SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

This is still a very fresh wound, as I only “stumbled” across my wife’s cheating less than 2 weeks ago. I will lay out a couple things I know for fact before getting into my story.

1) I know for fact that this is the first time she has done this

2) I also know as fact that the other person first contacted her, she was under the impression it was a business contact.

3). My wife changed jobs about 2 weeks before Covid shut things down in our area. She went from a very stressful job working 70-80 hr weeks, to a job that she was very comfortable with, but within first 2 weeks moved out of the office into a work from home environment.

4) I would describe our marriage as an 8/10. We have been married for 18 yrs. We constantly went out on dates, had alone time, sex was satisfying for both of us, but also plenty on time with our kids as well.

5) she would agree with us having a very good life together

So about 2 weeks ago, we had just gotten home from a Friday night out. Both tired from a long week and were getting ready for bed. My wife feel asleep. I couldn’t find my phone so I grabbed hers to call mine (this is not uncommon for each of us to use the others phone). After I dialed, I always hard close on our iPhone. As I do this, the screen next to it is a LinkedIn chat. Without even looking that close, some very graphic language was being used. At this point, I proceeded to scroll to top and read it all. There was only 3 days worth of conversation, but you could tell there was more, but it had been deleted. There was little chatting about day to day, but mostly sexual in nature, but specifically what positions and sexual acts they were going to participate in when they met up. My wife was an active participant and initiated some of it too. Most of the conversation was through LinkedIn chat, but I also later found out a lot of it was through snap chat as well. Numerous explicit pictures were shared through there as well. They had not met at that point, but it was very apparent that plans were being made to do so. They were going to meet @ 10 am the following Friday, conveniently enough when I would be out of town for a brief business trip.

When I confronted her about this, she never denied it. She looked like a deer in headlights. She initially only answered what I asked and left out many details. The OP is a name we both knew from college, but never someone we associated with other than sharing a class or 2 with. He apparently “connected” on LinkedIn and started a conversation with her. She even told me back at the beginning when it was completely casual. Somewhere after about a week of small talk, he started turning it sexual and within a day, she was engaging in the conversation in that manner with him. She tells me, she deleted him a few times because she knew it was wrong, but apparently that didn’t last very long. I didn’t notice at the time much of a behavior change, but looking back at it now, she was always on the phone. As I started putting timelines together, there were times where she was in the same room as me chatting with him online. She also would excuse herself to go to the “bathroom” but really was going to take explicit pics to send to him.

She tells me that she knows what she did was wrong, and she didn’t have any intention of ever leaving our marriage. I do not doubt that, but that isn’t even a concern of mine. We have had friends you have suffered through infidelity and we have discussed how both of us share a zero tolerance view of this behavior. To me, whether it was physical yet or not, it is still a violation of trust. I firmly believe if I did not stumble on this message, I would’ve been none the wiser and she would’ve had sex with this guy. She tells me that it was nothing to do specifically with this person, but more the attention she received from someone new. We had our first marriage counseling session last week. I know it is still so early in the recovery process, but I just don’t know what I feel. She has been over the top apologetic and owning her mistakes. She deleted and/or gave me all passwords after sending him a message to never contact her again. I don’t think she fully realizes my viewpoints regarding the level of devastation to the trust I had in her. She will sometimes make a comment about how it was at least stopped before it got physical, but I think she fails to take into account that I stopped it, not her. She has also said that she didn’t feel it was as real because it was online. I reminded her that this person did exist, they used real names, he only lives 30 minutes away, and they were making arrangements to meet.

My biggest concerns are the following:

- how can I trust her again? She was my everything and had 110% trust in everything before. Can I let this 1 time affect how I have felt about someone I have been with for so long and created what seemed like such a great life together.

- am I dwelling to much on the “what if I didn’t catch that message and put a stop to it?”

- why was she willing to have sexually explicit chats/send nudes to him, when she won’t even do that with me?

