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Fanny, you know who the people are that have followed your story from the beginning.

They have taken their time to pass along valuable wisdom that comes from painful experience.

This wisdom wasn't given with strings attached. No it was given to you because people (myself included) genuinely care about you.

That said you have disregarded EVERY single piece of wisdom that has been given to you except getting counseling. Great you've started to do this but your actions say you're not really ALL IN and truly serious about this.

I also have to point out that the counselor you're seeing is NOT good. Any counselor that was worth a shit and heard what you've shared about this loser BF you've had for the past four years, the guy who came to buy your boat, would have advised you to put seeing ANY man on hold for the time being.

Heck maybe she did and you're ignoring her advice as you have ignored the advice given here.

As I also mentioned to you there's going to come a point in time where your friends and people here on SI are going to step away from being a rubbernecker to this continual wreck because Franny, you're very personable and easy to like, BUT that makes this even harder to watch because nobody wants to see you get hurt and it's even more painful that you AND YOU ALONE are responsible for all of the heartache and bullshit that you'll experience.

We've tried to tell you that you are worth EVERYTHING that you desire but in order to get it you HAVE TO PUT EVERYTHING ELSE TO THE SIDE because you do NOT need the distraction.

To focus on you and you alone!!

To go NO CONTACT!!

But you are like a little kid who is hellbent on doing things your way.

Franny let me ask you a question.

How is doing things your way working for you?

I think we can all see and it's a freaking train wreck!!

Doesn't have to be this way but you sure are hard headed and AGAIN have to learn things the hard way.

And what Belle said is what everyone is thinking (the over/under is Two weeks for you to fuck this new guy or Mr Wonderful comes back in the picture).

Also who are these friends of yours and what do they have to say about you and all your drama?

Do they call you out on it or are they all enablers???

As I said previously I'm tired following this. I wish you had a 1stwife, or HellFire, or Charity or tush there with you physically to knock some sense into you and than give you a hug and to keep you from doing the same shit over and over again.

What do your friends say?

Is your counselor really on board with you meeting up with any man even for lunch???

I have posted a few time and tried to cut through the noise.

Fanny please listen.

You have been alone you say but you are not comfortable being alone. Thats the crux of your bad choices.

Find happiness fulfillment and completeness without the help of another human. Then you won't fall for the shithead that you wasted the last 7 years on. The jeep man stranger you allowed in your home. The stranger from 7 years ago who was so verclempt that he couldn't call you again?!?! You don't see this as odd? As desperate? As problematic in your paths?

Please take dating off the table for 3 months. Focus on you. What you want and what you deserve. Examine why you tolerated being an option for 7 years to the man you can't seem to stay away from regardless of him treating you like an ATM and whore.

Dig deep figure it out. You deserve better.

Everyone here wants to help, we simply no longer know how

So true! Couldn’t have said it better myself.

I fuck up. I make mistakes and do stupid things. It's a hard wired aspect of the human condition.

Doesn't mean I don't want to make the right choices - it's more of what guides me to those choices I guess.

Am I ok being alone. Yes. Do I WANT to be alone? No. I've been on my own for a very long time - I've built a life for myself by myself. All I've ever wanted was someone to share it with and I can honestly say I've never made the right choice when it comes to that.

The fact that I'm on day seven on no contact with Mr. Wonderful (that admittedly made me laugh so I'm sticking with it) is a testament to a want for something better. Other than the 8 months we didn't speak after break up #1 in February 2018 this is the longest we've ever gone without speaking. Will he come back? Probably - men like him always do - but will I take him back? No.

As far as the new guy goes The1stWife is sort of right - I have this deep seeded need to always have a man in my life. That's something I'm going to explore with my therapist. Maybe it's because I have a low self esteem stemmed from getting shot in the head by my brother when I was 12 and having permanent scars that make me feel ugly. So I boost myself up by the sheer fact that men still find me attractive. Maybe it's because my father and brother - the two people who are supposed to be role models in my formative years were anything but and it's created a perfect storm of wanting constant validation from men. I could wax psychological about this for hours.

My father left us when we were 13 and never looked back. My brother beat the shit out of me for years after he tried to kill me and my mother looked the other way. She paid for his college but refused to pay for mine - gave him anything and everything he wanted and as soon as he was out of the house felt like she didn't need to be a parent anymore and would spend 4-5 days a week at her boyfriend's house leaving me to my own devices. I was 16. When I came home from college after my freshman year she told me I wasn't allowed to stay in the house and to find another place to live. It's events like this that I think have shaped me who I am today. I will do ANYTHING to succeed...and have such an abject fear of failure that I'm willing to go to any length to avoid it.

