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Wife in affair and wants divorce

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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 12:45 PM on Monday, November 2nd, 2020

Would suggest you research narcissistic behavior. In particular the covert narcissist and see how closely your wife matches the documented behavior.

I will take a look. I saw some of the symptoms but she doesn’t fit them all. I noticed one was having no empathy. She has way too much, when someone gives her a sob story she feels “so bad” for that person and so on. Just her her AP, “he’s had a rough life, you don’t know what he’s been through”. 🙄

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
id 8604471
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smolderingdark ( member #64064) posted at 12:09 AM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

I noticed one was having no empathy. She has way too much, when someone gives her a sob story she feels “so bad” for that person and so on. Just her her AP, “he’s had a rough life, you don’t know what he’s been through”.

Covert narcissists are able to mimic emotions, empathy and sympathy for others. It is all just an act. Covert narcissists are harder to detect but you can if you know what to look for. I was married to one.

How the Narcissist Hurts You Using Cognitive Empathy

By Kim Saeed - Author, Researcher, Educator

Cognitive Empathy

This is where things start to get dark. Think of every sleazy lawyer, salesperson, or interrogator you’ve ever heard about or come across – they all utilize cognitive empathy.

This gives narcissists the ability to see things from your perspective and then act in a way that’s most beneficial to them. Cognitive empathy is still empathy – just not the kind most people are familiar with.

Why the Narcissist’s Lack of Empathy Concept is a Myth

Narcissists don’t lack empathy in the way we typically believe – they lack compassion, remorse, and regret.

We tend to confuse emotions like compassion with empathy, but as mentioned above, a person can understand what another person feels, thinks, and experiences without feeling the human emotions that go along with it.

That’s exactly why the narcissist’s lack of empathy concept is a farce – and a dangerous one at that.

It tends to let them off the hook for very hurtful behavior. The narcissist’s lack of empathy idea implies that their abusive behavior is completely unintentional.

In reality, it’s extremely manipulative and extremely intentional.

posts: 167   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2018
id 8604802
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smolderingdark ( member #64064) posted at 12:18 AM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

HOW DO THEY DO IT? Narcissists will absorb and mimic the dynamics available to them with ALL people to exploit, pillage, and use every opportunity to take all the supply they can. They have to because this is the only working dynamic in their life because they lack a true personality, emotions, ability to bond and most importantly EMPATHY!

Narcissists know exactly how to introduce themselves and engage with another person in order to find out about their personal life story, interests, and figure out who they are and what they stand for. They know how to manipulate you right into their lair with charm that is really a key to gaining your trust and to open your mind like a safe to find all of the valuables you have hidden away AND use that information to their advantage. Many normal people want a connection AND affirmation about themselves, their beliefs and are open and can become vulnerable when another person empathically affirms them or identifies with them as having a strong and common connection and so much in common. This is what opens up our minds to the Narcissist so they can crawl in there and extort what they can. This is not a person getting to know us for the right reasons as in some sort of human connection or to bond – it is an agenda a Narcissist uses to lure you into their agenda of abuse. We know there are people out there that can and will take advantage of other people BUT we never really had insight to a psychopathic creature of this degree that is so seamless at their manipulation with an agenda to use our trust so totally against us to get at something they want.

Narcissists manipulate others via fake emotions which most people read AND react to as being authentic and accurate, and then respond accordingly as normal people do. The use of the right “emotion” at the right time opens up the person emotionally to the detached and cold Narcissist who is watching from behind their own fake persona, like a predator stalking prey, waiting to seize the person emotionally. The Narcissist’s emotional camouflage is strikingly convincing and fools most people they use it on. Narcissists overcompensate for their devoid and emotionless self with that extreme charm or charisma, AND fake personality. Narcissists are seductive by nature and disarm others with seductive charm, talk, gestures, and alluring messages designed to appeal to the victim and connect with just what the Narcissist feels the victim needs at that moment to seize the opportunity to pull in a new target. This is what snares the victim into their agenda especially when the Narcissist comes so attractively packaged with a huge bow and bright wrapping paper as I use to describe them so often. Unfortunately, there is no amazing gift to be found under all that wrapping and huge bow. It is just a bottomless, dark and empty box or a huge void that draws you into it – but it is DANGEROUS to any humans that unwrap that package to look and search inside.

