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Dispirited posted 1/11/2020 20:16 PM

Because it is so bad that I have been afraid that if I face it and admit who and what I am.

It's more selfish behavior and thinking, because if I don't face my shame and guilt I am going to go on being and doing the same and that means people will get hurt more. I don't want to hurt people anymore. I have to face and come to terms with me.

What? How do you change any behavior without facing it? So be by yourself as an alternative- that way you won't harm anyone. Get a grip:)Life is not about YOU.

Dispirited posted 1/11/2020 20:25 PM

ChanceAtLife35 every day I think and fear that I truly am the unchangeable monster that I have shown. I have not changed, because I have made excuses and been a coward instead off facing me and sitting with myself and doing the hard work...I have not even stuck with coming here consistently. all excuses

Maybe you are right, but I have to believe in myself and that I can be a better person and be good for goodness sake and genuine and without agenda or seeking validation or kudos. I am a dirtbag and want to repair...but so far all I have is words, which is nothing.

well good luck with that ass-halfed thinking.Once you betray me, then repair it. If not? Then go to IC and spare others:)

LLXC posted 1/11/2020 22:53 PM

My first step I think is to distance myself from all women except my BW

Isn't your wife divorcing you? How about doing what SHE wants? If she wants you around, fine. But you write so much about what a shitty person you are.

No one is all good and all bad. You were a shitty husband. Maybe you are a good employee. Instead of castigating yourself, use the areas in which you are skilled in order to inorove areas in which you are not skilled

You stopped taking your son to cub scouts because of your poor boundaeies?

You are aware that you can look for a better troop for him or" gasp, bot talk to that woman. Your son should not be farther punished.

The guy offering to help with the job search? If he knew you were a cheating asshole, he would be disgusted. And you dont know who he really is either. But he might respect you if he knew you are a guy who has been unethical and is doing better.

I personally think self reflection is important for growth, but it can be paralyzing. Become more empathetic. More authentic. Notice how you are inproving, where you need inprovement.

This self hatred helps no one. I guarantee you your wife just wishes you realized this shit a year ago

Btw. You cannot avoid women forever. How about paying attention to your instinct, notice it happening, and then STOP.

If you know you are acting inappropriately with other women, how do you know you are not acting inappropriately with your wife? This is her determination.

You have acted inappropriately with other women in two ways: in ways your wife wouldnt approve and/or in ways that make those women uncomfortable.

I am sure the root cause is your need for external validation, and as long as you hate yourself, this wont change. So do one thing every day you are proud of. It is a start.

Or whatever. You need to take action.

wantstorepair posted 1/12/2020 11:49 AM

Zugzwang I hie facebook and linked-in profiles. FB is the triggering one for her because it daily shows memory photos from years past, all of which are triggering because they depict what looks to be a happy time or event however the reality is I was being a cheating liar and the vent and the happiness was false.

She is triggered by a lot of things and I certainly have not been mindful of her PTS triggers and foreseen them coming and been tender and kind to her through her pain. Yes, you are 100% correct that if I was more mindful and proactive about her triggers that it would help her a great deal. I have to get much much better about this and stop being so selfish and inwardly focused.

wantstorepair posted 1/12/2020 12:04 PM

LLXC she wants me to stop being defensive, argumentative, minimizing and justifying. she wants to have confidence that I will actually change and sustain it so that any agreement we have going forward with custody, divorce, etc. can be trusted and upheld.

Yes my need for external validation is the problem.

MY BW has said it countless times, Dispirited said it directly, and you eluded to it as well I think as have others, about stop making it about me. This is where I fail...Everyone tells me that I am the problem; the way I think, the way I am wired, my selfishness, etc. (I am not arguing that they are wring), and that I need to fix me, but then says it is not about me...

I am not a stupid person but I am completely lost on this and it makes me feel so emotionally dumb that I cannot grasp. what everyone else figured out as a child.

wantstorepair posted 1/12/2020 12:06 PM

LLXC I have been trying to do a daily gratitude journal to start the day, and am going to add to it at the end of the day a what I am proud of.

[This message edited by wantstorepair at 12:25 PM, January 12th (Sunday)]

LLXC posted 1/12/2020 13:33 PM

LLXC I have been trying to do a daily gratitude journal to start the day, and am going to add to it at the end of the day a what I am proud of

That is really great.

This is where I fail...Everyone tells me that I am the problem; the way I think, the way I am wired, my selfishness, etc. (I am not arguing that they are wring), and that I need to fix me, but then says it is not about me...

