SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

They hear stories of BH saying things that upset me and they interpret it as him being vindictive.

These are the words of someone who hasn't been through a betrayal on this level or if they have they have completely rugswept it.

Pretty much your affairs are kind of like stomping on a bug. You crushed his very mind and soul. Not only that you have done it three times with your multiple ddays.

*AP (I believe you mean your BS) has my phone and access to everything, and he's upset about some of the things my dad texted me. He says my dad is in "denial" when he says that I must have had reasons for why I did what I did, that I can't let BH's anger turn me into a shell of my former self, and that if BH won't decide to work on fixing the relationship then eventually I need to cut my losses because that's no way to live.

You know its only been in the last 40 years that mental health organizations have actually realized what happens with the betrayal from the affair. The symptoms the BS goes through are the same as PTSD. Think about is... your husband is going through the same thing that someone who has come home from war on terror.

That said, the old mantra on healing from affairs is to forgive and forget i.e. rugsweep the motherfucker, and never talk about it again. All this causes is the emotions bottle up and they will come out in a huge explosion.

The next manta is that there must have been something lacking in the relationship that caused the wayward to go off and fuck someone else. That is in itself is bullshit. That is like saying your BS held a gun to your head and make you fuck the AP.

My mom said the old "There was something missing in the relationship" to me. I am proud to say that I looked her straight in the eye and told her that was total bullshit. I told her that there was nothing my wife did that made my affair a reality. It was all because of my selfish and self-centered bullshit.

Finally you are and you will continue to be scrutinized. Your words and your actions will looked at with a fine tooth comb. You blew up his world. He is trying to get his mind wrapped around this destruction.

Finally the healing timeline for this is 2-5 years, and this is only if your actions and words show that you are being remorseful. You may not realize this but the outcome of the relationship is mostly in your hands. I say mostly because sometimes affairs are simply a dealbreaker and sometimes it takes awhile for the BS to come to that conclusion. If its not an out of the gate deal breaker, your actions, your words, will be the determination if you are going to be safe or not and if he is going to remain married to you or not.

CantEatCantSleep: I read your post and you seemed somewhat sincere ,remorseful and certainly wuiye articulate but for some reason decided against responding. I just felt you might not have been truthful in some way.

Well I read your BH's post and was not surprised that he mentioned something very wayward and unconscionable and totally disrespectful and humiliating that you did and failed to mention during your infidelity. Your BH indicated that you took the OM to your matrimonial home while he was away on business trips and had sex in your matrimonial home. I am assuming you probably did so in the marital bed? Did you intentionally leave this out in your post?

Clearly your BH made mention of this which means it is a serious issue for him and to his psyche( and should be)Yes you had an adulterous affair but IMO it is far more complicated as it relates to R when you also totally disrespected your BH and the marriage by bringing the OM into your marital home and seemingly the bedroom you two share and then turn around and have sex with your BH in the same bed. You only stopped this behavior because you were caught. It shows a lack of decency and respect for your own self. Seriously speaking how can you or why would really expect your BH to consider Reconciliation after he experienced such heinous castrating betrayal?

CantSleepCantEat, being a Wayward really sucks and the consequences are justifiably painful. It appears you don't like some of the feedback you are getting.

You still have a tremendous amount of work to do on yourself. If you are smart you will pay close attention to what the seasoned, experienced posters here are telling you (even if it hurts your feelings). Whether you realize it or not, you are getting the best free advice on the planet.

Hello,

Firstly, I apologize for the lack of responses the last few days. I have been working on the disclosure for my BH, which has taken me away from here. I truly do appreciate the advice and feedback I get here - it has proven immensely useful in my self-reflection so far, and I'm sure it will continue to be. I will post a more detailed response when I am not on my phone, to ensure I address everything.

In the meantime: No, AP was never in the bed BH and I shared. He was never on that level of the home. I did invite him over to our house once when BH was away, but (truly) my intent was to experience some time with him without having to *do* anything. We were always out, or in hotels, and I wanted to know what an evening of nothing was like with him. Yes, sex happened, but it was on the main level of the home only, and at the end of the night (not that it really matters, but it's important to me to clarify). I have since replaced the couch.

I did not intentionally leave it out of my post - yes, it bothers BH substantially. And yes, it should. I regretted it as soon as it happened. AP asked to come over again the next night, and I told him "no".

