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Some advice please

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HellFire posted 4/14/2021 14:16 PM

If he has spoken to an attorney about a divorce, that's being smart. You basically ended the marriage with your affair. Looking into seeing how a divorce will affect him financially, and with the kids, is a smart move. It's something we tell most BS to do,when they arrive here.

At 6 months out,the shock is wearing off, and the pain and anger are setting in.

If you tell him you are preparing for the worst..a divorce..that sends a clear message to him.

Is he a member here?

gmc94 posted 4/14/2021 14:17 PM

BS are routinely advised to look into D right after dday. And they should. That he's contacted attorneys or otherwise explored with D may look like doesn't necessarily mean he's made a decision.
And - for some BS, they instinctively know that the betrayal is a deal breaker. And that's OK, because I don't believe there is a WS alive who did not also instinctively know that D is a likely result of having an A (tho many push that thought aside bc they somehow manage to convince themselves they will never be caught).

has your BS read How to Help Your Spouse Heal? Would he be willing to listen to one of the Helping Couples Heal podcasts with you? To learn about R. Or is he just closing the door.
Again closing the door is an acceptable and understandable choice for a BS. However, I also believe that many BS may have a knee jerk reaction to immediately D bc they think it will ease their pain. And from what I read on SI, it CAN lessen the pain (again, think lizard brain and those tigers - if you don't have to see any tigers, your lizard brain can relax, so that will ease pain), but it does not necessarily mean the BS is healed. IOW, by filing for an immediate D, the BS will likely STILL need to do their own emotional healing.

And - I notice you've only been M for 2 years. Not saying this to hurt you, yet I honestly think that could have a big impact on the BS' decision to D or attempt R, in that two years is not the same "investment" in the M itself. I'm sure some folks will disagree with me on that front, but I know that my age and the length of my M were both factors in how I've contemplated D since dday. Had I been in my 30s, I would have been far better equipped to "cut my losses" and simply D. It's just a lot easier to dig up a 2yr old tree than a 25yo tree with a serious root system.

Look - the ONLY thing you control is you. That was true before your A, during your A, and today. You can be there, be supportive, bring up the A (if your BS wants that - most, but not all, do). You can clearly and empathetically communicate to him that you want to R, and then give him what he asks for.

In the meantime, you control you and you work on you. Learn to be the person you want to be. Learn to be a safe partner, whether that is with your BH or someone new.

Allow yourself the space to really GRIEVE all that's lost by this choice - and I think you know the losses go well beyond your M.

Godspeed.

BindassBP posted 4/14/2021 15:24 PM

Even though I do work with this person I do not speak to them or anything.


You are still working with your AP. In BS's eyes that means you don't care about his feelings. You are still close to your AP. Whether you contact him or not BS will always think you still do and carrying on the affair at work. BS's always look at actions, not words because your words have zero value. If you cared for his feelings you should have left the job already and and looking for a new one.

src9043 posted 4/14/2021 15:42 PM

If your AP is married or has a girlfriend, you must tell her about the affair. She has a right to know and your revelation to her is a step in showing your BS that the affair is over and that you have no feelings for the AP. Your AP has no right to hide in the shadows only to prey on some other married woman. Do the right thing and let her know.

This0is0Fine posted 4/14/2021 15:43 PM

For me, a safe partner and the "why" are intimately tied.

EDIT TO ADD HERE: You should get a new job ASAP. Complete NC, including an NC letter you BH sees you send saying something like, "I am recommitting to my marriage and for that to happen I need to never speak with you again for any reason. Please do not make any attempt to contact me now or ever again."

The solid belief that you won't do it again, is what makes you safe (well in my opinion that's the main thing). That if the same factors line up, you will choose a better path to deal with whatever stress, or problems, or anything else. You will have boundaries that are strong and cannot be broken through with enough temptation or opportunity.

"I didn't think I would do it before, how can I be sure now?"

You have to understand your why, and how to avoid it next time. Why did you allow yourself to lie to your partner? Do you still believe those same things that you did to give yourself permission in the first place?

It's possible that even if you make the changes needed to be safe, your husband might see you as unsafe forever. Like some WSs aren't "R" material, some BSs don't have "R" in them either. The A is a dealbreaker, pure and simple.

[This message edited by This0is0Fine at 3:45 PM, April 14th (Wednesday)]

Thumos posted 4/14/2021 15:54 PM

He tells me it's a choice not a mistake.

As others have noted, your husband is correct.

I had a rough upbringing. then my father wasn't in my life.

My biological father died when I was very young. Then my stepdad turned out to be abusive and an alcoholic.

As a betrayed husband, I don't discount family of origin issues, but it often rings somewhat hollow (at least to me) to have these issues used to account for adultery as an adult.

-As a start you can write out a detailed narrative timeline of your affair in your own hand, many pages in length with as much detail as you can. Give this to your husband. Have you done this?