I never thought I would ever consider sticking it out in a situation like this, it was always very black/white to me. I know this sounds like I am making excuses for her, trust me I am not, but this is such an out of character move for her, that makes me feel like she did just make a giant mistake that flips our life upside down.

I appreciate the forum to vent. We have plenty of friends, but many which we are both friends with. I don’t want to drag them into this. Thanks in advance for the support

- how can I trust her again? She was my everything and had 110% trust in everything before. Can I let this 1 time affect how I have felt about someone I have been with for so long and created what seemed like such a great life together.

For now? You cannot trust her at all. Period. She has cheated on you. Period. IF you are staying together, she will have to work very hard and for a very long time to regain the trust she threw away with her selfishness.

- am I dwelling to much on the “what if I didn’t catch that message and put a stop to it?”

IMHO, no you are not. She would have 'sealed the deal' if you hadn't happened to find out when you did.

- why was she willing to have sexually explicit chats/send nudes to him, when she won’t even do that with me?

Because she is a cheater and this is what they do.

I never thought I would ever consider sticking it out in a situation like this, it was always very black/white to me. I know this sounds like I am making excuses for her, trust me I am not, but this is such an out of character move for her, that makes me feel like she did just make a giant mistake that flips our life upside down.

Yep, I always thought I was very firm on it too, and it turns out I wasn't. that's okay - this is truly one of those situations that you just don't know how you will be until you are in it.

Other than the cheating itself, this is the biggest red flag I can see:

She will sometimes make a comment about how it was at least stopped before it got physical, but I think she fails to take into account that I stopped it, not her. She has also said that she didn’t feel it was as real because it was online. I reminded her that this person did exist, they used real names, he only lives 30 minutes away, and they were making arrangements to meet.

This is so dismissive of your pain and this is dangerously wayward thinking. She is minimizing what she did and making it seem like 'no big deal cus I didn't actually sleep with the guy'. It is a BFD. In three weeks for some compliments from some random loser, she destroyed almost 2 decades of marriage. There is nothing small about that.

Apple23, I am so sorry for what your WW has done to you.

She tells me that she knows what she did was wrong, and she didn’t have any intention of ever leaving our marriage

she didn’t have any intention of ever leaving our marriage? Isn't that exactly what she did when she stole time away from you and gave it to him?

Of course she didn't intend to leave the marriage, what she wanted was to have the faithful, hardworking husband at home to return to after having fun with the AP at your expense.

You say the AP lives 30 minutes away but you are sure nothing has happened yet? Are you really sure? People here have seen this too many times and watched as the BS finds out that it had indeed been a physical affair.

He gave her some attention and your WW ran with it. So, now what? What happens the next time some guy pays her some attention and you don't happen to catch it?

You are just st the beginning of what is a truly shitty experience. I'm sorry for you. As I read your post, my fight or flight mechanism kicked in and I realized that my WW's A is still very much with me.

You are going to have many people here say that youbarecgoingvto get great advice. That is true. This site helped me as did the wonderful people here. It has been 3.5 years since Dday #1 for me, and I still consider myself a freshie with a long way to go. Given this, I will tell you one thing I have learned: Chester's lie. They lie a lot. And when they are done lying, they lie some more. You are not going to get the truth for a long time, if ever. You will get iterations of her story.

She will justify this in her head in many ways. All of them are complete bullshit. She is an animal that has been cornered and is in self protection mode. You need to be a complete badass now. Dont stand for any bullshit. And dont believe she hasn't done this before. It's possible that this is her first time, but ask yourself what your gut is telling you. I think they have done studies on intuition and found that it is correct about 80% of the time. Listen to yours, I didn't and it cost me.

Be very strategic. I love Westway's posts as he became a hero of mine, navigating his shitshow. I wish I had his badassness. You are not fighting a battle, you are beginning a campaign to get your life and agency back, whatever the form that takes.

Oh, and a strategically timed poly request is great as well. In my job, I have to confront student with academic dishonesty. I never reveal what or how I know things until I have assessed that they gave divulged everything, and even then, I only reaveal a bit and get them to assume I know much more. They are on their heals and sing like canaries. Only the sociopaths play it cool. Met more than my share of those.

