SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

They are just thoughts swirling in my head along with everything else. This is the one time me being selfish comes in handy. I am too selfish to leave them. I don't want to miss out on her life or anything that happens. I lost my mom 3 years ago. Even though I am an adult, I still feel like I have lost having a mom there. I can't go to her with my happiness or sadness. I would never want my daughter to experience that. They are just horrible thoughts, and I know there are others who have felt this way.

My therapist made me realize that I have very little self worth and rely on what others think of me. It is absolutely true. My BS thinks I am a heartless piece of shit with no soul and no ounce of goodness. That's what I see now when I look in the mirror. He's known me for 17 years. He knows me better than I know myself at times. If that's what he sees, then it must be true.

That is what I am trying to fight against, because I never saw myself as that. Then I feel bad that I don't want to agree with his opinion of me.

I know this is just the beginning of this rollercoaster, and I am already closing my eyes tight ready to scream in fear. That scares the hell out of my too. I AM on this rollercoaster for the whole ride, but I am also hurting. I inflicted his pain and my own. This forum is the only place I can talk about it, because I don't want him to think that I think my pain is more important than his, because I don't.

Your husband did NOT always feel that way about you. His thoughts are 100% related to your affair. Of course he will sometimes feel you are a POS and heartless, because you were during your affair.

But are you truly heartless? Do you not care about and truly love your husband?. Unless everything you wrote on your thread is fabricated, then that statement is entirely false. If anything this shows the disconnect between what you write on a forum and what you are conveying to your husband.

Instead of spending precious time beating yourself up,perhaps you need to focus on a way to save the relationship, even if you cannot save the marriage.

Your husband may never be able to forgive you without a divorce. The reason he beat down your AP was a primal need to render justice. However that justice was one-sided which is why there is all the talk of you suffering no consequences. Right or wrong it is what it is.

There may be a way for you both to get what you need. As much as he may need to divorce you (render justice) he truly does not want to lose you.

Are you 100% willing to do the 2-5 years to recover from an affair, if there is a agreement that after divorce you remain living together as coparents with boundaries?. This may give him the "out" he desperately has been searching for.

You wrote something that may lead him to believe remaining together post divorce is possible.

My fear of divorcing isn't about if I will be able to financially survive, it's about if I will be able to emotionally survive without him. Finances would suck ass, but I would manage. He would never leave me financially hurting. Losing him would destroy me. Just like I have destroyed him now.

This is NOT meaningless to a BS. This may be what he needs to hear to stay beyond the divorce.

Talk to him again. Tell him if he needs the divorce, you will agree to it IF he is willing to give you the 2-5 years to rebuild a different relationship while remaining together as coparents. Include what you posted above if he doubts you will stay.

Everyone who has read both of your threads knows he loves you very much, as do you. There is no reason that divorce means the end of the love you both share.

What I have written here about my love for him isn't fake, and I have told him how much I love him. But those words mean nothing to him now, according to him. I also told him last night that losing him would destroy me. He said he wishes I could have figured that out before I betrayed him. I am ready to do the 2-5+ years to rebuild. I would do the in house co-parenting, but he has said that me being around is potentially what's stopping him from healing.

I have no reason to lie on this forum. Plus, anything I say can easily be brought to his attention and he can then easily say when I am lying. I also don't say anything on here to make myself look good, if that's even possible being a WW. What I say here, I have said to him. I haven't written anything he doesn't already know or something I won't tell him later on.

I am thankful that he sent me the link to this site. I need the advice and criticism. I need people who have lived through to tell me when I'm overreacting or full of shit or that there is a sliver of hope. I don't have anyone in the real world to really talk to. My three friends that know haven't been through this. Well one has, but she isn't much help. While I did confess to them, I haven't really gone back for support because they are giving me the "your my friend and I love you and you are a good person" speech, instead of the "you royally fucked up and need to fix your shit what the fuck were you thinking" speech. Those are the talks that I need. I love them for still Loving me, but I need the truth not the it will all be rainbows and butterflies.

LD,

It doesnt take a WW to feel as if she is an unfit mother. My wife carries a whole bunch of mommy guilt. I could of did this better, I could of did that better. I messed up my kids. I need to show her all the good things she has done in helping our children grow. I think a bunch of women, NOT ALL, carry some worries from seeing how their parents raised them and try want to do better.

