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I think that even if you are 99% sure that they took it all the way, you should do the poly just to remove any doubt and give you peace of mind in that you know the truth with respect to that.

You say that they could not have got together at your house, could they have gone elsewhere ? Other than the car? Or are you thinking they took it all the way in the car?

You say that they could not have got together at your house, could they have gone elsewhere ? Other than the car? Or are you thinking they took it all the way in the car?

Mrs Flibble admitted going to his house at least twice so there was opportunity other than the car or the Flibble home.

Oh! I see. I now understand why Mr Fibble is fairly sure they took it all the way.

Thanks.

Mrs Fibble is one those smart WW. She’s been manipulating the situation since the beginning of her affair. If it wasn’t for that one text, at the wrong time, she’d still be in it. Since that time, she been playing the “long game”, trickle truthing at the right time. Mr. Fibble coming here to SI has thrown her plan of the rails. She knew the poly was coming, so she figured, I’ll drop a small detail, maybe that will be enough to make him back off the poly. It almost worked, till Mr F mentioned it here at the end of one of his updates and we all jumped on his ass for almost dismissing it.

So what does she do? What she does best. Manipulate the situation. The poly is definitely going to happen now and she will fail. If she confesses now, she’ll be thrown out with no chance of R. But then the another lockdown looms, perfect timing! I’ll confess some more, not all, just most and see what happens. Mr Fibble won’t be able to throw me out and he won’t be able leave either. She bought some time now and even though the divorce is still on, reconciliation is off the table(for now), the poly is no longer needed, play the long game.

I do agree that a polygraph would clear everything. I do also agree that it isn't up to Mr. Flibble to pursue it, it should be on his WW.

I hope everything is going well Mr. Flibble.

Mrs Fibble is one those smart WW. She’s been manipulating the situation since the beginning of her affair. If it wasn’t for that one text, at the wrong time, she’d still be in it. Since that time, she been playing the “long game”, trickle truthing at the right time. Mr. Fibble coming here to SI has thrown her plan of the rails. She knew the poly was coming, so she figured, I’ll drop a small detail, maybe that will be enough to make him back off the poly. It almost worked, till Mr F mentioned it here at the end of one of his updates and we all jumped on his ass for almost dismissing it.

So what does she do? What she does best. Manipulate the situation. The poly is definitely going to happen now and she will fail. If she confesses now, she’ll be thrown out with no chance of R. But then the another lockdown looms, perfect timing! I’ll confess some more, not all, just most and see what happens. Mr Fibble won’t be able to throw me out and he won’t be able leave either. She bought some time now and even though the divorce is still on, reconciliation is off the table(for now), the poly is no longer needed, play the long game.

Reminds me of that line from Kill Bill... “You gotta hand it to the old girl. I never saw nobody buffalo Bill the way she buffaloed Bill.”

Well she tried. But MrF didn’t fall for it.

- having a secret phone

- being coached on how to hide everything by him

- sexting and pictures being exchanged

- many more meetings in public places AND his car

- she had been to his place 2 times

and many more minor details

Good grief

As you stated you would want to know

Complete new timeline required

And as your now aware the minor details are often minimized

Then poly as at a later stage when the anger and disgust dies the honesty going forward is the greatest measure of her mindset

Was she coached after D Day ?

As her AP didn't throw her under the bus ?

Which makes no sence

Sorry I went dark, but I had a lot on my hands this past week. All this assets separation is way harder and time consuming than I originaly anticipated. I exchanged about 200 emails just past few days with my lawyer and guy who manages our finances. It's a nightmare but we slowly make our way forwards. Looks like we will lose a good bit of money we put into our stocks portofolio, but there is no other way how to keep the house so I try to not be bothered by it.

Things at home are kind of "meh" right now. It's hard to detach while being locked in a house 24/7 and with SO who really wants to connect, on any level, every chance she gets. She reminds me every day that she will keep fighting, is very sorry for everything and she still plans to take the poly as soon as possible. She wanted to go throught questions I would like her to answer but I feel like we are long past a point where it mattered.

When it comes to me, I try to keep my new attitude = no more Mr. Whatever guy. It definitely helps when dealing with practical issues of getting our finances in order. The only downfall I find worth mentioning (never noticed before) is that my new attitude makes her VERY bothered, in the good sense. I have never subscribed to that alpha/beta paradigm, but maybe there is some truth in it. At least when it comes to my wife.

Fact?

Your wife is now terrified that you're actually going to leave her. And, on that, she's in deep deep denial in that it might really happen. The really bad part is: but oh yes, it is.

hollowhurt I pretty much know her motives for lying - fear and self-preservance. I know I might still have my rose-colored glasses on, but I don't see any malice in her actions. Now. Before, during her A? Absolutely.

I asked her for truth, repeatedly. What I got was more lies. So I am done with that. Not words, but actions. She is a proven liar now, so everything she says now is a lie until proven otherwise.

She claims to have destroyed the burner phone days after dday, where was she hiding it?

She kept it in her desk at work. Charged it there, too. But she WAS using it at home, quite often actually. I can't believe I didn't notice. She kept it in her walk-in closet, hidden in one of her shoes.

Did she use it to communicate with SH after Dday?

Not that I know of. And I doubt it since she dropped him like hot potato the moment I busted her. He tried to contact her later on her personal number and she told me right away and blocked both numbers.

Who purchased it?

She did, as instructed by SH. It was the cheapest Samsung, paid in cash.

When it comes to physical part - she denies it went further than kissing and wandering hands. I was very direct - she denies handjobs, fingering, oral or any other kind of sexual activity so she won't get me on technicalities. He also never saw her full naked or even her boobs. Only in her underwear on pics.

