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WH would have never ended the EA on his own accord.

I just had a hunch, no solid proof, that something was going on -only his constant phone checking, sneaking off to check his phone when we would be out on our deck hanging out, etc.

When I installed the keylogger on his phone, it didn't take long at all to confirm my fear that he was cheating. That day I called the locksmith, had the locks changed to the house, packed him a suitcase, wrote him a note telling him I knew about him and his druggie whore, and to remove his property from my house in 30 days.

We stayed apart for five weeks and then reconciled. He said that my discovering his EA was probably one of the "best" things that could have happened for our relationship. It's one of the worst things I've experienced in my life, but now we have a stronger bond. He says he's the happiest he's been in his life. He knows he fucked up and I try not to bust his balls too much about it, but I do every now and then.

In my situation, I'm glad I found out. If not, we probably would still be in a "business partner" type of marriage,since he was confiding to druggie whore and giving part of himself to her that he should've been giving to me.

We've only been married a little over a year. They say the first year is the hardest. Hell, I hope so!

I think about the "what ifs," but not as much as I used to. I used to think about what if I had gone to our shop when he was "working late" like I wanted to do? While there were times that he was legitimately working late, I may have been able to catch him with the OW because that's where they had their PA. When I think about that particular "what if" it's always accompanied by my beating the crap out of her and dragging her out of our shop, naked, and throwing both her and her clothes outside. She wouldn't have had a way home since she didn't drive.

I think about what if I left after I kissed my WH and smelled her on his mustache.

I think about what if I checked the phone records sooner.

I think about what if my WH hadn't been called by the State Police to tow her mother's car after she hit a deer. That's how they met.

We don't live in the land of what-ifs. We live in the land of what is. And since it is what it is, I have to focus on accepting what I cannot change and changing the things I can because I won't allow the what ifs to drive me crazy. I'm crazy enough as it is lol

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts on this. Mr Psych and I have talked about this several times, and it's always a variation of him not yet our if the fog, so he would have continued, maybe even following through on his plan to divorce me when our youngest left for college this past August. Impossible to know now.

But your posts have lead me to ask myself: how many men and woman are currently cheating on their spouses without the spouse knowing? I've read as high as 60% of married persons cheat. I find that hard to believe, yet then again, I look around and see how easy and common it may actually be.

YES YES YES! I absolutely had the suspicion it would have continued. He had just started up a new EA with an old GF. After only a couple of weeks they were chatting intimately and talking about Skyping and about visiting to relive the old memories, see if the spark was still there. All the while saying how naughty it was and how they shouldn't be doing it!!! BARF!!

When finally discovered he denied, denied, denied. After confronted with printed copies of the emails, texts; TT started coming out. I continued to find more.

Sadly, I think the answer in my case is YES, he'd absolutely still be doing it. He would have started a new PA by now. But he was also leaving clues (whether purposely or accidentally I don't know). And that's how he got busted.

My WS admits he would have continued if not caught. He now knows that he has a problem and is working with IC and MC. I believe him and he's working hard on regaining trust, being transparent and accountable.

I have to consciously make myself STOP the negative cycles. I drove me nuts at first. But it's getting better as our work together continues & as I see his actions matching his words.

My WS admits he would have continued if not caught. He now knows that he has a problem and is working with IC and MC. I believe him and he's working hard on regaining trust, being transparent and accountable.

This is huge, StandswithFist. In addition to being transparent and accountable, he also has to work on WHY it was acceptable to do what he did. Why did the little voice in his head tell him it was okay? That he was entitled to do what he knew in his heart was cheating and betrayal. Why?

My husband would have continued too, because he hadn't a clue that anything was wrong with him. He just didn't see it. Only afterward, when the dirty secrets and lies and betrayals are hung out in the sun for all to see does the reality set in, the enormity of how much they lied to themselves in addition to everyone else. I believe the cheater must have that moment of recognition when they SEE, truly see, just how horrible it all is and truly feel the remorse flow through them. Only then will they be able to begin the process of tearing themselves apart in order to rebuild a better version of themselves.

[This message edited by psychmom at 12:03 PM, January 25th (Monday)]

psychmom, I've read 60 percent of marriages have infidelity. Statistically longer marriages have a higher R rate. WH says that the longer the couple stays together after DDay, higher odds of R. I'm not sure that is true, since I believe very little of what he says!

After 6 years of A, I know it wouldve gone on, and WH would've taken the whole thing to his grave even if it had ended.