This is the problem - you castigate yourself and blame yourself. Yes, you have been selfish and horrible. Now you are aware of it, so do something. Maybe see a therapist with whom you are honest.

You keep a journal? At the end of the day, note how often you lie, how often ylur words dont match your actions. And then start fixing that.

It is not a skill you have, so you learn it by doing. Thus will help your wife going forward.

She knows how bad the problem is, she knows how long it takes to fix

Chaos posted 1/13/2020 06:50 AM

Everyone tells me that I am the problem; the way I think, the way I am wired, my selfishness, etc.

I'm going to challenge you on this.

If your home that had a wiring problem that you knew would cause it to catch fire and blow up if you used any appliance would you:

A - call an electrician and get it re-wired ASAP

B - use the appliances anyway because that's just how the house is wired knowing full well it would catch fire and blow up

"that's just how I am wired" is just another excuse.

wantstorepair posted 1/13/2020 13:41 PM

Chaos, Agreed. I'd call the electrician right away. I am a fucked up person and need to rewire - I am my own electrician. I certainly do not want to write off my behavior as "oh well, I am just wired that way."

LLXC posted 1/13/2020 14:01 PM

No one can be their own electrician. Find a great therapist. You cannot do this on your own.

Maybe also a really great personal coach. To learn how to communicate effectively and authentically. To help with your wife and your kids.

But therapy is vital. And hell, maybe it is your wiring and you have NPD. If thst is the case, it is very very difficult to treat, but not impossible

Chaos posted 1/13/2020 14:14 PM

On a tangent - using my same professional electrician analogy for your faulty wiring:

Ask any licence and bonded electrician what they think of those self proclaimed DIY experts after they have to go in and spend days fixing their mess - and charge them exponentially to do so.

LLXC is right - get a professional. Because face it. Being your own DIY expert hasn't worked for you in the past 26 years - what makes you think this time is any different?

millienotboo posted 1/13/2020 20:20 PM

Iím a BW, I didnít see a stop sign...sooooooo
Wallowing (which you are) in your shame and guilt is just one more way to keep this all about you.
My FWH used to say ďyou deserve betterĒ he was correct but he didnít mean it. If he had meant it he would have BEEN better.
When I told him that it was an epiphany for him. Itís not a hard concept, itís not that hard to be right. You wonít ever change the things that you did and youíre wasting a great deal of time trying to reconcile how people see you versus the person that you are. Start now, today, being better. Daddy Dom has come so far since he got here that it is astounding. You should read the last several of his posts twice a day, every day until they sink in.
Youíre making this far too complicated. What is a good person, in your estimation? A person who can empathize? A person who can put his family first? You donít have to be a saint, I donít think anyone is asking that of you. Do the next right thing. Build yourself into the person that you can admire. One step at a time. Start with radical honesty. Live in honesty. Resolve to never tell another lie, not to anyone. Especially not to yourself. It wonít take long to find that itís easy to make the right choice when you know you canít lie about it.
You may never have another chance with your wife. Itís a painful repercussion of the choices that youíve made but if you have any hope of a fulfilling life youíre going to need to make big changes. I wish you luck and I love a success story....

Zugzwang posted 1/13/2020 20:25 PM

EASY solution do the hard thing. Get rid of facebook and linkedin.

wantstorepair posted 1/14/2020 11:30 AM

Thank you millienotboo. and yes, I read Daddydoms post to me daily.

Hurtmyheart posted 1/14/2020 16:59 PM

What pdxguy said-

"If you're cheating on your wife, you're also likely cheating in other areas of your life. Again, it's not working. STOP.

So, when you're ready to change, like truly change, tell us what you're actually doing.

And the last thing I can say that might be useful. Your validation from women: look to your childhood."

All of this is right on, wantstorepair. I've read several of your posts and one comment in particular stood out to me when you said that you got totally drunk one night. But before I read this particular comment, I was reading some of your other comments. What came to my mind as I was reading is that you sounded like an alcoholic.

I agree with Pdxguy about your issues of seeking validation most likely have come from your upbringing. Have you delved into this idea as of yet? I will give you examples of myself and my WH.

When I was young, my siblings and parents (esp my mom) constantly called me names and put me down. My home was already in constant chaos but that is another contributing factor to my downfall. I knew in my heart that what they were saying about me was untrue and invalid. At the same time in my life, outside sources, friends, neighbors, teachers, strangers, etc. would validate how and what "I" felt and believed about myself. I was beautiful, smart, kind, sweet, talented. And so the cycle began.