You may discover that the W you have now does not resemble the woman you married. She is. When asked, Michelangelo responded that his technique was not to carve a sculpture, but to reveal the image hiding within the stone. I think that aging does this for us. When we are young, we hide. As we get older, the exhaustion of having done this is too much and we reveal our true selves, first to us, and sometimes accidentally, to the world.

Hi, Apple23, welcome to our little club that nobody wants to join. You seem like a decent chap at the core (see what I did there?). I can bet your mind is reeling at the moment. Understand a few things, going into it.

She knew it was wrong. You say she says that. So there's not disputing in her mind that this wasn't acceptable behavior.

She planned on accelerating the behavior to a physical confrontation. She was an active party in those discussions, she doesn't deny any of it, she had intentions to be in a physically sexual relationship with this guy.

With that said, you seem to be thinking this was a "mistake" on her part.. Alll a biggg mistake, sorry honey? That kind of thing. Let's nip that in the bud. You are going to see this a lot on here. Mistakes involve a lesser degree of free will than intentions. A mistake might be spelling a word wrong, or painting over an outlet or something. A mistake involves doing something you didn't intend to do, or doing it wrong. By that (very loose, I admit) definition, Adultery is NOT a mistake. It is a deliberate act of will, one that is chosen. It is a series of active decisions.. usually starting from the very small and innocuous decisions ("Should I link to this old college acquaintance on LinkedIN? Y/N" then "Should I post a smiley face at this risque comment Y/N" then "Should I laugh at this even risquier comment? Y/N" then "Should I say something back flirtations? Y/N" then "Should I respond to his graphic suggestion or sexual innuendo? Y/N" You see how that works? Every step of the way, it went from the very innocent and deniable activities to something a little less acceptable, then even less acceptable.. then incredibly inappropriate for a married woman to be engaging in. The common factor? At any moment, your wife could have said "Hey wait a minute, I'm married!! This is WRONG!"

Well, she didn't do that. Instead, she collaborated with this fantasy to the point where she was more than willing to destroy your marriage to go sample a little strange (I'll be delicate here,you've had a rough couple weeks). You, your feelings, your children (if you have any) suddenly didn't matter at all to her, or she conveniently forgot them. So she could go sample some strange.

Does this inform your opinion at all? Because it really ought to. For me, adultery was always about the decision to act and continue to act, and disregard for boundaries. A partner that is willing to do that has checked out of the marriage. Your wife planned on doing all those things, AND staying in the marriage. You should ask her what her plan was for the marriage going forward, in a state of adultery. Was she ever going to inform you (doubt it)? Was she feeling the same towards you as before? What would change? She has sent you a clear message here-- your feelings and to a greater extent, the marriage itself, are an elastic concept. They are not a hard boundary for her. You say she is "incredibly apologetic". What is that except words? Do you want to stay in this relationship with her? What will it take to make YOU feel safe again? Has she even worked on that?

To answer your questions:

how can I trust her again? She was my everything and had 110% trust in everything before. Can I let this 1 time affect how I have felt about someone I have been with for so long and created what seemed like such a great life together.

You really can't trust her again. At least, not for several years. You are going to dwell on this for a very, very long time, and it will suck. You will be triggered by her betrayal. You will have nightmares, loss of sleep, lost of intimacy. It's going to happen. These are the consequences.

- am I dwelling to much on the “what if I didn’t catch that message and put a stop to it?”

Hell no, you're not. The mere fact that you DID catch her in the act is indicative that it WOULD have been a physical act. ONE SHE CHOSE despite the effect it would undoubtedly have on you and your marriage if discovered. She didn't even think twice! (I assume so anyway). You're luck you did catch her this early.

- why was she willing to have sexually explicit chats/send nudes to him, when she won’t even do that with me?

Well, in a word, maybe disrespect or disregard for her husband? Maybe. I don't know either of you. Was that ever part of your marital repertoire before? Have you asked her about this directly? How come a stranger gets to see what you deny me, your husband? It would be interesting what she says.

