SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Full history is in my story - background:
Together 29 years, married 25 - 2 kids, 25 and 16.
1st EA was online / phone in 2007 with a woman from a dating site. Lasted 6-8 months and rug swept
I am in IC (so is he)

WH (EA / 53) began working with a 19 yo a year ago. In this line of work, it means he picks her up, drops her off, and they spend 2 - 4 hours a day, alone, in his work truck.

In January, 2021 he wired her $600 to help her get out of her home country after losing her green card. He did this behind my back after I explicitly asked him not to. My spidey-senses were already tingling but up to this point, I did not have a solid reason not to trust him. Now my trust was broken and I began to question everything. He insisted he did nothing wrong. (fwiw, his company did give him the $$ back)

I started IC in late February. We started MC in March (BIG mistake). I opened a separate bank account.

Early March - he writes a 4 page letter explaining his relationship with EACOW - how she "gets him" and "always has a smile for him". How they had similar horrible childhoods and that she's "his best friend". I'm very upset and ask to share this letter with our MC, and he refuses.

Late March, he financed a $1,200 cell phone for her. Fight ensued and I asked him to leave. He refused.

April - He opened his own bank account and began getting new credit cards. 4/17 (dday#1) he backed out of a concert we were supposed to go to in lieu of going out to dinner with COW (now 20yo). When he got home, a major fight ensued - he kept lying to me about where he was and with whom, broke the bedroom door down and the police were called. He continued to lie to me until I got a hold of his phone and found their text messages from the night before. More fighting, very little remorse, lots of blame shifting and gaslighting. I asked him to leave again. The next day, per the advice of our MC, he left and spent a week in an extended stay motel. We R'd, he was sorry, promised to change, etc. and came home. This starts the hysterical bonding cycle.

In early May, MC ended, again at the advice of our therapist who said she couldn't do anything for us as he continued his EA behavior and I "couldn't stop getting triggered".
**side note - MC was a JOKE! She was from the Gottman / Perle school of infidelity and everything was 50/50 fault. MC becomes WH's IC (which I find disturbing)

Late May he moved his paycheck from our joint account to his personal checking account, without notice or discussion. There had been fights about him continuously buying lunch for 20yo COW. I was devastated - more fighting and I asked him to leave, again. Started consultations with lawyers and worked up the first draft of a separation agreement.

Late June - WH sent me a text message meant for COW / EAP - nothing super explicit but intimate, with heart emojis. I left and went to a hotel and then spent the July 4th holiday with D(16) at a resort, without him. I asked him to leave, again. He went back country hiking, by himself, in the dark, and made *woe is me* posts on Facebook about being alone and getting eaten by bears. When I got home, I bought an air mattress and cleaned out our spare bedroom and installed WH in there. I retained a lawyer (that didn't work out). This went on about 2 weeks before I came home one night to the hoovering / love bombing. He got on bended knee, professing his love, his sorrow, promising complete transparency (including open phones, find my iphone on) etc. He cleans the whole house, makes dinner every night, bakes an "I love you" cake. It took a week before my defenses came down.

Then 7/25 (Dday#2) I discovered he'd been on multiple dating sites, including Match and Tinder, for months. He'd been sitting next to me on the couch that week, taking screen shots of various scantily clad women. Another huge fight occurred. I scream that I "hate him" and WH told me to "shoot him" and I called the police again. As I was talking to dispatch, he went and got a handgun from an unlocked dresser in the spare bedroom and said he was going to "go out blazing"...then proceeded to lock the gun away in the safe. Police arrived (a LOT of police arrive - about 12) - I tell them what happened but he was calm and rational at this point so there was little they could do. He did leave and spent the night sleeping somewhere else. Feeling unsafe, I left the next day with our D and went to my brothers for 2 weeks. I keep texting him asking him to please move out.

On 8/4 I found out he was talking to someone he met on Tinder. I had her number, texted her, and outed WH. She gave me enough to know they'd been talking since right after I left on 7/26 and had been planning to meet up.
I confronted WH (over the phone) and he asked me to come home and talk about separation. I went home and he went on to explain how in IC he and his therapist agree he is a "sex addict" and has a problem. He assures me he's never had a PA. He also has an issue getting too close to OW when they're "just friends". He and I agree this is a major issue. He promises he is done with Tinder & all the dating sites. We discuss his living situation and I suggest he rent a room or apartment as a "bug out" place while we decide if we want to R or S. I still want to R. Hysterical bonding.

