SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

You're doing great OP. Sorry he's such a twatwaffle <3

No suggestions re the divorce stuff, but in terms of career stuff have you considered reaching out to some recruiters in the industry you're in? My background is in recruiting and I'm happy to provide some suggestions on working with an agency - they can help you "passively job search" (ie they interview you and let you know when matching opportunities become available)

I know this is all so infuriating, and it's hard to talk rationally with someone that is not looking at things rationally. But you're doing a great job, and you can mentally hurt him whenever he does something dumb (which is frequently)

((((hugs))))

Thank you TwiceFooled. It is considerate of you to provide support and good ideas for the job search too.

I have reached out to a few recruiters I used in my past life for the niche industry and field I had worked in. A lot has changed in the 8 years since I worked in my channel for sure. But I've been applying for roles and will keep the search going. I'm using a number of search sites and job aggregators along with the headhunters, and doing the usual back of the envelope work (e.g., visited 100+ company pages today to trawl career postings). So, trying to do the top level stuff and also trying for the bottom level stuff (contract work, looking at odd jobs).

I felt an immense sense of urgency to find meaningful work when we moved here a few weeks ago, and that was WITH the knowledge I'd be getting the financial support we agreed to to get on my feet. Now that he has reneged on all of it and I am looking at a new future where I will (1) lose A LOT of my meager savings to mediation/trial/legal fees; (2) end up with MUCH less than I had been counting on; (3) now absolutely NEED a job that is high comp, the urgency, fear, and stress are through the roof.

And at the end of the day. All I want is to just be able to start putting this behind me, dealing with the trauma this has caused, begin to try to manage my emotions and "move on." But I have to table all of it as I find myself again, deeper and deeper, in complete survival mode. It feels like another blow. Nope, no need to try to heal, just keep suffering! So disgusted.

I am certain that a year from now you will be in a better place.

I’m sorry your STBXH has turned into the worst possible human.

But one day he will be a distant memory and you will be on top of the world.

Thanks 1st Wife. Your post made me tear up. I know a lot of this is temporary. I will eventually find a stable job, and then jump to another stable job and another. I can go into debt and work to rebuild it. I can eventually get to a place where I can begin to try to work through the piles and piles of traumatic baggage he has saddled me with. I inherently know it will not always be as hard as it is now. But it all feels really insurmountable, and of course when I have so much on my plate, so much to be genuinely concerned and stressed about, so much to be constantly worries about .... it gets added to this period of time when I feel completely broken, thrown away, weak, lacking confidence, and self esteem. And the worst thing is I am painfully aware it CAN get worse and it might get worse.

I do want to put him in the rearview (despite the whole must be in touch to coparent) but it also is still really really sad that I'm in this position, that he has done all of this to me. I don't want to come away despising him and being bitter and resentful and angry for the rest of my life. But if he continues to stick to this horrible new "plan" that basically solidifies that I will be left to financial bankruptcy while I suffer the consequences of his disgusting decisions I do not know how I will be anything but bitter, angry, hateful. It scares me. But I have enough more important things than my mental health to be focused on now.

Fold,

I really don’t have anything to add except to tell you that you are doing an amazing job imo with all that has come your way.

I am concerned about this tremendous stress effecting your long term health. Are you still getting IC? What can you do to help bring down your stress levels? Are you a runner or have other forms of stress reducing exercise you enjoy?

We here are all with you in spirit. I have no doubt your future will be much brighter. Sending hugs. ❤️

Another voice of support for you Fold! I agree with beachgirl, this is a tremendous amount of stress and I hope you are tapping into whatever solutions you can find to keep you healthy.

Can you have your parents move in with you for a little bit ? I don’t have a strong family support system and have had to navigate everything alone and it can get very exhausting. Having your parents around when you negotiate with exWH will help ?

Hope the kids have started school and you have some downtime to yourself. Sending you lots of hugs.

Thanks, Abalone and BeachGirl. Again. Always, lol.

