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Heart Ripped in Half

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thatbpguy posted 2/12/2020 17:52 PM

When you say you have quit your part time job and she has taken one and it helps, I see this as a hopeful sign that R can be accomplished.

That said, if he is married, his wife must be told. And I agree with no more play dates between the kids as full non contact is mandatory. Also, there are repercussions to her actions. Maybe an in-house separation and she will need to show serious and genuine remorse. It may not happen right away, but I think it will come. Also, I suggest reading on the site about the '180'. I suggest doing it softly and make her understand that while you love her, you can be fine without her. She needs to rediscover love for you and take the lead in healing you.

You wife is broken and needs therapy to find out why. I also suggest some serious minded MC for the both of you.

Be firm, think before you act so you act soundly. But if you want to salvage the marriage, it can be done.

ChamomileTea posted 2/12/2020 17:55 PM

Ugh... I wanna smack you and hug you at the same time. Because like so many betrayed spouse's, you come in here half-assed believing that this is somehow your fault. It's not. Not any of it.

Cheating is 100% about the cheater. So, it doesn't matter that you were working two jobs to support her ungrateful ass or that you napped on weekends. People who truly believe in their own stated values, values like faithfulness and honesty, don't abandon those values based on the behavior of others. Nothing you did (or didn't do) made her cheat. The capacity for deceit was ALREADY inside her, all this time, hidden from your view. But now that you've seen it, I suspect your memory will supply you with lesser examples of her selfishness over the years.

Marriages don't cheat. People do. And the people who cheat are capable of doing so because their character is defective. Their values do not align with their actions. YOU don't cause that. It happened a long time ago, in childhood, when for whatever reason these values didn't take hold.

In reviewing your posting history, I've found some other not very nice things which suggest that your WW is either completely lacking in empathy or that she's actually cruel. She watched you suffer for months, and in the grips of so-called "honesty" critically compared your lovemaking. Whether it's a case of zero empathy or cruelty, the ends are the same... she's someone who has no compunction about hurting you.

Only you can decide what's good enough for you. But I will tell you this as someone who reconciled five years ago... it's not good enough for the WS to simply stop cheating. They have to repair the character defect which allowed them to view cheating as a choice. Right now, your WW isn't remotely good enough for you. She doesn't share your values. You cry and you worry that you might never be enough for her?... but it's the other way around.

Don't settle for less than you deserve. It's okay if you're not quite ready to file for D, but remember that eventually your WW must pull her head out of her hindquarters and get to work. She has to actually BE remorseful for what she's done. She has to commit to repairing her broken character

ChamomileTea posted 2/12/2020 17:55 PM

duplicate post

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 6:48 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

ChamomileTea posted 2/12/2020 17:55 PM

duplicate post

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 6:47 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

RealityBlows posted 2/12/2020 18:21 PM

Trust me Brother. There is a whole new life on the other side of this shit sando. A whole world full of beautiful, interesting, loving women who will completely redefine what it is like to be in a loving relationship. Birth is painful and it's extremely painful to be re-born. Just look at this whole mess as new beginning. Except this time around, you're going to be all the wiser.

Smillie posted 2/12/2020 18:40 PM

She is not grovelling for a second chance and she thinks she is justified in her actions. It might be time to expose her to family and friends. It will be hard for her to maintain her attitude when others know. I think this is a no-lose for you. If she gets it and tries to regain your trust then you can reconcile. If she pulls further away then you can file for divorce. Either way it will help you to determine her true feelings.

ChamomileTea posted 2/12/2020 18:41 PM

First off, I know you've already heard this but I hope you'll let it sink in this time...
Nothing you do (or fail to do) can cause another person to abandon their own value system. What this means is that your WW's stated value of fidelity is NOT something which is truly valued by her.

