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Tough one but in turmoil - have I left tt too late?

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Kibs posted 9/15/2019 16:37 PM

Here goes.

Last year I started taking some meds for anxiety. I had all sorts of side effects and I was concerned about a personality change but my consultant told me to persevere with them and if I donít then he canít help me. He said if I didnít take them I wonít get better.

The physical symptoms subsided so I continued with them and figured any personality change would subside just as quickly. Although it turns out that it didnít, nor did I twig in time.

I stopped having feelings for both my husband and my son. I thought it odd but assumed it was part of the tablets and meant if I wanted to get better I would have to just get on with it.

Fast forward a little while and I told my husband I think we are better as friends. He just said Ďgreatí.

To cut a long story short I ended up getting attention from another man. He was very flirty and very complimentary. I started to enjoy the attention. I also started drinking, something I had always been afraid to do as I was scared I would be ill (part of my anxiety, sickness phobia). However, I was going out and getting drunk a lot! Completely out of character, I was always much happier being at home with a cup of tea and snuggled on the sofa with my husband and son.

One night after a drinking session the man offered to walk me home. I accepted. He hugged me when I said I was ok from there, I hugged him back then he went in for a kiss. I pulled away and said no that is not good. I should have cut all ties there and then but no, for some bizarre reason I didnít and it escalated. We talked a lot, mostly normal but he sent me a lot of selfies and was always saying how attractive I am. I only ever have him back that he had nice eyes (not even true) and one selfie again when I was drunk. I donít Ďdoí selfies! We shared a kiss and had sex once, then almost had sex again but didnít then once again on a drunken night we did again but not fully if that makes sense. It was after that night realisation dawned on me. Like what the hell am I doing. This is absolutely everything I am against, always have been and always will be. I knew I wasnít right and I thought about maybe coming off my tablets incase it could be those but why would they cause something like that right?

Nothing else happened between us after that but he tried his hardest, always when drunk. Tried to remain civil with him but every time alcohol was involved he would try it on. The last straw was when I let him stay on our sofa at home because he had lost his key. My husband knew he was stopping. The man tried to pull me on top of him. I told him to leave first thing and I never want to speak to him again. He did just that and all ties were cut. 3 days later I was off my meds and every single feeling of Love I had for my husband and son came flooding right back.

I confessed to my husband in January. I said I had been seeing someone and we kissed. He asked a day or so later if we had sex and I said yes. He came home after a week and said he doesnít want to speak about anything and wants to leave the past in the past. So as much as I wanted to tell all I just couldnít. I felt like if he wanted to know he would ask. He asked a couple of months later if I had sex once and I said yes.

I spent our week apart researching this medication and it is there in black and white that they can have detrimental effects on a personality. Causing dishinibition which is exactly what happened. They can affect your frontal lobe and cause you to act in ways you wouldnít in a Ďnormalí state of mind. My friends and even my husband have admitted I was not myself last year and one of my friends said she wished she had told me, I said I knew but not until the damage had been done and I didnít have evidence that it was tablet related.. I still donít know why I did what I did, I canít explain it but I guess the meds didnít help. There was zero problem in our marriage other than our lack of communication but I know this is the case with a lot of couple.

My husband is a wonderful soul. It breaks my heart that I did all of this without even considering him and my son!

A couple of weeks ago he invited me on a camping trip which I went on. It was lovely and he told me he loves me (he had spent months saying he doesnít know if he loves me).

Last week he asked to come home (he moved back out in June as he couldnít deal with it) and he said he wants to know everything, I said he does know everything and if he wants to know then he needs to ask. He didnít ask. I accepted it then a couple of days later I told him not to move back yet. I told him I want nothing more than for him to come home but I want him to be sure.

However, though I only count one of the occasions as having had sex I am aware that to him the other attempts could be seen as that too. I feel like I need to tell him and need to go over every detail. He didnít know how it all came about it or anything.