My stress level is pretty damn high. But until this experience, I have never had every single stressor I can possibly think of coming down on me at one time the way all of this has. A lot of the time I feel like I am emotionally flailing. Physically I am upright. I am exercising 4-5 days a week. Hydrating, sticking to one cup of coffee, no alcohol. Continue to have not-great sleep, not-great appetite. I have lost 25% of my total body weight in three months. I was heavier than I like to be and needed to, but extreme and traumatic stress was not the right impetus for a health change.

I am still doing online therapy, until my insurance ends. He's very tell it like it is, which works for me. And I have good friends who check in daily, weekly. I am lucky for that.

My parents live a few states away. They are in their late 70s and retired, but have a lot of local commitments (childcare, eldercare, volunteer endeavors) that keep them where they are. They can and will come out if I need help in a pinch (like if I have to travel to go to trial). They are already planning to spend the holidays here.

Otherwise, school has begun and that is a huge help just to get some things done.

I have a "strategy session" tonight with a couple we are both friends with who are going to help me prep more for how to approach the conversation I will have tomorrow with WH. I need to be open and let him explain his reasoning or he will get defensive and it will go nowhere. And I have to be careful not to let my emotions make me unveil the threats I am willing to make if it goes south. I don't want to show all of my cards but also literally have nothing else to lose. It is complex. Who knew I would ever have to involve other people to help me strategize how to best get it across to my WH that if he keeps all of the money he promised me to support the kids that the kids will suffer? I mean, common sense. Except apparently that is lacking.

Fold,
Please keep us posted how the talk goes with him. Prepare for the worst but hope for the best ! Take care.

Hi Fold, just hoping your talk went well and that you got something out of it.

Thinking of you and hoping things went well.

Abalone, Nekonomida, and SadieMae, thanks so much for checking in. This is SO long so I am doing it in two parts. Totes pathetic I know but here we are!

PART ONE:

We started off OK. Small talk, status of his criminal case (no update), desire for us to hammer things out vs. go to mediation. It was downhill from there, and conversation went about as badly as I suspected it would. We spent 1.5 hours going in circles (luckily kids at school during this time) and he was absolutely defensive, angry, and disgruntled. I kept my cool and was calm but assertive the majority of the time. His main point was that he claims he never agreed to the value for alimony in perpetuity and his lawyer said 12 months (at half the amount we agreed to) was super generous since the state where we filed requires zero. I reminded him that we agreed to the set of terms before we retained our lawyers, and that he could review the paper trail of three versions of the original draft document and related email communication he and I had; the emails we sent our attorneys with said draft document laying everything out; and review the separation agreement which has 99% of the same terms as the divorce agreement and which was signed and stamped by him, his lawyer, and the judge. He kept repeating that the state won't make him do any of it, he never agreed to any of it, I am not remembering correctly, and it doesn't matter anyway because he is not agreeing to it now. Same goes for contributing to college savings and meeting me halfway on childcare/activities/camp.

I brought up logical points: That he encouraged me to move because to get support since his actions had cost me my home, community, and social circle, and to get distance from the spotlight of military and eventually he media. He gaslighted again saying he never wanted me to leave, did not encourage me to leave. When I pointed out that he had literally said to my parents and my BFF when they came out to help during the first move, well before we decided to divorce, that he supported me moving with the kids because he knew it was unhealthy for me and he claims he never said it. I pointed out that my relocation was moot as the difference between the rental in our old state and my rental here is $400, and if I had remained in the old state we would still have two households to pay for, I would have the exact same childcare issues, and the exact same work limitations. I told him he was driving both of us deep into debt and he countered that he had higher debts now than I was facing. When I reminded him that he had income streaming in to pay debts while I didn't and the difference was I was going to go into debt literally paying for the repercussions of his singular choices... he told me to get a job.

