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VezFromTaz

I doubt from what you are saying there would be a basis for a DV Order (since you were in intimate relationship that would be the correct order, not a RO) in Australia (the basis of an Order varies from State to State, but there has to be DV and risk of further DV). No idea about Canada.

I think I would be able to get a DV in Oz simply because of past behaviour when we lived there. I had the cops come over and it was them that suggested DV counselling. Emotional and psychological as well as financial DV counts. It's not necessarily just physical. However, I'm hoping he will just quit after my letter. If not I'll escalate with a letter from a lawyer.

In any event, I'd suggest not doing it unless there is a real risk of serious harassment because it is fuel for the narc (as you know they love negative attention and being notorious just as much as being drooled over). A very clinical cease and desist letter from a lawyer, not you (which is just more thrills for him), might do the trick,

I know you're likely right. And I've decided that for my own cathartic reasons, I am going to send my one page letter that succinctly tells him things I needed to tell him over the past 30 years. I get that that's not the way to do it, really I do. I just need to do this for me. I never once stood up to him as strongly as I wanted to. I was always way too respectful. And took the high road. But not this one time. I've got over 30 years of things that I needed to say, and I'm saying them. Past that, I'll get a lawyer if he contacts me again.

but I dont think police are allowed to do that anymore (maybe in some small country towns in Oz 🤣).

Get me to those small towns! haha

This type of post separation harassment is so effective because he doesnt even have to do much to trigger psychological distress in you. Ergh.

It's been interesting to see my own reaction. At first I was slightly shocked. Then I kind of had to laugh. Then called a few friends to debrief. One friend made me laugh for hours about it. And then I wrote my letter, (it just flowed out of me...haha) and tomorrow I'm going to send it. So overall, the recovery time is sooooo much faster than it ever was. I'm so glad that it rolled off quickly and I can see the humour. But oh!!! how delicious it's been to write the letter. It has given me so much satisfaction. I've read it over more than a few times!!

Wants to sabotage your trip.

He doesn't know I'm coming to see my daughter. We have one kid in each country. He was visiting my side of the world.

The 1st Wife:

Have your attorney write the no contact letter.

And if he does contact you then get a restraining order.

Thanks for that. Yes, I agree, I'm only adding one more step before going to the lawyer. I'm writing my own little letter...more as therapy, redemption and closure for myself, not for any other reason.

Charity 411

He might be angry at discovering that life went on without him, so he's trying to reassert his existence.

This makes so much sense to me! He's always been jealous of me. My relationships, especially with the kids and now the grandkids. He'd say weird shit like...everyone loves you. I didn't realize his jealousy until I did.

There is usually a trigger that makes people like this resurface. I had a long term relationship with a guy who treated me like garbage but then was relentless in stalking me when I finally ended it.

it was a painting of me, done in the 1800s (yeah, I'm not 200 years old) in Poland (never been there) that was painted telepathically

Thanks for the comedic relief! This made me howl, in resonance because they can be soooo crazy!

What a crazymaking story. I'm really sorry you had to endure this.

Congrats for being able to figure it all out. They are like a very strange mystery. And it's most bizarre to try to get into the head of a narc, isn't it.

On another note, I had the opposite photo experience recently. When my EXH left me 30 years ago pictures of him were the last thing I wanted. He died suddenly about a month ago. When my daughter and his wife, who was the OW, started planning the funeral, they discovered he kept every picture of me and him all those years, all the way back to our first date. In fact, he even had my wedding pictures from my first short lived marriage. My daughter and I were both baffled by it.

. What is it about them and photos? Again, it's all so bizarre. Did yours take photos? Mine hated it. I took them all, over the almost 30 years. Do you have any idea why he kept them?

Crazyblindsided:

he has gone silent. I just don't know for how long

Keep us posted.

I was just thinking what a novel a person can write with all these posts. Life is certainly stranger than fiction!

GraceLove, it was actually his sister, who I loved dearly, that took most of the pictures. She was always with a camera, so both he and I are in almost all of them. I don't really know why he kept them. He left me for the OW and married her, so I can't fathom why he kept them. I have no memory of talking about our photos when we split up. The bizarre thing is that he kept my wedding photos from my first marriage, which ended in a couple of years when I realized he was gay. My daughter now has them all and she's grateful to have them.

I'm glad you got a laugh at the painting episode. At the time I was so freaked out I wasn't sure what to do. When you deal with this kind of crazy you have to try and figure out if what ever you do is going to put a stop to it, or give them a reason to escalate. If I kept it, would he see it as a sign I wanted him back or that it he could see me telepathically through the eyes of the painting? If I tried to return it, would he be waiting for me to pull up and see that as a sign I wanted to see him?