Narcissists exploit the human need to connect or bond to their own advantage by camouflaging themselves with an array of EMOTIONS to create a connection or an open door to our brain through our emotions and hearts. Manipulation and positive affirmation of our ‘personal beliefs and likes’ induces a form of dizzying disorientation, so we begin to trust them and then our identity or persona is compromised by the Narcissist through their vast manipulation. It allows us to feel safe, having our values/emotions reinforced and mirrored back to us, and establishes a strong connection and even love. Narcissists know that if they can control an individual in this manner and at this level they have that key to deeply penetrate and manipulate an individual. The victims are hooked and will deeply connect to the Narcissist – simply it reinforces the basics that we have grown up with and that is trust, falling in love, or loving a person. Unfortunately, it is not by any means normal that they accomplish this and instead it is the act of the Narcissist manipulating us through this mirroring to GET US THERE.

The unfortunate aspect with a Narcissist is that there is an agenda that follows where they extort and then start attacking our belief system through horrendous acts of betrayal, brain-washing, gas-lighting, lying, stealing, etc., to virtually debase, control, dehumanize and destroy us. This is when the Narcissist reveals their pathology and act upon their destructive nature. This is the cycle of their abuse. This is where the Narcissist’s mask slips and the loathsome creature from within rears its fangs and attempts to devour us after they have gained entry into our lives and gotten what they came for. Basically they control their victim to keep them confused so the Narcissist can keep taking that supply until they are satiated.

Narcissists do not only use their charm and destructive manipulation on their partners and in relationships, this is their main tool they use in every aspect of their life. They are in a constant manipulation or camouflage mode charming every person in every walk of life because their needs are varied and many. Sadly, this includes mothers, fathers, and brothers/sisters abusing other family member’s even parents abusing their own biological children. It includes work environments where the Narcissist triangulates other employees to damage the work force as well as bosses doing the same. They may hide behind the camouflage of the local church, a charity, political movement, professional group, or corporation. They may obtain a professional degree and have a career or profession such as a doctor, lawyer, preacher, CEO, or in the psychological or behavioral sciences field. The world is their playground and we are their toys to play with and throw in a heap to accomplish their agenda and many needs.

A Narcissist only needs to join in and listen to find out what motivates and drives a person or even a group. Narcissists will then absorb and mimic the dynamics available to them to exploit, pillage, and use every opportunity to take all the supply they can, ultimately causing extreme destruction to the people that they exploit.

posts: 167   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2018
id 8604805
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smolderingdark ( member #64064) posted at 12:24 AM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

From the narcissist H.G. Tudor

The Mocking Through Mimicry

I love to copy. I have to copy. It is all I have known for as long as I can remember. It is my natural setting to mimic those around me. I have to fit in, I have to belong and the most effective way for me to achieve this is to replicate everything that I come into contact with. If I interact with an esteemed academic I will listen to his or her achievements and then pass those off as my own as I peel away their glittering accolades and apply them to myself. Should I spend time with an exceptional sporting individual then their record-breaking endeavours will be purloined for my benefit and sported as my own in furtherance of my own belief in my exceptional ability. Author? Yes I have written books too. Model? Yes I do some modelling from time to time. Chef? You should try my signature dish, it is heavenly. Everyone I have dealings with presents me with an opportunity to copy an element of their personality. character or personae so that I may then present it as my own and in so doing I shine brighter and become an even more attractive prospect to those whose lives I effortlessly infiltrate.

This skill at mimicry enables me to ghost in and out of people’s lives. I know the social norms which are applicable and through careful examination and application I am able to pass as one just like you. I am a facsimile of a decent, personable and engaging individual and this allows me access to my targets without raising any alarms. My veneer of respectability has been fashioned from all those that I engage with, gathering patches, fragments, shards and pieces until they are hewn together and I drape it about me allowing me to come and go as I please.

It is however with you that I exhibit the astonishing mimicry of which I am a master. Once I have selected you as my target I have learned much about you already. With what will eventually be recognised as alarming ease, I replicate a fondness for all those things which you like and a distaste for all those things that you dislike. Think back and you will readily recall how I love horse-riding just as you did, that I enjoyed swimming in open water just like you and my passion for the works of Geoffrey Chaucer matched yours. Those interests which were close to you became interests that were close to me. Your appreciation of an excellent bottle of Chateau Margaux was matched by my ability to remember the applicable tasting notes and recite them to you as if it was my own appreciation. I would mimic the way you sat, copying your body language because I know, from extensive practice that this paves the way to bonding with you. I would mimic your speech patterns to form a sub-conscious link between us. I liked blue because you liked blue. I found listening to soul music an offence to my ears but I maintained a false enjoyment of it since you liked it so much. I actually enjoy choosing from the Crustacea bar but your dislike of seafood meant that I too turned lobster and oysters away. How often did you remark aloud, to me or to your friends,

“We have so much in common.”