Personally, I think you are on very dicey ground here. You went to couples counseling. I advise against this, but you may both need to go to individualized counseling. THe marriage looked healthy to me, from your description. It didn't fail.. SHE failed. This is on her alone-- she needs to fix herself FIRST before recommitting to this marriage. YOU need to deal with infidelity trauma, which is another thing altogether.

Best of luck, man.. I know you're in the confused, what the hell just happened phase. You will soon be in the mind-numbing rage phase (Oh yes, you will. trust the internet strangers on this). Don't let that anger overwhelm you. You don't have to hate her-- but I would disengage and get some space for a while. Maybe she should move out for a while and stay with her parents while she sees a counselor. If you trust her to behave. Just a thought, you have a lot on your plate to parse and she might be triggering you. Come rant on here ANY time and we'll do our best to help.

They were going to take it the physical step at 10pm that friday. So her "at least it wasn't physical" is pretty much a slap in your face. She was planning to an looking forward to it.

- how can I trust you again? Why should I trust you again?

- “what if I didn’t catch that message and put a stop to it?” Where were you going to meet? Were you going to have sex"

- why were you willing to have sexually explicit chats/send nudes to him, when you won’t even do that with me?

These are good questions to ask her point blank, and there needs to be real answers not just "I don't know, I am ashamed, I am sorry" . Let her talk, then when pauses do what a therapists would. say "and then what?"

Also to show how much your trust is shattered don't have sex with her until you both have STI tests. She may try to love bomb you.

Hang in there, it'll be very hard for a while. It's up to her to earn you back.

[This message edited by MickeyBill2016 at 11:42 AM, July 1st (Wednesday)]

Have no doubt, this is her true character and she would have followed through. Think long and hard what your future will be like now.

Any kids. If not, do not rule out divorce. Even if you do have kids, do not rule it out.

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the genuinous of the responses. Sorting through the truths, the half truths, and the unknown is very difficult. I know much much more than she realizes at this point, and I intend to keep it that was as I navigate through. So far, with the things we have discussed, her story is matching close to the narrative.

I know it’s hard to believe, but I am certain that this was the first time. Part of the issue I struggle with most is the pace it accelerated at and the lack of control from someone that demonstrates that on a daily basis over the course of our relationship (meaning, well thought out, conscientious).

Thanks for sounding board. I hope one day, whatever recovery looks like for me, I am able to return the favor.

- how can I trust her again?

You can't. Not unless she fixes what's broken inside.

First, you can start with a polygraph. It's expensive, sure. But it will end the nagging doubt that there's something you're missing.

Then, it's all about character. There's something in a cheater's character which is capable of saying "yes" to perfidy. Their stated values don't align with their actions.

Look at it this way, you have a stated value of Fidelity. That value is strong for you, so you've built boundaries around it. If you were to get text messages from an old female acquaintance, your boundaries keep the conversation above board, because you BELIEVE in fidelity. You value it. The breakdown in your WW's character is that there's a "but..." in her core value of fidelity. For her, she states her belief in fidelity via her vows, but... if her ego needs bolstering, out it goes. There's no boundary to protect it because it's just not that important to her. Her stated belief was lip service and she doesn't truly value Fidelity enough to protect it. The same for other core values.. if the belief is weak and insubstantial, the boundaries around it will be insufficient or even nonexistent.

These flaws in character can be fixed, but the cheater has to do it for themselves. They have to see the need for it and they have to dig deep to find out why they're so cavalier with their own values. They have to see how they've let themselves down and deal with the repercussions of causing so much pain to others.

You begin to see how something like this can require really good therapy, IC (individual counseling) rather than MC (marriage counseling). Marriages don't cheat. People do. So, a bad MC who's trying to make everyone comfortable and split the blame will inadvertently cause more harm. If you decide to continue MC, don't be afraid to redirect any blame-shifting back to your WW. You may have 50% and no more of the marital problems. But the cheating is 100% on her.

