SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I think. Really, what is the point of continuing to suffer, being alone at home while his wife is at Mark's house, and is late, without sex for more than 6 months, please someone justify that OP, continue to suffer,

I try to understand, because being a young man, with his career,

You can allow so many disrespect, I remember you said you were attractive, I don't remember if it was here or on reddit, so that, really, so that we can continue holding on, that they continue to fight with you, here we are all adults, and we have lived, many things Through the years, it is totally evident that your wife has a physical affair with Mark, that's why she doesn't want to have sex with you, I know it hurts, but it's the truth,

OP, don't you think it is better to suffer for a short time than to continue suffering for a lifetime,

time passes so fast, life is so short, and we all deserve to find happiness, and form a family, full of love.

OP, GET OUT BEFORE YOU CONTINUE SUFFERING

THIS IS REALLY SAD AND PAIN TO READ,

SORRY FOR BEING SO DIRECT, BUT I CAN'T LIE, AND TELL YOU THAT EVERYTHING WILL BE GOOD, I WOULD LIKE, BUT YOU CANNOT LIE AND PLAY WITH THE FEELINGS OF A GOOD GUY.

Sharkman said:

Honestly it’s not unusual to have him keep anything quiet. He’d be risking both personal and professional drama by getting involved. Frankly I probably wouldn’t have asked him.

This. Emphatically. I admire you being proactive about this but I suspect the other employee doesn't want to stick his neck out for YOU or HER. He just doesn't want to get involved. Was he being evasive? Probably. He's probably also telling himself "don't get involved in this drama" and he's probably right. 9 out of 10 people would react the same way.

I know you might be confused CCB. I understand. I'm sympathetic where you are right now-- and I would favor some form of resolution that doesn't crush you. I'm from the "get evidence" camp. You know the law. You know what will help you legally in a divorce, and if that's not your specialty, you know other lawyers that do know that kind of law, far more than I do. I'm bottom line kind of guy in my line of work, and I don't waste time chasing lost opportunities because it's a waste of effort. If your wife is giving you the ILYBNILWY already, after this short of a marriage, AND doesn't' want to pursue counseling, AND isn't committed to any kind of change, then you are in limbo and you need to make change happen. Reading your descriptions of her behavior is like reading a classic definition of a woman checked out of her marriage. To preserve your own self worth and sanity, if you aren't going to pursue getting more proof (VARS, PIs, phone records, whatever) and it doesn't look like you are, then maybe you don't need proof and should just consider ending things amicably because it's clear she doesn't love you. Maybe you just should throw in the towel. I understand you are in love with her in a way she isn't' in love with you, but how is that going to change her? Has expressing your love helped move the football down the field even an inch?

and then that turns into me trying to discuss stuff with her, my wife deflecting or dismissing me, and then getting mad at me for being impatient or not even responding at all. It never goes anywhere. And I just end up feeling like a villain because every interaction we have that's longer than 5 minutes is negative.

That is the textbook definition of gaslighting. Expert gaslighters make their victims feel like they (the victims) are crazy.

Does it matter whether she's happier with Mark? The only thing that really matters is that you're not happy.

Just serve her. Let your lawyer do the talking.

[This message edited by Butforthegrace at 8:48 PM, June 27th (Sunday)]

If you want proof hire the PI. Go out of town for a few

Days and let them do their job in catching them. Don’t talk to her about her relationship with the AP before you go.

If you don’t want to go thru that, then have the discussion. But know that it won’t work if your not going to take the position that you can tell she loves another, has him in her heart more than she has you, and you are not willing to live your life like that and are doing the only thing you can do: move on to find happiness in a relationship with someone who you can put first and will feel the same in return.

That you cannot be in this relationship if the AP is also a part of it and that includes in her heart even if she cuts contact. She can have him and he can have her but she can’t have you too. No control just fact.

Keep it simple like that. No longer talks. If she pushes to talk more, say you have said all your going to say and you are moving on until you see real changes.

You know you. You know if things continue on as they are your life will be miserable.

State what you need to see and feel to stay, in the most simple way, and then start working on ending the relationship until you really see and feel it. NOT when she says “I will change”. No. But not until she actually changes.

I’m sorry but it’s the only way. And the good part is if you stick to it, one way or another, you find your path to happiness.

So if you need mire proof, call a PI tomorrow and put them on the case. If you dont and it doesn’t matter the details, emotional cheating it still cheating, then just tell her what you need then stop talking.

[This message edited by Stevesn at 9:12 PM, June 27th (Sunday)]

Tell her that you have something to say, and its not really for discussion:

"Look, affair or no affair, you are clearly unhappy in this M. Even though I love you, I just cannot stay with someone who is not in love with me, and who is happier spending time with someone else. I am not going to force something that is not there, I have too much respect for both of us to do that. It is time for us to part ways."

You can do that! it takes like 20 seconds, practice it in the mirror so you don't choke up.

Then go take the dog for a walk or on a drive. Tell her we both need time to think about this.

Leave your phone at home so if she tries to contact you, the phone will ring at home. When you get home don;t engage.