Marriages don't cheat. People do. So, it wasn't about you working a second job in order to take care of her ungrateful ass, and it wasn't about you napping on the weekend. It's about your WW's defective character, that gap between what a person claims to believe and what they actually do. Your WW cheated because, underneath whatever lip-service she gave to the contrary, she doesn't truly value fidelity. She doesn't believe in it. And this propensity for cheating was ALWAYS there.
You didn't cause it. We develop our value system in childhood.

Now, I'm not saying that people can't change or that they can't learn to value honesty, integrity, fidelity, etc. But it's very difficult. It takes an inordinate amount of introspection and work... and it's more rare than we think for a WS to actually get it done.

After reading your posting history, I'm also concerned about your WW's total lack of empathy... and that's me giving her the benefit of the doubt and not writing her off as merely cruel for cruelty's sake. The things she's said to you are unacceptable. The fact that she continued to cheat for months while watching you struggle in pain... is unacceptable. These are HUGE hurdles going forward because now you're looking at the repair of defective character *and* somehow instilling some empathy from the ground-up. You're not a bad guy if you don't want to take that on. It's a daunting prospect.

You've got littles to think of, and that makes it harder. Your WW, as she is today, is no fit role model for them. Without your steady guidance, she'll clone that character defect, so it's really important that you learn to set boundaries and that you do what you need to do in order to be the best dad possible, R or D. Your kids need at least ONE sane parent. Most studies agree that children can deal with adversity as long as one parent is stable and involved.

You don't have to rush to any decisions. Your best bet is to see an attorney and get your ducks in a row. That will allow you to keep your options open while you're processing the adultery and strengthening yourself, both emotionally and physically through good self-care.

If you will allow me to influence you on a few things today, let it be these:
Truly accept that you didn't cause this,
that cheating is always about the cheater,
and that there's nothing you could have done to prevent your WW's adultery.
And finally, that you WILL be okay. Believe it.

Strength to you.

ETA: I thought I had lost that earlier post, so this one is a recreation of sorts. I've been losing quite a number of longs posts lately. So frustrating.

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 6:42 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

Marz posted 2/12/2020 18:45 PM

My wife said she is no longer seeing him or talking via phone or text. When I ask , she wont let me see her phone or FB or email, stating these things are private.

Cheaters all lie a lot. Her actions tell you sheís still in the affair.

You worked your ass off to provide xtra for her and the family and she cheated in return? Bud, thatís just a bullshit excuse to justify the affair. Cheater always rewrite the family history to justify their actions. Thatís all this is.

Right now sheís just sorry she got caught. Unless her attitude changes no chance for R.

I do hope you wake up to the reality of where youíre at because if you donít nothings changing.

Expose the affair without warning if you want to try and end it. Helping hide it will just enable it.

[This message edited by Marz at 1:08 AM, February 13th (Thursday)]

The1stWife posted 2/12/2020 21:37 PM

Iím sorry for you. I really am. You are in the same position so many of us were in.

Blindsided on Dday1. Affair continues after the cheater promises itís over. ILYBNILWY (I love you but not in love with you). Comparing you to the OM. False reconciliation (which you seem to be in b/c you have NO idea if sheís still cheating).

You have no trust or confidence in her (rightfully so).

From my own experience (and this is my position based on my experience) doing nothing is a mistake. I learned that the hard way b/c my H continued his affair.

In any event things were not working (unbeknownst to me) and he continued cheating. What he didnít know was I had a solid exit plan/plan B in place after 6 months. And on dday2 I went into swift execution mode.

Very calmly and quietly I told my H that I was left with no choice but to D him. I could no longer live with his cheating and he was free to go and be with the OW or anyone else he wanted.

I no longer cared. I was done. And I left the room. It wasnít a conversation or open for discussion. I restored my self esteem and power in my marriage in that one move. I had $ in the bank, he was being forced to leave our home, we had no joint credit card accounts and he was out!

He no longer had any decision making ability over me.

He was begging me to Reconcile even though earlier that day he wanted a D. I demanded a post nup to even consider reconciliation. He willingly signed.