"I stopped it, not her."

This is all you need to know. She would've had sex with the other man and it would have become a regular meeting every time you left town.

Before you do anything else you need to meet with a good divorce lawyer and have an iron-clad post-nuptial agreement drawn up as soon as possible. Have your WW agree and sign it, notarize it, and have it filed with the county for future reference if your WW decides to do this again.

The point of the post-nup is to protect your future. Your WW has proven beyond a doubt that she's willing to risk your health and her family for the short-term attention of another man. Do not think she won't do it again given the right circumstances.

The second point of the post-nup is that it imposes tangible consequences for her choices. It shows her that you are willing to cut her loose at a moments notice if she ever hints at betraying you again.

The third point of the post-nup is that it lessons the expenses and speeds the proceedings if you decide that you don't want to or can no longer stand to live with the betrayer.

Your WW didn't make a mistake. She made dozens of decisions and choices that led her down the path she was excitedly traveling down. She chose her selfish path over you and her family. It's your turn now to choose your path. From here forward, choose the paths that bring you the most contentment, happiness, and success. You only get one life. This life is about you now. You can make your life better than it ever was before. You're worth the effort. Take care of yourself. I wish the best for you.

My biggest concerns are the following:

1) how can I trust her again? She was my everything and had 110% trust in everything before. Can I let this 1 time affect how I have felt about someone I have been with for so long and created what seemed like such a great life together.

2) am I dwelling to much on the “what if I didn’t catch that message and put a stop to it?”

3) why was she willing to have sexually explicit chats/send nudes to him, when she won’t even do that with me?

I’ll just answer your questions…

1) You can’t. True blind trust & faith are gone forever. You see, when people marry (or move in as a couple) true blind trust & faith follow. Trust & faith are facts. Facts that in my mind [trust] and in my heart [faith], I know you will never betray me. Now those facts have changed forever. Yes, she was going to betray you, and yes she may very well do so again. The danger is that you develop a faux type of trust & faith. You get all her passwords (for the sites she wants you to know about), she will call you whenever she is away (but may be calling from her lover’s motel rook or back of the van), allows you to read all her texts (but you never know about her burner phone)….. Basically, you will forever live in a trustless/faithless marriage. BUT, what she can do is to actually be 100% trustworthy every day moving forward. You will never know, but I think her confidence of being so will in some small way connect with you and help see you thru.

2) Not at all! She was going to start having sex with this man- period. To me, there’s no difference between being stopped by you. She betrayed you in full. Now you know her capabilities and desires. This situation needs to be dealt with as such.

3) Probably because she found a fantasy sex mate and was very open to the idea. And still is as it’s within her to do so. THAT is something she needs to deal with very directly.

I wish you well. Build a good support group. Take care of yourself and the kids. Print out some divorce papers and start filling them out so she understands how serious you are. Just keep them around for 9 or 12 months. You may need them. She is terribly broken and needs to fix herself and help you heal.

[This message edited by thatbpguy at 12:11 PM, July 1st (Wednesday)]

Cheating is cheating. Even if she didn’t have sex, she was still cheating.

Imagine your marriage like a car. Your WW “made a mistake” and slashed all 4 tires. Now, you are wondering if you should trust your car for a road trip (with no tires)....

She had not intention to leave the marriage but by sexting and planning to meet her new BF, she terminated your marriage.

She didn’t want to sext you because you’re the stable safe husband at home. But she doesn’t want the compliments and attention to stop from her BF, so she exchanges nude of herself for attention.

Marriage is based on trust and you have none (understandably).

She will need to rebuild trust if you are to accept rebuilding a new marriage.

How do you know “for a fact” that she hasn’t done this before? In 3 weeks, she went from normal married wife to sexting some guy and planning to meet up. Just like that. You know she is able to lie in your face, and text her BF while you’re in room!

Ask her detailed timeline, which should include any cheating since you started dating. Then tell her you’ll check the timeline with a Polygraph. Once you have a better confidence as to what the truth is, youcandecide if you want to R or D.

