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A warning that is often offered here at SI, probably more than anything else, is that a betrayed spouse must first take care of themselves. Once that has occurred then it is the time to either choose to divorce or reconcile.

I am 72 years old dang it and unbelievably, 32 years into reconciling, and in all honesty, that is the 1st time that concept has been presented to me as a crucial step in infidelity recovery. And I would like to submit that that goes for both the betrayed and the betrayer. I am aware that my initial reaction the night my wife disclosed was I needed to take care 1st was, not me, not even her, but our marriage. (Irrational thinking, I know.)

Below will explain how I, and I believe my wife as well, honestly looked at how we were to mature and prosper as a married couple.

When my wife and I were 18 and 19 years of age we were greatly, for better and worse, influenced by the conservative church we attended. (No offence meant to anyone, I am only sharing our experiences of outside influences.)
Tall candles participated in our wedding ceremony. There were 3 pure white candles on the altar in front of us. The middle candle was unlit, a representation of our upcoming union. And on either side, there was an individual, lit candle, each to represent her and I. During the ceremony we held our individual lit candles and then together we lit the exposed wax thread of the unlit middle, taller candle. We in tantum lit middle candle and as the glow of the flame became secured, we blew out our smaller, incomplete candles.

The meaning of this ritual was to, symbolically, express a vow that we were setting aside our individuality to become 1 ‘new person’ under God. Sounds sweet and romantic but was it healthy? Looking back at that concept we took literally, I am now fully aware we got off on the wrong foot. Plus, as time passed, this "two people becoming one person belief began to fray our natural selves, strangling our uniquely individual souls.

As I have come to see it, my wife simply was the 1st to buckle under the pressure of believing she had to lose herself to be loved by me. (I’m not making excuses, she had healthy options, just giving important background.)
We were on our own after the infidelity for the church was holy unprepared to be of any real help. Forgiveness and returning to being the marriage they scolded us be, was their only offering. No insight, no rethink, just do it the church’s way and you will be fine.

Fortunately, we rejected their insistences and found our own way which did include fostering each other’s real selves and assisting in each other’s finding of themselves. We knew we were taking the chance that in these new discoveries of our individual selves we might realize we were not going to be a couple anymore. But there was no turning back and I had no desire to return to what we were pre-infidelity.

For us, reconciliation has worked so far. I am not making the claim that there is no pain anymore, no discomforting, intrusive thoughts, or that there are no more of those unquenchable questions, you know, the dreaded "how’s and why’s". I’m only saying they no longer rule the day. The sting of infidelity has become far less destructive. That said, we know we must, from time to time, give pain its due so we might continue the success of the reconciliation and prosper as both individuals and as a couple.

Thank you for sharing this beautiful post! Wow. Hits home here!

Just yesterday I was meditating on the spiritual position we are thrown into on D-Day (without writing a book, here!). Simply phrased, we go from our perceived "couple unit" right back to "Well, I guess it's just me and You, God." And I wondered what we need to do to maintain that constant sense of who we truly are, a loved child of God, when we are immersed in the many self-sacrificing aspects of marriage? Deep stuff.

Thanks again for your post and for sharing that story about the candles. I think that was my understanding of marriage, too. Lofty concept...maybe unrealisitic.

Thank you Superesse for your thoughtful reply. You can write a book on any of my posts anytime you feel it to be helpful to you, others, or to me. 😊

I must be fully transparent and state that neither of us follows a religious tradition anymore. But we support those that do. It was a painful choice to leave our church home, with the loss of our dearest friends but it was the right decision for us and we’ve never looked back.

It sounded as if you chose divorce (am I right?) that is often the best alternative to take and for many, the only alternative to take.

Best wishes
Asterisk

Thanks again, sir! No, neither "D" or "R." Another poster the other day identified our situation as "Zombie M." ! Can't be "limbo" if I'm not waiting for him to change. But at my age (74 1/2) with heart damage from the stress of it all, seems like this is the course I'm stuck in. At least we can limp along like an old motor with 3 cylinders blown...knocks, under-powered, burns excessive oil, but gets me to the grocery store. Sad.

Anyway it's a deep subject and one to explore. I'm thinking you came from a tradition where M is considered eternal? My background is not quite that strong about M but we aren't allowed to D and remarry either. And at this stage I'm not even going to consider that option!

I have enjoyed your ruminations.

What an incredibly descriptive analogy. Even it is very sad, I loved the connection to a aged car. As a man only 2 years behind you, I can relate to the thought of "just limping along". Fortunately, weird thing for me to say, I was 35 years old when my wife disclosed. It was brutal but time was on our side.

