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westofboston

It’s been just over a month since I learned of the affair, but my wife now tells me she refuses to discuss the affair any longer because it happened long ago and it’s too emotionally difficult for her to discuss. WTF! Just like 2004-2009, it’s apparently all about her needs and wants!

She's lied to you for over a decade. This is about you - your needs and your wants. If she's not willing to address that then you need to divorce her. She has abused you, gaslit you, and betrayed you for a decade and a half and a month of asking question is too much for her?

Fuck that.

She views you as a safety net.

I know this is scary. I know this isn't what you wanted. You can survive this. Do not lock your life away with someone who is content with abusing you.

westofboston, I am glad you are here but so sorry for the reason you had to find this site.

There is a thread in the "I Can Relate" section of this site titled "For Those Who Found Out Years Later."

It contains people who are in the same boat as you as far as finding out long after the affair had apparently ended.

I know you said the A ended only because he retired but did she end it or did he? Was there any official ending of the A? If he came back into her life today would the A continue?

I want my marriage to work

I think what you want to work is the marriage that you thought you had. The problem is that the marriage and wife you thought you had were both a mirage. Your marriage was full of deceit, lies, half truths, denial and falsehoods.

The faithful wife you thought you had is a woman willing to have sex with another married man while you were facing major health concerns all the while lying to your face when you suspected and then continuing to lie for the next 12 years.

I’m just not sure if ‘wanting’ will be enough, though

I understand that you want to save the marriage but unless your WW is will to do all the hard work there would appear as though there is nothing to save.

I can’t imagine growing older feeling the way I’ve been feeling over the past month

I am afraid that now you knowing a portion of the truth will only make you feel worse in the next few months/years. That is until you know everything and she is willing to start helping you heal.

I just don’t know how to deal with the depth of her lies, betrayal and deceit

All of us here just knew that our spouses would never betray us the way they did.

There is a lot of good information on this thread and in the healing library but the only true way to get past this is to go through it.

If your WW is not willing to go through it with you, see the pain she is causing you and help you heal, then there may not be room for her in your life when you reach the other side.

my wife now tells me she refuses to discuss the affair any longer because it happened long ago and it’s too emotionally difficult for her to discuss

It may have been 12 years in her past but your WW's betrayal is now part of you present day life.

You might consider directing her to this site as a WW or at least to another similar site where the FWS will not have any of her self-entitlement but will help to set her straight.

I truly feel for you. The lesson to be learned by everyone is to follow your gut and don't rug sweep anything. I rug swept and paid for it down the line. I don't know how you could ever get over such a monstrous betrayal. You are 64. If you are healthy and in good shape, don't let your age stop you from leaving. If you aren't, get in as good shape as possible physically. If you feel finances will devastate you and you must stay simply for that reason, I would go find a girlfriend. Tell your wife it's no longer any of her business what you do. Tell her the marriage has been returned to a marriage of convenience, the same status she treated it during her affair. Maybe this is terrible advice, but honestly, you owe this person nothing. Maybe you can find a rich widow and dump your sorry ass wife. That is what she deserves. I apologize for my anger seeping through but these people are simply disgusting and deserve no consideration. Do whatever is right for you. Her welfare is irrelevant. Finally, track down the AP POS and tell his wife. Make your miserable WW help you find him.

She does not believe you will leave or show her any consequences. Have divorce papers drawn up. Let her know you are going to talk to a lawyer. Then do it. Begin to pull away. Ask her to sleep in another room. Stop doing things that she loves. If you have friends spend more time with them. All this is designed to get her attention. She really needs IC to figure out her issues. If she changes her tone insist on this. Listen to the advice you get from the folks here. They know what they are talking about. You don’t have to actually file for divorce although you are justified. Find your anger and use it. Good luck.

Ah man. Happy retirement.

Your wife - selfish, sneaky, cruel, abusive, liar.

5 years, she's a very good cheater and liar.

So many questions - this her only affair? STDS - do I have any, does she? She still in contact with this clown? Why didn't she leave me (answer probably is she's a selfish cake eater). How do I move forward? Who is her boyfriend right now?

How can she now be so dismissive of my need to discuss this? Answer: she's embarrassed her ass has been caught red-handed. And now you're tarnishing all the love-feels memories of her tawdry affair. This was her secret thing, now you've butted in.

Tell the other man's wife. It's the decent thing to inform her, but I think just as much to drop a bomb on the other man.

You have kids? I think I'd tell them, your marriage is now on shaky grounds they should know.

So sorry man. Look after yourself. Don't take any shit from her, she's dumped on you enough.

I can’t comprehend...

I can’t comprehend...

I can’t comprehend...

I can’t comprehend......so f’ing much!

Yeah, it is a case of mind = blown isn't it?