I also think the above is the reason I pick hapless losers because I know what it's like to be poor and destitute and I want to show them how to succeed when you have nothing. I mean, I worked three jobs and lived in a studio apartment in Michigan with no heat in graduate school because the rent was $230/month and it was all I could afford. So I know what it's like to build something from nothing because here I am 20 some odd years later with all the trappings of a good life.

This new (or not so new since we shared air space seven years ago) guy seems very smitten and was forthright about his intentions. And while it could all be smoke and mirrors to get me in the sack at the very least I'm prepared now to shut it down. On the plus side though he's NOT a hapless loser as he seems to have his shit together and doesn't need my wallet. That in and of itself is an improvement from every other man I've dated. I literally have no expectations of how it'll turn out but I sure as shit know that if it's not going the way I want I can walk away confident that I won't make the same mistakes I've made before.

I have a great life - I really do. My friends love me unconditionally and are very supportive - they've told me for years what an asshole and user Mr. Wonderful is but as always I rationalized it and shut them down. They've been right all along but aren't the kind of people to walk away from me just because I'm stubborn. That's why they're great friends - they love me no matter what. At the moment they're so proud of me for cutting Mr. Wonderful loose and are my biggest cheerleaders. And yes, they've heard me say "I'm DONE!" a million times (they like to joke like they feel like they're living the real life version of the movie 'Groundhog Day') but they are giving me the advice and support I need to stay on the wagon so to speak. And the wagon has really soft seats with unlimited wifi so I think I'll stay on for awhile.

[This message edited by FannyandCat at 9:12 AM, April 17th (Saturday)]

I fuck up. I make mistakes and do stupid things. It's a hard wired aspect of the human condition.

When you do the same thing over and over again, it is no longer a mistake but a choice.

You have received excellent advice from some seasoned posters.

The pattern as I see it is this: you come for advice, they give it, you claim mistake happened and offer excuses, more advice is given, another claimed mistake and excuses, and still they give more advice.

If you want change, you have to make the changes.

Fanny thanks for sharing some background.

That's quite a bit that you've been through and yes it's AWESOME that you've overcome it.

That said, you have a ton of shit to work through. I know you're lonely and want a man in your life, but Fanny, it's not just about finding the right partner it's also about being the right partner.

Don't you think it would be in your best interest to put men/any relationship on the back burner right now to just focus on you?

Getting counseling and sorting out all the shit you went through growing up because damn That's a lot of shit you've been through and more importantly Fanny it's VERY easy to see how it's seeped into a lot of areas of your life and how it's driving your choices (destructive choices).

Three months isn't going to be enough. Don't you think it would be worth it to you to invest the next year to digging in and fixing Fanny?

What's ONE year??

Doesn't mean that your life is on hold as you can still see your friends but men, dating and new/old relationships are put on hold for a year.

Commit to counseling for a year.

Use your resources ($ and time) and invest in YOU!!!

If not the same cycle is going to continue.

You're obviously a fighter and a overcomer so you can certainly do this.

Even if you found a great guy right now Fanny, given where you're at, you would destroy it.....there's no way it would sustain itself.

I know this isn't what you would want.

Put the work in now and get to a better place.

First step is understanding why you do and say the things you do and yes your childhood and early adult years have made you who you are. Again that's a lot to sort through.

Fanny you're worth it.

I hope you give this some serious thought my friend.

Edit: sorry for saying Franny instead of Fanny. Tough week for me/one yr anniversary of my mom passing away

[This message edited by Booyah at 11:18 AM, April 17th (Saturday)]

They've been right all along but aren't the kind of people to walk away from me just because I'm stubborn. That's why they're great friends - they love me no matter what.

And the same goes for your anonymous friends here at SI.

We ALL want to see you succeed. Live the best life. With the best people. Sadly Mr Wonderful was not one of them.

I applaud you for your accomplishments. You should be proud you were able to survive your terrible childhood. I’m at a loss to understand WHY your brother still remained free and not in jail b/c it does not sound like be shot you by accident. But maybe that was the cover up and that was the lie you had to live with in your family. I’m sorry to see this.

I hope you can see we are here to support you.