My question is, do you think I have left it too long to tell him this information? I am still ready to tell him but does it take away any chance of sorting this whole mess out? Do I ask if he wants to hear EVERYTHING before I start blurting it all out/give him the details??

I have to say we have got on and chatted daily since it all came out. We even went car shopping together and he still comes home to cut the grass (my grass cutting skills are terrible). I know itís easy for me to say but I am a good person despite what I have done. I donít hurt people, I am scared of upsetting anyone and I have a good heart so I canít get my head around why the hell I have done this. I have searched suicide methods. I am struggling to function and worst of all Iím struggling to parent. I struggle to cook, tidy do anything. I go to work and come home and thatís it. I canít see any escape from the pain and itís all caused by my own doing. I donít want this to come across as feeling sorry for myself because I know my husband will be hurting a million times more than I am but I just donít know where to go from here.

I genuinely love him and my son more than anything, unfortunately all I have is hope.

wifehad5 posted 9/15/2019 19:02 PM

Nine months ago your husband said he didn't want to talk about it any more. Ask him if he's changed his mind.

Carissima posted 9/15/2019 19:33 PM

BW here, no stop sign

Last week he asked to come home (he moved back out in June as he couldnít deal with it) and he said he wants to know everything, I said he does know everything and if he wants to know then he needs to ask.

Your husband asked for full details just last week so it's obviously not too late to give him the information! My question is why did you lie to him and tell him he knows everything when you've just told us he doesn't? Plus the 'needing to ask' part is nonsense and makes no sense - he had just asked and you proceeded to try and gaslight him.

He didnít ask. I accepted it then a couple of days later I told him not to move back yet. I told him I want nothing more than for him to come home but I want him to be sure.

Why would he ask? As a BS your response makes it obvious you're lying and hiding information. I would be asking myself if you just don't want him home because you'll have to face the truth and the continued lying. It's all about protecting your comfort levels. I can't imagine how your BH is feeling after putting everything on the line, asking to come home and then being told no. I have to say, if it were me there would never be another request.

You will never 'sort' this if you continue to lie, full disclosure and truth is required.

One last thing, if you feel suicidal contact your local helpline. No matter what happens with your marriage remember you have a son who loves you.

Justgetitoverwith posted 9/15/2019 21:39 PM

Blaming it on a personality change caused by meds, when you clearly were aware of said personality change and still knew what was right or wrong. The love for your husband which came flooding back as soon as you stopped taking the meds is quite likely due to guilt at your behaviour, and relief you got away with it. I don't think the meds (and any associated effect) would have cleared your system that quickly.

Now you are wondering if it's too late to confess the extra details? Sorry if this sounds harsh, but it's all standard avoidance behaviour. There's never any excuse for infidelity, and not coming completely clean is for your benefit only. No matter what excuses you come up with now. Are you afraid that the extra information, which is a contradiction of what you told him before, will mess up the easy time you have been having so far?

The best way through it is to be completely honest, and volunteer things without having to be asked. Ask any BS.

Abacus posted 9/15/2019 23:09 PM

BS here.

As you have sat and thought through the situation over all this time, you have every autonomous right to decide that "the meds made me do it". You're allowed to feel that way, but it's not ever going to fly with the person you chose to betray.

Don't protest this. We don't know you. We only know what you've shared. And what you've shared was, "the meds made me do this".

Before you get any deeper into this with your BH, it is my strong suggestion that you recognize what you've told us and see why we, perfect strangers, might roll our eyes at what you've said. Blame the meds? You made choices. Own them. You're not the victim here.

I'm not trying to be mean. Just holding up a mirror. Figure out how to look at what happened you hurt someone else. He's going to need YOU to take responsiblity for that. You're going to have to seek forgiveness for what YOU have done to him, not for what you feel was done to you by the meds. They don't even belong in the conversation. Frankly, they make your remorse seem insincere. You don't get extra bonus points for them. They detract from your believability that you're willing to take responsibility for what you've done.