Thanks again, for keeping me accountable. I need it right now.

Give it your best effort, that's all you can do. good luck.

[This message edited by MickeyBill2016 at 11:26 PM, August 6th (Sunday)]

Thanks for your response regarding the issue of inviting your OM to your marital home. I hope you realize this was a terrible idea all around and tells me you were not in "insanity mode" neither can you use the term "was not thinking" when you did this. From your own words you wanted to see what it was like spending time with OM "without doing anything" IN YOUR MARITAL HOME- Really? Whether or not it was on a different level of the house, it does not matter,you brought OM there and had sex with him; this was your husband's castle, this was where he felt safe and secure, this was where he felt like he was in charge, this was his haven. You took this away from him and gave this to OM, no wonder OM wanted to return the next night. Not to beat up on you, but I want you to see what you have done to your BH's mental psyche, his emotional and physical health. He cannot ever feel safe and comfortable in his own home knowing the disrespect and disregard you intentionally dished out to him. This will forever haunt him. The idea of you being somewhat impatient with his lack of motivation and effort to reconcile is preposterous. You need to be extremely patient and give him time even if it ends in a decision to divorce. You are being unreasonable in wanting him to be quick and get over it and move on with the marriage. You really are delusional if you expect a quick resolution, considering the only reason he knows is because OMW contacted him, you did not confess, as a matter of fact you deleted evidence and lied, you and trickle truthing was your mantra, eventually you buckled under pressure from him.This affair would have continued had OM's wife not seen the love note.

Your BH saw your love messages of wanting to runaway with OM to be together forever and all the emotional, passionate sexual exchanges between you and OM. So why should BH believe anything you say now?

Did you ever describe how much you loved your BH in any of these exchanges with OM? Did you ever tell OM how guilty you felt in betraying your husband? Did you at anytime stop the sexual affair? You continued to meet with OM even after he left the company, you pursued and planned sexual trysts for a whole year.

Why would it make sense to BH now when you tell him you want to save the marriage? He is being rational with his feelings and has every right to be ambivalent, and to ever trust you. To the contrary you are the irrational one expecting your BH to get over this and give you emotional stability and not put you "on hold" indefinitely. Please realize you broke the boundaries of the marriage and by doing so you lost the opportunity to decide Reconciliation if and when.

In the meantime: No, AP was never in the bed BH and I shared. He was never on that level of the home. I did invite him over to our house once when BH was away, but (truly) my intent was to experience some time with him without having to *do* anything. We were always out, or in hotels, and I wanted to know what an evening of nothing was like with him. Yes, sex happened, but it was on the main level of the home only, and at the end of the night (not that it really matters, but it's important to me to clarify). I have since replaced the couch.

Hmmm so you had your AP in your martial home to see what life would be like when you ran away together into the sunset. But that's ok because you ONLY played husband and wife down stairs and ONLY had sex on the couch. And hey you replaced the couch so it is a non issue now anyway right?

Can you see how you are minimising the damage your A has done to your BH? If you can't see what damage you have done with your A, Trickle Truth (I hate that term it is lying) and plans to leave your husband for your AP then I can see how you are getting inpatient for him to get over it already.

Please take some time to put yourself in your BH's shoes - how would you be feeling if he had been the one having the A. If you had to find out from someone else. If he continued to lie and disrespect you. Then see how you feel about his healing time line.

Apologies in advance, because I'm sure this is going to be really long. I have a lot of catching up to do. I'm going to split this up so that I don't have multiple responses to the same people in the same reply.

HellFire - I would like to sincerely thank you. What you said has taken a few days for me to process, but I realize you were right. I'm also quite happy to report that BH has contacted a potential IC and has recently joined this site, though we have agreed that I will not read his posts since doing so could hinder his ability/willingness to be open with his thoughts and feelings.