I couldn't sleep last night so I vent over her timeline again. And I found an interesting pattern - everytime their A got "heated" it culminated with a meeting where she put a breaks on (or so she says) and immedietaly after there are "pauses" for one or two weeks then It picks up again. I thing there are two possible explanations:

1) he got what he wanted

2) he didn't got what he wanted and either lost interest or realized he still needs to put more work

The only downfall I find worth mentioning (never noticed before) is that my new attitude makes her VERY bothered, in the good sense. I have never subscribed to that alpha/beta paradigm, but maybe there is some truth in it. At least when it comes to my wife.

Not sure how this is a downfall. But I might not be getting it. Could you elaborate?

For someone so skilled in the art of infidelity, shithead sure fucked up by sending that one text. When you think about, your WW was actually in control of the affair from the start. No emotions involved, physical to a point(or so she claims), gaslighting you like a seasoned pro......

These are not traits of a “coached” cheater. These are well thought out actions, delivered with precision. I predict in the next few weeks your WW is going to break if you continue with your newfound attitude. And by break, I mean really spill her guts with the truth and what really went down.

I gave her numerous opportunities, kept moving the poles but every rope comes to a point when it just snaps. And I think I already came to mine. She keeps asking me what she can do to make this right and I have no idea.

She knew what to do but didn't do it. This is her words from your first post : "Told me she now realises this whole mess could have been avoided if she were honest." Since the same thing has happened several times, it seems that she didn't really realize it. Moreover, this is the best of the possibilities. If she had realised this but continued to lie, she knew that honesty will not save the situation and the truth will make things much worse.

What I can't understand is why she nuked our R on her own. I would never know about most of what she told me, she covered her tracks pretty well. I would say either the threat of poly or her guilt pushed her to come clean.

The threat of poly of course. Think about the previous TT's. Were they also said out of guilt? There is an unnoticed point here; when a piece of truth is told, untold pieces are still hidden. Of course, she is well aware of this. Revealing a little truth in the name of being honest in order to hide a more important truth cannot be done with a feeling of guilt.

Each time, looking into your eyes, knowing she was lying, she said that she had decided to be honest and had nothing else to hide. She always gave the truth bit by bit to see how much would be enough for you. Sorry, but that's not a good sign of personality.

The only downfall I find worth mentioning (never noticed before) is that my new attitude makes her VERY bothered, in the good sense. I have never subscribed to that alpha/beta paradigm, but maybe there is some truth in it. At least when it comes to my wife.

I also don't like this type of naming. But these facts were known long before they were called that way.

Now your WW sees you are done with TT and you don't care about the rest. That's why she is bothered. She was probably planning to give you enough truth to keep you in marriage. She can no longer continue to TT unless you allow her. Therefore, I wouldn't recommend asking questions about the A. Just accept it as if the worst happened and continue the D steps. Let her find for what needs to be done, until you are satisfied. If she can't or doesn't want, D is already in process.

If the truth is horrible for you and D is inevitable when told, she has two options; she tells it and takes her chances for the hope of R or she agrees to D sticking to her story and hopes for being friends in the future.

Couldn't the whole truth really be only that much? Even so, she caused it by bringing it this far, this way. She has no right to complain.

I pretty much know her motives for lying - fear and self-preservance.

This fear and self-preservation motives didn't come into play at first, though. She didn't end the relationship when you had doubts and fights with her about it, but she did only when she was caught.

She kept it in her desk at work. Charged it there, too. But she WAS using it at home, quite often actually. I can't believe I didn't notice. She kept it in her walk-in closet, hidden in one of her shoes.

The questions that struck me here is why didn't the messages sent by SH's X-GF show the next stages of the A? Where were the pictures? Was SH also using burner phone?

Did they study not only not to get caught, but also what to do in case of being caught? Could that "we went too far" messages have been specifically left on the phone to give the impression that they are not going any further? But if it were, SH would delete the ILY messages so that his X-GF wouldn't see it. A bit complicated...

I have said several times that you coped well with this situation from the very beginning. You say it like you're just getting started, but you're actually acting like an alpha male from the very beginning. That's why my view about your future is always positive. I know that no matter what decision you take, you will come out of this situation as strong as possible.

There were never any brakes put on, that’s not how this stuff works

And I found an interesting pattern - everytime their A got "heated" it culminated with a meeting where she put a breaks on (or so she says) and immedietaly after there are "pauses" for one or two weeks then It picks up again. I thing there are two possible explanations:

1) he got what he wanted

2) he didn't got what he wanted and either lost interest or realized he still needs to put more work

For the pro APs I think it's more about the game or conquest than the sex. I don't think he'd lose interest as that would be failing. Didn't he have multiples going on. If she did bolt there could have been some avoidance or pull back on her part. It could have been on his part to cut back her ego kibbles and push up her desperation to go further.

When did she buy the phone? Insist she be honest. Layer that over the timeline. Of course asking that ramps up her hope and causes you more drama.

Mr F. Do you have a game plan if your wife actually sets up the polygraph and passes all of your questions? Of course, the divorce will proceed to its final conclusion regardless. However, if she passes the poly, will you agree to attempt to reconcile?

You mentioned that you didn’t sleep last night. Just wondering, is your wife sleeping like a baby?

She wanted to go throught questions I would like her to answer but I feel like we are long past a point where it mattered.

First do NOT do that -- IF you have her do this you use questions that YOU want and that she hasn't rehearsed a 1000 times.

Second, the mere fact that she had a burner -- went OUT and bought it, and was active in PLANNING this affair with the POSOM -- yeah, this was more than just kissing. This went on for months? And NO sex -- just doesn't stand up to scrutiny.