SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Did you get to look at her other phone?

You should if you haven't.

What made her confess THIS time to the additional information? Something had to spark her to do that -- was it the idea of the poly (so you got your parking lot confession WAY early).

Seeing how often she has lied and then confessed later, how could she POSSIBLY think that you would believe her about NOT having sex with the guy (especially if she was at his house 2x) -- just not credible.

How stupid she thinks I am? Unbelieveable.

My bet is she's hoping you're still naive and dumb struck enough to convince yourself of it. But you know as well as we do that it's a lie.

No experienced OM is going to waste all this time and effort on someone he wasn't getting sex out of. Even though her first story stunk, it at least offered the possibility. Multiple in person meetings that she continued to hide means it's a done deal.

Saw this posted somewhere a while back.....

“Even in reconciliation, cheaters are still driven by selfishness, and focused on the preservation of what they want, rather than what the betrayed spouse needs The betrayed is supposed to have all the power during reconcilation, but the truth is, the cheater does. They control how long reconcilation takes, how much truth is dished out etc. They can still leave at any time. A primary reason reconciliation happens is because when the cheatee says 'I want to reconcile' the cheater has chosen the forgiving spouse over the AP. If they choose to leave for their lover/AP, it’s over. Cheaters are master manipulators who control the relationship - while letting you think you have a say in what happens to you if you choose to stay with them. Truth is, you are at the mercy of their choices."

Not sure how much of it I believed at first, years ago. Now, the more times goes on, the more I see how things play out, the more sense it seems to make.

Silver lining (if there can be one at all) is that you didn’t waste any more time in “R” with her.

I know you’re still reeling in pain and shock. I just want you to know that there are plenty of good women out there that would kill for a guy like you.

Not sure what the current dating market is like for a single mom with a history of infidelity, but I don’t think she is going to be too happy in the coming years.

R is absolutely off the table, I can't even stand to look at her. I let her speak to kids over WhatsApp when I made sure she is keeping it together and that's it. Not interested in what she has to say. And definitely NO polygraph, it would be a waste of money now and I don't believe she would even do it. It was all a game of who will break first. I still don't understand why she told me now.

The burner phone is gone. It was a cheap one with a prepaid SIM card, bought in cash. She told me she smashed it with a hammer few days after Dday and threw it away. I don't care really, what purpose would it serve if I knew what was said?

Her AP was a player. If you haven’t already, get a full panel STD test now!

At least you know now that you are for sure out of the infidelity. I know it doesn't seem like it now but life does get better.

Sadly she is just like most cheaters. Another day another lie and who knows what comes next. You and your kids deserve so much better. She brought about her own catastrophic downfall.

You don’t need to spend time, money and mental energy trying to learn more. Stay the course with the divorce and look towards a future that is free of toxic lies and infidelity.

I honestly don't know what she had been thinking. She had been quiet few days before, and looked out of place. After she had told me about that "car incident" i was obviously asking more questions, but it's not that I had to pull it out of her. And many things she told me I had no idea about and would probably never find out. The sheer depth of her lies and deception is just monumental.

I asked her why tell me now, and she said she can't keep lying to me and she wants me to know everything. I have no idea what's going on in her head.

I asked her why tell me now, and she said she can't keep lying to me and she wants me to know everything. I have no idea what's going on in her head.

Guilt is corrosive to most people. The more your reconciliation was progressing, the more you were nice to her, the worse the guilt became. Better now than years down the road. She still didn't feel guilty enough to confess to the full on PA.

I have followed your story for quite some time. Initially, it looked like the two of you could get past all of this crap. She seemed to be upfront and honest per your posts. While you are a stranger to all of us, I could not help but get emotionally invested in your process. I am a BS so I know the absolute pain you have experienced. I know all about trickle truth. Sadly, this just didn't have to happen. Your wife is such a fool. My ex-wife is a sociopath who couldn't give two cents about my well-being. Your wife was simply a sucker. But in the end, she threw you, her children, and the marriage under the bus. At some level, she must have understood that this would end badly. At some level, she must have thought about starting a new life with the AP. No doubt the affair would have continued if you did not catch her. You have a lot of work to do. You need to stabilize your wife's emotions so that she can be a successful co-parent. Of course, you need to deal with what you are going through. I hope you are in IC with a therapist that deals with infidelity. I certainly understand why R is off the table at this point. Heal, take care of your children, and when you are ready, find a worthy partner. Again, I am very sorry it ended this way.

[This message edited by src9043 at 1:51 PM, March 5th (Friday)]

Again Mr. Flibble, sorry for your pain.

***

I write this next section in the hope that maybe there is a betrayed spouse reading this or who will read it, and not fall for the standard cheater's bullshit, and they find the strength, as you did, to get the truth before committing to reconciling with a disloyal liar.

Before you told us there was more, but seemed to be open to a polygraph, I was going to coach you on how to ask questions and get very specific so she had to commit to a given answer that was polygraph-worthy. (I kind of started that already)

Her strategy was to gloss over the details and then try to love-bomb you, pussy-bomb you, and simply keep her head down until you moved on. It almost worked, but I could tell you still had doubts.