Be strong!!!

OP, if you decide you must have this conversation and you cannot wait and you go into it with the plan that it will be a calm and rational, matter of fact statement from you, I think there is a good chance that she goes immediately into attack mode to derail your planned delivery and put you back on your heels and flailing and finding yourself thinking how and the hell did this happen, this is not what I had in mind. Best of luck whatever course you choose. I think you need to start thinking more about you and what you will do and less about managing your interactions with your wife. You can control the former, but not so easily the latter.

Personally I think at this point she needs to see you taking some actions rather than having another conversation.

Likely, she believes that you won’t do anything about this (none of them ever seem to think we will for some reason!) and that she can continue to deny and deflect it away rather than work to resolve it and it’s time you demonstrated that isn’t what is going to happen.

I think you do that by separating, filing for divorce or both. You could hire a PI as well for proof of the affair but at this point, the affair is less of an issue than the way she has been treating you and appears happy to continue treating you. You must be visibly unhappy and she seems not to care and worse, happy to see it continue that way. You will start to see her differently once her treatment of you sinks in, and it’s hard to put that genie back in the bottle.

When I D my XWW, I didn’t feel the need to tell her it’s because of her cheating. She was basically of the opinion (paraphrased) that her affairs were not the issue, the issue was that I didn’t give her enough attention. Any discussions about the A would result in her getting really annoyed.

I don’t think your WW thinks what she’s doing is an issue.

Even if you hire a PI, and find proof and confront her, she’ll find you annoying and find justification for her behavior.

Doing the 180 is to help you detach and be able to get yourself out this one way relationship. Perhaps you can start with a two weeks vacation somewhere? You need to detach.

me trying to discuss stuff with her, my wife deflecting or dismissing me, and then getting mad at me for being impatient or not even responding at all. It never goes anywhere. And I just end up feeling like a villain because every interaction we have that's longer than 5 minutes is negative

. She doesn't want to talk about it because it's clear that she's having an affair. She's trying to put you off so she can continue to cake-eat. Have the stability of you and her relationship with Mark. She doesn't want to fix this or talk about it or change it. She wants to keep things the way they are. So she deflects and avoids and make having the conversation harder on you.

You can't stay in this limbo any longer. She's not going to verbally make a choice between you and Mark... The fact that she is choosing to keep Mark in her life when you've made it clear that their relationship is causing you pain is a choice.

double post

[This message edited by Freeme at 5:54 AM, June 28th (Monday)]

I approached my situation backwards, what was I hoping for? Was anything I was dealing with accomplish my goals? Even assuming all these shenanigans ended right now, your wife has done and said some horrible things to you. On top of that, she's giving her "best self" to Mark while you end with all the leftover negative traits. Even if you win, you lose. Is this the person you want to have kids with? Get old with? Live out your retirement day in and day out? The person who has not put you first? You love a theory because her behavior is who she really is. Marriage is hard without infidelity and if this new of a marriage was too hard for her and already caused her to check out, you're dodging a bullet. It only gets harder after you layer on more facets in life (promotions, houses, kids, death, retirement).

I appreciate you're need to smoke the hopium pipe for as long as you have, but it seems like it's time to gather up as much dignity and self worth as you can find, and cut your losses.

CCB, it sounds as though you know what you need to do, but are having problems taking that step. Am I correct? If so, why? Because you still have feelings for your WW? That is understandable. The folks here are trying to help you protect yourself and heal. All indications are that the only way to do that is to remove yourself from the presence of your WW.

I will give you the same advice I have given many others BS's, and I think it really fits in your situation. It's time to stand up for yourself. You know it, you talk about it, but you haven't done it yet. I think you will find that just this step will help you heal a lot. You sound as though your WW's actions are killing your self-confidence. Standing up for yourself will really help. Your WW is disrespecting you and the M. You know it. She disagrees because she is a wayward and they ignore logic and sense most of the time. You asking her to focus on the M is not smothering, it is a reasonable request. Asking her to stop talking to someone who is taking her energy and attention from the M is not smothering or unreasonable either.

You deserve better. Let her know that and that you are not going to put up with her behavior any longer. File for D, it doesn't have to be acrimonious. Let her know that YOU know your worth and it is more than what she is giving you.

Tigers Rule is spot on.

You are living in limbo hell right now, and the only way out is to gather your courage and get out.

Please don't allow yourself to be disrespected one more second. It's emotionally debilitating.

CCB, it sounds as though you know what you need to do, but are having problems taking that step. Am I correct? If so, why? Because you still have feelings for your WW? That is understandable. The folks here are trying to help you protect yourself and heal. All indications are that the only way to do that is to remove yourself from the presence of your WW.

You're right. I am struggling so hard to do that. I mean, hell, even this morning, I've been avoidant, cold, and not engaging with her while we were getting ready for work. She can tell something is up.