Everything you listed, you've seen out in the world with other people. There is nothing new. Heck, you've seen worse. It is comprehensible when you see it out there. You watch the news, see a similar report, and think, "Yup, douchebag" and go back to checking your email.

What makes it incomprehensible is when you try to align it with the person you know. When those don't align, then you say, "I can't comprehend..."

So here's what needs to happen. Every time you get ready to think "I can't comprehend..." you need to immediately replace it with "I don't know her"

Every.Single.Time

How could she do that? It's easy. She could do that, because that is who she is. Just being true to her nature.

Not who you thought she was....who she actually is.

The advice on the 180 given above, it is critical. Taking a step back and just seeing with new eyes. Un-knowing who you thought she was. Actually seeing who she is. Believe what she showed you too.

She is not who you thought she was

She is showing who she is

Sending strength!

If you have children, you should get a DNA test to determine if they are actually your children.

This man is 64. His wife was 47 at the time of the affair. He doesn’t mention any children. I think he could do the math and deduce whether that is an issue. He’s in agony.

And here come the burn the witch gang to tell him to DNA test his children. Children that could have been adults when this affair happened.

There’s a lot of good advice here, but can we stop throwing out the "DNA test your kids" at every single damn betrayed husband?

Why on earth WOULDN'T you DNA test your kids if it turned out you got cheated on?

There's literally no downside to it unless you believe in wayward thinking logic like "As long as you don't know they aren't your kids you will treat them like blood."

Why on earth WOULDN'T you DNA test your kids if it turned out you got cheated on?
There's literally no downside to it unless you believe in wayward thinking logic like "As long as you don't know they aren't your kids you will treat them like blood."

There’s a lot of reasons a 64 year old man whose wife had an affair 15+ years ago at age 47 wouldn’t DNA test his kids. Among those reasons, just spitballing here:
1. The kids were fucking twenty+ years old when she had an affair.
2. He’d rather not humiliate their mother just to satisfy the question of paternity concerning kids that he did in fact raise.
3. He’d rather not blow up the family unit as it exists even if there is a real chance that he is not the biological father.
4. He is undecided about his next steps, whether to attempt to reconcile or divorce, and in neither event is paternity a particularly relevant issue to that initial decision unless somehow this 47 year old woman begat children who are still minors.
5. Shall I go on?

[This message edited by Wiseoldfool at 10:05 PM, Wednesday, April 14th]

W.o.Fool,

Can’t you understand the concept that a known cheater could have well cheated previously? And also, perhaps even more importantly, the DNA test serves to send a strong message to the WW that she has nuked all trust for the ENTIRE marriage, and that the BS won’t even trust her with this.

And really?? The advice to seek a DNA test is strictly part of the "burn the witch" crowd? Wow. Perhaps a better question is: why are you a part of the "rescue the victim damsel in distress" crowd for a WW who had a FIVE YEAR EA/PA ? Oh that poor poor woman!

Seems sexist to me to view a 64 yr old grown ass woman as a victim of her own choices. She’s not a child.

It may seem like you have the truth and know the extent of her affair activity, but cheaters always lie when caught. When caught cheaters give a painful, but ALWAYS a partial story. Sometimes they will slowly provide more facts, but its usually a painful and grueling process - called "trickle truth".

Cheaters have their reasons, but whatever the reasons, the result is you are likely facing more trauma. Just be ready, keep calm, know that you're in a process and there will likely be no easy and quick story. Cheaters just don't behave that way, none of them behave that way. As sure as the sky is blue, cheaters lie about the extent of their affairs. The emotional and physical facts are minimized or outright lied about.

Lots of good advice here on how to proceed, my only advice is to get your mind oriented around the idea that there won't be one cure-all conversation, one sit down with all the facts, or one confessional that answers everything. Even if she were willing, its not even possible. So stay strong, focus on your own health and well being, tackle the affair only as you are able.

1. The kids were fucking twenty+ years old when she had an affair.

The affair that we know of. There could be more. He just found out his wife has been lying to him for 17 years. Why not 37?

2. He’d rather not humiliate their mother just to satisfy the question of paternity concerning kids that he did in fact raise.

Humiliate whom? How? She lied and cheated. She chose that. He isn't humiliating her. Exposure is extremely common to recommend.

3. He’d rather not blow up the family unit as it exists even if there is a real chance that he is not the biological father.

I can almost understand this. If he has NO intention to cut his kids out of his life, why should he do something that might turn them against their mother. It goes along with your previous question in terms of "is exposure by the BS bad?" The answer to that is generally no. But it can be a personal choice. I only revealed my wife's affair to people I was pretty sure would support me, AND if I chose to R and they didn't approve I could comfortably cut out of my life.

4. He is undecided about his next steps, whether to attempt to reconcile or divorce, and in neither event is paternity a particularly relevant issue to that initial decision unless somehow this 47 year old woman begat children who are still minors.

