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I think I may have fucked up. She has acting the complete opposite of what everyone said she would. Which makes me think that she genuinely is remorseful.

Please describe her behavior that you consider "remorse".

Calm down, deep breaths.

First of all, it is not at all unusual for people in your wife's situation to try a variety of different tactics. They'll try anger, if that doesn't work they'll try crying, if that doesn't work they'll try making their partner jealous, and so on. We were just cautioning you to be very careful of believing her if she went immediately to the "I love you so much let me make it all better" route, which is a common tactic.

Second, in what way have you fucked up? If you just asked for a divorce in order to get her to change her behavior, then yes, you fucked up when you did that. You ask for a divorce when you're fully prepared to go through with it. You may hope that it will shock your WS into attempting true reconciliation, but if divorce is the only option they give you for getting out of infidelity, then that's how it goes. If her reaction to this news is something like "fine with me", then divorce is your best option, however painful that may be.

Why don't you tell us a bit about how she reacted? What did she say?

Stay calm.

If she really is is remorseful then she will stay that way.

You can always decide later to not D.

Stay your course for now, watch what she does for the next week or two.

Which makes me think that she genuinely is remorseful

Seems like that doesn't it? Lots of tears. Crying. Promising to make it up to you. Promises to do whatever it takes to get you to stay. Committing to IC, MC and anything else you want. And it feels like...YES...she finally gets it!

Question...where was this before? Where was this total commitment to saving the marriage a few days/weeks ago? What an amazing transformation. From a person who cheats 4 months into a marriage to a remorseful model "fWW"

Notice how it only popped up when you put your foot down? Its called Love Bombing. Look it up. Seriously google it. You will notice that many of the articles reference sociopaths and narcissist individuals. Why? This is one of their go to techniques.

She is trying to get you to back down. And her best weapon at this point is emotional manipulation. If you back down she will never really respect you, and you will be back here again in the future. Doing this same dance with her.

Stay strong.

[This message edited by ramius at 10:22 PM, February 6th (Monday)]

What makes me think that she is being remorseful is the fact that she hasn't really done anything that anybody has suggested she would or has guessed that she did. She was crying a little, not a lot, and she wasn't begging for me to take her back.

She mentioned that she was disappointed that I wasn't giving our relationship another chance. And honestly, I never thought of it like that. Which is why I feel like I fucked up asking for a divorce. She has told me that she genuinely just wants me to be happy and that she is sorry for what she did.

When she was packing everything up and we were going through who gets what, she broke down at anything that reminded her of all the good times we had together. And I have to be honest, I didn't show it but I was breaking down inside being reminded of all those good memories as well. I am truthfully starting to think that the good times were so good that they outweigh what she did. The good memories are so good that it makes me not even care if she were to cheat on me again.

Which I know that sounds crazy, but that's what true love does to some of us.

The good memories are so good that it makes me not even care if she were to cheat on me again.

No. Just no. Stop.

If you decide that you want to not get divorced, that's your call. We can advise against it, because frankly there's very little in your story that would give anyone hope that she's going to be a faithful, trustworthy, safe spouse for the next 30 years; but if you decide you want to try to reconcile, we will do what we can to help you maximize your chances of a successful reconciliation.

And that cannot happen if you have the mindset that what she did wasn't all that bad. That you should just deal with it. That you should put it behind you. That-- God forbid-- you should tolerate it again.

Understand what I'm saying. I'm not talking about justice, or morality, or any other nebulous concept. I'm talking very concretely about maximizing your chances of getting true reconciliation. And that cannot happen if you're thinking that way.

If you decide not to follow through on the divorce, there are some very concrete, time-tested steps and requirements that have been proven over and over again to give you the best possible chances of successful R. You can read about them in the Healing Library, and we can talk to you about them.

To be clear, I and most other people in this thread think that your best chance for happiness is to get divorced. Based on the information we have, your wife seems like she's damaged in a way that make her an unsafe partner. I am not advising you to attempt R. But if you do decide to, please follow the successful script; don't just decide you'll put up with her behavior because you love her or because you remember the good times.

No it doesn't sound crazy, it sounds like heartbreak.

Been there man, I know, but I would still D if my WW refused to end her A.

She knew I was going to burn both of their worlds down to the ground, complete scortched earth, if she continued the A, and then I would still D when I was done...I was not going to be plan B.

Yeah just slow down and don't evaluate things based on her initial reaction. The decision you just made is not final papers. Stick to your guns man and give it some time.

I know it hurts like hell. But don't forget the hell you were already in.

Detach, detach, detach. Continue with your plan for now, and judge her actions, not words.

Incoming 2x4

So I rushed upstairs and into the apartment and went into the room freaking the fuck out and repeating over and over "why'd you cheat on me?"