What ifs are extremely traumatic.

There are two sides to this.

On the one hand, I have no doubt that had my brother not caught my WW and OM holding hands in the Upper West Side, it would have continued. And maybe it would have gotten to the point where she would have left me for him since he apparently lived in a place where there were always rainbows, and bunnies humping in the meadows, and unicorns fart skittles.

On the other hand, she may have left me and then what? Well, she would have found out who he really is and would have been miserable for the rest of her life.

We've actually discussed this and while my wife had no intention of leaving, OM may have ended up pressuring her for that. She's grateful she was caught.

So yeah, would they have been at it for a longer period of time? Sure. Would it have helped her in any way? Nope. The opposite really. And so I can look at the "what if"? question as a negative or a positive. In my view it's a positive I caught her when I did and she shares that same view.

Over time he got careless.

I found money hidden in a boot in the closet. I took a picture of it. After he got home I checked the boot and there was more money in it.

I confronted him and he lied and lied.

So I went out to the barn and found his burner phone and extra clothes and toiletries.

I couldn't believe it.

He said later he is glad I found out because he wanted to stop and didn't know how.

Here's how.... Keep your f'ing dick in your pants!

I'm two years out and still can't believe he did this.

'My husband would have continued too, because he hadn't a clue that anything was wrong with him. He just didn't see it. Only afterward, when the dirty secrets and lies and betrayals are hung out in the sun for all to see does the reality set in, the enormity of how much they lied to themselves in addition to everyone else. I believe the cheater must have that moment of recognition when they SEE, truly see, just how horrible it all is and truly feel the remorse flow through them. Only then will they be able to begin the process of tearing themselves apart in order to rebuild a better version of themselves.'

This, in spades. I found out, because I snooped. Had I not found out, my WH would've continued, probably not for that much longer if only because his AP lived in a different country. But he was able to continue the EA when he physically could not have a PA any more, because from day one he told him self it was not going to continue much longer. But he didn't stop it. He told himself ' it's just a one night stand, it's just for this two weeks, it's just until I give her some money, it's just until I give her some more money.' Etc etc.

Through the whole A, he saw himself as working on his marriage to me. Talk about delusional. He completely ignored the fact that while our marriage was not great at all before the affair, it got significantly worse as soon as he started to have an affair.

I think what would've happened, is that this is affair would have fizzled out. but I'm sure either would have had one night stands during his travels for work, or would have fallen into a full on PA with someone else. I think once he had crossed that line, it would've been easier to keep going, having other affairs.

Like you, there are things about our marriage that potentially could be so much better post-affair. He is facing some unpleasant truths about himself and realising how much he damaged our marriage going back years.

I honestly feel my husband might not have lived very long had I not confronted him. He has atrial fibrillation and it can be triggered by stress. He was in the hospital 3 times during the A and looked terrible. I think if we had divorced, he wouldn't have lived very long. He is grateful that he was caught although I am still struggling at 17 mos since Dday (but only about 7 mos since TT). This is a long and bumpy road...

I have often thought "what if?" too. I guess none of us really know the answer to those questions..

I was surprised to see this post resurface after so long -- originally posted by me in January 2016

I've come a long ways since then, but yet, the "what if" questions still have significance. But I seldom ask them anymore. It's been nearly 3 years now, almost seems like a lifetime ago. The haunting questions of the first 2 years post DDay were a near constant part of my life then. Not so much anymore. I guess over time most of my questions have been answered, at least to some needed degree. I think I know what I need to know to move forward with him. He's still in IC, 3rd one since this began, but interested in exploring more about himself, better understanding why and how he ended up where he did, eager to not repeat the past.

I no longer worry that I'll be deceived by him again. I know him better today than at any other time in our marriage. I do know had I not discovered when I did, he would have continued, but after that? It's all hypothetical and no use obsessing on any longer. Today, I'm not the same person I was back then. I'm more atuned to him and our relationship. More so, more atuned to myself.

Just wanted to pop in and acknowledge this "old" post. If it helps others, that is all to the good.

I haven't read all the posts yet. I feel exactly the same way.

He said he tried to stop after he left his one job in. I ember but he was still calling her everyday and I found pictures he took in March so that tells how successful he was at stopping on his own.

He believes he would have stopped but I know he wouldn't have. I mean after suspecting a year after it started many years ago, he still didn't stop, just stopped the physical but still talked all the time. Then he started again. So if he couldn't stop by himself when almost caught and swore that he would never hurt me, how could I ever believe that he would have stopped. I can't even be 100% sure he has now. I think he has and I have no proof otherwise but I don't know.