And I can tell you something: You would have always had nagging doubts because you didn't get the truth, a story that makes sense.

There is a poster here named Nanatwo who has this in her signature: First the truth. Then, maybe, reconciliation. Louise Penny

To me it was pretty obvious that 1) your wife was holding a lot back, and 2) She was unstable.

That's why I kept hammering at that bullshit story about the car and telling you there was more.

There is always more. Cheaters will lie, minimize, and then they will lie some more. Take that to the bank.

Other people who have been betrayed: Her story was absurd. Adults don't steal off to a private place to just "smooch". And by her own admission she was in the car with him many times other than the one she flagged as "The Session". And she is an adult. The idea that she was shocked at his trying to get under her skirt or whatever is ludicrous.

***

Here is why your wife told you what she did yesterday: The threat of a polygraph

She tried to tell you as much as she could, short of sex, which she probably considered to be your ultimate dealbreaker, in the hope that you would believe that she had finally "come clean" by telling you how bad she was and then you would try to work through it with her.

Another thing to understand about cheaters is that they try to decide what your dealbreaker is - how far they can go and when it becomes too much. Then they move those goalposts again and again.

Finally, it becomes: It's okay because my husband/wife doesn't know [dealbreaking act], so this really doesn't hurt them.

***

What makes me really mad about what she has done to you is outside the cheating. That's just normal repugnant behavior. But the fact that she risked the health of her entire family screwing around with this dude during a worldwide pandemic - a guy who was fucking around with at least 4 other women - the risk she was willing to place her family under is off the charts crazy, stupid and selfish!

UGH! I am so sorry for you Mr. Flibble. This breaks my fucking heart.

At the same time, I am relieved that you are not going to spend so much time in the same limbo that so many of us faced, because we didn't find a place like the Surviving Infidelity Just Found Out Forum early enough, or we didn't take the advice from the people who say to demand truth and accountability before offering attempted reconciliation, or instead we took the advice from people who seem to focus more on keeping a couple together as a "win" than what it means when a betrayed spouse continues living with a liar. AKA rugsweeping.

Please get some rest. Please focus on your children and yourself. Then moe forward with your life. You are a good man and you will make through this. It will certainly hurt, but not as bad as living with someone who you know is lying but cannot prove it.

***

I hope your wife gets some help. But she needs to truly want that help or it will do her no good at all.

She has to seek help not because of what she lost and hopes to recover, but because of the serious character problems that allowed her to throw it away.

I really hope that this phrase of "Burn the Witch" will die on this forum.

It's such bullshit.

Sure, there is the odd "burned and broken man" here or there who vent and rant.

But this "Burn the Witch" phrase is actually used to try and intimidate men who are advising betrayed men that they should not rugsweep the infidelity and lies of their wife. That they should not demand truth. Not demand accountability. Not establish the boundaries that they need in their relationship, what they will accept and not accept.

"Can't you see she's sorry?" They paint the betrayed man almost as abusive because he doesn't melt when the tears start flowing.

You NEVER see this happen in thread where the cheater is male. Not from men, not from women advising the betrayed woman. Nobody suggests that a cheating man was hunted and fooled by a "predator".

This Damsel in Distress point of view is thoroughly against the fact that women are equal to men and have their own agency and volition.

It's tiresome.

***

I would also like to point out that MR. Flibble's wife lied to him, her family, AND THE THERAPIST!

Therapy is not going to make a cheating liar into an honest and loyal person. They are not going to force accountability. They are not going to tear down the wall of lies.

They will however, cash the check, and help you "find your whys" to present to your betrayed spouse.

A therapist cannot and won't even try to change you into someone better. It has to start with you. Only you can change you. And you have to want it more than anything in the world. You have to be willing to lose what you squandered in order to gain your character.

***

Mr Flibble. I salute your determination. I read that other thread from before this one. You were castigated and called names. Even recently. You were tempted, but you stuck to your principles. And as you said, you trusted your gut.

Be well, and good luck.

[This message edited by faithfulman at 4:57 PM, March 5th (Friday)]

You need to get tested for STDS. PLAIN AND SIMPLE.

This is why I always recommend you do this and make your partner do this before moving forward with R.

Thos is why I always recommend meeting with qn attorney.

This is why I always say demand q tomelkne with a deadline. Get the truth force it.

She is still protecting herself.

I'am really very sorry for you. This was the only case where I saw hope. But I was always saying that the only condition is that you should know the whole truth first and therefore have a poly test.

Why she tell these now? What came to my mind is, you have explained here your approach to the poly test from the beginning, if you had this type of conversation with her, she might have had the courage to hide the truth. And recently as the probability of poly test grew stronger she began to see that she couldn't hide them anymore. Perhaps she thought there might be still hope for R when she slowly revealed the truth.

And with a great possibility there are more lies and hidings, sexual intercourse first of all. After all these car meetings, sextings and going to his place, it really surprises me if they haven't had sex. If everything was so innocent, there would be no need for a burner phone and coaching for hide everything. Actually, they worked like experts. In one of my recent posts I said

"This is very likely to be true if they didn't perfectly planned a lie in case of being busted long before."

