with you, serious fist bump! Reasonable expectations are what you need to find, its unrealistic to expect you to share your day to day routine with W and heal from all of this, and be in a position to have the perspective needed to decide one way or the other! Too many people have unreasonable expectations. I don't see you being unrealistic at all, to the contrary!

On the myriad of posts that are being ignored by you....Good on you! There is a wide spectrum of opinion in here, you have made another good step forward, instead of challenging each of them or responding to them....Instead You are taking what you need and leaving the rest behind! That is all you can do my friend (sorry I know we are not friends, but if I can be so bold, we are in here at the very least!)

I don't want to be trite or cliché, but no goal worth attaining was ever obtained or maintained easily, it takes hard work, dedication, self love, self respect, perseverance and tenacity! Failure is not an option. Whatever you decide to do. At least you have recognized what the possible outcomes are, so you are not going into this being deluded as to the possible outcome!

Grieving fucking sucks! I haven't felt like this since my Mom passed in April 2006! We B's are walking beside you on the twisty road you are on, some helping you navigate those cow pies....some pushing your face in the cow pies, as if you haven't suffered enough shit already! the road is long and filled with cow pies, You have put your rubber boots on, there's a lot of cow pies in the first part! You are just taking them off temporarily, to clean them up and give yourself a chance to navigate the next leg of the path so you minimize stepping in too many! They will be there, but you have a good idea of where they are or could be hiding and how you can avoid stepping in all or some of them and YOU FOR SURE WILL NOT LET ANYONE PUSH YOUR FACE IN THEM ANYMORE!

That's what I'm talking about!!

Strength to you! ((((((Walloped)))))

Want this to stop!

Walloped - I got your PM but can't PM back I don't have enough posts. Thanks for the PM - good luck my friend.

Please do me a favor google "talk about marriage" and go there please...

I'm sorry if I hurt you in any way it was not my intent.

I am a bit disturbed by your description of the BIL's attitude and reaction to all this. I kind of read it as he and your SIL know more about this than they are letting on and that he is a somewhat unwilling participant except for his wifes sake.

I could be wrong but I have acted what could be described as similar when I was made a party to someone elses deception and although not 100% on board, went along with it anyway. What is his relationship like with your children? If he is a good Uncle and he has been put into this situation, I bet some awkwardness will show.

I know you got your wife goggles slapped off pretty hard and you are seeing her differently so don't be surprised if your perception on other things start to change.

Walloped, Go back and read Marbo888 on page 25. The prey for this predator are altruistic and selfless, concerned for the welfare of others. Healthcare, home health, volunteer workers. Your wife as you knew her in March. He exploited every weakness and skillfully manipulated her into to his web. He is the worst of the worst. I am not excusing for one minute what your wife has done, but a wedding ring is a boundary. Let me use this analogy. What if she had been persuaded to smoke crack cocaine by a friend. The rush & euphoria from that hit is permanently burned in her mind. Some addicts chase that high and will sell their souls & the shoes off their feet just to find it again. She may have wanted to stop, But the manipulator had her now addicted to the powerful bonding hormone, OXYTOCIN (it is very powerful and very real). He made her an addict. Internal, anal, swallowing, were all tactics in his playbook to dominate. He was her master and now had control over her mind and she was addicted. She is now sick and needs help to stop. Bigger said your goal is to get her out of infidelity. She laid it all on the line. What more can you badger from her. She was addicted and could not or did not want to stop. She has to become aware that the fantasy was not real. Everyone here talks about the other wife. Have you no curiosity about the man who turned your world upside down. I wonder who is in the apartment now with him. Another mark. I keep thinking about Richard Gere in Unfaithful. Maybe your wife will want to find out if he was real. Devoted only to her. His subversive mate. Why not more IC for her in an intensive environment. I spent 3 weeks, in house therapy to resolve the issue that my life had become unmanageable. I worked on resentments, (many from my childhood), disclosure, letting go, making amends & earning forgiveness , and then working with others who suffer to stay out of self. Self for me put me in a place to relapse. I have but a daily reprieve based on my spiritual condition. Why not try to get into IC before your Thursday appointment to run things by your therapist. Your wife is sick & you and your family need her. Help her heal. My prayers are with your family every day.

Walloped -

I just want to say there is nothing wrong with you having empathy and compassion for your wife ...as long as it doesn't prevent you from being honest with yourself about the situation, doesn't encourage codependenc or rugsweeping, doesn't cause you pain, doesn't prevent you from prioritizing your own self care and healing, etc.

I'm just saying that because it seems there are some folks who want to condemn her no matter what, and no effort on her part gets acknowledged at all.

I imagine that it feels fucked up in her mind as well. No matter how hard she tries, she isn't going to do it perfectly. It just is what it is.

(((W)))

I am a bit disturbed by your description of the BIL's attitude and reaction to all this. I kind of read it as he and your SIL know more about this than they are letting on and that he is a somewhat unwilling participant except for his wifes sake.

