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I hope someone can relate and give advice.

I am in IC after many years-working on myself. I am worth it.

Anyway-even though A was years ago, I was assigned Torn Asunder to read (internal groan-not another infidelity-you can have a better marriage after A book).

So-I read the book, and came to a chapter where that talk about the one spouse becomes the other spouse’s parent. A W buys all the husbands clothes, one spouse corrects the others pronunciation, spouse gives detailed instructions-go upstairs and take off those dirty jeans, shower, and wash your hair.

OMG-that is my marriage. I realized, other than socks and underwear, I have barely bought any clothes for myself, by myself, In years. W does the other two things too. And I just went along.

I think this is 2 FOO colliding in the worst possible way. I am the oldest of 5 kids. I and my next sister down got pushed into the role of pseudo parents for the 3 little siblings. My mom had some migraines that she had to stay in a dark room all day, and no noise. Also with 5 kids, her nurturing time was way split up. Dad worked-normal 70’s to 80’s American set up.

Her FOO-her Dad had 2 affairs-kicked to curb after second one. After age 12, her mother raised her alone. Her dad left the picture (not financially, just emotionally). My MIL was awesome, and a very strong woman-going into the workforce at 45 and having a hell of a career. But, she was really bossy, and had to be in control. Always.

So, I think unconsciously, I went looking for the nurturing I missed as a kid ( and found it). Her role model was to take charge of every situation.

I have told W about the M we are in. I told her I am a man, and I can buy my own clothes (just bought some shirts off internet-and they look great on me). I also said I can do most things without being told what to do step by step (successful career).

So, she is trying to stop this, but struggling. She saw a Tshirt that says "I’m trying not to be controlling, but you’re doing it wrong" and said that is her.

She is also upset she can’t buy me clothes.

How do we get out of this? Her bossing me on housework and her buying me clothes is the norm.

I know this sounds funny, especially to the women on this board, but I am serious. Breaking out of this is causing some conflicts between us. I think I am the defiant man/child now, and she does not like it.

[This message edited by goingtomakeit at 12:36 PM, Wednesday, August 9th]

TOTALLY relate to this... Not a good dynamic.

My W also has a history of being very 'particular'. The planner, the social coordinator, decorator, shopper, scheduler. Very much the person that needs to be in charge. It was GREAT being married to her... I didn't have to think, and she was 'happy'. Problem was that I was more of an accessory than a partner.
Additionally, for her, there was also the constant feeling of resentment over 'having to do everything'. Circular.
It really contributed her feelings of entitlement to cultivate EM relationships that went wrong, and also contributed to her being POSITIVE she could manage or fix things when they went sideways.
I, on the other hand, also made decisions to rug-sweep or invalidate my own feelings because of those feelings of being sort of optional in her life.
Social narratives about toxic masculinity, misogamy, male privilege and how women and children don't need men in their lives are pounded into our heads - and media twists us around even more as it portrays powerful females as domineering or seductive while portraying men as either dangerous or as idiots. It's very easy for women to believe they HAVE to be in control of everything and for decent guys to lose themselves completely trying to prove they're not a threat.
Took us a long time to start breaking those old patterns - but doing so has put us on a different trajectory. I speak my mind, she's learned to accept some help and it feels much more like an actual relationship.
Couple of things we did -
Household stuff? We decided to split it, each doing the things we LIKE to do. I do laundry, cook and break down all of her amazon boxes. She does the shopping, manages housekeeping.
Balls? I grew a pair. Not in an a-hole sort of way.. I had to change a lot of self-deprecating habits and get comfortable having an opinion and putting my foot down, even on simple things. That was probably the most important change. She probably thinks it's funny when I do it, but once I de-programmed myself, I realized that there's nothing wrong with 'being a man'.

[This message edited by suddenlyisee at 1:45 PM, Wednesday, August 9th]

Hi goingtomakeit,

I read your story and your actions, dedication to your children and life are worthy of praise in many ways.

The insights you had about the relationship with your wife are very important.

I want to offer another way to look at your wife buying you clothes. I have been married for over 40 years (my betrayal was in a prior relationship) and at the beginning of our marriage I bought my own clothes. Early on my wife started buying me clothes and I was confused and a bit angry. When I asked her about it she said that she dreamed of buying clothes for her someday, future husband, she liked to imagine how I would look in them as she shopped and it made her proud when I liked and wore them. So for my wife buying clothes for me created a intimate connection. Over the years I still buy a few things but let her buy me whatever she wants. Frankly, she does a good job!

So you may want to let her buy things for you now and then when she is out shopping because she is thinking of you and you buy the standard stuff. Based on your posts you are a very thoughtful thinker, so I wanted to give you another way to think about the clothes shopping. Your other points are spot on. My wife would never micromanage my life, she knows better .

TooOld

Thanks guys for the replies.

I know my W is fighting the FOO. I talked about this with her brothers wife. Her SIL said her brother actually says "I am your father- I know what is best for you". She ignores him.

During MC, she said it was like raising 3 little boys (me and 2 DS). For a little while, I did buy my own clothes and she panicked. She said I was getting hip new clothes and a hip new haircut getting ready to leave her. (This was my post A makeover).

So the clothes are a big issue and probably triggering for her on some level.

I take responsibility for letting her take over this part of me. It’s a balance, because I think she has great taste. Better than mine. But, I am nearly 60 years old, shouldn’t I decide how I want the world to see me?

Here are a few questions to ask your wife: does she feel overwhelmed and overburdened because she’s always trying to take charge of things? Did she feel any resentment because of this, which she used to justify her affair? How has "babying you" affected her ability to respect and be attracted to you (and vice versa)? I think these are questions that could lead to productive conversations, provided that you’re able to be honest and patient with one another.

As for falling into the rebellious teenager/scolding parent dynamic, I think this can be avoided with a little compromise from time to time. For example, if you’re going to event or an outing together, pick out 2 shirts and ask her which one she prefers. You’re still showing that you value her opinion and giving her a say, but you’re still choosing the clothing options.

If her answer is neither, than simply go with what you prefer without opening it up for discussion.

As an aside, your story reminded me of a friend from my postpartum support group who constantly complained about how her husband never helped with the baby or with chores around the house. I got the impression that he was the laziest man on Earth.

Then I went to her house one day and saw them in action. Any time he would try to do anything (whether it was change the baby’s diaper or set the table), she would tell him he was doing it wrong. It suddenly made sense why he would grab a beer and watch football instead of helping her.