He threw a lot of really hurtful statements at me: "What makes you think you deserve anything?" "Tell me using actual facts, exactly why you should get any money at all" "Why aren't you working?" "You decided to move here and its your own fault" "I will force a trial and you know a judge will give you nothing but the minimum of child support." When I used my "prepared statement" that I was being backed into a corner, did not want to have to handle things in a different way, had kept quiet about his criminal case, and may not be able to continue to maintain that confidentiality... he baited me, accused me of threatening him, said I could go talk to anybody I wanted to because he did not care, and then basically counter-threatened me "if you threaten me you will get nothing, eff around and find out." He followed it up with a lovely diatribe about all of my faults, that he didn't have to be bullied by me or antagonized by me, that I did not get to abuse him any more or treat him like a punching bag or lash out at him any more, and that "these are all your issues that you are so sarcastic, bitter, resentful, and entitled." It was completely nuts and I have never ever seen him like that or been spoken to like that by anybody.

In the end I told him that we needed to table the discussion, go get the kids, and could try to talk again. And if we got nowhere then then we would begin the process for retaining a mediator. By this point I was in tears and he surprisingly was too. I think if nothing else there is a TINY part of him that has to stop lying to himself that this situation we are in. He can tell himself his therapist, and anyone that I am to blame, but after yelling at me for 1.5 hours he has to look me in the face and let himself admit to himself all of this is because of what he did to me and our family. I threw out a counteroffer for alimony, reiterated the others points we had discussed. Instead of the original value for perpetuity I decreased it to 2/3 the amount for 20 years. I told him not to give his thoughts on it then and that we would talk the next day; I'd write up what we had discussed to give to him. Then we got the kids, I said goodbye, and met a friend for dinner.

Today I saw him again as we had the first day of a kid activity and I had to go to sign the waiver. Once they went into the class he and I went out to my car. I started by saying that we had spent too much time arguing yesterday and I couldn't do it again today. Went over the notes I'd written for a counter. He did not agree on the spot to anything but said he had talked to his attorney this morning and that we were not far apart on things. We agreed to discuss again tomorrow. I said, and mostly meant it, that I didn't want things to go this way, that I did not want any of it and I didn't want to be here. I wanted to be back in my old house, with my family, and with none of this ever happening, but it was not an option and we both needed a chance to just move on. And he again was tearful and said that this was hard for him, that he is holding back tears a lot of the time, that he is seeing his therapist, that he was trying. I just ended it saying we should stop for now, and that this was not a contest over who was more hurt, we are both suffering, and that he had to keep perspective that this wasn't me doing something to him, it was him doing something to me. He nodded, said thanks, and we went our separate ways.

Tomorrow will be the next/last chance to iron things out more. I am sure that he will counter on the terms and we will see what happens. I have been crying basically nonstop for 24 hours, was exhausted last night but up most of it. I am just so disgusted and sad about everything. Plus it is hard to not have my kids last night and tonight. Been apart from them for ONE night ever in the past 5 years. And this seems dramatic and I have NEVER used this term, but I realized today that I actually feel like I was emotionally abused last night. I keep seeing his face yelling at me and I've felt more anxious than usual today (which is pretty damn anxious).

In the end it is all just so much a freaking shame that any of this happened, that it could go this way, that it could still go horribly, and that I just can't trust him. It could have been so different, it should have been do different. I know you all know how that feels.

Oh, man... That enraged, defensive asshole tactic sucks. My WH can switch that personality on and it can be terrifying and soooo frustrating. After some time and work on myself, it's easier to separate and not rise to all of the bait he hurls at me. I look at those comments, those insults, those complaints as diversionary tactics --each one trying to throw me off the trail he so desperately needs me off of. It sounds like your STBX uses a similar tactic. Be kind to yourself, that's so hard to go through.

DARVO Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender.

I pray he comes back with a counter-offer you can live with (in all senses of the phrase) so that you two can come to an agreement and you can put this all behind you.

Good to know your STBXH is a victim in all this. (Sarcasm)

He lies and cheats, subjects your family to a devastating life changing financially impacting future AND he plays the victim.

If fir no other reason I think moving away from him was one of your smarter moves.

Once this D is hashed out then at least you don’t have to witness his continued downward spiral.

At least your kids have one parent who has morals and is stable.