Thank you for sharing some of your story and I’m sorry I misunderstood the part where you said: "Well, I guess it’s just me and you, God."

No, divorce in the case of infidelity was not forbidden in our church but remarriage was not a well accepted direction to take. It was based on the teachings that "You can only be one flesh with your spouse, until death." Strange stuff I use to ascribe to."

My shortened story is that my wife and I worked in the missionary field for 12 years. We had returned from the field with me becoming the youth director at our church, my wife was the organist, and her affair partner, the choir director. As one might guess, it was a messy situation. I knew they were close, I encouraged it because their work was glorious and their connection should have been safe. I had no idea that they had become physically involved for 1 ½ years. I resigned immediately and moved 1200 miles away leaving my wife and two kids behind. Not as a permanent situation but time for everyone to take stock. My kids joined me 3 months later and then my wife 3 months after that. And, in full discloser, I was humiliated. It was a real test of personal and collective survival.

Thank you Superesse for your kind words.

Asterisk

How very true indeed. Thank you Asterisk for sharing this thought.

I have been doing just as you suggested for 12 years. I come first (now that kids are grown).

I don’t worry about our marriage because I’ve gotten to a place where I am good with him or without him. Single or married — all good in my book.

Not to say I would not be saddened if we D but I would not be devastated. I think that is the difference.

I spent a solid 2 years with my counselor during & after his affair. I have no regrets whatsoever about that because it made me a better person and I have much more self confidence now than I ever did.

But better late than never.

I am so sorry that the church was not prepared to help you navigate the Betryal properly. Unfortunately, this is often the case sadly. That said, I really wish you would reconsider and not toss away trie religion, because of your unqualified and insensitive Church leadership.

Friend, Christ defiantly commands forgiveness because we all need forgiveness from Him. But He also wholly supports making amends...for the betrayer to make things right. He also gives liberty for divorce. Finally, God knows wounded hearts take time and care to heal.

If you were to focus on the person and words of Christ, I trust you again realize, He is the only way and is the Great Physician for your soul. 🙏

Thank you The1stWife, for sharing your successful growth as a "better person" mentioned below:

I spent a solid 2 years with my counselor during & after his affair. I have no regrets whatsoever about that because it made me a better person and I have much more self confidence now than I ever did.

I have maintained that I also grew in some positive ways from my wife’s affair, ways that I may never have had if that event did not occur. That is not saying that I’m glad it did, only that the human spirit has the capacity to turn most, if not all, tragedies into a growth opportunity verses destruction.

The one thing I never redeveloped was the level of confidence in myself that I had pre D-day. I’m impressed that you were able to increase your confidence, not an easy task. Another difference is that my wife and I are vastly more connected post D-day than we were pre D-day. It took a long time to regrow, and for me to trust the growth, of our connectedness. As you mentioned yourself, I am more aware that I’d survive and thrive if something tore us apart, but I would still be devastated and heartbroken. The one thing that I did well, post D-day was to not harden my heart towards my wife, and that was no easy task.

Asterisk

[This message edited by Asterisk at 10:06 AM, Thursday, September 11th]

WoodThrush2,

Thank you for your concern about my walk away from Christ. I would like to clarify that I did not leave the faith because of the affair or how it was handled in the church. Though that event did reveal a crack that would grow wider as other things occurred. I was able to see now that my eyes had been opened.

That said, I understand and appreciate your encouragement for me to rethink my current position. I take no offense with your suggestion that I return. However, I cannot see that in my future.

One more thought about something you said.

Friend, Christ defiantly commands forgiveness...

One thing I have come to believe, it is not right to "command" forgiveness. For forgiveness to be healthy and real, it must come from a person’s free-will desire. Any other way, it is artificial and doomed to failure. It cannot and never should have been "commanded". Just my thoughts.

Thank you Woodthrush2 for your concerns. I believe it comes from your heart.

Asterisk

[This message edited by Asterisk at 10:20 AM, Thursday, September 11th]

Asterisk, I am wondering about your self confidence and how it has impacted you.

I became very insightful about my H’s inner workings and his "why".

He didn’t cheat because I was not a good wife. His cheating had nothing to do with me. His very typical midlife crisis affair was so cliche it was laughable

I did not know about this site during his affair so I was on my own and using my own smarts to get through it. I think that is what bolstered my self esteem. The fact I survived this nightmare made me realize I had some strength from within. Hence my increased self confidence.