Welcome to the club no one wants to belong to. I am so sorry you are here.

And all I will say is this. Get a polygraph. Make sure she knows you are going to do this. Make the appointment and set the date before you inform her.

Then sit her down and tell her that she is scheduled for a polygraph and this is her last chance to come clean before it happens. And make sure she knows that any attempt at reconciliation is dependant on 2 things.

1. Her being 100% honest about everything and providing a timeline of the affair.

2. Her passing the polygraph.

If she refuses to go? Lawyer up. Odds are it was a physical affair as well and you are being trickle truthed. Stay strong and do what is best for you now.

And again - so sorry you are here :-(

I know it’s hard to believe, but I am certain that this was the first time.

How, exactly?

You have no way of knowing this was first time. Look at how easily she was tricking you.

She tells me that she knows what she did was wrong, and she didn’t have any intention of ever leaving our marriage. I do not doubt that, but that isn’t even a concern of mine. We have had friends you have suffered through infidelity and we have discussed how both of us share a zero tolerance view of this behavior.

It is odd for her to say she didn't have any intention to leave the marriage but she knew that you had a zero tolerance view of cheating. I'm assuming that she just thought you'd never find out and wasn't thinking ahead but these two statements together just invoke a sort of cognitive dissonance don't they? She was in effect risking exactly that the marriage would end as she knew your boundary and she did it any way. That is something she needs to deal with. How did she sell your marriage so cheaply? That is not a marriage counselor issue or one you can fix for her. She has to understand that and figure out how she is going to do better. You need to push her for that answer.

It ramped up very quickly. Therefore, this may not be her first time.

IMO you should ensure she takes this very seriously. She will be inclined to minimize and say it was just a fantasy and she never would have gone to meet him.

Therefore, inform her:

1 - she has destroyed your trust and you no longer believe anything she says (her promises and excuses means nothing)

2 - although your immediate reaction is to divorce (this makes a statement) you will give yourself 90 days before making a final decision. Make an appointment with your attorney (and let her know).

3 - In the interim, she should provide a plan on why she wants to be married to you and how she intends to rebuild trust; and to fix whatever is broken in her that would entertain the notion of adultery

4 - Read up on the 180 (not to punish her) but to give you space so you can think straight

[This message edited by Robert22205https at 5:07 PM, July 1st (Wednesday)]

She tells me that she knows what she did was wrong, and she didn’t have any intention of ever leaving our marriage. I do not doubt that, but that isn’t even a concern of mine.

Your WW is a liar. She lied to you for some time. Maybe she wasn't planning on leaving you...yet. Is that supposed to make it OK? She was just going to nail this guy on the side and keep you in the dark? Should you feel better about that?

She tells me that it was nothing to do specifically with this person, but more the attention she received from someone new

So she will engage in this type of behavior with any guy who shows her this attention? She has such poor judgement, she can't distinguish from the love of her BH and the attention of a random guy looking for some strange? Again, is this supposed to make you feel better?

Your WW is absolutely minimizing. This is a bad sign. Did you all discuss the A in counseling, or did the counselor side with her that, since it wasn't physical (according to the lying WS), it's not that bad?

Other than apologize, what exactly is your WW doing to try to rebuild your trust and put the M first?

She tells me that it was nothing to do specifically with this person, but more the attention she received from someone new

I don't like this either. Does that mean that you need to give her a sufficient amount of attention or she will have an Affair? If someone else gives her more attention will this happen again? Has she at least acknowledged that her need for this kind of validation is a problem that she needs to deal with?

Second session with MC tonight. We will see where it goes.

Yes she has apologized profusely and is constantly giving me updates on what she is up to (she is doing this on own), To a degree, I am not sure what I want from her or what will make me feel better yet to be honest, other than cut off all contact and be 100% honest and answer any and all questions I have regardless of how it makes her feel. So far, she is keeping he end up. Do I trust her, hell no. But I have to at least listen and try to talk it through and maybe one day some level of trust could be earned back