Maybe it's because I have a low self esteem stemmed from getting shot in the head by my brother when I was 12 and having permanent scars that make me feel ugly. So I boost myself up by the sheer fact that men still find me attractive. Maybe it's because my father and brother - the two people who are supposed to be role models in my formative years were anything but and it's created a perfect storm of wanting constant validation from men. I could wax psychological about this for hours.

If I may offer an alternative here - it may be rubbish, but it is still worth taking up with your therapist. If my own therapy has taught me anything it is how much our actions are driven by the emotional wounds sustained in our childhood/early youth that are still buried deep in our subconscious. Sometimes they aren't even subconscious but we make them so - when they surface from time to time, we do our best to subdue them in false belief that they aren't important or even a sign of weakness. You could say that we ignore or even despise that emotionally hurt child within us. Yet, that hurting child is still there and sometimes returns with a vengeance, acting like a master-puppeteer and steering us towards paths we wouldn't otherwise take.
Your emotional wound may not have anything to do with your outward appearance - I think you have ample evidence that men do find you attractive. Granted, they may well be shady low-lives and whatnot but they don't seem to have any problems with your appearance. I'd venture to say that your longing for male attention stems from the lack of positive male presence in your formative years and the resulting feeling of vulnerability. Young girls tend to look to male members of the immediate family for protection more than anything. From what you write, your father and brother were anything but protective of you. Maybe that's who you're looking for - a protector, a knight in shining armor who will come to your rescue and save your inner child?

She paid for his college but refused to pay for mine - gave him anything and everything he wanted and as soon as he was out of the house felt like she didn't need to be a parent anymore and would spend 4-5 days a week at her boyfriend's house leaving me to my own devices. I was 16. When I came home from college after my freshman year she told me I wasn't allowed to stay in the house and to find another place to live. It's events like this that I think have shaped me who I am today.

That's another can of worms worth opening with your therapist's assistance. In our teenage years, our need for emotional support and protection from our parents begins to be slowly supplanted by the need for recognition and respect. Simply put, we want to feel appreciated and important. If that appreciation and respect are lacking - we often try to achieve them by becoming a better alter ego of our parent. What's a better way to gain someone's respect than by outdoing them and "brazenly" displaying qualities we find them lacking in? This could partly explain why you are so selfless and considerate in your dealings with romantic patners. It's like an inner voice saying: "Look mom, unlike you, I am a caring and empathetic person, I am better than you and I deserve your respect".
Sometimes we take a perceived weakness of character of our parents and go overboard trying to compensate for it. Hence, sons of henpecked fathers grow up to be toxically masculine (I'm not particularly fond of this term, but it is what it is) and disrespectful of their romantic partners or women in general; on the other hand, daughters of submissive mothers grow up to be bossy and controlling in their relationships.
Whatever the case with you, make sure your therapist is up to the task of untangling the ways in which the dynamics of your early relationships (be they romantic or otherwise) have determined your actions and outlook on life.

Edit: And, as others have written before, give yourself a considerable break from dating. You aren't emotionally healthy yet and all you can attract is an equally unhealthy individual.

[This message edited by Sceadugenga at 7:48 PM, Saturday, April 17th]

My brother was charged with a litany of offenses...attempted murder, illegal possession of a firearm, assault with a deadly weapon, assault with intent to kill...you name it. He was 15 at the time but this was in the 80's and while he would have been charged as an adult today that wasn't the case 30+ years ago. All the charges were dropped and he plead guilty to assault - given probation until his 18th birthday with mandatory group therapy. My father kicked him out of the house an my aunt, a psychiatrist offered to take him home with her. He lived with her until my father moved out seven months later. I have forever blamed myself for the demise of my parents marriage and think my father couldn't look at me as I was the face of his shame. My brother used my father's .32 revolver and he just couldn't deal with it.

I have facial palsy on the right side of my face - I have a crooked smile. And I'm completely deaf in my right ear as the bullet went through my cheek and lodged in my right ear. The combination of those two things make me very self conscious of my appearance so I guess to compensate I stay very thin and try to make my body the focal point versus my face. I've spent most of my life with horribly low self esteem.

Sceadugenga - you couldn't have hit it more precisely. That's exactly what I want - someone to be my protector...someone that has my back because it feels like I've spent a lifetime protecting myself and not doing a very good job. I just want someone to BE there. Mr. Wonderful is tall, strong and exudes masculinity and I so wanted him to be the man that could keep me safe. He put on a good show but ultimately he was a wolf in sheep's clothing...he liked to TALK like a man but couldn't match the talk with action. He turned out to be a weak, spineless wimp who never voices he actual wants and needs and would rather do the exact opposite of what he wants to do to appease others.