Asterisk your thoughts and in general your posts have me thinking. this was one of my main fears since dday: whether I ll never stop thinking about the affair. Probably I won’t, and maybe I shouldn’t either.

Apart from that, not me nor my husband come from a religious background, but the ways that we both set aside our individualities was pretty evident since the day that we met. And I can say that it was mostly him that was totally immersed in to us. That also made him at some point conclude that he "gives a lot and that he deserves to… since I don’t really love him". Bull##t thought process that I had to pay for when he confessed his infidelity. He honestly thought I didn’t care….

I say all that to conclude that I think that there are relationships that start with the best of intentions, one of them being to become one. We ve all learned the hard way that we have to tend for our individualities, in order to be able to love others from a place of sincerity. I wasn’t sincere either with my husband. I didn’t cheat because I think I am smarter than that (hence one of the ways that your confidence can improve after dday) , but was I right when I didn’t talk about things that bothered me for years? No I wasn’t! I put myself first now, as the 1st wife says, and by doing so all my relationships have improved, not only the one with my husband. And yes I too feel that I will survive without him! I will be heartbroken but I will survive.

[This message edited by Phosphorescent at 11:19 AM, Thursday, September 11th]

The1stWife,

Much like you, I, and my wife as well, went through the process of figuring out how to reconcile on our own. 32 years ago, the internet didn’t exist. Heck, home computers weren’t a thing. Around 7 or 8 months in we did go to secular marriage counseling for many months. Honestly, from the standpoint of couples counseling it was excellent. Far superior to the religious based counseling we had always turned to out of suspicion of outside influences. We never tried individual counseling because we mistakenly saw it as a mutual problem in our marriage. To anyone, if an affair were to occur in their lives, I’d now advise to put marriage counseling on hold and seek individual counseling 1st. I think that order would shorten recovery no matter the direction that is called for.

As to my self-confidence. In many ways, I am far more confident. I know that I can survive extraordinary suffering and humiliation and come out the other end unhardened or bitter. I’m not suggesting I’m not affected, I wouldn’t want to go through an event this traumatic and come away from it the same person. But I also wouldn’t want to become someone I despise either. So, in areas such as this I am very strong and confident in myself. However, I honestly thought that I was a decent enough husband and man that my wife would not risk losing me. I just thought I was more valuable than I was. Now I know differently.

Thank you The1stWife for engaging me on this issue. It means the world to me. Conversations such as these give me pause for it helps me see there are issues I have not fully resolved....such as the confidence one.

Asterisk

Thank you Phosphorescent for sharing some of your story with me. It helps to know one is not alone, not that I would every wish this on anyone.

Concerning remembering D-day and all that came with it, my experience is that it never goes fully away. I have thought about it everyday of the 32 years. In the beginning it was cruel and ever present. In wake and sleep there was no escaping it. I’m glad I’m not a drinker because back then, I might have drank until I dropped dead, and would have welcomed the permanency of that sleep. I was in bad shape, lost in every way possible.

These days, it is more of a passing thought that sometimes stings but doesn’t typically cause me a deep ache. In fact, I’m proud of myself and of my wife for hanging in there and rebuilding a loving, happy relationship. But there still are triggers that creep in and attempt to tell me I’m not worth what I am worth, that I am less than I am. That is a demon that still has my ear and knows how to say demeaning things to my soul.
Asterisk

Funny thing about that last sentence, Asterisk. Not to go into this topic deeper here (because we aren't supposed to) but if I'm permitted one personal observation from my own family: many people of faith have had their growth diverted drastically by the unfaithfulness of either their spouse or some nasty authority figure within their church hierarchy. It is a just real sad thing to witness and it makes me think you weren't far off the mark with that comment.

In any case you seem to be on an exploratory journey now. Hope these thoughts help.

I am about 1.5 years out from d-day and what my wife did enters my thoughts every day and I'm concerned this will go on forever. Everyone has the physical ability but not the moral ability to cheat. I never thought my wife could do what she did and now that I know she has the moral (lack of?) ability to cheat I wonder if/when...

Multiple times she has said I know you cannot believe me but I can never see myself doing something like this again. And I'm sure in the moment she believes that but two years ago if I asked her could you ever do something like this her answer would have been an adamant no, never, why would you ask such a question.

There's a saying that a man will suffer in silence and sacrifice his happiness for his family and a woman will sacrifice her family for her happiness. Yes, the reverse can be true I understand.