Since I found out last night, she has revealed that that night a week ago, she didn't stay at her friend's house that we had been invited to but stayed at the guy friend's apartment. They didn't have sexual intercourse but he gave her a hand if you know what I mean and a little bit of oral. She says she stopped him from giving her oral when he started. She has also revealed that they have been sexting over the entire last week.

I bet she didn't get weepy over that memory of your 4 month marriage.

She mentioned that she was disappointed that I wasn't giving our relationship another chance. And honestly, I never thought of it like that.

Of course you didn't think of it like that... because it's crazy. She's disappointed IN YOU?

Proceed with caution, I think she has quite a ways to go be genuinely remorseful.

ihatechoosinga, the last post you put up, smacks of manipulation on your wife's part.

She knows what buttons to push to make you feel guilty. By reminiscing whilst packing, she is drawing you back into her web, by playing on your emotions for her. Mindfvckkery at work.

If you are keen on overlooking her A, then you can continue putting her on a pedestal. If you want to get out of infidelity, then you will need to take off your rose-tinted glasses, and face reality. Either decision will have an impact of the quality of life you will have in your future.

The pedestal version of your future will possibly have you put your head into the sand, and believe/agree everything your WW tells you, with your self-esteem shot, and your integrity non-existent. All choices will no longer be yours, and you will have no control over your life.

If you take off the glasses, you would have control over your life again. What you make of it from then on, will depend on you. There is a whole world to explore.

She has not really shown any real indication of remorse, but is just giving you little performances of the great acting she is capable of.

180 180 180

No. Just no. Stop.

^^^ This x1000

Oh Man I want to grab hold of you and give you a metaphorical slap!

You do realise that what you are suggesting is that you are now willing to live in an open marriage that has been forced on you by your WW? Yes I'm sure that will lead to a lifetime of marital bliss!

What you are doing is mental gymnastics with yourself to try and alleviate your heartbreak.

Be aware of the difference between regret and remorse. What has she actually done or started to do to show you remorse?

Gently..but I believe you probably have some co-dependency and self esteem issues. Welcome to the club!

The more of your posts I read the more I'd recommend downloading the 'No More Mr Nice Guy' pdf.

Be open minded as to her recent display of what you call 'remorse' but please don't allow yourself to be manipulated by behaviour that is NOT remorse.

Whilst I was writing, RocketRaccoon has posted exactly the same sentiments a few minutes ago.

Maybe, totally independently of each other, we've both managed to read the situation completely wrongly.

What do you think?

[This message edited by sillyoldsod at 3:23 AM, February 7th (Tuesday)]

I don't know where you live that you can't file for divorce until after a year of separation, but if I were you I'd look into having the marriage annulled. The rules may be different.

You definitely sound like you have co-dependent tendencies, so you might want to read up on that. I'm a recovered co-dependent and learning about this and fixing it has changed my life. Those of us who fall on the Co-D spectrum tend to forgive quickly, believe ongoing lies, want to fix things, second guess themselves, give others the benefit of the doubt, make up rationalizations about why things don't suck as much as they seem to, or won't suck as much as they are likely to, make excuses for others bad behavior and even blame ourselves for others bad choices.

Remorse is so vastly different than regret or sorrow, or fear. I never got remorse. I got all kinds of other behavior and words masquerading as remorse. But I never got words that let me know how badly WS felt about what he'd done to ME, and how dedicated he was going to be about repairing that damage. Every time he came close I would fill in the blanks, and practically coach him on what to say to make me feel better. I was the one who wanted to keep the marriage together, he was the one who wanted me to get over it. When I told his mom, he decided he hated me. He couldn't handle that there were consequences for him, including that he was going to have to be ashamed of what he did.

I don't think I have ever recommended D in any of my posts and I am still in R two years after the discovery of my WW's A.

But in your case, it's so soon after M and you have so few entanglements that to me it seems the much better option. You are on an emotional roller coaster right now and things that seem reasonable to you now do not seem reasonable to those of us looking at your story with the (unfortunate) gift of experience.

Of course this will be painful but this is your chance to unburden yourself of a person who sounds high likely to let you down again and in doing so will cause you a world of pain.

Stay strong, put yourself first and make a new life that gives you what you deserve.

She was crying a little, not a lot, and she wasn't begging for me to take her back

any talk with you could have been defiant, regretful, or remorseful with some permutations possible between them. shes regretful.

She mentioned that she was disappointed that I wasn't giving our relationship another chance.

4 months ago you got married. 1 week ago she was blowing this guy while he fingers her. and shes disappointed in you??? you dont see the irony in that statement? it reeks of self entitlemented.