“We like so many of the same things it is wonderful.”

“We share so many interests, I love it.”

“We are so well matched. On every level. We really are soulmates.”

Of course we are. I made it so because I wanted to be everything you wanted. I took your long list of likes and dislikes, your catalogue of loves and hates and your grimoire of hopes and fears and I copied each and every page. I am a walking photocopier and I copied everything you wanted in order to ensure that my seduction of you was successful, encompassing and absolute.

Yet, my astonishing powers of mimicry did not end there. Goodness me no, there was more yet to come. In a particularly unpleasant twist to this malevolent skill of mine I would mimic your responses to my devaluation of you but this time it would not be a complete facsimile, I would make a slight change to my copying so that you would be undermined even further.

When you stood there crying with frustration and I drank deep of the delicious fuel you provided me, I would raise my hands to my eyes and draw pretend tears on my cheeks and make a sobbing noise to humiliate you further. Here I was letting you know that I copied everything that went before yet now I copy again but not with the perfection I once exhibited. I allow the sting of sarcasm and the malicious mockery to infiltrate my copying of your behaviour so that your hurt and bewilderment was increased. You would shout at me and I would shout back using the exact words before standing and laughing at you as you burned with frustration, unable to find any response. You might stamp your feet in exasperation and I would do the same but with a leer of disdain writ large across my face.

There were times when you would scream. A terrified scream as my vicious manipulations would take their toll and as you tried to curl into a ball and hope you might just disappear and escape this nightmare, I would lean in close to you and mimic your scream into your ear, creating this fabricated falsetto of distress in order to further your own. Every reaction to my devaluation of you had the potential to be met by a mimicked reply from me in order to further your misery and demonstrate I did not treat your responses with any sincerity or concern.

I am the master of mimicry, the king of copying and the duke of duplication. I am a walking and talking photocopier machine. I put the rank in Rank Xerox.

posts: 167   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2018
id 8604809
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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 12:34 AM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

Wow thanks for all the info. If you don’t mind me asking, how did your marriage end?

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
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smolderingdark ( member #64064) posted at 2:01 PM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

The short version, the marriage ended on my terms.

There was an incident where I saw her for who she was, not who I thought she was.

When I decided to divorce I went no contact. The only line of communication was through my lawyer. My ex had no opportunity to even attempt to manipulate me.

My ex wife dragged out the process. It should have taken a little over a year to complete. In the end it took 2.5 years to be free of her.

posts: 167   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2018
id 8604947
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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 3:34 PM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

Wow she’s already trying to bring her new guy over to her parents house so they can just “try” to get along with him. 😂

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
id 8604999
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thatbpguy ( member #58540) posted at 6:31 PM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

Wow she’s already trying to bring her new guy over to her parents house so they can just “try” to get along with him.

He's a loser and his little act will probably not impress anyone.

ME: BH Her: WW DDay 1, R; DDay 2, R; DDay 3, I left; Divorced Remarried to a wonderful woman

"There are far, far better things ahead than any we leave behind." C.S. Lewis

As a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly...

posts: 4480   ·   registered: May. 2nd, 2017   ·   location: Vancouver, WA
id 8605078
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smolderingdark ( member #64064) posted at 10:26 PM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

Wow she’s already trying to bring her new guy over to her parents house so they can just “try” to get along with him.

How classy. My recommendation to you is to quietly withdraw from your former in laws. If a baby factors into the equation you should have little doubt they will eventually take their daughter back.

Push hard for the divorce to complete as quickly as possible while she is presently occupied with her current target.

posts: 167   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2018
id 8605190
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smolderingdark ( member #64064) posted at 10:56 PM on Tuesday, November 3rd, 2020

[This message edited by smolderingdark at 4:57 PM, November 3rd (Tuesday)]

posts: 167   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2018
id 8605205
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Devasated ( new member #75718) posted at 3:32 PM on Sunday, November 8th, 2020

Good for you! Yes move forward with the divorce. I had 2 D-Days to deal the second one was not as bad. It's been 5 weeks since first (he lied and told me that he is not in love with her and is no longer talking, wants to figure out what he really wants blah, blah, blah busted on Whatsapp and that was 2 weeks ago) I am in the same position with the house, bought in 2003 married in 2013. Already know from my attorney WH cannot touch anything with the house. It's sickly comforting to know that other's are on the same timeline, and not just sitting back waiting for the WS to make the move. She won't do it first unless he pressures her into it.