My point is for 6 months I tried to ďniceĒ him back to the marriage. Unfortunately he viewed me as weak and clingy.

Until dday2 when I stood up to him and started going my own way. Without him. And he then was blindsided by me!

BTW no one would ever expect my H to cheat. No one thought he was that kind of person.

Iím just saying if you donít restore the balance of power in your marriage she will have no redirect for you and may cheat again. Ask me how I know....

[This message edited by The1stWife at 9:41 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

KingofNothing posted 2/12/2020 23:10 PM

Denny, my friend, I have been where you are, uncertain of what to do next when the evidence kept piling up. They didnít even hide it well. You seem fearful and anticipating something worse will happen. Or maybe you fear change. You are in shock, suffering the anguish of blatant betrayals (multiple betrayals). You are in the midst of shock and grief. You canít believe what this person you entrusted with your love and fidelity has done to your marriage and family. You know why your thoughts are so scattered? Why you canít make up your mind? Thatís shock talking, trying to keep you cocooned from more bad shit.

Now is not the time to take counsel from fear. Now is the time to start being practical. Ruthless, even. You probably think these internet strangers are full of it and donít understand your situation. Believe me, we do. You know what will be next? The growing realization of how angry you are now. You donít think so, but brother, you are. Just watch.

The trick is to use that energy not with pointless rage and unproductive explosions. Use it.. with icy cold, polite ruthlessness as you regain control of this situation. Donít think about the AP for another second. Heís a piece of steaming human offal that preys on other menís wives. As for your wife. Itís high time you set the terms of engagement here. No more fucking waffling. There are a great list of non negotiable you should think about. Mr. Thumos will be by to list them for you. One of them, you know. No more contact with the AP. You told her that, and she fucked him anyway.

Why did that happen? Because she knows she will face no consequences for it.

You must inform her that you are consulting with a lawyer and absolutely will terminate the marriage if she continues to lie and break her word. Thatís the cost of betrayal. Sheís already destroyed your marriage. SHE did that. The woman you love. Not for any good reason, either. She was bored and wanted a cheap thrilló she was willing to trade her marriage for it. Not so romantic, now, is it? If she wants to salvage something with you, she must be held accountable. IT IS HER FAULT, NOT YOURS. She pays the price, not you. She doesnít get to complain or make terms about something SHE destroyed. She is in no position to make demands about a damned thing. You are.

I donít want to come off as heartless. Your wife was very cruel to you. She still is right now. The only real difference between me and you is the passage of time and some form of healing. Everyone on SI is some form of walking wounded in various stages of healing. Listen to what the old timers have to say. They will express it eloquently.. better than I can. Just take this one thing away with you. You canít carry the weight of her transgressions for her. Thatís a heavy burden. You need to think about what the future holds for YOU now, and IF you want her in it. A mighty big IF indeed. Read up on the 180 in he Healing Library. It is specifically written for your situation. Protect yourself from further trauma. Be the good example for your kids. Someone has to be, and it isnít your wife.

God bless you and give you the strength you will need for difficult times.

[This message edited by KingofNothing at 11:15 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

Tigersrule77 posted 2/13/2020 06:56 AM

Denny, I know what you are going through is very difficult. It may be the most difficult thing a person has to deal with. It is a huge betrayal.

It is time for you to allow yourself to be angry. It is OK.

You worked your ass off at two jobs to provide a life for your family. Did your WW ask you to quit one when she missed time with you or was having issues with your M? No. She was happy with you taking care of her financially. And she abused that and went out and found her AP.

If your friend told you that his/her WS treated them that way, what would you tell your friend?

You need to start the 180 and detach from your WW. Tell her YOU need space to think if she is worthy of offering her R. In my opinion, the 180 is the best thing a BS can do for themselves. It will allow you to think without being twisted by your emotions.