She has told me that she genuinely just wants me to be happy and that she is sorry for what she did.

this is a glimmer that maybe there is something there to work with ... but then she comes out with

When she was packing everything up and we were going through who gets what, she broke down at anything that reminded her of all the good times we had together.

which is blatantly emotional manipulation. this is not remorse. remorse is her putting your needs first. not trying to manipulate you.

The good memories are so good that it makes me not even care if she were to cheat on me again....Which I know that sounds crazy, but that's what true love does to some of us.

this is quasi stockholm syndrom thinking. if you really feel this way then why not carry it to the logical conclusion. let her have her boyfriend. you all can divide times and organize schedules so she can see both of you. if you are both happy with that, why not. but its got to be transparent and agreed to by both parties. you okay with your wife having a boyfriend or two?

if so, tell her. im sure she would be overjoyed at the "peace in our time" compromise. but if you arent willing to accept her having a boyfriend then you dont accept it.

Stop stop stop

You need to make a wise decision. Wise decisions are not made emotionally. Right now it doesn't matter if she is remorseful or regretful (though these are important data points you will need later)

Right now you need to get out of infidelity (you haven't assured this yet) and to buy you some time to temper those emotions so that you can start making decisions.

kusy slow slow slow down. Read the advice from people here. Don't rush to make any decisions. Implement 180z

I'm sorry for going crazy. You all are right. When I look back at the 180 that I did for just one day (yesterday) she was getting really pushy and upset with me. And I think I would be lying to myself if I didn't say that we weren't co-dependent on each other to at least a small extent.

She said that it happened because she felt lonely and felt like I wasn't giving her any attention or spending any time with her because I am always studying for school. She honestly said a bunch of other stuff but in the end it kept coming back to the fact that I wasn't paying enough attention to her.

My side of the story. Before I went back to school, I asked her more than once if she was okay with it. I told her multiple times that I would have to study a lot (I am taking prerequisites right now to apply for PT school. So I don't even have as much school work now as I will when I get into PT school). She was fully supportive. She is very needy, so I even asked her if she would be able to make it through me having to study so much. She assured me that she would be fine. I have even asked her a few times since I have started going back to school if she is okay with me having to study so much. She has assured me she was okay most of the times I have asked. On a couple of occasions she said she wanted to spend time with me. I would respond by saying okay let's go do something and each time she would respond by insisting that I study because "school is more important."

You know that's a bullshit excuse, right? But, let's say we take it at face value and in order to keep your WW from cheating on you, you need to be dancing attendance on her 24/7 and making sure she feels like a special snowflake at all times.

Are you really prepared to do that?

You're right, PT school is challenging and competitive. There are long lists of students hoping to take your place if you quit or fail.

So, let's say you give up your dream in order to keep your WW happy. You do understand that no matter where you end up job-wise, you're going to look back on what might have been and have regrets. Every time you feel dissatisfaction with the daily grind, you're going to wonder if you wouldn't have been happier being a PT, and eventually, you will hate her for it.

Life's challenges don't stop at work though. If she can't handle you going to school, how will she handle the REAL stresses of life? What if you have to work long hours to make ends meet? What if you have a special needs child?.. or a life-changing illness? There are many seasons in a long life. So many changes.

It sounds to me like you are both pretty young. It's possible that she just isn't mature enough yet to make a lifelong commitment. And it's also been a very short time since you found out about all this. You haven't had time to absorb the shock.

I'm not saying whether you should or shouldn't divorce your WW. What I am saying is that YOU need to be the focus of your attention just now. As you process this new information and make decisions on the future course of your life, you need to do so in the context of what's singularly best for YOU. I know that might sound selfish and counter-intuitive at the moment, but it's what needs to happen.

If we take her excuse as gospel, what she's telling you essentially is that she's not mature enough to be a good life partner right now. Not to scare you.. but some people never do attain that level of emotional maturity. So if you throw your own dreams away, you are quite likely to regret it, either in resentment later in life or should emotional maturity never come to fruition with her.

To refrain from putting your needs first after this revelation sets you up for disappointment later in life. My advice, whether you stay married or not, is to avoid caving in to demands that you put others ahead of yourself just now. Your WW's arguments may sound rational, so might your MC's. But if they run counter to what you REALLY want, don't feel bad about rejecting them and being true to yourself.

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 6:39 AM, February 7th (Tuesday)]

I'm sorry for going crazy.

Buddy stop apologising! You have nothing to apologise to us for. We have all ridden the emotional rollercoaster from hell!

And I think I would be lying to myself if I didn't say that we weren't co-dependent on each other to at least a small extent.

Hmm...maybe research narcissist/co-dependent relationships. No doubt your WW with her psych qualification will be fully aware of that particular relationship dynamic??

There are some fantastic educational videos on YouTube. A good starting point would be to watch anything from Ross Rosenberg.

Knowledge is power!