Because, ultimately, the only way your marriage is getting through this is to focus on HIS hurts, HIS needs, and HIS loss. Not your meds issues. You broke the relationship. Put on your big girl pants, stop blaming outside influences on your poor choices, approach him with humility, and be willing to do whatever it takes to repair the damage.

It's okay if you don't like my response. But it's honest.

RocketRaccoon posted 9/16/2019 00:55 AM

Hi Kibs,

Betrayed here, and since there is no Stop sign, thought I'd wade in for a little while.

There is no 'too late' or 'too long' when it comes to confessing all the details of your infidelity. There is no statute of limitations.

As a suggestion, instead of being reactive, do a pro-active thing, write down the timeline of your affair. Two versions; one that is an overview of when and why it started, and another one where it pulls no punches. Give him both versions at the same time, and tell him what they are; i.e. one PG rated, and the other is XXX rated.

The first one is a primer for your BH, in case he is not ready to handle the down and dirty details. The second one is when he has braced himself to know the details (emotions, what was said, what positions, where, how many times, etc). It would be better if you put down the number of times as 3, rather than one, as it would be seen as minimising your betrayal.

He will probably be feeling emasculated, as you got pleasure form another man. Something that was reserved for the spouse alone. He might be thinking that he was 'not enough', and that you derived more pleasure form your AP than your BH. This will mindfuck your BH badly, especially if you had done things with your AP that was not allowed or done with your BH.

Write down every embarrassing/dirty detail, you will probably hurt your husband more, but it is better to let it all out at once, rather than T(rickle)T(ruth) him. That would probably end your M. TT is poison to any attempts at R(econciliation).

Going to be blunt now, so skip what I have posted below if you don't want to read blunt comments.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
As to thinking of yourself as a good person (a lot of WS think like this), I doubt your BH will agree with that. A Good Person would not have done what WS do. I can understand that you want to believe you are a good person, and you probably were before your A, but you are now a cheater.

This will stay with you forever. I know there are a lot of other posters who say that your past does not define you, but I believe that it does. It is our past that makes us who we are.

What you do with your past will dictate who you are in the future. If you do not learn from past mistakes, there is a high likelihood that it will happen again.

Then comes your thoughts of suicide. This is Wayward thinking, as it is utterly selfish. I know that you have thought about the effect it will have on your BH and son, so that is a good thing that you did not follow through.

Kibs posted 9/16/2019 01:26 AM

Carissima,

Itís strange but it was in the middle of us being intimate and he said ĎI want to know everythingí I just said Ďyou doí knowing at that time I needed to tell him full gory details but right after said if you need to know ask. Rather than it being in a gaslighting way I meant it in a way that when he first found out what I had done he said he didnít want to know anything or talk about anything. I didnít want to just blurt everything out if he didnít want to hear it, it didnít feel like the right time mid sex if that makes sense but after getting your point of view I see thatís what needs/needed to be done.

I guess part of me didnít want him to come home because the whole thing hasnít been discussed so youíre perhaps right there, if we hadnít discussed full details and he came home then we did discuss and it didnít work out then it all starts again. Heís already moved out twice and with an 8 year old child in the mix is it something we should risk again? Genuine question because I donít know. I know we wouldnít be having this issue in the first place if it wasnít for me and I know I didnít think about my son at the time this was taking place so I probably have no right to stress about his feelings now but I do.

Justgetitoverwith -

The thing is at the time for a few weeks, I knew what I was doing wasnít right but I didnít seem to care which I know sounds odd, only after the last time something happened did something click. I wish I could explain it better. I didnít think about my husband or my son at all! It wasnít just my husband I stopped loving this is the thing. So when you say my feelings of love came back because of guilt, why would they go in the first place and why would they disappear for both of the only people in my life I really love? The feelings had gone before anything with the other man. I had been weaning myself off my meds for a few weeks and 3 days after the last tablet the feelings flooding back did definitely happen, along with being scared of sick, the OCD coming back with a vengeance, didnít feel like drinking. It wasnít just a case of one thing and it was almost like a switch had been flicked. I canít say the tablets are completely to blame because I donít know that but they most definitely contributed and anyone that knows me could see that and I also I can see that. Even he has said he could see it. Plus when you say I got away with it and Iíve had an easy time, that is not true. I didnít get away with anything nor has it been easy, it has been the complete opposite. As far as I was aware our marriage was over up until 2 weeks ago so I donít feel like thatís getting away with it and having it easy.