I worked for City Hall so I brought it and the letter to work and showed all my coworkers and asked what they thought I should do. Our City Manager told me to take it to our Police Department, so I brought it to the Chief who happened to be a woman. She thought it was the creepiest thing she'd ever seen and sent one of our officers to give it back to him. Thankfully I haven't heard from him since.

The good news is that he ran for US Congress twice and lost both times. If you google his name his listing in The Encyclopedia of American Loons comes up, and he's labeled "A Blathering Idiot". The only remaining question I have is why in world did I ever allow myself to end up in a relationship with him?

I was thinking about you yesterday, Grace, and one thing occurred to me. When I told off my ex, I simply told him to stop. That his opinion no longer mattered to me, and he had to just stop. I didn't give him any kind of "or else" statements. I didn't tell him what I would do if his behavior continued. I just told him he didn't matter and that I wasn't going to take it anymore.

I think there was some importance to this. If I had said, "...or I'll get an RO on you," that would have been a dare to him, and God knows that bastard can't back down from a dare.

I merely told him I wouldn't take it anymore. I told him very firmly that he didn't matter. I let him figure out that his behavior was bordering on the ridiculous, and I was no longer the quivering ball of fear and hurt that cared about his opinion of me. Clearly, I was no longer the victim. I didn't even need anything further to back me up. I was standing up to him all on my own, and courts and police be damned, he was to KNOOCK IT OFF.

I've since blocked him on my phone and all social media. If I ever receive any mail from him, I'll simply burn it, and send the ashes back to him. (Good luck finding my address - I have since moved 650 miles away!)

He's honestly nothing but a sperm donor to me now. There is nothing that could go on with his life that could affect me in any way. I set a boundary and fully expect him to comply with it. I'd rather have him worry about the consequences than dare him or figure out what they might be for him.

BTW, he is fully unaware that I am now armed, as is my eldest son.

And NO, I'm NOT suggesting that you arm yourself! I moved to the South, where almost everybody has a gun. Mine would only be cuter if it was pink, but it'll scare the bejeeberz out of anyone that tries to break into my house.

Charity 411

When you deal with this kind of crazy you have to try and figure out if what ever you do is going to put a stop to it, or give them a reason to escalate.

That is it exactly. It's almost by trial and error, to some degree. I suppose the thing about it all is, after awhile nothing will surprise. It's weird because on some level I think I know him better than anyone. And yet, at times I think, maybe not. Maybe I don't know him at all. But then what is there to know? A reflection of something that doesn't exist? A shell of a person? It's freaky, really.

SolarChick

When I told off my ex, I simply told him to stop. That his opinion no longer mattered to me, and he had to just stop.

It's interesting...I did the same thing. There was no threat. It was just a super bold expectation. I didn't mention a thing about the photos. At all. And I would say that sends a message right there....it's not about the photos. It's about him not every contacting me again. I did tell him there were only 2 exceptions to this: He's on his death bed, or he gives me back the money he owes me. Other than that, he's to never contact me again.

The rest of the letter called him out on all his shit. Imagine, it was a very sparse letter, only 1 page. It was a thing of beauty if I do say so myself! Super cutting. Super unexpected coming from me. And super bold. It was so very cathartic to call him out on his narc/socio shit.

I was no longer the quivering ball of fear and hurt that cared about his opinion of me. Yas! This was the tone of mine as well. It was empowering.

Clearly, I was no longer the victim. I didn't even need anything further to back me up. I was standing up to him all on my own, and courts and police be damned, he was to KNOOCK IT OFF. I love this...It's exactly this.

You mentioned something about daring him. Not sure if others have noticed this other-level-crazy, but mine couldn't back down from a dare or a bet. He was like a child. So if you ever said..I bet you can't...blah blah blah....it would be on. SO bizarre!!

BTW, he is fully unaware that I am now armed, as is my eldest son. laugh

I laughed at this!! So good! (No Politics) Have you seen that meme of the girl before and after the narcissist? First picture she's all shy with blond hair and a frumpy dress smiling, the After the narc photo...she's armed to the max, with black leather outfit and a cigarette. I love that one!

And NO, I'm NOT suggesting that you arm yourself! I moved to the South, where almost everybody has a gun. Mine would only be cuter if it was pink, but it'll scare the bejeeberz out of anyone that tries to break into my house.

