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D Day, again

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AmySue78 posted 1/7/2020 23:04 PM

Once again I have found out that my WS has been emotionally unfaithful. (At least he says that's all that has been going on.) I found out on Christmas Eve. Merry Christmas to me. My son & I were looking for my tissue paper to wrap presents & found a burner phone. Fortunately my son thought it was just an old phone. I knew differently. I had given my WS another chance, he swore to never do anything like this again. I looked at the phone & found that not only had he been unfaithful, again, but it was far worse this time. He has progressed from a porn addiction, to chatting with women online, to contacting prostitutes. The messages on the phone were all asking for rates, photos of his junk to prove he's clean, & trying to arrange times to meet. All times when I would be working. All on days when he drives me to work, all in the city I work in. He insists that nothing physical has happened, but whether it has or not, I am completely destroyed, again. I'm not sure I can come back from this. He has promised to get counseling, but as Aerosmith says: Same Old Story, Same Old Song & Dance. I'm not sure if our relationship is worth fixing anymore.

Ichthus posted 1/7/2020 23:13 PM

Wow, that sucks. So sorry your going through this again.

3greatkids posted 1/7/2020 23:22 PM

Iím very sorry.

Cheaters lie.

Please donít endanger your heath and sanity for a liar.

You deserve better.

[This message edited by 3greatkids at 11:22 PM, January 7th (Tuesday)]

skeetermooch posted 1/8/2020 00:01 AM

I'm sorry you're going through this, AmySue.
He sounds pretty determined to cheat and lie. Burner phones are next level.

Please get yourself support, IC, call in your friends and family.

Buffer posted 1/8/2020 00:04 AM

He is a pig, file D now. Then get checked for STDs.
Sorry but he doesnít deserve you!

Buffer

allusions posted 1/8/2020 00:32 AM

I think it's time he take a polygraph test, don't you?

Tallgirl posted 1/8/2020 04:58 AM

I am sorry that you are going through this. It sounds like an addiction and an escalation.

If he hasnít already, he will go physical. please protect yourself with an STD test and protect your $.

Your husband photographed his dishonesty, his actions leave little doubt of intent and lies are now part of him.

I suggest an Extremely Hard 180. You need time to heal and decide if you want to D. He is certainly not a safe partner right now.

Put you and your son first. If you canít look at him, he can find a couch to sleep on.

Big hugs, you deserve so much more.


[This message edited by Tallgirl at 4:59 AM, January 8th (Wednesday)]

jb3199 posted 1/8/2020 05:35 AM

With this burner phone, could you get any idea how far back this goes? Is it possible that he never stopped his behavior from your initial discovery?

nekonamida posted 1/8/2020 09:47 AM

You need to get an STD test ASAP. He didn't just jump through a bunch of hoops to meet prostitutes and chicken out. He got physical with them. Maybe even other OWs too. Don't believe anything he says right now because he is in full CYA mode.

Get an IC. See a lawyer even if you're not ready to file. He needs to be moving heaven and earth to fix himself and if he's not, he will keep cheating on you. You're going to need to put yourself first and figure out a life without him if he won't step up and get serious help for his addiction. What do you think is different this time if anything?

FEEL posted 1/8/2020 12:43 PM

Nothing changes IF nothing changes. It seems very clear that he is not changing his ways, despite him swearing he was never going to do anything like this again. So what are YOU going to do about this.

You can't change people. YOU can only change you and how you respond to others actions. It seems he's not changing so if you don't do anything your likely to wind up here posting the same thing again, in a month, 6 month or a year from now. This is up to YOU and YOU only.

Chaos posted 1/8/2020 14:09 PM

I'm sorry. You know the drill. 180, self care, attorney consult, STD testing.

I hope you put that burner phone in a safe place he can't find it. And use the shit out of it for evidence. If you can go after each one of those skanks he contacted - even if it is just to make them give a statement.