My mother and brother laughed at me when I told them I was going to graduate school. Hell, they didn't even think I would graduate college. I was always "the failure of the family" that "wouldn't amount to anything". Yes I rebelled as a teenager but nothing too horrible - but the two of them painted me out to be this crack whore hellion. They would actually have private discussions about "what are we going to do about Fanny" (I found this out in my 20's). I'd look them in the eye and say, "I'll show you" and they would laugh. On my mother's deathbed (she passed away about 11 years ago) she looked at me and said, "you showed me" and that still brings tears to my eyes. By that time she had cut me out of her estate and my brother had cut her off from me for years but I wasn't going to not be there in her final days. Those last five days were a total shitshow that's a story for another day but suffice to say I will always cherish being there.

I'm going to bring these subjects up when I see my therapist tomorrow. In other news, I made it through the weekend with no contact. On day NINE...

And Jadedangel - people make poor choices. Whatever path I need to take to make the right choices is my path to take. Just because it doesn't fit into a particular mold doesn't make it any better or worse - it' just a different mold. I'm listening to ALL of you and taking it all in - good, bad and ugly. I appreciate your input as much as the others - it ALL helps.

You have a lot to sort through with your therapist Fanny!!

Congrats on getting through day nine.

Remember breaking NC the clock goes all the way back to zero and you start over.

At some point down the line you'll run into this guy, but hopefully you'll be deep in therapy and more cognizant of your decision process and thus more prepared to make better choices knowing what the consequences are.

I hope this is a good week for you.

Congrats on day 9!

You interesting how this tragedy happened and your family “fell apart”. Only now you know it was their shame and issues but as a child that is hard to understand and accept.

I hope you recognize the issues with your brother are serious and if your parents never did anything about his behavior or deep rooted problems then that is on them.

It is possible you misinterpreted their shame and guilt as blame. But as a kid it’s not your job to fix them. It’s their job to fix themselves.

Get help with the emotional healing. I think it will help you tremendously.

Go for day 10!

Fanny,

Your last few posts have a lot of information in them and you have truly been through a lot.

I really do hope for you that you get the exbf or whatever you want to call him out of your system.

YOU are too GOOD for him. There will be someone worthy of your time and love just not him.

He is a snake, a user and that is all he will ever be.

Starting day 10 - therapy appointment this afternoon.

I haven't seen my brother since my mother died. My father and I tried to reconnect in 2009 after a 20 year absence and it was a total disaster. We haven't spoken since. I really don't see a reason to contact either of them. Ironically my aunt (my mom's sister) still keeps in touch with my brother and recently got back in touch with me after an 11 year absence. I found out that not only has she kept in touch with him this whole time but has had him at her house for visits. That sort of hurt - she doesn't talk to me for over a decade but maintained contact with him and had him at her house for Thanksgiving? I don't get it but it's nice to finally talk to someone blood related for a change. My father has one brother too (with a wife and two kids close to my age) but I haven't seen him in almost 20 years and haven't spoken to him in over a decade. Truth be told I really don't have a family, which I guess could be another reason I have this need to have a man in my life - I want to look at him and think of him as my family.

In all candor, I hate the holidays because I become the "charity invite" for Thanksgiving and Christmas. While I like being included and always have a good time it nonetheless hurts that I don't have a place of my own to attend family gatherings. What I would give to have a Sunday family dinner.

That's probably why I tried so hard with Mr. Wonderful - he has a HUGE supportive family...tons of aunts, uncles and cousins that visit frequently. Funny thing though was he'd never invite me over to actually MEET any of these people and that always pissed me off to no end. And yes, he'd have me over for a couple family dinners when his aunt, uncle and two cousins moved in but when any other extended family came to visit I was excluded.

So while I have a lot of great friends and stay busy I still feel this immense sense of loneliness - does that make sense? I could go out every night and take part in a million activities to stay busy but every night I'm in my bed with the dog and the cat wishing there was a human there too.

And that's the thing - when I really want something I stop at nothing to get it. That's both good and bad because it's made me successful professionally but it's been a disaster in my personal life. I don't know how to give up even when red flags are literally whipping my face with gale force winds. If I give up then I've failed and for whatever stupid reason I can't accept that.