Wall put his implicit trust in SIL and the first thing that she did was lie to him. Of course BIL will be unsettled, Bro Code is alive and real.

I keep seeing posts suggesting that Walloped go all in to help his wife heal. Walloped can't take the lead in helping his wife heal until he heals himself. They can't help each other ehal at this point because the pain is different as are the triggers. As good as a job he has done, his head still isn't wrapped around this. Hence, his moving out for a month. Let him get settled and then if and when he decides to reconcile (if)he can help her heal. She did this to herself, love drugs or not, she put herself in the position. She needs to be pro-active in undoing her own damage. I do agree that she seems like she's trying

My self I would tell my wife "Your gonna take me to his apartment, you should be able to find it with your eyes closed. I want to know where he sleeps. What he drives." "Its none of your business what revenge I may seek with your fvckbuddy! If you break NC were done."

I would send someone there to give your regards and get the cuff links back and just let him know you know what he drives and where he lives.

Man! If you lived closer I would come do it for you. People like him need to be cut off at the knees!

DEAR WALLOPED!

Sorry if my english is bad, Im italian, I understand english but I am not a good writter yet. I move to USA a few months ago.

Recently I read about Ashley madison’s news, and i felt curiosity for whats the site its about. So I discovered this page and the firts post that I read was yours.

Firtsly, I have to tell you that your story touched me a lot, because it reminded me of a good friend , who suffered greatly when she discovered the treachery of her husband.

Before to start to writte my opinion on your situation , I must clarify first that I've never been married and I have no children, I am single now and, Im 24 years old.

Probably you are thinking now that Im too Young for have any knowledge about live’s struggles , but let me tell you something, In my 24 years I fell in love, I cried, have been betrayed, I have known many people with the same problems, I have taken decisions that have changed in some way my character and my way of acting toward life, and that I will continue taking on new forms, because nothing in life is constant , of course not at all compares with your suffering.

When I read your post, inmediately I contact with my friend, she’s french and she is 36 years , she through for all your situation years ago, her husband betrayed during the half of their years of marriage, She loved him very much, and the betrayal of your wife is small compared to that of her husband , the important thing here is, that she make a big decison: divorce. It was horrible for everybody an specially for their daughter. Now, she doesn't cry anymore. she is happy because her heart doesn't suffer anymore. She and I discused about how you are resolving your situation, and we agree in a few things:

First: The only guilty here is your wife,

Second: Of the two, who suffer most is you, because you was the deceived part.

Third: Your wounds will deepen as you're knowing the details of your intimate relationship with her lover

Now, do you really want to continue whit your marriage? Are you sure that you will be happy again?

The answer its NO, you never gonna be happy again, why? The simple reason is that your will never trust on your wife again. It doesn't matter if you use hundreds of lie detector to know what she feels, what she think and what made, nothing will be the same.

At this point, you know everything that she did with her lover, let me ask you one thing,

Do you feel better? or Doing that relief your suffering? probably NO.

It is insane that you use a lie detector in her, you're denigrating yourself as person.

Walloped, if you want to come back whit your wife, just do it, but, this implies that you have to turn the page of the betrayal and pick up your marriage, try to pretend that nothing has changed and go back to being the happy couple that were.

Now, I 'm going to talk about your wife. Probably she's a good mother, she's a good friend, daugther and she was a good wife.

When a women starts looking for love in another man is because it is missing. A woman who truly loves her husband and respects it never would betray him.

Perhaps you thought that your marriage was ok, that there were no problems, but all that you are going through now is a proof that sometthing was amiss as a couple.

Your marriage is over, that is your reality.

So, take a break, don't be afraid. Take as much time that you need to think and analyse each part of your life, put in a balance the good and the bad. Imagine how your life would be if you chose to forgive your wife.

I think Walloped plan is sound.

He moves out. Concentrates on his issues and heals.

He gets his mind on where it needs to be concerning his feelings, his family and his marriage.

And I think his wife truly needs space now to.

She needs to reflect on herself. She needs to reflect on her own actions. She needs to look deep inside herself on what she truly wants in her life. What does she desire?

ANd you know what else.....

If I were her husband I wouldn't monitor her at all.

I would give her all the freedom to fix her issues that she can fix in a month. I would give her that time to decide just who she wants in her life and how she plans to spend the next 3o years of her life. And with whom she plans to spend those years with.

And if she goes off the reservation so be it. If it was my wife I would give her plenty of rope to move around freely. Hopefully she becomes the woman she always claimed to be.

Hopefully she does not hang herself with all that rope.

The lie detector will uncover any issues before and during the separation.

JMO.

HM

One other point I've been meaning to make --

If the fucker called her 14 times and even went as far as to track her down at her sister's house within 48 hours of being caught, it lessens the likelihood that he's a professional player and was just a puppy dog in love divorcee.

14 times is fucking pathetic. No self-respecting man would call 14 times in one day, particularly under those circumstances. He was being driven by something other than predatory vagina hunting.