Wondering if she stays with this person is a waste of mental energy and accommodating free rent in your brain.

I spend 90% of my waking hours thinking about this whole ordeal, I as you am also eating healthy, working out, lots of water and trying to sleep. I keep telling myself that it's for the best.

However I know the mental anguish you are feeling. Take a few minutes everyday for gratitude and appreciation that you are an amazing journey, no matter where you land know it is on your terms!!

Counseling and therapy help, I actually have 2 now. I found an infidelity trauma therapist. SO far so good!

7+ years married
10+ together
No children together
Raised his 2 youngest

posts: 23   ·   registered: Oct. 24th, 2020   ·   location: Chicago, IL
id 8606699
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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 12:37 PM on Thursday, November 12th, 2020

Found out she has nowhere to go on Thanksgiving lol. Why isn’t she going with her new man? Only thing I can think of is his parents don’t know about her yet because what other reason would she have to not be with him?? She called me earlier this week to tell me something that could have been a text message...

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
id 8608141
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ShutterHappy ( member #64318) posted at 1:44 PM on Thursday, November 12th, 2020

After an exit A, the WS often crumbles down. Most of us here will recognize that, a BS will have a feeling of validation seeing the XWS destroying his/her life after the D.

But the best way to heal and move on is to look forward, not backward. When we look forward, there’s no WS there.

Me: BH
Divorced, remarried.
I plan on living forever. So far so good

posts: 1534   ·   registered: Jun. 30th, 2018   ·   location: In my house
id 8608164
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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 2:04 PM on Thursday, November 12th, 2020

After an exit A, the WS often crumbles down. Most of us here will recognize that, a BS will have a feeling of validation seeing the XWS destroying his/her life after the D.

But the best way to heal and move on is to look forward, not backward. When we look forward, there’s no WS there.

After an exit, you mean after the divorce is done or since she’s moved out? I’m really not trying to follow what she’s doing or anything because all it does is make me mad. I just hear these things through other ppl. I think I’m doing good for being what it is now. We have our first hearing the end of this month and if all goes as planned our divorce will be final that day. Then she will be able to go run off with her new man freely and the “fun” of the affair will be over

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
id 8608169
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Westway ( member #71747) posted at 6:56 PM on Thursday, November 12th, 2020

She doesn’t want to reconcile at this point because she said she’s “done trying” even though she only brought this to my attention and then a week later said “I’m done” and she did no wrong in this, it’s all my fault.

She knows it would take years to make things up to you. She knows that she doesn't have the strength of will or strength of character to spend years helping someone heal from her bad decisions, so she is not even going to try.

She also knows that even if she does everything to help you heal, you may still leave her in the end, so she just says to herself it is a risk she is not willing to take.

She also knows that for years she will be under the scrutiny of both you and her extended family. F*ck that.

She also knows that deep down she doesn't love or respect you enough to put in the hard work to keep you.

And pride. Her pride won't let her admit she's in the wrong.

So that is why she was finished before she even started. She would rather blame it all on you and bail.

[This message edited by Westway at 12:57 PM, November 12th (Thursday)]

Me: 52;

XWW: 50 y.o. serial cheater

Married 22 years, Together 24
2 Daughters: aged 16 and 20
DDay: 9/20/19
Divorced 12/03/20.

posts: 1366   ·   registered: Oct. 3rd, 2019   ·   location: USA
id 8608321
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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 1:39 AM on Tuesday, November 17th, 2020

Well apparently she’s not spending Thanksgiving with her new man. Wonder why?? You’d think the first holiday they’d spend together right?? Maybe because he still lives at home LOL.

No I’m not trying to follow what she’s doing, I just heard this through someone else.

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
id 8609793
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Underserving ( member #72259) posted at 5:48 AM on Tuesday, November 17th, 2020

I’m gonna have to agree with a fellow member, and comment on how “easy” this is all playing out for you. It doesn’t minimize your pain, please don’t misunderstand me. But oh to have the answer be so clear cut. I’ve told my WH countless times I wish he would have just left me for the OW. It would have been the purest form of revenge letting karma play out. His life would be RUINED, and our children would know their parents splitting up was his fault. The sluts Twitter was enough for me to ensure he never saw my kids around her. It would have been poetic.

As for my reality, so much more grey area. I didn’t find out about the A until 3 years later after he transformed into the perfect husband. He refuses to give up on the marriage, so I’d be the one going to the lawyers office and filing. Even though HE broke the marriage, I’d be the one officially (legally) ending it. It’s a chaotic shit storm I wish on no one.