I, however do get where youíre all coming from. The sad part is I have been cheated on before and I know how it feels. The fact I could do this to someone else sickens me.

I have messaged my husband (he is away at the moment) and asked him to come over when heís back because I want to tell him full full details - this was done before I came on here. I know this needs to be done I only wish I did at the beginning but hindsight is a marvellous thing. The reasons I didnít in the beginning was genuinely because he said he didnít want to know everything. I told him I had been Ďseeingí someone else and that we had kissed and he just got up and walked out (understandably), he asked a couple of days later if we had sex and I of course said yes. When he asked at a later date if it was just once I said yes because to me it was but now I see that the Ďattemptsí could be seen as that too.

I struggle to take full full responsibility for this and I know itís hard for you to see this as being to do with the meds but I know for a fact that they went a long way towards what happened. I can sit here and swear that none of this would have happened without being on medication and know that for certain. I know myself, I know what I believe and donít believe in. However this just makes it all the more difficult. Itís frustrating to me. After doing a lot of research some of the mental side effects are Hypomania, thymoanesthesia and dishinibition to name but a few, these are the ones I experienced. This is not made up.

However, I can also see where youíre coming from with being on the receiving end that the above information is irrelevant. I donít know how to make it right I really donít. I love this man and he loves me. My family is everything to me and I cannot comprehend what I have done. Yes I feel a huge amount of guilt of course I do, I feel like I have destroyed our lives, I have destroyed my husband I have destroyed our son.

Iím sorry to all of you that have been on the receiving end, nobody deserves to be cheated on, nobody.

totallydumb posted 9/16/2019 08:34 AM

BS here.

I can sympathize with your situation to a certain point.

One of my nieces was in a car accident a few years ago. She died as a result of her injuries.

It turned out the other driver who caused the accident was on meds and had a few drinks on top of this. Very similar to your situation.

The driver was convicted of vehicular homicide and was sent to prison.

Thankfully, this driver did not tell my family that "the meds made me do it".

She took full responsibility and was accountable for her actions.

Maybe you should do the same.

FearfulAvoidance posted 9/16/2019 10:48 AM

I want to touch on "the meds made me do it" talk. Any medication that is taken to help mental illness can royally fuck a person's sense of reality up. Certain medications mixed with certain disorders can absolutely propel your brain into a hypomanic or manic state without you having ANY idea it is happening.

I have stuggled with depression my entire adult life. I have been on every antidepressant you can think of. One of them threw me into emotional rages, so I stopped. Then I found wellbutrin and thought it was a wonder drug. I felt good everytime I'd start it or increase my dose. But it never lasted and I always fell into a pit of depression. And then I'd go back on and feel great. Then i started developing anxiety in a way that was unlike it had ever been. Cycle continues.

A few months before my A I started back up on the wellbutrin. Good at first, and then down so I went and increased my dose. Shortly after I exhibited impulsive behavior and reached out to my soon to be AP. Before I understood what was happening I was flying high and in a full blown affair. I was raging on my wife telling her that I was FINE, I felt great, for the first time in years I wasn't depressed at ALL and proceeded to blame her for everything under the sun that has ever been wrong with me. A few months later I crashed, harder than I'd ever crashed. Eventually I disclosed (select parts) to my wife, and a fee months later I switched to an SSRI. Poof, anxiety gone, and started to be able to function somewhat easier with wading through the destruction I had caused the past 6 months.

All of this is to say, this whole time I had been undiagnosed bipolar 2. Antidepressants don't tend to work well for bipolar depression and some, like wellbutrin, can actually CAUSE hypomania or mania. During my affair my wife kept crying at me, "who are you?? You are not my wife. You are a stranger. Give me back my wife".