If he went that far as to have a burner, solicit and sext other women complete with dick pics - odds are he's had physical contact with at least one of them.

psychmom posted 1/8/2020 14:27 PM

AmySue, you have every reason to question whether this is a relationship worth saving. Your H clearly is wayward in his thinking and actions, and his "promise" to get IC rings hollow. It is not you who needs to "fix" this relationship, but HIM, and it does not appear at this point that he is interested in doing that. Selfish, manipulative, deceptive, untrustworthy - that is what he is today.

The advice to take care of yourself is a good place for you to begin. Get tested for STIs (because liars lie), take care of your financials, and above all else, be kind to yourself. This level of abuse and trauma is like nothing else most of us have ever had to deal with. If you've gone through this before, you know what you need to do. I'm extremely sorry that you've found yourself here again, AmySue. Sending you strength as you find your way out of infidelity yet again.

Notmine posted 1/8/2020 17:34 PM

He has progressed from a porn addiction, to chatting with women online, to contacting prostitutes

Sobriety from addiction is a lifelong process. It is a lifetime commitment. In order for the vast majority of addicts to find meaningful sobriety, they must hit "bottom". "Bottom" refers to a time or an event in life that causes an addict to reach the lowest possible point in their disease. It is a time when the person feels like things cannot get worse for them. This is when most of us reach out for help and take it seriously. My husband is an SA. These are the long term actions he takes to stay safe for me - implemented and maintained by HIM, not me.
1. 12 step recovery. 90 meetings in 90 days at first and then ongoing meetings EVERY WEEK.
2. He has a sponsor who he talks to WEEKLY and he works the 12 steps EVERY DAY.
3. He attends counseling EVERY WEEK with a certified sex addictions counselor.
4. He reads suggested literature and takes all suggestions from his sponsor and counselor.
5. He abstains from masturbation (unless I am there) and any porn or stimulating sexual content (my FWH believes these are triggers for him).
6. ALL electronics are open to my perusal, ANY time.
7. He helps other men in crisis, which alleviates the shame.
I am a recovering alcoholic - 21 years sober. We like to say that we get a daily reprieve from our disease. This means that we must continuously commit to a program of recovery...on the daily.

It sounds to me and I think to you that this man is nowhere near ready for a relationship. His promises are addict bullshit. His ACTIONS will tell you whether he is a safe partner for you. I am not saying that addicts do not feel bad and filled with shame in the moment, but these feelings fade as soon as they are off the hot seat and then they are back into the addictive behaviors. If he was really interested in getting sober and maintaining a healthy lifestyle, then you would see the above referenced ACTIONS happening consistently in the LONG TERM. He has figured out that he can engage in his addiction, cry remorse when caught and then go back to his life again. This pattern will not change unless he gets to the point that is unbearable for HIM. I am sorry to say that you are not helping him get to this point if you accept his addict BS and continue to be there for him. He is showing you who he is and you need to take that seriously. You also need to stop believing him. He is continuously lying to you and I would bet that he is lying about the contact he has had with the women he is contacting. Sex addicts are all about stimulation.

My recommendation for you is S-anon. It will help you understand the addiction and what it means for you. There is also a doctor named Patrick Carnes, who has an interview on Youtube which was really helpful for me when I was trying to understand sex addiction.

I believe 12-step recovery, in addition to counseling by someone who understands SA, is the only way to deal with sex addiction. This may or may not work, depending on your husbandís level of commitment. You cannot make this decision for him. He must do it on his own. He must help himself. If he is unwilling to engage in the above referenced steps, R.U.N. All addictions progress. He has not found the bottom yet and the bottom will be really ugly. As you have discovered, life with a using addict is living in awful, unrelenting chaos. You do not need to live your life this way.

The1stWife posted 1/8/2020 17:49 PM

I agree yiu need to get support from your own counselor and sAnon or a similar type group.

Also stop expecting he will remain monogamous. Itís impossible for him. Youíve been shown that he will give in to his selfish choices time and time again.

Get yourself a new mindset. A new beginning for your life. Whether you Divorce or stay together you need an exit plan for you. Just in case. Because things can change and you need to be prepared.

tushnurse posted 1/9/2020 06:02 AM

(((AmySue)))

Sorry you find yourself here. But nonetheless here you are.