Have you done everything right, probably not. No one is a perfect parent. Have you been selfish recently, hell yes. Your DD is just starting school. Odds are she will not remember your selfish period as she grows and matures. So start now showering her with love. But still be a parent, reaching her right from wrong. To be respected, responsible, caring, etc... Too many young parents want to be a childs friend rather than a parent. It's a fine line, I'm sure you'll figure it out.

As for your BH, keep fighting for him. Even if he says he wants to D. D takes time. You have to sort out your splits. Work on yourself to become a better partner. To make him feel safe as he said to you that one time lying in bed. Though you do, for your only sanity did to also prepare for a possible D. I like the suggestion made about giving him a D and still cohabiting, being co-parents under the same roof. You will need to work out logistics since you both will be technically single. Cover all your bases. If you can offer him a fair post-nup agreement in lieu of D, that may be another avenue to look into. But you both would need to get lawyers to look out for your own best interests.

FWIW, I as a former BS many years ago, am pulling for you. Though I'm an outsider looking in, you seem to be getting it. Keep working on yourself. Keep trying to show him how much he means to you. Dont give up if he ask for D. Dont give up til the D is official.

My therapist made me realize that I have very little self worth and rely on what others think of me. It is absolutely true. My BS thinks I am a heartless piece of shit with no soul and no ounce of goodness. That's what I see now when I look in the mirror. He's known me for 17 years. He knows me better than I know myself at times. If that's what he sees, then it must be true.

Everyone has been a piece of shit at some point in their lives. Maybe not by cheating, but no one is perfect and EVERYONE has made a mistake by making a poor choice. EVERYONE.

I am a former OW and haven't been one for over 8 years now. I am also an alcoholic and have been sober for 7 years. I don't normally post much but I just felt compelled to post here.

One of the reason I started reading this site when I first got sober was to help in my recovery. To realize the mistakes and choices I made did affect other people. And they were shitty choices to make. I can never justify being with a married man. As I read more and more of the BS stories, can't really put into words how even more shitty I felt about what I had done. But I needed to read them at the time. I needed to understand how my behavior affected someone else.

One of the things that keep people stuck is negativity and constantly telling ourselves we are a waste of space. As long as you tell yourself this, you will always be this. You need to become a better person for YOU first. You can't do it for someone else you need to do it for YOU, because doing it for someone else is just coasting along. Once you do it for you the rest will follow.

Your husband may never get over this and he has every right to be angry. Just like some of my friends can't get over how I was when I was drinking. Some things can't be unseen or unheard or even forgiven. It's a life lesson and even if we lose someone we truly love, we learn. And sometimes we have to move on from the loss, because this is part of the consequences that we brought on ourselves.

I truly believe that people can change and learn thru their mistakes. It's a long hard road, but really it can be done. I know for myself I am not the same person I was 8 years ago.

Not really sure if I am articulating what I am trying to say, but I hope it makes sense!

[This message edited by Lilypad at 9:07 PM, September 2nd (Monday)]

Posted by 66charger:

Talk to him again. Tell him if he needs the divorce, you will agree to it IF he is willing to give you the 2-5 years to rebuild a different relationship while remaining together as coparents. Include what you posted above if he doubts you will stay.

I'm sure this is not meant to be construed in a bad way, but I would be incredibly insulted by this type of suggestion.

It sounds like the cheater would be doing the betrayed spouse a favor and she is somehow owed something because she is graciously "agreeing" to a divorce that he doesn't need her agreement for.

So I would tread lightly with the "I'll do this if you do that" approach, Life destroyer.

Just my 2 cents.

Last night I told him how I felt after I heard what my daughter asked him. He said he understood, hopes I can get help, and told me to get out of my woe-is-me feeling. He then told me that we will be divorcing. He has been on that side for two weeks, and his feelings haven't changed. I begged for him to give us a few months to see if he has happy moments. We went back and forth. He did admit that he still loves me and wants to be with me, but he won't let himself. He won't let himself because that would mean he is being stupid. I stuck to those words and kept begging. Hearing him actually say the words "we will be divorcing," fuck man. I could feel my body crushing down on me.

LD, I know that this isn't the outcome that you wanted. But I want you to know that you have shown a lot of bravery and strength in your posts here. Your daughter still needs you. Redemption and becoming a safe person is possible and I think you'll get there whether you D or R. Hold on and stay strong for her.

I'm not giving up on him. I'm fighting for the part of him that still loves me and wants to be with me. I will fight for him to allow himself to let that part of him open up.