I felt like a stranger to myself, and at the time thought this must be who I really am and I'd been fighting it the whole time. Once I was off the welbutrin I looked behind me at the wake of destruction and didn't understand how any of it happened. How did I do this? Who was that person? I had a head full of disgusting memories that felt like another person put them there. I remember one day a few months out my wife looking at me, like she was searching for something within my soul, and she said to me with teary eyes, "is it really you? Are you really back?".

Did the meds mixed with an incorrect diagnosis make me have an A? Nope. Did they take away my inhibitions and send me into an extreme hypomanic bording on manic state? You betcha they did. Does that excuse or make less damaging any of the horrific things I did? Not a chance. After my diagnosis earlier this year I watched my wife try to rationalize how this made everything make sense, and walking the line of "maybe it wasn't my fault", it was the meds.

The point is it doesn't matter what external forces were present to make the A an option. If you got drunk and had sex with someone against their will, it is still rape, and you should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. The above analogy of an impaired driver that killed an innocent and never once made an excuse for their behavior is spot on.


Carissima posted 9/16/2019 13:25 PM

I've also suffered severe depression for years, now with added anxiety thanks to the reason we are all here.

I know the feeling of having no feelings, of being unable to function. In fact I almost lost my job over it. What I didn't lose was my knowledge of right and wrong, my awareness what the consequences of my actions would be. It would still have been a conscious choice to act out.

Kibs posted 9/16/2019 13:50 PM

Youíre right.

This is all on me.

The messages from him I didnít read to much in to I just know I liked the attention, I was flattered. When he went in for the kiss I pushed away and said no. At that point I was aware of what was right and wrong but it was beginning to blur if that makes sense. I didnít have any thought for a couple of weeks (the time in which the sex happened) I didnít think I was wrong but I didnít think I was right at the same time. The times I pushed away was like I almost knew it was wrong but couldnít accept that,. I just kind of felt nothing. Then it was almost like with the physical side effects that had worn off the mental side affects had worn off. I still wasnít myself but I realised that what I had done was very very wrong. When the man tried it on with me a few times after that I was able to say no. When he tried it on at my house I was able to tell him to F off and never speak to him again.

So what happens when somebody tells me I had said something very important that I donít remember ever saying, like they said I was at work when I said that to them (not related to the A but that time of year). How have I forgot something significant? How do I then know I know everything I had done/said is exact before I can tell my husband? Do I contact the person I cheated on him with or do I just tell him what I genuinely know and hope that I havenít forgotten anything? If Iím honest I donít want to contact him, absolutely never want to speak to him or see him ever again but what if I have to? Iím not asking to be slated here I just want advice. I feel like I havenít forgot anything and I have written a timeline as suggested but on the other hand if I want it out I want it all out.

I hate myself, I hate what I have done. I was a good person, I am a good person again but last year I was not a good person. Not at all. I was a cheater, whoever called me that it wasnít harsh it is the truth.

Itís good to get someone elseís perspective of their meds doing crazy shit to them. I know youíre right in saying they did not MAKE me do what I did.

Please can somebody tell me what sort of affair I had? There was no feelings there nor did I fancy him. It was a case of youíre paying me attention I like it and right now I want it. We chatted daily about normal stuff as well and about our relationships (which husband knows about). Thatís not an EA is it? I donít know what types there are.

HellFire posted 9/16/2019 13:56 PM

You had am EA and a PA.

You may not have fancied him, but you enjoyed the way he made you feel. You liked the ego kibble, and the validation. All of that is emotional. It may not have been a "love" affair, but that doesn't mean it wasn't an EA.

And the attempted sexual encounters? That's sex. It doesn't have to involve an orgasm to equal sex.

[This message edited by HellFire at 1:57 PM, September 16th (Monday)]

Kibs posted 9/16/2019 14:33 PM

Thank you hellfire. Youíre absolutely right, I donít know why I didnít see it like that.