Please for your sanity, and your well being do 2 things today.
Make an appt for full STD testing, this will mean blood work and a pelvic exam. Anything less is not complete. Your H has been interacting w/ a high risk community. You need to be sure you are healthy.
Make an appt to see an attorney or three, you need to know your rights, and his obligations. Without this informed choice you cannot choose to move forward again, or to D. But you do need to know what those options look like for you.

Read up on the 180 here for your sanity. Stop interacting with him, if he asks why, tell him he is the only on that fix/work on his addiction issues. Until you see consistent change and actions from him as outlined in prior posts, then you need to protect yourself and child. Kick him out of your bedroom. Stop doing anything for him.

Keep reading and posting here, you will find tons of great support and advice, from people who have walked a similar path as you.

steadychevy posted 1/9/2020 06:47 AM

So sorry, AmySue. To me this is one of the big worries of BSs who offer R as an gift.

You might consider a polygraph to determine if he's had sexual contact of any kind since you married or were engaged to marry or since the last DDay. If the evidence of betrayal is enough for you to D then why bother with a poly. If you are on the fence and are still gathering evidence to use in making a decision then it could be worth it.

As suggested, you don't really know the full extent of what has happened so get an STD test for your own safety. He needs to get one too and no physical contact until he has a clean test.

Is this a fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me situation for you?

AmySue78 posted 1/9/2020 20:29 PM

I find myself in a very difficult situation. We cannot afford to divorce financially. Our furnace has died & has to be replaced. As far as everything else, I'm afraid that divorcing will cause a setback to my daughter who has a learning disability. (She's been doing so well they're talking discontinuing services!). I have told my WS to consider us separated. He has been trying to get a hold of a counseling agency to get help, the holidays threw their schedule. He has also promised to get tested. I'm hoping he keeps his word this time. Maybe telling him I consider us separated scared him enough to change course.

Dispirited posted 1/9/2020 20:54 PM

I know-it sucks when finances are a factor.And when you mention the daughter, suddenly that becomes even more important. Oh how many have been presented with this problem.Lack of finances...children...and suddenly out of the blue, one winds up here.

And that is what pisses me off...these situations that are so tenuous and then the person can't think about what their actions will result in.And often, because of the selfish crap, people are suddenly put in these situations.

I understand life is not always kind, but at the same time, life is hard enough without throwing a cog in the wheel.I understand and feel so badly..I always think about people like you who lose faith in the good of others. Others are not like him.No consolation, but there are good men out there:)

Dispirited posted 1/9/2020 21:00 PM

Read up on the 180 here for your sanity. Stop interacting with him, if he asks why, tell him he is the only on that fix/work on his addiction issues. Until you see consistent change and actions from him as outlined in prior posts, then you need to protect yourself and child. Kick him out of your bedroom. Stop doing anything for him.

Oh- how easy to say:)we see everything on the outside, yet lose track of the trauma these people go through. Yes- spoken like a counselor.She has no "cover"- no ability for a counselor. So then...your words only go so far.Understand?:)

nekonamida posted 1/10/2020 07:37 AM

Oh- how easy to say:)we see everything on the outside, yet lose track of the trauma these people go through. Yes- spoken like a counselor.She has no "cover"- no ability for a counselor. So then...your words only go so far.Understand?:)

The 180 and IC are standard advice here. I think you should read up on it in the Healing Library. The 180 is absolutely necessary for a BS like Amy to get some emotional distance when she can't get physical distance from her WS.

Right now all he's doing is throwing around empty promises with no follow through which is exactly what he did before that lead to more cheating. NOT 180ing, allowing him to re-enter her bedroom, is an extremely dangerous game when your spouse is seeing prostitutes. Hep C, HIV, HPV (which can be deadly), even syphilis is making a come back these days. Amy needs to protect herself by getting a full STD test and cutting off all physical contact until he has proven that he is clean and done with seeing prostitutes for good.

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