8/7 - I leave with D16 and her cousin for vacation. He goes and signs a 12 month lease on a $$$$$ riverfront condo. I never specified WHERE he needed to live, but figured if it was just for "bugging out", then he'd consider renting a room or a relatively cheap one bedroom...not leasing a $2,300 a month, 2 bedroom, riverfront condo.
He decides to fly down and join us for a couple days of vacation. We get along, but after finding out about the condo, I'm once again heartbroken. He doesn't know if he wants to R. After returning home, he begins to spend time after work and on the weekends setting up his bachelor pad, but never officially moves out.
Since 7/25, he no longer is transparent - all phone passcodes have been changed and find my iphone is off. If I ask to see his phone, he'll hold it, ask what I want to see, and if he doesn't want me to see it, says "you've invaded my privacy enough" and puts the phone away.

8/15 we have a talk after his IC / day at the condo. His therapist is suggesting we separate. No definitive length of time (he is all over the place...from 2 weeks to a year). He wants to leave the following Saturday (come to find out later b/c he was getting his furniture delivered that week). This is very upsetting to me - he's saying he wants to S but stay another week as he empties out the house and just pretends everything is ok. He says he wants to work on R - be "exclusive", and promises transparency / turning find my iphone back on, etc...but I was adamant that once he closed that door to his condo, what he did was no longer my business and over the next 2-3 days, I make it abundantly clear if he leaves, there is a slim-to-none chance of R. He continues to go and set up the condo, but never leaves. Lots of tears and hysterical bonding.

Labor Day weekend - I discover a notification on his work phone from Tinder with a code for accessing an account. I confront him and he blows up. Swears he hasn't been on Tinder (this is a LIE), I'm invading his privacy, controlling his life, etc...He gets a couple things together and says he's going to the condo for the weekend. I get on bended knee, tears streaming, full codependent/pick me mode, begging him to stay. I tell him the notification was probably a mistake - maybe even a scam...please don't leave. He tells me he needs "time to cool off", he's staying at the condo overnight, and leaves - tells me I can join him to go on a trip Sunday if I want. I had enough. Something about the whole situation struck me as odd (OW? Time with COW? Trying to hook up with a Tinder date? idk and probably never will) and so I decide I can't have him walk in and out of my life like this and I'm done. He left and as far as I was concerned, can stay permanently at his condo. I block him on social media and on my phone. I pack all his extra crap up and it still sits in a laundry basket in the spare bedroom.

Again, I have absolutely no idea what occurred between him walking out of the house around 1p and his return at 9:30p that night, except I blocked him from being able to contact me. He walks in and I ask what he's doing there and he says "its my house too". We proceed to fight. Around 11:00 I'm done and told him so - that I'd blocked him...want to go NC (for awhile) and that it's best to separate. Wasn't this what he wanted 2 weeks ago?? He threatens to kill himself (again) and leaves - slamming the door hard enough to crack the frame and screaming tires off into the night. This time, I go to bed...until my oldest texts me and sends me a message from her dad that says "Bye". He's also texted D16 and his sister. Now I'm scared and his sister and I agree he's super unstable and we should call the police. As he's threatened to drive the wrong way down a major highway and I'm unsure if he's got a gun, he is listed as an endangered missing person. The most f***ed up thing about this is the WHOLE time he's been sitting 200 yards away, watching the whole scene unfold. About 2 hours after everything started, an officer spots him down the street. He is once again confronted, and is completely sane and rational. Explains we had a fight and I "overreacted" so he was going to sleep in his truck down the street. The police didn't have enough to take him to the hospital for a 24.00 hour hold, tell him to get a hotel, and I try to go back to bed around 2:30am

He comes back home around 4am - more tears, he's a big f-up, he's not sleeping and having horrible flashbacks all the time and needs help. I immediately go into codependent fix-it mode. He agrees to call his doctor in the morning for an emergency psych appointment. He does speak to a therapist, but the psychiatrist can't talk to him for 5 days and he ends up cancelling the appointment. Truthfully, he goes back to "normal" by Tuesday - after 2 days of hysterical bonding.