Your wife is a bitch. I’m sorry she was so empty inside she discarded a loyal husband for someone who is TEMPORARILY kissing her ass. It won’t last. Thank your lucky stars, God, or leprechaun you are a man without kids. Finding a better woman will be an easy task for you

BW (32)Found out 3 years post end of AD-day 12-9-19In R

Infidelity brings out the cuss in me. I’m not as foul mouthed in real life. ;)

posts: 775   ·   registered: Dec. 9th, 2019
id 8609837
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steadychevy ( member #42608) posted at 1:42 PM on Tuesday, November 17th, 2020

I wish my XWW had left me for her AP when she was actively fucking him. It would have hurt like hell but I would have been a lot younger. Eighteen years younger than I am now when the D was finalized. However, she wasn't going to leave me and she wanted the results of our long term life goal being achieved.

I was wondering if you have filed for divorce and had her served yet? Where I live it takes a year of separation to get a divorce except in the case of adultery, abuse or abandonment. Under those cases you can get a divorce in 3 months. There isn't any changes in the settlement just the time line.

As others have said, push hard to get divorced as quickly as possible while she's still in the "honeymoon" of her adultery. Your divorce should be quite simple with no children, short marriage unless you cohabitated before marriage and that counts and fewer other entanglements.

Carry on, stay strong. I'm so sorry for this happening to you and you didn't get the lifelong loving marriage you anticipated. There is still time for that with someone else whose morals and values match your own.

BH(me)72(now); XWW 64; M 42 yrsDDay1-01/09/13;DDay2-26/10/13;DDay3-19/12/13;DDay4-21/01/14LTA-09/02-06/06? OM - COW 4 years; "dates" w/3 lovers post engagement;ONS w/stranger post commitment, lies, lies, liesSeparated 23/09/2017; D 16/03/2020

posts: 4720   ·   registered: Feb. 27th, 2014   ·   location: Canada
id 8609887
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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 2:10 PM on Tuesday, November 17th, 2020

I’m gonna have to agree with a fellow member, and comment on how “easy” this is all playing out for you. It doesn’t minimize your pain, please don’t misunderstand me. But oh to have the answer be so clear cut. I’ve told my WH countless times I wish he would have just left me for the OW. It would have been the purest form of revenge letting karma play out. His life would be RUINED, and our children would know their parents splitting up was his fault. The sluts Twitter was enough for me to ensure he never saw my kids around her. It would have been poetic.

As for my reality, so much more grey area. I didn’t find out about the A until 3 years later after he transformed into the perfect husband. He refuses to give up on the marriage, so I’d be the one going to the lawyers office and filing. Even though HE broke the marriage, I’d be the one officially (legally) ending it. It’s a chaotic shit storm I wish on no one.

Your wife is a bitch. I’m sorry she was so empty inside she discarded a loyal husband for someone who is TEMPORARILY kissing her ass. It won’t last. Thank your lucky stars, God, or leprechaun you are a man without kids. Finding a better woman will be an easy task for you

Thank you. Everyone I have talked to said it’s temporary (her and him) but she believes he’s “the one”. She’s always had a thing for me and she always kept coming to me in the 25 of our 30 years alive. Crazy how she’s throwing it al away for someone she just met a few months ago.

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
id 8609896
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 Nhraracer (original poster new member #75772) posted at 2:16 PM on Tuesday, November 17th, 2020

I wish my XWW had left me for her AP when she was actively fucking him. It would have hurt like hell but I would have been a lot younger. Eighteen years younger than I am now when the D was finalized. However, she wasn't going to leave me and she wanted the results of our long term life goal being achieved.

I was wondering if you have filed for divorce and had her served yet? Where I live it takes a year of separation to get a divorce except in the case of adultery, abuse or abandonment. Under those cases you can get a divorce in 3 months. There isn't any changes in the settlement just the time line.

As others have said, push hard to get divorced as quickly as possible while she's still in the "honeymoon" of her adultery. Your divorce should be quite simple with no children, short marriage unless you cohabitated before marriage and that counts and fewer other entanglements.

Carry on, stay strong. I'm so sorry for this happening to you and you didn't get the lifelong loving marriage you anticipated. There is still time for that with someone else whose morals and values match your own.

Yes I have filed for divorce and we have our first hearing next week actually. We don’t have to be separated for anytime. If she still agrees to what we agreed on then it will be final that day.

posts: 40   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020
id 8609901
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