-Offer to take a polygraph and then ask your husband if he'd like to set it up or if he would like for you to set one up.

-Take a full STD battery of tests and show him the results.

-Find another job immediately, go full NC with your AP.

It has only been 4-5 months since you ended your affair if I'm correct? Right now your husband is reeling. Take your own feelings of despair and magnify them 100 times.

You've got a long road ahead of you if you really want to reconcile. It will take 2-5 years before your husband even has the equilibrium to think straight to even consider reconciliation appropriately.

It might help if you provide a bit more detail about what you mean when you say your husband was emotionally and verbally abusive to you. This can mean a lot of different things, and without any specificity it might be hard for folks to really advise you.

Patty21 posted 4/14/2021 19:57 PM

The person I had an affair with didn't have a wife or gf. I am making steps into finding a new job even though my husband told me to stay. I know that it causes him pain and I definitely don't want to continue that. I have taken a STD test, polygraph test as well. I didn't have any dieases also I did pass my polygraph but my husband made q comment on how he didn't get to ask what he wanted or was surprised that I even passed. At the moment he doesn't want my comfort. I just listen or I answer questions when he asks. At times he just gets mad with me and that's when I let him have his own space. Then I usually try to read. I will definitely check out the podcast

HellFire posted 4/14/2021 20:04 PM

I've sent you a PM

nekonamida posted 4/14/2021 20:15 PM

I didn't have any dieases also I did pass my polygraph but my husband made q comment on how he didn't get to ask what he wanted or was surprised that I even passed.

How did this happen? Was he left out of the process of making the questions? If so, it's no wonder he doesn't feel good about it because a pass or fail relies heavily on what is asked and how.

Thumos posted 4/15/2021 10:03 AM

I am making steps into finding a new job even though my husband told me to stay.

The "even though" is an unnecessary clause. Gently, this seems like a form of justification. Your betrayed husband is reeling and will say all sorts of things from one day to the next. This will go on for a good long while. You need a moral and ethical framework to guide that should surpass this, otherwise you're just falling back into a form of wayward thinking. Staying in the job is untenable. I'm glad you're taking steps. Perhaps accelerate them? I don't know if you're answered this elsewhere, but have you read Linda McDonald's book and implemented her work plan?

Thumos posted 4/15/2021 10:16 AM

What is specifically meant when you say emotional and verbal abuse?

grubs posted 4/15/2021 10:20 AM

How did this happen? Was he left out of the process of making the questions? If so, it's no wonder he doesn't feel good about it because a pass or fail relies heavily on what is asked and how.

Likely the question he wanted to ask was rejected due to not being a good question for lie detection. The test has to consist of just a few e yes or no questions in a factual nature without any ambiguity. Wording has to only have one interpretation. That cuts out most questions about feelings.

gmc94 posted 4/15/2021 11:46 AM

There is an episode in the helping couples heal podcast about polygraphs - you may want to listen to it and see if it's something your BH could find helpful/explanatory

Derpmeister posted 4/15/2021 15:48 PM

@patty

From what you describe your husband was abusive before, although it doesn't become very apparent how bad this was.

I mean we all interact differently with language.
For example, I've detailed about myself to my wife under what circumstances I could see myself being a "slut" or "man-whore".
It's very culturally defined, I fall in the European/Australian sphere of English speech.
Meaning we quite crassly throw around the word "c?nt" like the silly c&nts we are. It doesn't mean anything depending on the charge behind it and I have trouble interpreting your husbands prior behaviour.
When I cross the pond and visit the USA, people will go ballistic over certain words, to the point I feel very restrained and uncomfortable.

But in my relationship we have no problem calling ourselves bad words when the shoe fits, my wife has called herself a whore a million times and I never disagreed with her description, only with how she handled her self image which wasn't healthy.
I'll call myself an ahole with no issues at all when I step out of line.


The thing that bothers me most as a BH and that's my advice to you is that; what you put forward about your past issues has become one of the things that I can stand least about WS.

I'm sure this is all new to you, but it's almost a universal that WS walk around with a specially crafted storyline for themselves, it's called "the hero's journey" in writing.
Basically you are the main character in your own story, and everything around you is fluff to bring more colour to your character.
Everything you do that's not right is due to your colourful backstory, and if it isn't it's all the material you're "growing" and have grown from.
Nothing you ever do is outright F'ed up, morally reprehensible, or for others to judge you for.
Being judged by others is a form of self protection for their sake you don't have to accept, but must accept that it's a dealbreaker for them and if it is outside of what they can live with you bail and find out how you can live with yourself in a good way.
Even if you've become a basket case from a horrible past, which no one denies is possible.
The fact you're the basket case you are, is probably because you keep looking for the reasons to do what you do and did, outside of yourself.