9/28 - he's been super distant again. Against my better judgement, I unlock his work phone and discover he's spent 31% of his time on that phone on Tinder (shocker ) and the Photo's are full of more screen shots of various scantily clad women and their profiles. His Google search history shows he's been researching "polyamory"!?

I confront him and I get blamed for him being on Tinder. He comes at me twice, arm cocked and hand in fist, acting like he'll strike me. I've been too controlling and haven't been loving enough. Then I get to hear about his "problem", his sex addiction stemming from being abused as a child, and how I don't understand what he's going through.
He even gives me an ultimatum, Tinder or porn.
I get told him being on Tinder and keeping screen shots of these women and profiles "isn't a big deal"...and that he isn't talking to them, so I should be more understanding.

I've been asking him to leave for two days. He tells me he doesn't have to go anywhere and I can leave if I want. Now he's telling me he's sublet the condo to someone. I ask to see the proof and he flashes an email from the condo association at me without letting me read it. He's lying.

Last night I started gray rocking as much as I could, but I have some outstanding issues, such as the fact he's still living at the house and he has the spare key fob to my new car. Replacing it would be $600+ - also the fact he's proven himself mentally unstable and could decide to steal it / wreck it.

I keep running the mantra "hes a POS" through my head when I'm tempted to try and have a discussion about the why's of what is happening. I'm not stupid, he's in the end stages of discard, but he's still getting something out of refusing to leave the marital home (control? security?). I'm kicking myself now for not going through with S back in mid-August :( I wasn't ready.

End notes:
- I did retain an attorney back in July but it was a sh*t-show. She tried to pressure me into $30k+ legal fees to take WH to court for infidelity. Then when I told her I wasn't interested in that, and only wanted her to look over / discuss the separation agreement ($2500), didn't contact me for 2 weeks. I asked for my remaining retainer back and haven't tried to do another consultation.
- I know if he doesn't leave soon, I will have to lawyer up again and probably spend $$$$$ to get him out of the house. I feel like I am more solid ground with proof he was on Tinder, the text messages with the OW from Tinder, and 2 police reports on file. (These things all occurred AFTER I cancelled the contract and got my remaining retainer back)
- He only had the one week of true love bombing / remorse and a handful of other nights where he made dinner or did the dishes.
- yes, the violence is VERY concerning. No, I did not call the police when he threatened to strike me Tuesday night.
- He is mentally unstable and needs help, which is another reason I am really trying to gray rock
- I am hoping between some reverse psychology (separation would be good for HIM, it would get him out from under my thumb, he could live his life, heal, etc), and gray rock he'll take the hint.
- I've messaged HIS therapist about what's happened over the last 4 weeks - he hasn't said if she reached out to him
- He is NOT paying his share of the household bills. I asked for $375 a week and have only received $1,200 total since the 8 weeks since he leased the condo.

About me / my actions through all this:
- I have done my part to keep us in the Chinese finger pull - tears, begging, pleading, asking him not to leave me / abandon me
- There have been times I've tried to say things to make him hurt as bad as he's hurt me, such as constantly reminding him about his Tinder account, or separating his paycheck / not helping with the bills, calling him names (a$$hole, jerk) - I'm not proud of my behavior and have apologized.
- I've talked to him for hours about my feelings / pain. I'm finally realizing he doesn't care
- I am in IC with a good therapist who's been very supportive and doesn't back down from telling me the blunt truth ("he's lying", "he's a master manipulator", "he is showing you who he is through his actions")
- I've been attending Codependents Anonymous meetings since April and am slowly working the steps
- I've read dozens of self help books, including "Cheating in a Nutshell", "Leave a Cheater, Gain a Life", "Attached", "Too Good to Leave, Too Bad to Stay", "Not Just Friends", "The Drama of the Gifted Child", "The Human Magnet Syndrome", "CoDependent No More", "Complex PTSD" - not to mention dozens of podcasts such as "The Adult Chair" and YouTube channels such as Dr. Ramani's on narcissists.