Smokenfire - I believe I said this before, but a huge thanks to you, too. This perspective was something I hadn't considered, and has been very enlightening when I consider BH's occasional insistence that I must have loved AP. He made mention of it again tonight, and thinking about it from this vantage really helped me understand that it's probably not just anger or hurt, but really an attempt to make sense of the senseless.

midnightschild99 - I think I must have missed your post, somehow. BH has sought out many details, yes, though the emotional question is much harder for us to address than the physical, largely because I'm not equipped to explain the emotional part, yet. By that I mean that I'm having a hard time making sense of it myself, and so my attempts to answer BH's questions about "what it was" have been woefully inadequate and largely worse then saying nothing. If it wasn't love like I thought it was at the time, what was it? I'm positive it wasn't love -- the fact that I am relieved to have AP out of my life and experience panic whenever he tries to contact me are evidence of that. But then, how do I explain what it was? The best I've come up with is that it was an unhealthy coping mechanism (like most of mine), but I feel like the answer to the "what" question has to follow the "why" and "how" questions, and I'm just starting to scratch the surface of those.

drownedman - My parents are skipping way ahead in their worry. I'm certain they would never badmouth BH, no matter what happens...especially because I wouldn't stand for it. I agree with you that their concerns are not legitimate at this point, especially after having a few days to think over HellFire's comments and having a few conversations with BH about how poorly I handled the original exchange. I can't fathom that their concerns would ever become reality, which is part of the reason I didn't put much stock into them to begin with. I should also mention that BH is not even remotely abusive. Even as he is warning me of the likelihood of D, he has been considerate and kind in many ways, when I certainly deserve none. Yes, he has his moments where he lashes out with hurtful things, but I'm sure they don't even make a dent compared to what he's dealing with. He's a wonderful man, and I really do love him dearly. It breaks my heart that he doubts my feelings for him, and it breaks again from the knowledge that I caused it myself.

Hippo16 - I don't intend to give up. I'm not sure I would know how to walk away. Sometimes I have a moment where I wonder if I'm just putting us both through suffering for nothing, especially when BH talks of D as a near-certainty, but instants later I snap out of it. I have to give this all I've got. It's worth it - I know it is. In the deepest part of my core, I know that there is good left in us, and I know that I am going to be a better partner in the future than I was in the past (because I am going to be a better person). I'm determined to be - there really is no other option. I can't live my life knowing what I know about myself now, without fixing it. I'd love nothing more than for BH to be the one to experience the "better me" that he always deserved, but realize that isn't my choice to make.

Unbeautiful - You're right, and I am not holding it against her. It was hurtful, but said likely with no expectation that I would find out, and certainly from a very emotional place. She has a tendency to expect the worst of people, so it makes sense that her mind would go to the darkest places it could find, especially when protecting her son. I know I wouldn't do the things she said, and I need to just take comfort in that, rather than get upset that she thought I might.

Round 2!

HellFire - I know BH isn't doing this to me on purpose. It's evident that he is exhausted by the emotional swings and the effort it's taking to keep it all together, and I can only imagine the toll it must be taking. I also know that he is looking for actions - words mean nothing from a liar. He wants to see that I'm taking strides toward fixing the parts of me that allowed me to do this. The challenge I'm having at the moment, is that he isn't around to see most of them because he's asked me to spend some time away from home and even when I am around he usually chooses to not be in the same room with me. That's not a complaint - I hate it, but I understand. However, it does make it hard for me to "show" him much. I know I'm just starting down a long personal journey, but the adjustments I've made so far have felt impactful, at least to me. The commitments to honest living, forgiveness and openness/transparency have already changed my outlook and my interactions with others, which in turn have spurred serious bouts of self-reflection and awareness. I feel very different already. It has already made a huge improvement in my mental and emotional state, and so I will be continuing down this path regardless. I hope he'll see it, eventually.

Unbeautiful - I am encouraged by BH's recent openness to seeking support. Not only do I think that doing so will help him with self-reflection, but I consider even the willingness to pursue it as a significant step in that direction. Knowing he has people to help him (and that he is willing to receive help from) gives me comfort. I know he doesn't (usually) want it from me, but he doesn't deserve to struggle alone. I don't know that I'm feeling sorry for myself...I do at times, certainly, but what I am having a hard time with at the moment is how to best support him, when he doesn't know what he needs. Our communication has been better the last couple of days, though, which is helping immensely.