This is actually extremely relevant to his decision. Did she cheat more than this time or not? This can't confirm there wasn't more cheating (can't prove a negative). It could reveal more cheating. It's nice to get 100% confidence in something this important when you are thrown into doubting the entire history of your marriage.

5. Shall I go on?

I'd be happy to continue rebutting until the end of time, because I think it is solid advice. Almost to the point that I wish DNA tests were routine for all fathers and no one was thought to be an untrusting asshole for wanting one. Men are more likely to raise a kid that isn't theirs than they are to get testicular cancer, but we all screen for that don't we?

I’m quite sure that the destruction of trust message can be adequately delivered without involving what could be adults with their own kids, for now. Separation, filing for divorce, the 180, any number of other things are quite clear indications of that.

I had absolutely nothing to say about saving this woman from her own choices. I’m not in the least bit urging any attempt to salvage this marriage. I’m not, as you said, part of the "save the damsel" gang. She has done a horrible thing and she is doing a horrible thing by being recalcitrant about the horrible thing she did. She doesn’t deserve "saving." Not yet anyway.

I had no criticism of any of the advice given here except for this one piece in this case where it definitely does not need to be the highest priority for this man in these moments. It might become a good idea, but it just does not need to be on the top five list of things to do today. One cannot unring that bell, but there are a lot of reasons one might regret having rung it because the mantra of the burn the witch crowd demands it.

People need to read what I wrote and not read into what I wrote.

I did not tell this man that he should NEVER resort to to a DNA test.

I said perhaps today it is not the highest priority, and that perhaps the facts of any given affair and marriage should matter. There is no cookie cutter solution that works for everyone.

I almost DNA tested my kids after D-Day. It was a perfectly reasonable response to a crazy set of facts and revelations. The chances that my kids are not mine are extremely low. They look like me and have a couple of facial characteristics only I could pass on. But STILL I thought about it.

Like TIF says, I think it probably should be a default for almost every single newly betrayed husband, almost maybe a new norm that a WW should expect after cheating.

Every BH can decide in their own unique circumstance, but probably the default should be to lean toward a paternity test - just as we would say it typically makes sense for a BH to at least talk to an attorney about divorce and understand the process.

Among other things, it drives home to the WW just how serious and transgressive and abusive their actions have been (which this WW, by her own words, certainly does not seem to yet comprehend).

[This message edited by Thumos at 4:48 PM, April 14th (Wednesday)]

A lot of what happens after the initial confrontation is data gathering and safety seeking. Trying to figure out what is and isn't true. When did the lying start, and what was the extent. There are many ways to go about this. For example, written timeline and polygraph. Also commonly recommended. DNA test, STD test, etc. These are about generally more about confirming further harm hasn't been done.

The fact of the matter is a BS has to go back to the beginning of the relationship and figure out if anything was amiss and when because they just found out they have been betrayed by the person they love most. She should be desperate to prove she could ever be trusted again. Like almost every WS ever, she want's to rugsweep.

Wiseoldfool:

I get what you are saying and I agree, absent more evidence that there was further cheating at a time when children were conceived, I find the recommendation for DNA testing of children in this case pretty silly. But further info may prove different. The OP can take the advice that he can use and leave the rest.

Maybe it's because I'm not old enough. When I read thread about people being lied to for 17 years I get pissed. I was lied to for a few months and it ripped me apart. 17 years guys. I know it's not a record, but this guy has been taken for a ride that can watch Rated R movies without parental permission.

"Adequately delivered" in another way seems unlikely. I don't think that westofboston's feelings could ever be adequately delivered.

Speaking of which, I'm sorry you are here OP. Try to take care of yourself. Eat well, drink water, try to get sleep.

It's certainly not bonkers or vindictive in the least if the OP actually wants a paternity test. That said, if he thinks his children are his, it's also not vital.

After nearly two decades of falsehood, he's certainly entitled to wonder about such things.

As an example, consider the SOP advice that BH's should VAR up after D-Day as insurance against false DV charges perpetrated by a WW. Is it likely in every case? Certainly not.

I'm sure glad I remained VAR'd up after D-Day. Along with every other stunning revelation, I never would have believed my WW would have been capable of such duplicity. But there I was one night, trying to talk to her about giving me the truth, and she flinched back acting as if was going to hit her when I forcefully but calmly and quietly told her to tell me truth. I hadn't lifted a finger, but the histrionic reaction she gave me was yet another eye opening revelation.

I told her not to even try to suggest that I would ever abuse her in any way, and that I was documenting everything should she ever try such a duplicitous gambit.

She never tried it again.

Word to the wise.

Why on earth WOULDN'T you DNA test your kids if it turned out you got cheated on?

Assuming the kids (are there kids?) are adults, it’s not his decision to make. It is theirs.