I’m so sorry you face this continued abuse.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 8:37 AM, Sunday, September 10th]

Thank you, Sadie. I am so very sorry that you were forced to deal with someone who did the same: the lying, the gaslighting, turning on cruelty. It is so incredibly unfair and hurtful. Like, how can wayward spouses lash out so strongly when they are the ones who cheated and destroyed everything? More and more damage and baggage piled on. I hope that you are in a much better position these days, and he has had more evolution and rationale.

1stWife: I appreciate your support. I was super shocked to see the lengths he went to during the first discussion. It was just textbook blame shifting and gaslighting plus aggression. Never have ever seen him like that. I think he even surprised himself in hindsight as he was emotional yesterday and again today.

So our original agreement was a value in perpetuity and his original counter (which should not have been as we agreed to terms, but I digress) was half the value for 12 months. On Saturday I countered with a lower value for 20 years. This morning via text he countered for that value for 13 years. When he did drop off before going to the airport I countered for 17 years plus 50% of kid lessons and camp fees (but not childcare). He agreed orally. He was upset again. I think if nothing else being with the kids this weekend, seeing the state I am in, and having to look me in the face and actually confront what he did to the person he did it to was a shake up he needed. It shows me that there is a TINY bit of who I thought he was still there. Now, this is not done and dusted, I would not be surprised if his attorney sends the draft back and it is different, but it is closer to being done. If it goes as is I will still be losing money each month, but it won't be the thousands I would lose if I was stuck with his counter from two weeks ago. And hopefully I can get work and start at least breaking even.

At this point I just want this done so I have a chance to focus on getting employed, doing everything for the kids, and trying to start to heal in some way. I know going through the actual divorce will be hard, signing the papers. The resignation, resolve, and sadness that will come from that.

Gosh, This sounded so exhausting. I mean after all this can he not have the integrity to just admit it was all him , stand by his words and not nickle and dime the financial support for his own kids. But then a person with integrity would not cheat in the first place.

My WH has made these huge statements about me which he would totally deny later on and it honestly boggles my mind. This is my biggest peeve and something I really judge a person by : Not being able to own your actions and your words . It really reflects a very poor character, and I could never take a person like that seriously or even respect them.

You now know his words mean nothing. Going forward everything from him should be in writing and through a lawyer.

His tears also mean nothing if he does not show it through his actions. Most likely the tears are for poor him.

You will need a bit to recover from this whole interaction but I really hope this back and forth is the last of it.

Take care Fold.

[This message edited by Abalone123 at 8:12 PM, Sunday, September 10th]

Thank you, Abalone, for your solidarity.

It was entirely exhausting, emotionally and physically draining, and I was really in tears or on the cusp for three straight days. I have tiny bit of hope that there is a light at the end of the tunnel, but I know that it can change. It is really up to him if he follows through or throws more curveballs.

I'm dreadfully sorry you have been on the receiving of pro-level gaslighting, Abalone. I feel like most of us here have. It is funny because the first month or so post DDay, there was zero gaslighting. Then as soon as the decision was formally made to file....boom. All day every day. I know it is a textbook coping / deflection mechanism, but it still suuuuuuuper stinks to be put through it repeatedly. And I totally agree with you that if somebody can't own their words and actions they're just a trash person. I mean, you can be a trash person for doing trash things but at the least have the integrity to own it and deal with it. But it is extra trash to do trash things and then deny or deflect.

My attorney BCCed me on an email to his this AM saying he understands we've finalized our terms and is awaiting the draft when the other counsel is ready. Hoping progress continues, in the right way, this week.

Praying for good progress and getting things signed!

Just checking in, I hope you are well.

Thanks, Sadie. I got the draft back today and except for a few edits I need to make the bulk of what we agreed to 2.0 is there. I think we are 99% done. My attorney is in trial until next week so we are having a call then and I am hopeful this can get signed next week and the hearing slotted in by the end of the month. I will Zoom for it even though do not need to even do that.

Once it is signed and done, then I know I will start dealing with all of the other emotions I have had to sideline. It worries me. Even though I don't want to be married to him and won't be for much longer, there is that intangible sense of security that comes from being married.