. But I want you to know that you have shown a lot of bravery and strength in your posts here. Your daughter still needs you. Redemption and becoming a safe person is possible and I think you'll get there whether you D or R. Hold on and stay strong for her.

Thank you! I know I will become a safe partner again because I REFUSE to let myself be that person I was during the A.

LD, if I may comment. I’ve read most of your posts as well as your BH. My opinion is that you are doing everything you think you can to show yourself a safe partner, which I honestly think is admirable. Unfortunately, there is a but. The one major thing I see and forgive me, but I don’t know either of you, is that you can’t feel the destruction, the mental aspect of what he’s going through. I’m talking about the deepest hurt, anger despair.

What you can see are the external emotions that are showing. Realize that he is going through mind movies of you having sex with the POSOM, spending loving time with him and particularly involving his children in your escapades.

He is looking at two women, one he loved dearly and the other who acted in a very shitty manner, might I say whorish.

You are working to become the former, but as I said, you cannot delve into his psyche to even begin to see what he is seeing and thinking. It’s totally devastating.

You said that your mother passed recently, may I offer my condolences.

The thing is looking at that scenario and I’m not trying to belittle your pain and agony at that, but consider that you probably still are working at that loss, now liken it to some degree to the death of your marriage and that’s exactly what it is when someone cheats especially the way you did. In the passing of a loved one, you will never see that person again.

Now consider that your marriage died the minute you started having feelings for your AP, but in this scenario, your BH sees you daily. Do you not think that his hurt, humiliation is not multiplied with every interaction, every time you want to hold or kiss him? Essentially, you have not given him the time and space to grieve.

I hope you can delve through my thought process here as I am trying to be helpful in getting you to see that there’s more here than what you hear or see.

It seems in trying to to the right thing, you are smothering him, which probably makes him wonder why as it was so easy for you to betray him. He probably wonders what does she want from me.

I guess the point I’m trying to make in this long diatribe, is that perhaps you should give him room to breathe as well as grieve his loss.

I honestly believe you are sorry for what happened, but unfortunately none of us have the foresight to see the future.

If I may add just a bit more. When my XWW left me, I pulled the plug within a few days and in your situation, I would have done exactly what your BH did with the only difference being that I would have left you on his doorstep with your belongings.

That being said and again I reiterate it’s me that would have done that.

Notwithstanding that, I do see the work you are putting into reparation of what was a marriage and I offer you kudos on that, I’ve been reading these types of forums for a long time and it’s not often the wayward puts in the work you seem to be doing.

All in all, I do wish you both the best regardless of the outcome and hopefully the conclusion will bring all involved peace.

LD- don't give up. Just stay the course. What your husband is saying and doing is normal and part of the roller coaster. I'm almost 3 years out and I heard "divorce" probably 50 times. Just keep your actions matching your words. My husband jokes one of the reasons we didn't divorce is because I refuse to leave. Just keep at it.

I would echo both Old Wounds and Pinkpggy. It's a hard balance of giving them room, but staying resilient, understanding and not giving up. My H also told me he wanted a divorce in the middle of month 9. We even rearranged our house to have in house separation and proceeded to live like that for a short time. I know of another successfully reconciled couple in which they were separated for months after DDAY. Keep supporting him the best you can, and keep working on yourself. You can't control the outcome, but you can control your energy in the best ways it can be used. Become the woman you deserve to be, the one your husband deserves. Rise up. Don't swim in shame, you will be lost in the abyss.

Lifedestroyer: Maybe your husband wants you to fight for your marriage.

Or,

Maybe he wants you to finally respect him, his wants, his needs, and his decisions.

At this point, it isn't about what you want anymore.

My heart has been pounding so hard today. Every time I had a moment where I wasn't speaking, my heart would jump right up to my throat. I just kept replaying his words in my head all day. I had to walk down to my daughter's class in hopes I could hug, but she was busy.

I'm so sorry. I know what it's like to have consequences become terrifyingly real, when during the time you made those bad choices, your wayward brain convinced you it would never happen.

((LifeDestroyer))

[This message edited by BraveSirRobin at 10:11 PM, September 3rd (Tuesday)]

It is never a good thing when the decision to divorce is made, and I am sorry for you. But actions have consequences

Yes, I do see that you do love your husband right now, but I would like to ask a question. Why do you want to stay married to him? Is staying married in his best interest, or your best interest?

What will help him heal from your betrayal?

I’m sorry. Good luck.