Wool94 - I really appreciate the advice and words of caution, but I don't know that I can "choose" one over the other, and I really hope it doesn't come to that. That being said, I have come to realize that I need to set my parents straight about a few key items. These are things that I have said to them consistently, but that I think they have spun from molehills into mountains through the power of parental worrying. I have to be firmer with them, absolutely. BH does not deserve to feel attacked, even unintentionally, by my father, by myself, or by anyone else as a result of what I've done. He is going through unspeakable pain and destabilization, and for my parents to worry about me in all of this is clearly misplaced concern. BH is family to them, too, and they need to act like it. They can (and must) be supportive to both of us, especially since right now all either of us is trying to do is get through the S#!% show I signed us up for.

SorrowfulMate - Yes, you're right. I offered all of my passwords and gave BH my phone with the understanding of complete transparency. I wasn't fighting it, so much as I suppose I wasn't prepared for it. Hence the question in my post, to which the answer was a resounding "YES", I was out of line. I realize the truth of that, now. And yes, I have read How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair, though I'm not sure if I read it before or after this incident happened.

I know there is nothing my BH did that in any way made me have an affair. Could our marriage have been better? Probably. But we were happy. I was happy with BH. And even if I wasn't, that's no justification, because there is no justification. I'm sure my parents would like to give me an excuse, but I wouldn't take it. I'm fully aware that I am solely responsible for what I chose to do and not do, and I've told my parents as much on multiple occasions.

Breadfruit1 - I'm sorry for the delayed response. The full reason was a mix of things, but lack of truthfulness was not one of them. At first, I was processing what was said (this often takes me time), then there were so many responses that I got somewhat overwhelmed, and finally, I have been working on a timeline for BH which I said I would have done by Saturday. I understand why it would seem like I disappeared because I didn't like the feedback I was getting, but nothing could be further from the truth. I really value it - I know I can't always trust my own judgement (obviously), and very much appreciate the help I receive here in working through these very complicated and emotional issues.

I absolutely realize having AP over to our home was a terrible idea. I realized that within hours, but it's no less true now.

If I've given the impression that I'm impatient with BH for how long he is taking to make a decision, that was not my intent. If anything, I am hoping that he takes more time, because the sooner he decides, the more likely it is to be for D! I don't want him to get over anything, and I recognize our marriage is dead. If we are going to continue a relationship, we will have to build a new one. I have faith that if we do, it would be one worth having, but that's not my decision to make.

It is obvious that you are upset, and probably feeling very protective of BH. Thank you for that - he is a wonderful person, and deserves to have people in his corner. I appreciate your level of passion and the anger for how BH must feel. It is clearly very raw for you, as I'm sure it is for him, still.

You are correct that BH found out about the A because of OMW sending him a letter that I had written. However, please don't jump to conclusions if possible - I assure you, the truth is bad enough. I don't say the following to be defensive, but only to "set the record straight" so we can work from the same series of events:

1.) I did not want to runaway to be with OM/AP "together forever". This was something that OM/AP seemed to feel differently about, but I at no point ever considered leaving BH. I think the "constantness" of BH was part of what allowed me to take him for granted the way that I did, which in turn allowed me to avoid thinking about the consequences of him finding out.

2.) The state of the A, while likely inconsequential, was on the way out. This has been an item of considerable contention between BH and myself, because it's "too convenient", but I had been thinking of ending it for several weeks, with the conviction growing in the last 2-3 before DDay. It takes me a long time to do things like that (I am conflict-avoidant and have decision anxiety), so I had not gotten up the nerve to do so, yet. I am also fully aware that my first attempt may not have been successful, and even if it was, would have likely resulted in falling back into the A a few times, so I don't mean to make it sound like it was over already. However, to say that the A would have continued had the letter not been exposed is misrepresenting things as being "full steam ahead" when in reality they were petering out. I only mention it as a point of clarification.

3.) Yes, I did talk to OM/AP about feeling guilty about betraying BH. We had at least one long conversation about it, and the A almost ended that day. I realize the total lack of value in "almost".

BH is absolutely within his rights to be ambivalent about any kind of future with me. I thought I had expressed that, but maybe I didn't or it was in another post.

Klaatu - Yes, you're right that it sucks. While the feedback I've received has taken me some time to sort through and wrap my head around, it has all been received with gratitude and an understanding that I have a lot of work to do, like you mentioned.

HardyRose - This is an excellent lesson in why I need to be careful when answering these on the fly. The "only" in there is terrible. I only meant it to clarify that there was no sex in the bed, not to minimize the impact and betrayal of what did happen.