Whew. He's a mess. I think you should have a VAR on you at all times to capture all the nonsense that he later denies, not only so that others can hear it, but so that you can play it back and get a good reminder of the bullshit when you feel drawn towards HB.

I also think that you should seek legal advice immediately.

Any chance of you swiping the key fob back from him on the sly?

Oh my. Check out the thread right below on strategies on dealing with difficult personalities. And stooooopppp interacting with him. This is not going anywhere good. He's a serial cheater with a nice basket of WTF going on in his brain. You know that you're dealing with an unstable person and that it's making you unstable. That's what they do. Run from this. Divorce is not a bad thing. It's a gift to yourself.

- I have done my part to keep us in the Chinese finger pull - tears, begging, pleading, asking him not to leave me / abandon me

This has to end. This is the equivalent of begging a rattlesnake to cuddle you. You don't really want to be successful.

Anger is a great and wonderful thing when used properly. I don't care what names you've called him (he deserves worse), but that isn't the best use of your anger. Grab hold of it and let it propel you into a life where you aren't being constantly manipulated by your spouse. Be outraged at this treatment. Stand up for yourself. Refuse to accept this in your life.

And hey, this guy isn't going to change. This level of toxic just is what it is. Stop wishing for that in any part of your heart. Disentangle yourself from this. Utilize every ounce of your codependency support group.

I think you should have a VAR on you at all times to capture all the nonsense that he later denies, not only so that others can hear it, but so that you can play it back and get a good reminder of the bullshit when you feel drawn towards HB.

How I wish I'd started doing this back in April when sh*t really started hitting the fan. I started recording our conversation on my phone last night and he got up and left the room.

I also think that you should seek legal advice immediately.

Yah - the situation has drastically changed from July and I need to stop letting one bad experience keep me from doing what needs to be done...and yet, there is still a part of me that's hoping he might just leave / sign the separation agreement (1 year with minor child in our state / U.S.)

Any chance of you swiping the key fob back from him on the sly?

I've already searched all of his clothes and looked in the "normal" spots. I think he has it locked up in his truck. That truck is another bone of contention as the vehicle is in both our names, but he's had my key since April locked in his work truck so I can't use it.

And hey, this guy isn't going to change. This level of toxic just is what it is. Stop wishing for that in any part of your heart. Disentangle yourself from this.

Thanks DD - it's just taking me awhile...I relate to the anxious-avoidant attachment style and also had an emotionally traumatic childhood (neglect / feelings of abandonment). I've been with WH since I was 15 years old (he was 24). I basically left a neglectful childhood for a neglectful & abusive partner / husband.

There is another thread on Trauma Bonding I've been actively following and has been helpful. I discovered trauma bonding on the Reddit subs and immediately thought to myself "holy sh*t! This is what's happening to me!". I'm not trying to let the thought keep me stuck - the opposite honestly. I'm analytical and it's helpful to know this back / forth / love / hate / leave / stay isn't some mental defect and there are things I can do for myself to let go and move on.

[This message edited by hysteria625 at 9:27 PM, Thursday, September 30th]

Oh good! That is a great thread. I said it there but I'll repeat it here. You know this, you're smart. You can fall out of love/obsession with him by making choices in your life. You can walk a path that leads you to not caring about him at all, and that would be like freeing yourself from a prison.

Sometimes you need to look at this as being slowly stabbed to death. First it was a toe, then it was an ankle, then it was a finger, then it was an arm, then it was a leg. Do you see my point that he slowly killing you emotionally and the stress of it is going to kill you physically. You need to get out however you can. He is really not worth anything to you or your well being.

Sometimes you need to look at this as being slowly stabbed to death. First it was a toe, then it was an ankle, then it was a finger, then it was an arm, then it was a leg. Do you see my point that he slowly killing you emotionally and the stress of it is going to kill you physically. You need to get out however you can. He is really not worth anything to you or your well being

.

Yes, like the proverbial frog in the pot. Jump out, sister. It's about to boil over.