I will give you the same advice I have given many others BS's, and I think it really fits in your situation. It's time to stand up for yourself. You know it, you talk about it, but you haven't done it yet. I think you will find that just this step will help you heal a lot. You sound as though your WW's actions are killing your self-confidence. Standing up for yourself will really help. Your WW is disrespecting you and the M. You know it. She disagrees because she is a wayward and they ignore logic and sense most of the time. You asking her to focus on the M is not smothering, it is a reasonable request. Asking her to stop talking to someone who is taking her energy and attention from the M is not smothering or unreasonable either.

Holy shit YES!!! How is it smothering for ME to ask her to spend time, energy, and attention working on our failing marriage...but it's not smothering for her to dedicate all that time/energy/emotional attention to another dude while she's at work, texting him at home, or out doing whatever with him?

You deserve better. Let her know that and that you are not going to put up with her behavior any longer. File for D, it doesn't have to be acrimonious. Let her know that YOU know your worth and it is more than what she is giving you.

I'm going to continue my disengagement, coldness, and distance. I am going to focus on that for now to hopefully soon get to a detached enough place where I can straight up tell her that we need to be done. It's so hard for me right now because I get too emotional when I even think of that.

What you need to do is regain agency over yourself. The moment you say NO MORE you will be totally changed for the better. You are desperately hoping that what is happening is not happening. Accept the truth and take immediate action for immediate rewards. You can trust ZERO of what she tells you so you must remove yourself from this nightmare. Immediately go 180... immediately hire divorce council and get a crystal clear picture of your path forward. What she has or hasn't done and what she will or will not do is no longer relevant. It is possible that in the future she will change but the damage is done and you will likely see her differently once you become your own person again. The time is now... give yourself this gift.

Is she reacting to your disengagement, coldness, and distance, or is she happy that you're not wasting her time with Mark?

I am going to focus on that for now to hopefully soon get to a detached enough place where I can straight up tell her that we need to be done.

Maybe the way get to there it is telling her that.

You're right. I am struggling so hard to do that. I mean, hell, even this morning, I've been avoidant, cold, and not engaging with her while we were getting ready for work. She can tell something is up.

My friend. I’m glad you are starting to enact The 180. I believe in it for someone who has a WS who is not seeing how their actions and choices are hurting the person they vowed to love and protect.

My only worry though is always that if you haven’t clearly set boundaries in a simple and clear way, that the WS will actually use the fact that their spouse is being distant to justify amping up the affair and blaming it on the detachment they are feeling.

So while I urge you to continue this emotional separation from her in order to get control of your own feelings and emotions, I still recommend saying something to her in a brief and concise way.

If necessary I would write it and give it to her if you can’t bring yourself to speak it.

“It is clear to me that you are more connected and in love with Mark than with me your husband. He seems to give you want you want and need and for some reason you can’t get that from me. I am letting you go find your happiness whatever that means to you.

I cannot be in a marriage with someone whose primary focus is another. I need to be cherished and loved as I wish to cherish and love my partner. That cannot happen with this man in our lives and in your heart.

It is not simply cutting him out of our world forever that would be necessary to try and rebuild our relationship but also out of your heart and mind. Since I don’t see or feel that happening, I am going to take the steps to move on without you as I feel I have lost you already anyway.

I wish you well in finding what you are looking for. Until such a time that you see him as the threat to our marriage that I do, we have nothing more to discuss “

Then do what your are doing. Disconnect and focus on you.

You may be surprised as to how she reacts, but don’t expect her to come around right away if ever. She needs to follow her own path. You cannot lead her down it.

[This message edited by Stevesn at 9:37 AM, June 28th (Monday)]

I thought lawyers were taught how to be bold, erudite and decisive. Why are you having such a hard time drumming up the courage to confront her?

Does she intimidate you?

Or are you worried you might fuck it up, because deep down you just want her to stop and for the two of you to go back to the way things were. Well, that will never happen, and it wasn't going to ever happen. She switched the rules on you mid-game, and the game will never be the same again, so change your tactics.

Doing the 180 isn't enough. The 180 by itself is just passive-aggressiveness. It only works when it is used alongside strong, decisive measures like separating finances and setting up consults with lawyers. You are mis-using the 180 because you think it will get her back. That is not what the 180 is for. The 180 is for when you have no other option but to distance yourself emotionally from the relationship and begin detaching yourself because D is pretty much inevitable. That is why you are having such a hard time with this.

ILYBINILWY - (true definition)

I love the lifestyle and everything my spouse provides for me and I want that to continue, but I want to be free to do whatever I want with whoever I want and any disagreement to this demand will be taken as my spouse trying to control me.

We all know it's hard, but you need to focus on you! Your spouse is not looking out for either you or the marriage.

I don't know that you need to tell her that you know she is in love with someone else or that you know she is unhappy or that you are setting her free to find her happiness or any other flowery things like that. She is abusing you. It's not romantic and you are not imprisoning her. You don't get any points for being a doormat. Disconnect. What she does and how she feels is no longer your concern. She clearly does not feel she needs your permission anyway. See the lawyer, get your act together. If she drops everything and begs you to come back, then maybe things change. I don't expect that will happen, though.