A very important item of clarification: I never had any intent of running away with AP. Never. AP wished I did - the fact that I didn't made him feel like "not enough" - but I didn't. I'm sure it's common for WS's to dream about that, and I assume that's why it keeps being brought up, but it's not accurate for my situation.

I'm honestly a little bit confused by the comments about my impatience. I am an impatient person in general, so I don't take offense, but I don't feel like I'm impatient with BH to "get over it"...the idea is kind of obscene to me. I must have said something to indicate that I was, but it's definitely not how I feel most of the time. I don't want him to hurt, and I hope he gets the support and help he needs to make the days and weeks ahead more manageable for him, but that's not the same as impatience or "getting over it".

Mostly, I just want him to allow himself to process what happened, so that he can begin to heal. I am worried about him, and how he'll cope if he doesn't seek help to work through this. Thankfully, he is, which is wonderful news.

Thanks again, everyone - I do appreciate the engagement and the feedback, as always. I'm learning as I go, and am painfully far from perfect, so I can use all the help I can get.

CantEatCantSleep: I re-read your post and I apologize for ridiculing you of being impatient with your BH with regards to R. Indeed from all indications; you want him to take as much time as possible. I've been hard on you but I won't falsely accuse you. I intend to be fair. This situation is hard enough as it is and I applaud you for taking responsibility (as hard and caustic as it may be)

Three questions: Was there anytime during the affair you felt compelled to tell your BH?

How were you able to mask/fake intimacy with BH? {assuming you did have sex/moments of intimacy with BH during your affair)

and therefore did you feel you were cheating on OM when you were with your BH?

You have said that you invited AP to your house to see what it would be like to spend time with him not involveing sex (not successful) obviously, we're you perhaps trying to imagine what life would be like with him ? And if so maybe he ment more to you than you would like to admit ?

So you've hurt him, your presence continues to hurt him, yet you continue to push him towards a direction that clearly hurts him.

Please come out of your fog and give the poor guy what he so dearly needs.

He needs and wants a safe spouse. He needs and wants a spouse who truly loves him. He wants and needs a spouse who wakes up in the morning thinking of him.

He has *clearly* stated his needs.

Why are you denying him this?

(PS: I say this respectfully, but with the bluntness that is necessary. This isn't really a good time to be dancing around words, eh?)

[This message edited by Sharkman at 8:21 AM, August 7th (Monday)]

Can'T sleep - I have read through your postings and I am wondering WHY the two of you got your parents involved in this mess??? I fully understand the need for support, but a parent is ALWAYS going to support their own child no matter what as it is apparent in your case with your parents and your MIL. This should have been kept between the two of you, an IC and maybe a MC. This makes R very difficult because his entire family will never again trust or be close to you, even if he decides to give you the gift of R.

[This message edited by NamasteGirl10 at 10:02 AM, August 7th (Monday)]

Your MIL resents you for hurting her son. Your parents resents him for making you feel "bad" all the time. Do you see the mess that this has created? Right now, you don't have any children yet, but imagine your life down the roads with children, holidays, birthday parties, graduations etc. when you have in-laws that do not like each other or their child's spouse? I think that you both made this a lot more difficult by exposing it to people who are unable to assist you.

I totally get the need for support and to have someone to talk to that gets you and shows love and empathy. I have none of it myself. I have told nobody except IC about what is going on and it is so so incredibly difficult and painful. I am a Daddy's girl and I wish I could call him and cry my eyes out. Instead I get up in the morning, put on my big girl pants, take care of my kids and go to work. I am a B'S and nobody knows what I am going through. It is because they don't underst5.

Breadfruit1 - In answer to your questions:

Was there anytime during the affair you felt compelled to tell your BH?

There were definitely times I wanted to tell BH, but I was a coward and was terrified of him leaving me. Please know that I recognize it's incredibly disrespectful and hurtful that I considered living a life with a hidden betrayal like that (and robbing BH of an honest relationship) to be preferable to facing the honest consequences of my choices. At first, I didn't recognize the EA for what it was and arrogantly thought I could keep things "appropriate" (even though they never were! BH rightly pointed out that the things I kept from him from the beginning were an indication of the fact that I knew it was not ok). By the time it graduated to a PA, I was in way over my head.