Whenever my family would say mean things about me, I would tell myself it wasn't true and also allowed the outside sources to compliment and validate my beliefs. Problem with this theory was that it also included men complimenting me and stepping into my boundries. Unknowingly, I took these behaviors into my marriage. In turn, when men approached me and gave me attention, I did not realize that this hurt my WH. I thought being nice and polite to these men and their compliments was innocent. It wasn't. I didn't realize the damage it caused to my WH until years later. Today I don't need outside validation from anyone because I know who I am and know that I am good. But it still does happen occasionally and my WH and I talk about it. My WH knows where my behavior came from and it has nothing to do with him.

I was I'm going to say, complimented inappropriately (by another man) the other day right in front of his wife! It wasn't sexual, I feel it was more rude and demeaning toward his wife. I did not respond but WH and I discussed it afterward and came to the agreement that this man stepped out of his boundries and had no right to make those comments toward me. My WH and I were able to discuss the situation.

My WH also grew up in a home of emotional and physical abuse by his mother, brothers and sister. His father was a functional alcoholic who was not emotionally available to his wife or kid's. The fathers alcoholism created an inbalance in the family structure and in turn when something went down, my WH mother used my WH as an emotional and physical punching bag. My WH mother beat my WH so severely that she left welts and bruises all over his body. Poor kid. And this wasn't the only time this had happened. And the emotional abuse did not stop until he was old enough to leave home. His brothers were no help either. Neither they nor the father protected him from his mother's emotional instability or violent tendencies.

My WH constant need to seek validation from all sorts of people and then women continued on until just a few years ago where he hit rock bottom. He also was an extremely heavy drinker, alcoholic. When things turned bad to worse for WH, he turned to alcohol and isolation and of course seeking validation from other women. All of this behavior stemmed from his childhood upbringing.

Today, my WH and I both understand how our childhoods contributed to our choices later in life and by the grace of God, we were able to learn and change from these unhealthy coping patterns, to make our marriage a safe and healthy union. I love that when things go down, we are able to talk and have clarity and find solutions. But it has taken a lot of work and we still have our ups and downs. And because we were willinh to look at ourselves and look deeply within through IC and MC, we have been able to overcome all sorts of issues.

What is your childhood story, wantstorepair? How do you believe this relates to the person you are today? I would have a very hard time believing you came from an emotionally healthy upbringing.

wantstorepair posted 1/15/2020 09:14 AM

Humblemyheart I am going to IC in about 15 minutes and have decided after chats with my BW, and reading your post, and all the other advice about going to my childhood to unpack why I need this validation as the sole topic to focus on. Yes I wallow and am in shame, and I act like a petulant tantruming child every day because of it. I am beginning to see the depth of my selfishness and cruelty to her still, and understand how that wallowing and my actions to express that steal away any chance of this being about the only victim here, my BW. Thank you for your help and kindness.

Hurtmyheart posted 1/15/2020 17:50 PM

I understand, wantstorepair. My WH betrayed me in the worst ways possible also. But because we were able to go back in time and really take a look at ourselves and our pasts, we were able to piece together how we got to this point in our relationship in the first place.

I believe you are on the right path and also understand why you are so down on yourself...because you hurt those who loved you most in life. I am not here to bring you done any further than you already are. IMO, beating another person down emotionally (esp when you are already in a very dark place) will not help you. I am only here to root you on to become the best man and father that you are meant to be. It has taken some time but I am finally beginning to accept that my WH has changed and he no longer has the desire to hurt me or anyone else for that matter. He was in great pain for a very long time, carried over from childhood. Hurt people hurt people. Until he was able to confront and accept that his upbringing was horrible, he couldn't get to the root of his problems. I wish he would post on here but he has chosen another path to healing through God and the Bible, meditation and prayer. And I support that. In fact, I think what caught my eye about your post is that you remind me of how my WH used to be and in fact, my WH used to talk just like you do about yourself, until he found God. My WH had a lot of self hatred for himself also. Not today! He loves who is and you can get there also.

I truly do believe that you are on the right path to emotional wellness, wantstorepair. It's okay to get well and leave that other person you were in the past. Kick his ass way in the past! I have hope for you. I want to see you turn your life around. You can do it, despite who you used to be.

I want you to think about something, my family did not want me to get well. They liked seeing the pain they caused me because of their own pain they were dealing with. Several of them are still in pain today but I decided that I am not going to allow them to continue to define who I was back then and certainly not today! I love who I am today. But it did take quite a bit of work on mine and my WH part to turn our lives around. Believe this or not, we allowed others to define who we were in the past. This is another reason our lives spiraled out of control.