I agree with Dee - It's very unlikely that he'll change. He's not well, and who knows what kind of nonsense he'll get up to next. Keep recording. Keep records. Keep screenshots. Get out of there, if you can.

Wow, just Wow.
I am truly sorry this person is treating you this way. He is very abusive.
I hope you can get away from him. You deserve a much better life than this.
Be strong.

You can do this. You CAN. You are stronger than you think you are. You know that this situation is absolutely toxic and that being around him is absolutely terrible for you and your kids. Please remember that they are watching you and learning what to expect and what they deserve in a romantic relationship. They will model Would you want any of this for them? I doubt it.

Go find another lawyer ASAP. Tell the lawyer what you want BEFORE you hand over the $ and tell your story. I promise you not all lawyers will treat you poorly.

Stop with the HB - trust me, I get it (no judgment at all) but you KNOW it’s not helping anything. Do not punish yourself for the past. Right now, focus on the future.

You have got this. 💪🏽

Call a locksmith or AAA to pick the lock to the truck. You're on the title so you're not breaking in.

Call a locksmith or AAA to pick the lock to the truck. You're on the title so you're not breaking in.

I have no reason to - he just doesn't want me driving it...never has. We bought it 2015 and he's always gotten pissy about me asking to drive it, unless it was to take the trash to the dump (which was a chore beneath him, you know, b/c he works so much )

You need to get out however you can. He is really not worth anything to you or your well being.

I'm slowly coming around - or trying to. Leaving just isn't THAT easy. D16 is on the spectrum and I don't want her to have to change schools her junior year of HS. My adult child and partner live in the basement. Housing in our area is absolutely insane right now...crappy 2 bedroom apartments are leasing for $1700 - $1800. I also have an elderly, dying dog and 2 cats that would also have to come with us. I get that these all sound like excuses - maybe they are...but it's why I wanted HIM to leave.

Check out the thread right below on strategies on dealing with difficult personalities.

I've been following that one too. There is some great advice. I'm also going to be very truthful and say that reading that thread almost makes me feel like I HAVE blown my situation out of proportion. While I may be in a FOG about him having PA(s), my gut still says he hasn't. That doesn't make the EA, Tinder account, and other treatment any less abusive, or mean I shouldn't be working on ending the M - or at least separating for my own mental health - but wow, my heart goes out to her and those children.

I didn't stay gray rock. I checked his phone early this morning and found out he's changed all his passcodes, again. I confronted him as he got ready for work.

- called him an f'n asshole
- asked him to please leave, he has a place to go

He claims he has sublet the condo but refuses to show me the proof, so I'm 99% certain he is lying.

He is blaming me for his sex addiction / tinder obsession b/c I "made him go to therapy". Apparently everything was fine until he went to therapy and started talking about his childhood abuse.

He says "I don't understand" his addiction. I told him I don't have to - that he needs to work through that with his therapist / maybe even a psychiatrist, but that he didn't need to stay with me knowing he won't stop hurting me. Also, knowing he could hurt me even worse by getting an STD if/when he decides to follow through.

Says I'm not taking our marriage vows seriously - that we said "for better or worse" and that he stood beside me when I went through a couple years of alcohol abuse (mostly binging on the weekends), but now I won't stay by him while he works through his sex addiction. I got completely clean on my own in 2015 - he never said one word about it and most of the time, was drinking WITH me. Not that this excuses my behavior, but he could've left, or told me I needed help.

I have to keep reminding myself he's just going to keep twisting everything to suit his narrative.

I have to remind myself to PAUSE, and not engage.

I have to STOP CARING about what he is / isn't doing.

I think you need an attorney to help you figure out the condo/financial stuff, and to help get him out of the house. I don't know how separation agreements work, but I think they address living arrangements, and certainly financial support, etc.

I understand that you're all twisted up emotionally, but if you start handling the business end of things I think you'll feel a lot better.

You are not blowing anything out of proportion. If anything, I am concerned you are under-reacting. This is a very very bad situation. He is mentally abusing you. He is committing financial abuse.

Gently, he has leased a fancy f*ckpad that he has furnished but has no intention of living in- he is spending a his time on Tinder, if he’s not having success he is likely using prostitutes. For your physical (and mental safety) you absolutely need to stop having sex with this man.