[This message edited by WalkinOnEggshelz at 11:12 AM, Tuesday, September 27th]

Charity 411 Encyclopedia of American Loons what a great link ~ will keep me entertained for at least the evening. I cant find the blathering idiot (perhaps this is for the best).
I see my ex riding through the city on a little kids scooter (not an escooter). He is a lawyer ffs riding around on basically a tricycle. Clowns is what they are.

[This message edited by VezfromTaz at 9:48 AM, Wednesday, September 21st]

Gracelove,

When I first saw this post, I did not read it through because of my own visceral reaction, but I book marked it, because, for the last seven years, I have been gently trying to get 25+ years of photos from my former spouse. She took them out of the house a year before the divorce, a year before I knew she was cheating, a year before I had a chance to react.

I understand the feeling that the photos are hers because she took the pictures, but they our memories of our children, our parties, our baptisms, Christmas celebrations, our Thanksgivings, our vacations, etc. Some of those pictures were taking because I was in grad school and could not be with her and the children, so they were taken for me. But to no avail, I once a year politely request she bring an album by (not to risk losing it in the mail) when she travels into town so that I can copy it - crickets.

Now that I read the rest of your post. I'm going through same thing with my daughter. At times she wants to know everything, see a copy of the divorce decree, and know all the dirt. Other times, she says I crossed her boundary because I referred to something in the past or I asked if she had a good visit with her mother. I never know which way the wind will blow.

My solution: I accept that my former spouse is angry and hurt, and blames me for all that is bad in her life, which entitled her to have affairs and runaway, and her ground to punish or get even at any and every chance. I accept that my daughter is hurt from the abandonment by her mother (who left her behind and moved 400+ miles away while my daughter was a teenager). I accept that my daughter is angry at me that I wasn't the husband her mother needed/wanted, thus drove her mom away.

Now, I love my daughter unconditionally; I apologize when I feel it's appropriate; and I say I don't agree when I don't agree with her (my daughter). And I always ask, are you just venting? Or do you want my thoughts, feedback or advice?

I'd suggest you double check your divorce decree to see if all assets have been distributed and the decree is final - if not sure, check with your representative/lawyer/attorney. If its about power and control, let him have the pictures and be done with it. If you feel you need to stop this before there's a next demand, then certainly contact your representative/lawyer/counsel/attorney.

I wish peace.

Healershaman

I understand that my post may have resonated with you. I'm sorry for what you have been going through.

The difference would be that you seem to have a genuine interest in your children and coming at it from a good place. Wanting to have a relationship etc.

My ex wasn't paternal. My youngest says this about him as well. He really had no interest in the children. Unless they could make him look good or he could extract supply from them.

Now he is 'trying' to be a good day. Why? Because he is feeling irrelevent. And he wants something in return. THis is who he is.

While I agree that the memories are joint, our circumstances are different.
I had given him the photos during the seperation for him to make copies (which he did, got the memory sticks, then didn't go pick them up from the shop. Instead telling my daughter to go do it, this while she just found out her dad was cheating, and 1 week before her wedding. My daughter and I are trying to figure out who went to pick them up. Was it her or me? Was it him? We aren't sure). Either way it wasn't our responsibility. If the pictures were so precious to him, he would have picked them up. And if he wasn't such an asshole he would never have put that pressure on my daughter to go do it.

So this can tell you what kind of father he is. He never had any interest in photos. He just wasn't wired that way.

Other times, she says I crossed her boundary because I referred to something in the past or I asked if she had a good visit with her mother. I never know which way the wind will blow. I totally get that. Same here. It's really hard to know what their reaction will be. This happens with my eldest, not my youngest anymore.

Now, I love my daughter unconditionally; I apologize when I feel it's appropriate; and I say I don't agree when I don't agree with her (my daughter). And I always ask, are you just venting? Or do you want my thoughts, feedback or advice? Sounds like a great way to move forward with your daughter. I like your approach.

I'd suggest you double check your divorce decree to see if all assets have been distributed and the decree is final - if not sure, check with your representative/lawyer/attorney. If its about power and control, let him have the pictures and be done with it. If you feel you need to stop this before there's a next demand, then certainly contact your representative/lawyer/counsel/attorney.
Everything was final. The photos were never part of anything in the decree. He's claiming the copies are his property. Which they are. So it was up to him to pick them up...5 years ago.

The other thing is...like my daughter said...he could have been decent about it. And just asked. Instead he had to threaten court action in a registered letter. Pathetic.

This is about me stopping the bullying. I'm not putting up with it ever again. I don't care about power and control on his part. Or giving in to keep the peace. I've done that lots. So for me, it's about standing up to him and saying no way, never again. And to get him to maintain the NC that I've fought to have.