So everyday I wonder if I would be better off in the long run by ending this relationship and trying to start over. We get along better today than we ever had. Our communication is great. She can actually verbalize her needs wants aggravations Etc and we have some healthy boundaries in place but the one thing that will never come back is that naive fantasy that no matter what she will always be right there by my side through thick and thin come hell or high water and always be there for me because I will never believe that again

Were I to discover today that she was doing something I would just shrug and say okay and go about my day and start the divorce process

A warning that is often offered here at SI, probably more than anything else, is that a betrayed spouse must first take care of themselves. Once that has occurred then it is the time to either choose to divorce or reconcile.

I am 72 years old dang it and unbelievably, 32 years into reconciling, and in all honesty, that is the 1st time that concept has been presented to me as a crucial step in infidelity recovery. And I would like to submit that that goes for both the betrayed and the betrayer. I am aware that my initial reaction the night my wife disclosed was I needed to take care 1st was, not me, not even her, but our marriage. (Irrational thinking, I know.)

I don't see a mistake here. I think it's reasonable to start by framing the problems as problems in th M, so I see no problem in starting by trying to fix the M.

IMO, it's virtually certain for the BS to think they failed, so it's entirely reasonable to to start with an idea that the BS screwed up, so fixing the problem is a matter of finding out what the BS did wrong so the BS could fix themself.

TBH, by the end of d-day I was pretty certain my W cheated because of her issues - but I had gone through a lot of therapy, and I was pretty good at ascertaining what was my responsibility and what was someone else's.

Even with that therapy, though, by d-day I saw myself (and everyone else) as organisms that want what they want when they want it. Therapy sort of taught me that if I wanted something from another person, they didn't have to give it to me. I was still faced with big decisions/questions/issues about what I wanted, what my W wanted, what was possible, what were the best options, etc., etc., etc.

It's just that I had a head start because therapy also taught me that the most important step I could take was to figure out what I wanted - and that was food and water, clothing (it was a cold day), answers, direction, sex, then sleep. I wanted comfort, too, but I didn't want it from my W, so I knew I was going to have to wait a long time for comfort. (Actually W's IC, who became our MC on d-day, gave me a lot of comfort by validating what I was thinking and feeling.)

So what do you think knowing you had to attend to yourself first do for you? That's a genuine question....

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:49 PM, Thursday, September 11th]

WB1340

I am about 1.5 years out from d-day and what my wife did enters my thoughts every day and I'm concerned this will go on forever. Everyone has the physical ability but not the moral ability to cheat. I never thought my wife could do what she did and now that I know she has the moral (lack of?) ability to cheat I wonder if/when...

Painful words my friend.

Oh man, I wish I could say that your concerns were unfounded, but they are not. Or at least that has been my situation, and I’ve been at this for over 32 years. The memory of D-day still lingers. One difference is that after about a decade, maybe even longer, I stopped worrying about a possible 2nd D-day or worse a relapse. It took an extraordinary amount of time for me to believe that my wife had changed. I think it took longer than was needed but it kept me feeling safer. I don’t know I really was, but it was the time I needed.

I am not sure if many will agree with me or push back but one of the things that helped me to grow my love and respect for my wife back was to let go of the "moral" failing aspect of their transgression. It just wasn’t helpful for me to remain in a judgement role towards my wife. Not that I did not have the right to hold the moral hammer but was it resolving anything to use it. I simply found I needed to lay it down and accept what had happened, happened. At first, I didn’t like it, I think because it made me feel vulnerable again. But it gave my wife the space she needed to find her way and to be accepted by me again.

Her cries to be believed again afford support to what I am trying to suggest above. Honestly, stepping back from our own pain, it must be a terrible place to find oneself. To know you’ve destroyed your reputation and relationship with your spouse so badly that there is nothing you can say to change it. Your word is worthless. Only what you do matters, for full trust was murdered and now it is reduced to evidence-based trust.

My thoughts, for whatever it is worth.

Sisoon

Thanks for sharing some more about your story and offering me assistance. I appreciate your thoughts concerning marriage counseling as a possible 1st option. The problem with my thinking was that I thought that that was the full way to go about it. Never even considered that I might need personal counseling to discover what it was "I" wanted verses what I thought was the "right" thing to do. Plus, in marriage counseling it was expected that I share in my wife’s decision to cheat. On that, our counselor was wrong. Did I play a role in her unhappiness in the marriage? Yes, absolutely, but not in how she chose to handle her unhappiness. That is fully on her. Her chose was terrible, no question, but I have never seen her as, or expressed to her that I thought "she" was a terrible person, for she is not.

Your ongoing support is kind, thank you.