If I'm being candid, I spent more time wishing the A had never happened than thinking about telling BH about it. I felt stuck in a trap of my own making with the A. If the root of the question is if I was going to tell BH about it, while I can't say I would never have (there are plenty on these forums who fess up years after the fact), I didn't feel like it was an option for me at the time. It's repulsive because being honest with BH should have been the only option - I am honestly working on figuring out how I could get it so wrong...

How were you able to mask/fake intimacy with BH? (assuming you did have sex/moments of intimacy with BH during your affair)

I don't have a good answer for this, yet. I know I am very good at rationalizing and compartmentalizing, and so I would tell myself things to minimize how bad it was. Things like "at least you didn't leave BH alone all night, you waited until a night he was going to be out" or "at least you didn't [X]" (whatever disgusting, horrible thing X would be), or "at least you told him where you were going" (even if I didn't tell who else would be there, or what was happening). Somehow, at the time, that was enough for me to justify continuing what I was doing. I realize it's ludicrous.

As far as intimacy, BH and I were intimate during the time of the A. I don't know how I could look him in the eyes and be intimate with him, after what I had done. I don't say that to get out of the question - it's an important one - I just really don't know right now. I never thought I would be capable of something like that, and so the answer is challenging because it requires a re-engineering of my understanding of myself.

and therefore did you feel you were cheating on OM when you were with your BH?

God, no. Absolutely not. Never did I feel like OM/AP was entitled to anything from me, or anything BH had. If anything, I didn't feel like BH wanted me...which would be understandable, considering the circumstances, but was actually a very unfortunate and longstanding miscommunication between him and I.

meridian -

Were you perhaps trying to imagine what life would be like with him?

I've thought about this, after all of the comments questioning what AP meant to me, but it's simply not accurate of my mindset. He came over and watched TV with me, and at the end of the night there was sex. If anything, I was hoping that not going to a hotel would keep sex out of the picture. It didn't, clearly, and instead increased the level of the betrayal up yet another notch. But no, it wasn't about "playing house". I am confident in that.

Sharkman - While you are being blunt, your questions are not very clear and that makes them hard to answer. I will try my best, anyway, but if I misunderstand any of them, please let me know.

So you've hurt him, your presence continues to hurt him, yet you continue to push him towards a direction that clearly hurts him.

Please come out of your fog and give the poor guy what he so dearly needs.

Yes, I absolutely hurt him. More than anyone else could. It eats me up every day. Yes, my presence continues to hurt him, which is why I have not been with him for more than a few hours at a time since 7/19 (at his request). My understanding is that the hurt is unavoidable, and he would hurt with me there or without me there. If he isn't hurting, he's avoiding or numbing, which means he isn't processing and which in turn means he will continue to be hurt by it for an even longer time. I'm not trying to make anything worse for him, but I think it's naive to assume that I leave the picture and suddenly it's all sunshine.

What am I pushing him towards? R? While I have made clear to him that I want to try again with him, I am not trying to force his hand or demand anything from him other than that he not make any decision immediately - it's pretty universally acknowledged that people do not make their best decisions when in the throes of their world falling apart. He and I have both agreed on the 90 day mark, and I will respect his decision, whatever it may be.

What is it that he needs? For me to abandon him, on top of everything else? To add insult to injury that after doing the unthinkable to him, by leaving him to pick up the pieces on his own? To be so cold as to not even try to help clean up the aftermath of the damage I've done? What possible worse way could there be to make him feel like he never meant anything to me, then to give up on him that way? I may be misinterpreting what you think he needs, and if so, I apologize.

He needs and wants a safe spouse. He needs and wants a spouse who truly loves him. He wants and needs a spouse who wakes up in the morning thinking of him.

Yes, he does. I do truly love him, and while I understand your bluntness, it isn't really for you to say how I feel. The issue is that my love might not be enough. That even though I think about him 100 times a day (including waking up in the morning), he might not want a broken person like me - he might decide the love of someone so damaged that they can do this to him, or the risk of staying with someone who was once "unsafe" isn't worth it.

He has *clearly* stated his needs.

Why are you denying him this?