For me, what if I hadn't looked in his computer for our va action pictures. Or what if he remembered that pictures he took on his phone auto saved in his computer and deleted them immediately? I still wouldn't know. I trusted him. I even believed him when he said years ago he would never hurt me and he was hurting me while he was saying it.

This subject has been a source of conflict for us. Our project which he had been working on had an end date that was approaching when I discovered. She swears that for her was the end date of her adventure.

I disagree. I don't think it would have been the everyday thing they had, but once a week or every couple of weeks, for sure.

She vowed to quit, or at least she says she did, all through it, but didn't. Even with the humiliation he put on her.

It became even more clear to me after the TT when she met him for coffee after dDay.

I found out in July 2015. They were planning to be working in the same town later that year. If I didn't find out, their EA would have turned PA later that year. Soul crushing, sometimes.

I know him better today than at any other time in our marriage. I do know had I not discovered when I did, he would have continued, but after that? It's all hypothetical and no use obsessing on any longer. Today, I'm not the same person I was back then. I'm more atuned to him and our relationship. More so, more atuned to myself.

OMG psychmom... this is IT. You know this right? "I know him better today than at any other point in our marriage" and (on his 3rd IC) he likely knows himself better than he has in his ENTIRE life. And the more atuned to yourself part? Literally, the point of life - and in the best cases, the outcome of all life's pain.

You have more than survived this. SO nice to see it in writing.

Healing. Hard f'ing work, but SO SO worth it!!

Psychmom, I often think about this. It pains me to know that my WW just assumed the affair would extinguish itself over difficulties in carrying on due to weather, season change, less spare time, lack of interest, yada, yada . . .. It was just going to fizzle. But not once did she think to herself that she shouldn't be doing this therefore she should end it. Not once did concern for me cause her to think of ending it. Not once did her wedding ring cause her realize she should end it. And she was sure she would never get found out . . . or as we call it . . . caught.

And I am not happy that I was not sufficient motivation for ending her stupid, worthless affair.

And I too realize how close I came to not knowing, not seeing the evidence, not catching her when I did. It could still be going on . . .

My WH had two A with the same AP 5 years apart. He dumped her twice and swears she was nuts and he would never have gone back regardless of DDay.

I beg to differ, I think the fact he had an online EA and then EA/PA with AP speaks for itself.

The what ifs can kill you, what if the AP wasn't a nut job, would the A have gone on longer or would he have run off with her? If I had found out earlier, would he have continued the A as he wouldn't have found out what she was truly like?

I have to think that things turned out as they were meant to and time will tell if we can truly R and mend our M.

Thanks for your insights around what ifs, it's helped me process this.

He would have been caught eventually. Maybe...MAYBE...he could have come up with some story of who this woman was who he texted with (throwing virtual kisses to) all the time. But how long can that kind of thing last?

In the end his relationship with his AP took a ton away with my relationship with him. The only way we were going to repair things between us was for his affair to end and his wall of justifications was so big and strong that he wasn't going to do this himself.

I often wonder about that same question. My therapist led me to the truth when I was being made to feel as if I was losing my mind... found the Facebook Chats and the rest as they say is history. It's been 9 months, a great deal of crying (on both sides for me and him, questions, painful answers to hear, therapy and daily work on our part to bring our marriage to a different place. You can go back, and why would you anyways. What if..... we were on the road to a head on crash either way. Call it a wake up call on our lives, whatever it's one trip I don't EVER want to take again. I consider myself in "recovery" and will be for a while. The changes I don't like are the crying jags and depression that trys to take over my head with "made up pictures" and relieving her so called "friendship" around me. BTW I don't understand have the letters used in conversations here so maybe someone can explain them to me? Thank you!

We discussed this quite a while ago. He swore that it would never have gone from EA to PA... well no, probably not with THAT AP since she was over 2,000 miles away. But he had already slid down the slippery slope from just "talking" to sexual texting and videos and thinking he was in love. The next woman who showed him attention IRL would have been the one, and he was already lined up by a co-worker for that to happen.

While I've gone over the what ifs, and still do from time to time, I try not to focus on them. They are less real than his relationship with AP, which was a total fantasy on both parts.

The best way for me to deal with the What Ifs when they come is to focus on the good that has come from what DID happen. We are becoming so much healthier as individuals and as a couple right now. That's all I have energy for today.