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After a long period of cracking, WS is now diagnosed with severe depression.

Brought on, no doubt, by the consequences of his crappy choices and the crazy AP stalking us both.

I have so much empathy for those with depression. I get how awful it is and I don't want him to suffer.

But is it okay to admit here that I'm sick of this somehow managing to be ALLLLLLLLLL about him?

Now he's depressed he has zero energy for R. He feels sorry for himself, because his life was so much better before D-day and it's consequences.

He keeps saying it's hard for us BOTH. But I'm not the one who created it.

He's probably had a breakdown of sorts and it's pretty severe so I feel like my feelings and needs are yet again nobody's priority.

I guess this post is just my little pity party. I'm sorry if I sound heartless. It does hurt me to see him suffer and I'm trying to help.

But somehow this has short changed me out of being the one who has wounds to lick and as childish as it is, it feels "not fair".

I can't really have a conversation with him right now. The little he's offering me is all he has to give. I'm not sure where it leaves me.

He says he has no capacity, so he tries to show me he loves me by doing practical things for me. Telling me I'm pretty. Making dinner when he has no energy.

I know he is trying, but it's still so much less than I need. I'm just sad all the time really. Not depressed like he is, but just a heavy kind of sad and a profound sense of aloneness.

I get it. I got frustrated when MC turned to my H's FOO issues and PTSD from military service. It needed to be addressed, but I felt like HEY, REMEMBER ME? lol

It is hard for both the victim and the perpetrator of the pain. I sure wouldn't want to be the one who brought the circus to town. That's a heavy load to carry, too.

I can't really have a conversation with him right now. The little he's offering me is all he has to give. I'm not sure where it leaves me.

Are both of you in IC?

Your feelings are VALID. I remember feeling the same way and my WH wasn't even diagnosed with severe depression.

"Oh, I'm sorry, are you having a tough time coping with the sh*tstorm you created? Is this difficult for you?"

For your sake I hope you have a hobby that is just for you that makes you feel good. Bonus points if it gives you endorphins. For me it was yoga. I got really good at yoga in the aftermath of D-Day. It helped take my mind off things and made me feel good at a time when I was at my lowest.

Are you in IC? You need someone you can talk to about this with. I know it can be all-consuming.

Yes it can seem like the betrayed spouse is just lost in the shuffle.

It’s hard that the betrayed is victimized more than once - first ny the affair and second by the cheater’s breakdown or descent into sadness and depression as a result of their terrible choices.

I guess you "make your bed now lie in it" doesn’t apply to the cheater in some cases.

You need a good outlet.

None of this shit is fair :(
Feels like "don't do the crime if you can't do the time" lol

IC for you, that will focus on you and help you focus on yourself.

just a heavy kind of sad and a profound sense of aloneness.

This resonated with me on many levels. I feel it to the bone some days. I'm farther out and R is going well. But after finding out about LTAP cyber stalking for 2 years and a subsequent Cease and Desist - it back again.

Are you in IC? I've had to go back recently due to the above. I find it helps. I even have a notes book that says Random Fuckery that I keep IC notes in. If something bothers me on some level I jot it down. If it goes away, I cross it off. If it lingers, I note why, what I'm feeling, what specifically [if I can put my finger on it] annoys me. Then I review before an appointment and go from there. It helps in a few ways. It allows me to identify things over time - and writing them down allows me to not ruminate on them non-stop just so I don't forget anything. Like the old info-mercial "set it and forget it" theory but with jotting things down.

Do you have IRL support - someone to vent to? Shoulder to cry on? Friend to have a glass of wine/cup of coffee with? There is in the I Can Relate forum a Betrayed Womenz thread that is kind of like all that. You may find comfort over there. I used to be a heavy regular there. Now just pop in from time to time. Check it out if you feeling it.

You can't pour from an empty cup and you sure can't heal that way. Please take care of yourself.