We don't care much what other people think about us today because we know who we are and we are very good people. Very good. BTW, I do read and talk about you to my WH. We want to see you get well.

I know you hurt your wife and family, I get that. But if you could, who do you want to be today and moving forward? How do "you" want to define yourself moving forward?

wantstorepair posted 1/16/2020 07:08 AM

Hurtsmyheart, today and moving forward I want to be an honest, humble, kind man who is content in his own skin and in who others can trust because I am genuine. Those things are what I want to define me as I care for my family and try to move forward in my life with dignity and respect for myself and my actions.

Every day is a chance and a blessing to be better than I was yesterday and repair. No more selfish wallowing. I have much to be grateful and thankful for, and a lot of work to do on me. My family needs me and are hurt and tired of me letting them down.

Hurtmyheart posted 1/17/2020 14:18 PM

Beautifully said, wantstorepair. And you can achieve this living one day at a time and sometimes, one moment at a time. Remember though, there will always be setbacks for you to overcome. Don't despair. Pick yourself back up and you always can start over again.

My WH makes me laugh today. If we have a bad moment he tells me that he doesn't care and that he'll take it and tells me how much he loves me and he will wait for me until his death. He tells me any day is a good day, as long as he is with me although I now have PTSD.

He tells me even if I yell at him or say hurtful things to him, he knows that he deserves it because of how much he has hurt me. Today, he will wait for me to feel better because no matter what or how I feel in the moment, he will be there for me and wait. I sometimes go down into deep, dark holes now.

In the worst moments of going through this turmoil, he has sat himself down on the couch and prayed and read the bible and waited until the storm passed. I am the storm. He quit arguing with me and would sit in silence. And there were multiple times when he wouldn't get any sleep before work the next day.

My WH truly has been there for me in these last few year's. He is not a perfect husband (and I am not perfect either) but he has humbled himself for the most part. I always say there is work to be done and improvement can be made. We all are a work in progress.

Let me tell you, this was not the man I grew to know over the last probably 13 years or so. We've been married for 32 year's now. The man I came to know became fearful and was afraid of his own shadow. He turned to alcohol for comfort among other things. He turned into a monster toward me and my two kid's. He hated and despised himself. I hated him too. Most of his behavior came on as a result childhood neglect and abuse from the hands of his mother and family. These issues were never resolved until he quit drinking and got into CR and IC around 4.5 years ago.

He isn't that horrible person anymore. Today, he is a kind and loving husband who puts his family first and is very strong and confident and will do anything for his family and I mean anything. This is what and who you can become too wantstorepair but it will take a lot of soul searching and change and acceptance for the damage you've caused. I've also had to accept the damage my WH caused to me, my son and daughter but am absolutely amazed how my kid's have turned their lives around over the last 3 year's. It's awesome to see how they are growing because WH turned his life around and became a great father and husband. There was a point when my son wouldn't even talk to his dad but WH kept vigilant and apologized and cried to my son so many times that I and the therapist had to tell WH to stop the apologies. Now show that you are sorry through your actions. And my WH did and still does today.

One more thought has come to my mind, my husband is a superior (and I can also say leader today) at his work. One of the employees made a comment and said, you must have had a great dad. My WH said, nope! My dad was an asshole alcoholic and my mother was a mean bitch. Lol The employees jaw dropped in disbelief.

Today my WH can be so brutally honest! Once my WH started telling the truth about who he was and is today, it has been hard for him to filter what he says. I think he needs some work in this area. Lol But hey! The truth shall set you free! He doesn't need to hide in shame or hurt anymore. It's actually very nice to be with someone like him.

I am rooting for you to turn your life around, wantstorepair. You can change and become the man you want to become. What you want to change about yourself is possible. Especially since it seems that you are out of denial. I hated being in denial. It sucks.

LLXC posted 1/17/2020 14:35 PM

Hurtsmyheart, today and moving forward I want to be an honest, humble, kind man who is content in his own skin and in who others can trust because I am genuine. Those things are what I want to define me as I care for my family and try to move forward in my life with dignity and respect for myself and my actions.

Is your wife happy with your progress? If she is great. And maybe ignore what i am about to say.

Are you being honest? Are you actually doing these things, or are you just sayong you WILL do it because that is the right thing to say and/or it sounds good and/or you think your wife might read this and this moght male her happy.

I really hope you are being sincere, for your sake and your children's.

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