You have tremendous insight into your “ family”. I use the term loosely b/c they just share DNA - they are not a real family.

The aunt sounds like a nice person but yet why exclude you? Makes no sense. Was the pain too much for your family to see? Did they just avoid you b/c they could not cope? If that is the case it’s too bad they didn’t share that with you instead of just turning their back on you.

So while Mr Wonderful did the same thing by excluding you, you are used to that behavior. You know it’s wrong but your family did it - so you “accepted” it from him.

And that explains how you hung in there for so long. Now it makes sense. If we maybe had known this perhaps the advice may have been different b/ c different factors influence your choices.

Glad to see the NC streak continues!

The1stWife -

I have no idea why I've been excluded. Part of me wonders if they all avoid me because they think I'm a basketcase because of the past...or maybe seeing my crooked smile brings back all the bad memories. What hurts the most is that my brother, who is a horrible person through and through, was ok to be invited but I was left out.

I ended going on that date this past Sunday and had a wonderful time. He acted like a perfect gentleman and we had a great lunch followed by a few hours at a local museum then a walk in a park. He brought me back to his boat and it's HUGE...and yes we kissed but that's it. But since Sunday he's pretty much ghosted me so I figured all of you were right - he's just a player and when I wouldn't do more than kiss him on Sunday he gave up. So I ripped him a new asshole and blocked him. FELT AMAZING.

I REALLY need to taking a dating break and focus on my own self-care. So I'm going to do one of my favorite things this week and spend a couple hours at the batting cages...win the World Series 100 times.

You ripped into him, because you haven't heard from him since Sunday? It's Tuesday. So you gave him..what? 24 hours to contact you,and then you went off on him?

First..Im glad you've decided to stop dating for awhile. You need to work on you.

But, I have to say, it's obvious you were way too serious, way too soon about this new guy. Throwing a fit because he went a day without contacting you is extreme.

[This message edited by HellFire at 11:23 AM, April 20th (Tuesday)]

Another bad decision....you didn't know this guy at all and you went on his boat????

Fanny he could have RAPED you!!!

As HellFire said, you don't hear from him after a few hours and you go off on him???

Two dangerous situations you have put yourself in.

Mr Jeep being allowed in your home and going with Mr Boat to his boat.

Please stop and think about what you are doing before you do it.

I had a friend murdered at 16 because she got in a car with someone she knew and ended up dead. Killed by the guy. Completely unsolved. It’s been 35 years and someone got away with murder. But all leads point to a stolen car with a guy pretending to own it and the murderer being someone she had spoken to and seen at her job.

You take risks. Too many risks. All for a guy.

He blew up my phone from Wednesday to Sunday then yesterday...NOTHING. And today...NOTHING. It wasn't a few hours it was 36 hours. And after the way he behaved before the date...flirty texts, good night texts, can't wait to see me again and how he thought we had great chemistry and blah blah blah to not say anything both Monday and today was enough for me. Was I serious about this guy? Fuck no...but I gave him a chance...he blew it. Oh and forgot to add he said, "I promise to text you as soon as I wake up on Monday". And we had had what I thought was a good general conversation about honesty and transparency on Sunday...I told him I am a person of my word...that if I say I'm going to do something I do it. Without your word you're nothing in this world. This was after he told me he was worried I wasn't going to show up when we met at the park earlier in the week. I also believe there are only two words you use very sparingly - love and promise. If you say you love something, mean it. If you promise to do something, do it. It's how I live my life. The fact that he couldn't keep such a simple promise spoke volumes to me. It was so stupid simple...something that would have literally taken maybe five seconds! That left a bad taste in my mouth. At the end of the day it just solidified the fact that I'm not ready to date anyone and need to focus on me for awhile.

And yeah, I shouldn't have gone on his boat. But I will say he acted like a perfect gentleman and didn't do anything other than kiss me. Bad judgement call? Yeah...no more visits to anyone's house, boat, car or whatever until I really get to know someone first and definitely no one coming to my house for the foreseeable future.

[This message edited by FannyandCat at 12:51 PM, April 20th (Tuesday)]

He blew up my phone from Wednesday to Sunday then yesterday...NOTHING. And today...NOTHING.

Figured as much. Do yourself the favor in the future and next time someone ghosts you return the favor. You only give them ego kibbles when you light them up afterwards.