This might just be part of what recovery looks like for your WS. There's a book by Terrence Real called,

I Don't Want to Talk About It

which I think might be very helpful to you. In it, the author discusses what he calls "covert male depression", how it develops, symptoms, and how it is resolved. It's a fascinating look at the interior of the "male midlife crisis". The basics are that there exists a covert type of depression and that the male in question is behaving in ways which keep it pacified so that it doesn't become full-blown overt depression. The little red sports car, the girlfriend on the side, the grandiose attitude... it's all about creating the dopamine band-aid and keeping that big depression at bay. It really is an eye-opening look into how the social wounding of young boys plays out in middle age. Here's the bottom line though... Real tells us that the path to healing is allowing the depression which has been staved off for so long to become overt. Then, getting down to the root of the disturbance and resolving those early wounds.

I would say that you guys are probably on the right track, but you are going to need to make sure you're getting proper support dealing with YOUR trauma. Be really kind to yourself and attentive to your self-care and emotional needs. It might take awhile to for your WH to start pulling his weight in R. And remember.. you don't have to wait if you don't want to. Don't feel pressured. The choice to stay or go is YOURS. But if you do want R, allowing your WH to resolve this depression might be part of that path and what makes him into a safe partner in the long run.

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 8:16 PM, Tuesday, September 7th]

You were thinking about separation in your other thread.

It could be beneficial for both of you.

"I am thinking I'm going to leave, at least for a while, to figure out what I want.

I wish he was doing / thinking / feeling everything I want and need but he is not."

Look, regardless of why this is the case, chemical imbalance, personal issues, FOO, lack of capability, etc. he isn't giving you what you want or need right now. You'll be able to focus on your healing away from the emotional abyss that is your WH. He might figure some shit out on his own if he is simultaneously allowed to comprehend separation and not have to face the pain he has caused on a daily basis.

Sending strength.

As it seems you can't depend on the person who traumatized you to make you a priority, you make yourself your priority. Remove him from the list of your concerns. A traumatized BS does not have the bandwidth for the WS's issues. A traumatized BS does not have any responsibility for dealing with the WS's issues. He has depression caused by his own actions. That's a him problem. He can take that over there somewhere and handle it without you having to look at it. What you don't need is the person who hurt you being the victim and making it all about him. I can't imagine hitting someone and then moping around expecing their sympathy for my broken hand. This is basically what's happening here and you don't have to stand for it.

Thanks so much everybody. It was really helpful to get this feedback.

1. Regards leaving, I decided I am not leaving my house. He can go. I have also thrown him out about once every 4 days these last weeks. I'm not a volatile person. I am not an angry person. But here I am. Volatile and Angry. I bite it down and then I get so angry I ask him to leave and he packs his bags and then ends up not going because he tells me how sorry he is and how much he loves me. What we've discussed is him getting his own place for a few months nearby. So we can just get a bit of space.

2. I feel caught between the devil and the deep blue sea. He's been rocking his body, shaking, crying, weight loss, unable to sleep. It's not just a mild situation, he's seriously not okay. So that ends up taking priority because as mad as I am I can't stand seeing him in that state. He has no capacity for resolving the mess he made or working on root causes because he can barely get out of bed in the morning.

3. Right now, neither of us are in IC. I think he's scared he's about to have a complete breakdown and he needs to feel more stable before he can even think about that. I should probably start IC for myself.

4. I KNOW he is TRYING. He tries to be kind. He is always trying to kiss and touch me and even if he feels terrible he listens when I need to talk. Not that he offers any real help, but he is TRYING. He makes me food so I eat (I lost a lot of weight) and his eyes look so sad if he sees me cry. He is doing what he can do, what he has the capacity for, but I feel stuck.

5. What makes me MOST angry about all of this, is that his screwed up brain associates his current broken state with having to move jobs, move house, change his life completely etc. He's on the spectrum so this kind of stuff does create huge anxiety generally, but I want him to see it's his AFFAIR which actually did this to him / me / us. It makes me SO ANGRY that he doesn't attribute this shit storm with cheating as the root cause. He doesn't see that nearly a year of basically being stalked, threatened blackmailed, hit and terrified by an insane OW was a pretty big part of why he is so sick. This makes me furious, because I think he is looking back at the good old days of cheating as being happier than now. Which is psychologically twisted, right?!