Part of me wishes I had red flagged this so I didnít get replies from people on the receiving end because it is hard to hear some home truths, things I had said about myself and had my friends tell me I need to stop beating myself up. Almost there but then I feel like Iím starting again. Iím too much of a sensitive person to hear all of this. I do feel low again, the thought to end it all because I canít bear what I have done is back. But I have a child. I might not be the best wife but I like to think Iím a good mum. No doubt one of you will decide that Iím not that either. But on the other hand without the honesty then I would still be trying to blame absolutely everything on the tablets.

The person that said my husband wonít think Iím a good person, my husband has told me outright without me mentioning anything that I am a good person. Even though Iíve cheated on him he still sees the good in me. That is the sort of person he is. Also the person I am. I see the good in everyone. I never judge anyone. We are human beings not machines. My ex cheated on me with my best friends and I am still friends with them both. I never fell out with them once even though it hurt like hell. To be honest part of me thinks I should just let him go. He could be happy with someone who would never do this to him. I know I deserve to grow old and lonely.

I deserve zero sympathy I know that. Thank you all for your words.

Carissima posted 9/16/2019 14:48 PM

Kibs, you can ask the Mods to put a flag on your thread. The waywards here will help you if you keep posting.

Kibs posted 9/16/2019 14:51 PM

Thank you, thatís kind of you to let me know.

BraveSirRobin posted 9/16/2019 15:53 PM

Definitely ask for the stop sign to be added if you aren't ready to hear from BS yet. You probably will want to eventually, because they have some really helpful insights, but in the initial stages, it's sometimes better to just hear from people who have walked in your shoes.

I also had a BH who went back and forth on what he wanted to know. Sadly, he was making those decisions from a position of misplaced trust. He wanted to believe that I would tell him the worst parts, the things that anyone would need to know, and spare him the grisly details. However, I was clinging to relief that I didn't have to tell him everything, and I was hiding so much more than he could have imagined. I heard the timid "don't tell" so much louder than the clear, repeated "tell."

Yes, you need to tell him everything. The judgment of what was or wasn't "real" sex is absolutely his to make. We struggled with this one, too, and I can't tell you the pain I would have spared him if I had just been honest at the outset. As with planting a tree, the best time to be honest is a long time ago, and the second best time is right now.

Lastly, no, OH HELL NO don't contact the OM. That's something that should almost never be done under any circumstances, and a solid never without the consent and participation of the BS.

DoinBettr posted 9/16/2019 15:55 PM

You did the right thing by not bringing him back in without at least the soft details. Write it out. Don't make him ask the questions. That may make him feel like he is hurting you and he will swallow the pain instead.
The hardest part I think is going to be the sofa part where he was aware of this guy and you made your BS part of the affair unknowingly.
Go read some other threads. All the WW have a hard time with TT. The best solution is complete disclosure in the beginning. Without that expect trust to be squandered more and more over time.
You can fix this. Your BS has done more for you than anyone else in your life.
Why would you be scared to try when that is on the line?

SI Staff posted 9/16/2019 17:15 PM

All,

The Stop Sign has been added. This thread is now closed to responses from Betrayed Spouses.

Kibs posted 9/17/2019 12:20 PM

So Iíve done it. I wrote out a timeline. I spoke to him he didnít want to see the timeline.

I told him the full on sex happened once and there were two Ďfumblesí which was kissing, touching etc and a penetration a couple of times. I have told him itís not his fault in the slightest and that I have no excuses, I know it wouldnít have happened without the meds but the fact is it did and for that I am fully responsible.

His face. Why is it so fíing hard for the WS, I canít even begin to imagine what itís like for the BS. I feel sick, I feel broken but I expect him to feel worse. He has left again. Where do I go from here? Shall I just leave him alone until he contacts me? I donít want to Ďhoundí him but I want him to know I care. x

Kibs posted 9/17/2019 15:22 PM

He has messaged thanking me for telling him everything

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