Why did I need to add the last words? In terms of this aspect, I have never read such an event here, but I still thought of this possibility, because, I have not cheated anyone until today, I do not lie a lot either, but if I do, I will say it perfectly and it never appears, but I also take precautions against the possibility of it.

It is a long time in the past, but there was another thing that came to my mind that I didn't mention here. When hotel spending occurs, MrFlibbe said

She just looked me in the eyes and said "It is not true. We never went to any hotel room ever, He's lying."

If someone accuses you of 100 things that are true and you have nothing to say against them, you can be confident of the only false accusation, thus giving the impression that not every accusation you made is correct. Of course, I am not saying this is exactly the case. I don't know with which emphasis she said this sentence, how her body language was. There is also the possibility that the liar could lie this way. This was just what crossed my mind when I had read.

Now, as you said, these are enough to be done, there is no need to poly. And the hiding part is as worse as the cheating part. Let her know that this part was real dealbreaker for you and you know there is much more than she told.

Considering that even just the beginning part is enough for you to divorce, it is clear why your STBXW is trying to hide the whole truth. If she had said everything at once, at least there would be a possbility of becoming friendly parents in the future, but now I don't think you would want to become friends again.

I know it's a difficult process for you but you have a strong personality and I'm sure you will handle it easier than anyone else.

[This message edited by guvensiz at 6:21 PM, March 5th (Friday)]

The sheer depth of her lies and deception is just monumental.

I asked her why tell me now, and she said she can't keep lying to me and she wants me to know everything. I have no idea what's going on in her head.

You have been told multiple times that you know everything, only to be hit by a fresh set of revelations. Given the history of the trickle truth you have been subjected to, I think it would be foolhardy to presume that the latest revelation completes the story.

There comes a point where the only way to break a liar's power over you is to tell them that you have no interest in being told anything more, and to make a decision based on your gut feeling about things.

What is amazing about this forum is the number of times that a wayward spouse tries to bullshit the person they betrayed, only to finally admit what their betrayed partner suspected all along. The reason you kept feeling like there was more to this story is because there really was more to the story.

There may be more to it that has not yet been revealed, but if you have reached your limit, it is time to end the confession sessions and tell your wife that a line has been crossed, and reconciliation is no longer an option.

I honestly don't know what she had been thinking. She had been quiet few days before, and looked out of place. After she had told me about that "car incident" i was obviously asking more questions, but it's not that I had to pull it out of her. And many things she told me I had no idea about and would probably never find out. The sheer depth of her lies and deception is just monumental.

I asked her why tell me now, and she said she can't keep lying to me and she wants me to know everything. I have no idea what's going on in her head.

Sometimes what's going on in a WS's head is that they finally figure out that they really do have to put the full truth on the table. It's not unusual for it to take this long, or even longer, before they stop trickling it out.

You've already decided on divorce, and that IS the prerogative of any BS. But don't go into it thinking the your WW is some kind of particularly monstrous case. This is par for the course with cheaters. It's garden variety. They're scared to put all the facts on the table at first, and then later on... they're scared not to.

As to whether you have the full truth now, who knows? You've had a lot of people telling you that there's no way she didn't have sex. And maybe she did. But no one here can know for sure. Motive, means, and opportunity certainly make for pretty damning circumstantial evidence, but then, there's always the odd hold-out. It's a moot point now anyway since you've decided your course. I just think you'd do well to realize that your WW's behavior isn't off the norm. Trickle truth is common, albeit unpleasant. It would be easier for everyone if WS's could turn it around on Day 1 and abandon their wayward thought process, but the vast majority do not.

Thank you all, I can't tell you how much your support means to me. I have reached to some of my friends but it's hard to meet now. They try to help as much as they can but they have their own lives and problems and I don't want to be a burden.

STBXW came this morning to my parents to apologize to them for everything in person. I had no desire to speak to her so she left me a letter but I am not sure if I should read it or not.

And as for reasons for lying? Self-preservance and fear I believe. It was obvious she wanted everything to just go away, to go back in time. Maybe It was too naive to expect her to tell me the truth when she knew it would mean it's over. So she let herself be eaten alive by guilt until she couldn't take it anymore and she came clean. You should have seem her this morning, she's a wreck. I can't help but feel sorry for her

STD tests done way back. All clear

She should be a wreck. Her life just exploded and she was the one who set up the bomb. But here's the thing - don't mistake being a wreck for remorse. It's regret. It's focused on herself and what she is losing. It's not about you and your healing. That is especially true if she is still keeping any lies going.

Read the letter or don't. It's entirely your choice. You can always save it and read it further out when you've healed more.

What would the letter really say that is of any material nature to you at this point? She did this to you. That you are in a position to feel a patchy is a good one, and you should stay there.

This wasn’t getting carried away like she built it. She had a complete relationship with him and planned, with her boyfriend, to conduct it right under your nose.

Extend human grace to her but the simple fact is that you know deep down that what you want out of your life isn’t something that she can be. Compassion to yourself isn’t second guessing and compassion to her isn’t to send any false signals.