6. He says he knows all of the above to be true, but he is in anxious state and can't think straight until he feels settled again with a stable place to live, job and so on so he can think again properly. He says once he is more stable he will give me everything I need and look after me as he should have always done. He says "we came this far Gracey, we just have a little further to go". Yet, every minute I feel deprived on my real eureka moment where he truly gets all of this, his crappy choices and all the consequences of them.

7. I can't really talk to my friends about this. I don't know why. Shame? I never pictured myself in this situation. I feel really ashamed. I could handle IC, so maybe I will try that as a good outlet and some support for myself.

8. I have so much empathy for people with mental health problems, particularly if they're in the spectrum because I can't stand seeing another human being suffer, but I still feel so angry. He had the capacity to create this mess, but lacks the capacity to resolve it.

9. The hidden depression thing rings really true. I was away for several months when his affair started and he was feeling really down at work and in general and along came AP with her lovebombing and flattery and all of a sudden he was Mr Big. I think he definitely felt that for a while. With ego issues dating back to FOO. Then it all clattered around his ears and here we are. I just wish HE instead of YOU had this level of insight.

10. He may never be able to do IC. MC maybe, but if he has a record of any mental health issues, he would lose his job. He has a job with background checks and so on. He's terrified by this. I am really not sure how he works though all this, even once he feels better, without IC.

11. What I need most is really for him to do the above, and to work through all this. I need him to get why he did this, how it happened, what it resulted in. I need him to just completely get it, and until he does I don't feel I can begin recovering as a couple.

Thanks as always for listening.

He can do online therapy under a different t name and pay cash - no health insurance payment needed.

He’s never going to progress unless he gets some help. Put the therapy in your name if you must.

But he needs to get counseling if he plans to survive this. And it appears like he really needs it right now.

3. Right now, neither of us are in IC. I think he's scared he's about to have a complete breakdown and he needs to feel more stable before he can even think about that.

This is like saying that I can't go to the doctor until I feel better. You wouldn't try to fix a broken arm yourself, right? He needs some professional help.

If he's in a profession that would boot him for seeking help for his mental health and his mental health isn't good, then perhaps he shouldn't be doing that right now - for his own wellbeing and for the wellbeing of others.

I second trying online therapy using an alias. Why not give it a shot?

10. He may never be able to do IC. MC maybe, but if he has a record of any mental health issues, he would lose his job. He has a job with background checks and so on. He's terrified by this. I am really not sure how he works though all this, even once he feels better, without IC.

11. What I need most is really for him to do the above, and to work through all this. I need him to get why he did this, how it happened, what it resulted in. I need him to just completely get it, and until he does I don't feel I can begin recovering as a couple.

He's not going to be in a position to do much in the way of marital recovery until the depression is treated. He can talk to his medical doctor about that if he's afraid to go to IC, but having experienced depression, it's much more debilitating than most people think. It colors EVERYTHING. All you say and all you do is through that lens. He will be looking at you and your marriage through that lens as well. So, best bet is that he gets himself healthy enough to work through the issues.

I'm not going to say don't do MC, particularly if that's all you can get. But I will say that MC's can make the situation worse instead of better, particularly if they're working from the "unmet needs" fallacy. If you decide on MC, interview that person yourself first. Find out if they agree that cheating is about the cheater and NOT about the relationship. IMHO, it's about character and our relationship with our own core values. It's about FOO and how we process our sense of morality. It's about the cheater's REAL world view, not the one he claims in public. Don't be afraid to interview a few of them until you settle on the right one.

It's not just a mild situation, he's seriously not okay. So that ends up taking priority because as mad as I am I can't stand seeing him in that state. He has no capacity for resolving the mess he made or working on root causes because he can barely get out of bed in the morning.

This is probably not going to go away very quickly without some sort of medical intervention.

BTW, is he still going to work?

It looks like more than IC may be needed. If I were depressed like your H, I would be grateful for my W's help in getting out of bed and to a doc's office, preferably a psychiatrist's office. Yes, it's unfair for you to be needed this way, but the payoff - an H who can deal with his issues - may be worth the effort.

You may be unwilling to go through the process of getting your H to a shrink - that would be perfectly understandable, and it's perfectly OK. But if he's depressed, you need support and that opens up these, and other, questions:

- What support do you want?
- How will you get it?

Of course, those questions are always important, no matter what your H is doing....