I'm still not sure which needs you are referring to, which makes it difficult to answer your questions. I'm at a disadvantage since I assume you are referring to something he wrote in JFO, which I have promised I won't read to protect his privacy. I will assume you are again referring to me leaving, and the fact of the matter is that I'm not leaving because I don't believe it is the right thing to do. I don't believe being abandoned in this city and having his whole financial situation turned upside down is actually what he needs. I don't believe he actually wants to be given up on. If he needs to D, then we will D. To be clear, when he proposed starting the D papers, I told him I would. I am not denying him anything - I am attempting to negotiate a very difficult situation, with the understanding that we are both not in the best mindsets to do so.

Please keep in mind that we are both working through our own demons right now, demons I brought upon both of us, and that the situation is more complicated than either of us can express in text.

Merdian said: "You have said that you invited AP to your house to see what it would be like to spend time with him not involveing sex (not successful) obviously, we're you perhaps trying to imagine what life would be like with him ? And if so maybe he ment more to you than you would like to admit ?"

This is profound and relevant as to CantEatCant Sleep intentions and to her state of mind regarding her marriage and I would hope she responds to the above. Why would she bring OM to the marital home in order "to see what it would be like to spend time with him (OM) without having sex"? For all intents and purposes she appears to be seriously thinking about them being together as a real couple, thus planning to end her marriage and replace BH with OM. Seems to me a couple sriously dating. This will be hard to convince anyone otherwise. She also turned off the security camera in the living room during OM's visit. Motives clear and damning. Intentions deliberate and calculated. Why did she not go to a hotel as she regularly did and just hang out with OM without having sex if she so much wanted to see what it would be like just to be together without sex? It leads me to think everytime they were together they were having sex. The idea of OM wanting to return to BH's home the next night really anger's me. He is a POS and just like CantEatCantSleep he had no respect for BH's home. IMO it's bad enough and immoral to be having an affair (Emotional and Physical) but to be comfortable bringing it into the marital home is beyond the pale. To stoop to such a level is disturbing to say the least. And yes the fact that you invaded your BH's privacy and trust by invading his sacred space-his home with OM, you get irritated and somewhat pissed that BH is invading your privacy by reading text messages between you and your parents? CantEatCantSleep you are missing the mark here. If you don't come to grips with the dynmaics of what you have done and realize it's not about you or your rights to privacy where BH is concerned in the forseeable future; any hopes for R is doomed.

Ouch.

Were you ever upset with your H?

Most that bring the AP in their home do it to really hurt their spouse.

Your actions will be very important, much more that your words.

Even if he does file for D, if you want him, you could try with your actions to win him back after the D.

You might consider in IC, to explore any resentment with your H and in bringing the AP into your home.

Good luck to you.

They hear stories of BH saying things that upset me and they interpret it as him being vindictive.

Who is telling your parents these stories?

If it's you, how do you think telling these stories is helping you or your BS recovery?

I can tell you that my MIL said something to me after our DD that I will never forget and it certainly makes sense now that I and we have gone through counseling to see that most of my FWH issues come from his FOO, specifically his mother.

Have you looked at how your FOO has impacted your thinking?

For your parents to say what they said so soon after DD PLUS this wasn't a ONS after blacking out, says a lot about them. I would NEVER support my child who did what you did. This was a year long decision with so many lies and betrayals.

I'm still not sure which needs you are referring to, which makes it difficult to answer your questions. I'm at a disadvantage since I assume you are referring to something he wrote in JFO, which I have promised I won't read to protect his privacy. I will assume you are again referring to me leaving, and the fact of the matter is that I'm not leaving because I don't believe it is the right thing to do. I don't believe being abandoned in this city and having his whole financial situation turned upside down is actually what he needs. I don't believe he actually wants to be given up on. If he needs to D, then we will D. To be clear, when he proposed starting the D papers, I told him I would. I am not denying him anything - I am attempting to negotiate a very difficult situation, with the understanding that we are both not in the best mindsets to do so.

I am sorry if I confused you, I was not referring back to any other threads.

You abused your husband for over a year. Giving it 90 days to not make an emotional decision is what you say because you are being selfish. He should have the right to exit an abusive relationship in 0 days if that helps him heal from the abuse better.

Do the poor guy a favor and give up this 90 days stuff (unless it's HIS therapist recommending it, of course). It's just a form of soft manipulation. Being blunt, you don't get to decide on what the grounds for reconciliation look like. You already ended the marriage in a very conscious fashion. Did he suggest the 90 days or did you?

(again please take this message with all the due respect intended)