(the script often goes like this)
It's a control thing, since you don't feel in control, you just pick what little grains you can get when people meet your very low bar for affection and acknowledgement.
You don't consider the things you do before or during, that's where the fun is, afterwards is for regrets and shoving the responsibility on your surrounding that didn't show consideration for you at all, even though... You never showed consideration for yourself, or anyone around you for that matter.
And you never really connect with the choices you actually do make by "just going along the road of least resistance, for others surely, not for you ", and life just "lives you" and not the other way around.

[This message edited by Derpmeister at 4:03 PM, April 15th (Thursday)]

Patty21 posted 4/15/2021 22:18 PM

With her polygraph test my husband was able to pick the questions he wanted. I didn't have a say. Also with the abuse I didn't go into detail because other people told me not to mention it. So I have kept quiet. I am religious and even though I have committed a sin. I have asked for forgiveness from god and I making the steps into being a better person for myself. I am in therapy to heal from my past trauma and also dealing with my affair. My husband tells me that I am going to hell and keeps telling how horrible I am. I agree that what I did was horrible but that doesn't mean that's how I choose to be for the rest of my life. I know that I will carry for the rest of my life that I choose to cheat but I don't want to continue that pattern. I want to have love and respect for myself. I want to be able to communicate on how I feel that hurting others. I want to be a safe partner and a good mother.

BetterNowReally posted 4/16/2021 13:50 PM

Patty,

I know you are trying to avoid the "verbal and emotional abuse" issue because of what some posters have said.

But I believe it might help to understand your situation better if we knew more about that.

One question I have is whether the "verbal and emotional abuse" occurred before your affair or only after your affair.

If it occurred only after your affair, which you only admitted a very short time ago, I think you have to accept that some negative comments by your husband are understandable and, frankly, your own fault, and that you need to suck it up buttercup.

But even then, if things are being said in front of children, that, to me, is inexcusable. Even though you may deserve the comments, your child is an innocent victim and should not become collateral damage.

If it was occurring before your affair and its disclosure, that is a different story. However, it is certainly no excuse to cheat. A proper response would be discussing it, demanding it stop, separating, divorcing, etc., but not cheating.

My other question is of what exactly did the "verbal and emotional abuse" consist? Please give some specific examples. Perhaps it was really terrible. Or perhaps you are exaggerating or being overly sensitive. It is not uncommon for a wayward to rewrite history or exaggerate, to others and in their own mind, to try to justify their misconduct, to themselves and to others.

Some of the things you mentioned he has said after your disclosure seem understandable and acceptable to me. For example, I think calling you a "hoe," while not especially nice, is not over the top. Him telling you he does not think you can change is just his opinion and feelings and is also, in my view, completely understandable and foreseeable and not even uncommon. I just do not see these types of comments as "verbal and emotional abuse" or even undeserved given what you did. Anything he says that is true, as far as I am concerned, is not abusive, nor is it fair for you to call his expressed feelings and opinions "abuse." The only thing you specifically mentioned that I think crosses a line is telling you that you are going to hell because of cheating, which is not even a Biblically correct statement in any event.

Of course, you do not have to answer on this forum if you prefer not to do so. But I suggest that you at least think about it very deeply and carefully. I believe that will help you. And if you do come to realize that you had overblown this in your mind and used it as improper justification, you should admit that to your husband and sincerely apologize for it. That may make him upset at first, but he will probably appreciate it after it sinks in for him. I know when I finally got a sincere and detailed apology from my wife, it helped a lot.

HellFire posted 4/16/2021 14:08 PM

Her husband is a member, and has been very open about the abuse. So,maybe we can all ease up on assuming she is lying about it.


He is not responsible for her affair, and she is not to blame for his abuse.

BetterNowReally posted 4/16/2021 14:33 PM

Hellfire,

I did not “assume she is lying.” I specifically said, “maybe it was really terrible.” I just asked for specific examples. I do not know what her husband had admitted. It is not in this thread.

HellFire posted 4/16/2021 14:45 PM

It is a running theme in this thread, that maybe she is lying or exaggerating that she was abused before the affair. Or, that the husband's response to the betrayal isn't abusive. I participated I'm that, because many times wayward wives will say they've been abused, when what is actually going on is the predictable and preventable response of a person who was cheated on.

Having put two and two together, it became very obvious that when she says she was abused,she was abused.

Regardless, that isn't the point of this thread. She should be focused on healing herself, and the damage done by the affair. He needs to work on himself, and heal, and no longer be an abuser.

[This message edited by HellFire at 2:46 PM, April 16th (Friday)]

nekonamida posted 4/16/2021 16:21 PM

Regardless, that isn't the point of this thread. She should be focused on healing herself, and the damage done by the affair. He needs to work on himself, and heal, and no longer be an abuser.

I don't know if I agree with this because the chances of him changing from abuser to safe spouse are even lower than the chance of a WS changing. She would be much better off healing and leaving the marriage.

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