Glad your WW started working. Now you need to focus on yourself, not the M. YOU didn't break this, it is not up to you to fix it. And you can't do it by yourself anyway.

Booyah posted 2/13/2020 22:38 PM

You know what to do.

The question is are you willing to take the action that's needed?

Sorry you're here my friend.

TheGuy123 posted 2/13/2020 22:52 PM

Your old lady can smell your fear....knock it off!

Chicks dig confident men so just let her go.

Go cry in the garageÖ.alone... like the rest of us.

I get it...been there.

Her abuse is so unhealthy and you need to get out of infidelity so let her go. It just might save your marriage.

TheGuy123 posted 2/13/2020 23:03 PM

Folks want what they can't have.

Asking her to leave is the first step in shifting the power to you.

Once she gets the taste of being let go, she just might think twice in what she is giving up.

If you want to get her to second guess her choices you gotta smile and wish her the best and just let her go. Thank her for the few good years, smile, and inform her you can move on with out her. You find better.

Fake it until you make it.

Once you go out and live life well, no longer let her dictate how you feel, and show her the indifference she deserves.....she might come crawling back....but by then do you really want to be her plan B?

It sucks man Ö.I know...its not what knocks us down that matters, it's how we get back up that counts!

Dennyden posted 2/16/2020 13:43 PM

If I decide to file papers, should I talk with her about it beforehand or without notice? She's asked for a trial separation. Is this helpful in reconciliation or just a way to start the divorce?

Robert22205https posted 2/16/2020 13:58 PM

Based on your posts, among other things: your wife in not remorseful, she deleted the texts, and she makes no attempt to do anything that would reassure you that she is NC with the OM (who is single).

IMO she thinks she's in love and a trial separation gets you out of the way so she can pursue the OM full time.

IMO your best strategy is to serve her with divorce papers without warning (adds to the shock and also takes control away from her).

The OM's wife cheated on him (like your wife is cheating on you). Therefore, there's a good chance he will dump her immediately once she's served and move on to his next conquest.

WontBeFooledAgai posted 2/16/2020 14:05 PM

By WW proposing Trial Separation, what she really means is 'I want to test-drive OM and my relationship w OM, so you just keep sitting around waiting for me to decide like a good little boy, and keep on being my Safe Choice.' Don't agree to it, Friend!

File for divorce without telling her. Just like she had her affair..without telling you.

[This message edited by WontBeFooledAgai at 2:10 PM, February 16th (Sunday)]

Marz posted 2/16/2020 14:10 PM

If I decide to file papers, should I talk with her about it beforehand or without notice?

Did she talk to you before she decided to have an affair?

She's asked for a trial separation. Is this helpful in reconciliation or just a way to start the divorce?

Like most cheaters she is getting you out of the way so she can devote all her time for her other man.

Wake up. The affair is still ongoing.

Inform his wife if heís married.

ChamomileTea posted 2/16/2020 14:17 PM

She's asked for a trial separation. Is this helpful in reconciliation or just a way to start the divorce?

Trial separations are only valuable as a tool to those couples who are having trouble with controlling their anger and who are exploding at one another. IOW, there's so much raw emotion that unsupervised communications have become damaging. So, the separation ends up being about developing better communication habits with the help of a therapist and THEN reengaging reconciliation. There's purpose to it, and typically, it's closely managed and observed by your marriage counselor.

If that's not what's going on... then yeah, it's usually about test-driving the AP while making sure the BS sticks around in case it doesn't work out. That, of course, is when it's not just saber-rattling to get the BS to back off and stop asking so many questions.

Personally, if my WS asked me for "trial separation"... I'd just land a D on his head and that would be that.

hardtomove posted 2/16/2020 14:18 PM

You really need to look within yourself. You need to question why you feel this behavior is justified? Why you have no self respect? She is still cheating on you. It has not stopped and you need to be decisive and do a hard 180 don't give her options. Full access too all communication forms.

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