Please please please lawyer up and try to minimize your interactions with him.

You CAN do this.

Old timer here. Have seen just about every scenario in my 13 years here.

1. Stop sleeping with him. Doing that just creates confusion for your mind and body. It makes you feel bonded to him and right now thats the last thing you need.

2. Get a lawyer. You need to find out the rules in your state most dont care whose name is on the title of cars and so forth. They are generally considered marital property. Learn your rights and FILE.

3. Get a VAR. Keep it on you at all times. If he has threatened to harm you once he will do it again. When he does you walk away lock yourself in a room. Call the police and file charges. This gives you something to have a reason to ask for sole use of the home.

4. When you start to doubt how dysfunctional this relationship is remember he was a grown as man when he started a relationship with a MINOR!!! 24 and 15 is a far too large if gap in age for a healthy relationship. There's a ton of maturation that occurs between 15-20. He was 4 years past that.

In the meantime stop interacting with him as much as you can. He isn't fixable and clearly doesn't have interest in dealing with his real issues. The less you talk to him the better off you are.

I reached out to 3 law offices this afternoon - one contacted me immediately and the first available is next Thursday for *another $350 consultation. The situation is SO drastically different now than it was in July when I last spoke with a lawyer but idk if it changes anything (ie, getting him out of the house) so I'll be curious what I can do to get things going.

A separation agreement would state living arrangements, financial agreements, how we plan to split the equity in the house / debt / retirement savings / etc...I have a draft drawn up that he's verbally agreed to but it means absolutely jack-shit if he won't sign.

I found out this afternoon he has spent over $10,000 furnishing his bachelor pad, on CREDIT. I'm NOT going to poke the bear with this information, but holy shit it was a massive wake up call that I've got to protect my ass ASAP.

If I can't get him to go to his condo, I'm going to borrow my oldest child's air mattress and set myself up in the spare bedroom starting tonight. The thought of sleeping with him anymore makes me sick (and sad).

I think I REALLY f***ed up not separating back in August...I'm terrified I'm going to be on the hook for 50% of this debt he's racked up over the last 8 weeks...and even though I'm not on the lease to the condo, if he stops paying the bills, am I on the hook for 50% of that too??? A lawyer should be able to help me understand...but given his current mental status, I'm not sure he'll sign a separation agreement anyway :(

I've been following that one too. There is some great advice. I'm also going to be very truthful and say that reading that thread almost makes me feel like I HAVE blown my situation out of proportion. While I may be in a FOG about him having PA(s), my gut still says he hasn't. That doesn't make the EA, Tinder account, and other treatment any less abusive, or mean I shouldn't be working on ending the M - or at least separating for my own mental health - but wow, my heart goes out to her and those children.

Ooh, no. You have not blown this out of proportion. I'm horrified reading what you're dealing with. You know why it doesn't seem as bad to you? You've adapted to a certain level of toxicity. That's what we do, we adapt to our environment. That's how we survive. It's worse than you think it is. When you get out, and I believe you will, you'll be amazed at how bad it really was. Life without this horrible drama is like walking out from smog into a clear blue day. Don't minimize what you're dealing with. This is a five-alarm fire.

Very proud of you for contacting attorneys, and for making a plan to sleep elsewhere.

Don't sweat what you can't change. Do your best from this moment forward. XO

If the credit cards are in joint name you may be liable. Speak to your lawyer about having that addressed so it ends up being HIS debt.

Cancel all joint credit cards ASAP.

Put a lock on your credit so no new cards are issued or credit applied for as joint. Immediately.

You need to get in front if this immediately.

All the joint cards are paid off and closed.

Bank accounts separate.

Fingers crossed that lawyering up protects me going forward and they have good news for me about what he’s already done.

I’d cleaned out the spare bedroom to set up and at least temporarily, he’s taken the hint and left. He wasn’t happy and took some of his guns which makes me nervous but I couldn’t stop him. He also took all his clothes and bath stuff. He texted and said he’d be back Sunday but I asked that we discuss an extended separation. I didn’t get a response.

You’re doing a great job. Keep it up.